Controversial Kizaru will either resign or Garling will punish him
- Thread starter RebelliousSoma
- Start date
We know the race associated with the land of gods were the Lunarians, which were considered the gods of the red line, yet we haven't seen statues of their species on the red line, the statues we've seen were exclusively human(like), so they're probably just some members of the founder families carved out in stone to declare their new home and the reason Lily declined living up there is because the founders attempted to dispose of the other races living on the red line - successfully so.
They managed to wipe out the arguably strongest species (Lunarians), the holy knights ain't no big deal here (and whose knights are they to begin with? If they serve someone even higher up than Imu, they wouldn't have allowed Imu to literally take seat as the king of the world).
Figarland on the other hand has all the characteristics of a Celestial Dragon; having "Saint" in his name and being an arrogant human who considers those living in the lower realms as scum not worth protecting, rather you would be even worse of a scum if you protected them, also doing slave hunting and killing for sports.
I don't think your idea of Garling has a good basis here? And yeah, obviously, it wouldn't be good portrayal to the outside world if you saw the supposed "gods" the Celestial Dragons proclaim to be just being executed as trash. They have to retain their untouchable image to the outside world obviously, which doesn't tell you everything about their internal policy.
And then again, who are the holy knights answer to? Who gave them authority? And if they are separate from the WG and the Celestial Dragons, why can Garling execute Celestial Dragons? It's not like the WG ever cared to adhere to someone's rules, because again, we know they literally wiped out species.
They managed to wipe out the arguably strongest species (Lunarians), the holy knights ain't no big deal here (and whose knights are they to begin with? If they serve someone even higher up than Imu, they wouldn't have allowed Imu to literally take seat as the king of the world).
Figarland on the other hand has all the characteristics of a Celestial Dragon; having "Saint" in his name and being an arrogant human who considers those living in the lower realms as scum not worth protecting, rather you would be even worse of a scum if you protected them, also doing slave hunting and killing for sports.
I don't think your idea of Garling has a good basis here? And yeah, obviously, it wouldn't be good portrayal to the outside world if you saw the supposed "gods" the Celestial Dragons proclaim to be just being executed as trash. They have to retain their untouchable image to the outside world obviously, which doesn't tell you everything about their internal policy.
And then again, who are the holy knights answer to? Who gave them authority? And if they are separate from the WG and the Celestial Dragons, why can Garling execute Celestial Dragons? It's not like the WG ever cared to adhere to someone's rules, because again, we know they literally wiped out species.
It would be more dramatic, and even logic after all the flashback Oda stuffed down in the readers throats, to have him die in order to let Bonney, Kuma, Sentomaru and the others escape. Then one or more elders can destroy him while the ones he saved cry.
The choice to have Garling execute him would just add a bit of hype for him but nothing much, almost a repetition of him executing that CD.
The choice to have Garling execute him would just add a bit of hype for him but nothing much, almost a repetition of him executing that CD.
I didn't say I think he's below Marines so idk where that came from.
We don't have enough information on how the Gorosei work or what authority the Holy Knights claim or can claim.
My guess is that the Holy Knights are all Celestial Dragons with the full authority to call Buster Calls, but their jurisdiction is restricted to Mariejois and matters regarding CDs.
The Gorosei probably have to sign off on executions of other CDs.
We don't have enough information on how the Gorosei work or what authority the Holy Knights claim or can claim.
My guess is that the Holy Knights are all Celestial Dragons with the full authority to call Buster Calls, but their jurisdiction is restricted to Mariejois and matters regarding CDs.
The Gorosei probably have to sign off on executions of other CDs.
Mary Geoise isn't Land of Gods
Land of Gods existed "Before" Mary Geoise
Meaning Mary Geoise came to Replace it, and it was Confirmed that Mary Geoise existed "Before" WG
That means it was Founders of Mary Geoise who Destroyed Land of Gods, not WG Founders.
If WG Founders Defeated Land of Gods, then They would be known as Founders of Mary Geoise, which We know They aren't
And who said that Holy Knights know about Imu?
Why is Imu spending his time alone? Just because He is Secretly Ruler of WG, doesn't mean He needs to make his entire Presence a Secret as well, after all He is a Celestial Dragon, He can simply walk around & go wherever He pleases & present himself as any other Celestial Dragon, but Secretly gives Orders to Gorosei
Yet Imu hides his entire Existence, not just his Authority, some Celestial Dragons don't even know about Void Century, how is that Possible if They are being Led by a Person from that Time Period? This means Imu hides himself even within Mary Geoise, why would that be you think?
Look, what We know for a Fact is that Garling have Higher Authority than Most CDs
I'm not saying that Holy Knights being CDs who are under Gorosei is Impossible or Unlikely but all i'm saying is that them being their own thing outside CDs who Operate similar to CP-9 in Enies Lobby isn't an Impossibility either
Being Higher Authority than Average CD doesn't necessarily mean you're Superior than "All" CDs but it's still on the Table.
And do you know what Dragon said? He said War doesn't officially Start until Holy Knights join it
And in Same Arc He said that, We are witnessing a Big Battle involving Five Elders
So this Vegapunk Conflict is bigger than the War that Dragon was teasing? It can't be
If Five Elders were bigger deal than Holy Knights then them coming to Egghead is bigger deal than Revos going at War with Holy Knights, which doesn't make sense at all from Story Perspective. It's like Kin'emon saying that War won't Officially Start until Flying Six are mobilized even when Calamities were all Mobilized, that's Contradiction
Also when Akainu was discussing what Mjosgard did, He said that Holy Knights will handle it, why Specifically them? How did He know that those Knights gonna judge Mjosgard & not Gorosei themselves do it? Same Akainu who badmouthed Gorosei for not being able to Control Doffy (Same Doffy who Blackmailed WG & Used CP-0, yet took Orders from Someone of High Authority, who till this Day wasn't Confirmed to be Gorosei or any CD)
Land of Gods existed "Before" Mary Geoise
Meaning Mary Geoise came to Replace it, and it was Confirmed that Mary Geoise existed "Before" WG
That means it was Founders of Mary Geoise who Destroyed Land of Gods, not WG Founders.
If WG Founders Defeated Land of Gods, then They would be known as Founders of Mary Geoise, which We know They aren't
And who said that Holy Knights know about Imu?
Why is Imu spending his time alone? Just because He is Secretly Ruler of WG, doesn't mean He needs to make his entire Presence a Secret as well, after all He is a Celestial Dragon, He can simply walk around & go wherever He pleases & present himself as any other Celestial Dragon, but Secretly gives Orders to Gorosei
Yet Imu hides his entire Existence, not just his Authority, some Celestial Dragons don't even know about Void Century, how is that Possible if They are being Led by a Person from that Time Period? This means Imu hides himself even within Mary Geoise, why would that be you think?
Look, what We know for a Fact is that Garling have Higher Authority than Most CDs
I'm not saying that Holy Knights being CDs who are under Gorosei is Impossible or Unlikely but all i'm saying is that them being their own thing outside CDs who Operate similar to CP-9 in Enies Lobby isn't an Impossibility either
Being Higher Authority than Average CD doesn't necessarily mean you're Superior than "All" CDs but it's still on the Table.
And do you know what Dragon said? He said War doesn't officially Start until Holy Knights join it
And in Same Arc He said that, We are witnessing a Big Battle involving Five Elders
So this Vegapunk Conflict is bigger than the War that Dragon was teasing? It can't be
If Five Elders were bigger deal than Holy Knights then them coming to Egghead is bigger deal than Revos going at War with Holy Knights, which doesn't make sense at all from Story Perspective. It's like Kin'emon saying that War won't Officially Start until Flying Six are mobilized even when Calamities were all Mobilized, that's Contradiction
Also when Akainu was discussing what Mjosgard did, He said that Holy Knights will handle it, why Specifically them? How did He know that those Knights gonna judge Mjosgard & not Gorosei themselves do it? Same Akainu who badmouthed Gorosei for not being able to Control Doffy (Same Doffy who Blackmailed WG & Used CP-0, yet took Orders from Someone of High Authority, who till this Day wasn't Confirmed to be Gorosei or any CD)
.
As far as I know, Akainu only said that some of the Celestials are supposed to act behind the Goroseis back, but he doesn't know the whole picture. He doesn't understand the scope of Doflamingo's knowledge, which comes with him being of the inner circle of the Celestial Dragons. Doffy knows of some national treasure whose sole existence would shake the world, it's not unlikely that he know's of Imu's existence, then why wouldn't someone like Garling? And if he doesn't as an "outsider", it still begs the question why he involves himself in the affairs of the Celestial Dragons and judges them.
Furthermore, Akainu pointing out how the holy knights will deal with this affair among the Celestial Dragons serves as further proof that he is intervened with them. And why would Dragon say that they (the WG) would utilize the holy knights as a response to the Revos declaring war on the WG/Celestial Dragons?
I think the Gorosei appearing in Egghead is a different matter. They summoned themselves within the context of stopping Vegapunk's message, it's not the war itself yet. The actual war or fight (against the Revos) would start with the holy knights taking their moves, as they are basically portrayed as the highest "soldiers", differently from the Gorosei, who are publicly perceived as the ruling politicians, hiding their diabolic nature from the outside world as pointed out by Sabo.
Furthermore, Akainu pointing out how the holy knights will deal with this affair among the Celestial Dragons serves as further proof that he is intervened with them. And why would Dragon say that they (the WG) would utilize the holy knights as a response to the Revos declaring war on the WG/Celestial Dragons?
I think the Gorosei appearing in Egghead is a different matter. They summoned themselves within the context of stopping Vegapunk's message, it's not the war itself yet. The actual war or fight (against the Revos) would start with the holy knights taking their moves, as they are basically portrayed as the highest "soldiers", differently from the Gorosei, who are publicly perceived as the ruling politicians, hiding their diabolic nature from the outside world as pointed out by Sabo.
Akainu actually said worse than that, He said "So you're telling me that the whole mistaken mess about Doflamingo leaving the Warlords, was on Orders from even Higher than you all?"
I didn't just talk about Garling not knowing about Imu, i asked you why does Imu need to Hide in First Place?
He is a Celestial Dragon, He can just live as He want while Secretly giving Orders, it doesn't make sense for Imu to hide his Presence unless there are People Scarier than Gorosei
Garling doesn't involve himself in CD Affairs, it's not like He did it so that Charlos gives him a pat on the back, if Holy Knights allowed CDs to live in their Land, then They expect them to be Respectful Guests, Mjosgard being Executed is basically like Garling not accepting such Trash Person to live there, not because He opposed Charlos (He actually Hit Charlos before but it didn't matter, showing that Garling didn't do it cuz of a CD being Hurt, but cuz of Mjosgard becoming not worthy of living there)
Actually the entire Sub-Plot of Mjosgard shows that CDs can become Good if They were taught to be Good, instead of thinking that Garling is a CD cuz of how He treats everyone as Insects, maybe it was CDs who became like that because of Holy Knights Influence
Meaning it's Holy Knights who are Evil Racists & CDs are like Children who grew up to be like them, hence why Oda draws CDs as Fanboys looking up to Garling, He is like their Idol
As for Egghead, i didn't talk about it's Circumstances, i know that it's Explained & Justified, what i meant is that from Writing Perspective & from Readers Perspective, it doesn't make sense for Oda to tease Holy Knights as the next big Fight "After" Gorosei Arc, it's simply not the correct Order if Gorosei are bigger deal than Holy Knights (From our view, not OPVerse)
I didn't just talk about Garling not knowing about Imu, i asked you why does Imu need to Hide in First Place?
He is a Celestial Dragon, He can just live as He want while Secretly giving Orders, it doesn't make sense for Imu to hide his Presence unless there are People Scarier than Gorosei
Garling doesn't involve himself in CD Affairs, it's not like He did it so that Charlos gives him a pat on the back, if Holy Knights allowed CDs to live in their Land, then They expect them to be Respectful Guests, Mjosgard being Executed is basically like Garling not accepting such Trash Person to live there, not because He opposed Charlos (He actually Hit Charlos before but it didn't matter, showing that Garling didn't do it cuz of a CD being Hurt, but cuz of Mjosgard becoming not worthy of living there)
Actually the entire Sub-Plot of Mjosgard shows that CDs can become Good if They were taught to be Good, instead of thinking that Garling is a CD cuz of how He treats everyone as Insects, maybe it was CDs who became like that because of Holy Knights Influence
Meaning it's Holy Knights who are Evil Racists & CDs are like Children who grew up to be like them, hence why Oda draws CDs as Fanboys looking up to Garling, He is like their Idol
As for Egghead, i didn't talk about it's Circumstances, i know that it's Explained & Justified, what i meant is that from Writing Perspective & from Readers Perspective, it doesn't make sense for Oda to tease Holy Knights as the next big Fight "After" Gorosei Arc, it's simply not the correct Order if Gorosei are bigger deal than Holy Knights (From our view, not OPVerse)
After all, Imu is supposed to be one of the ancient founders of the WG which even the Gorosei would bow down to, secretly sitting on the throne which was supposed to be empty. By virtue of his stature he can't just casually walk around outside. Not even the Gorosei are seen doing so and they are the public faces. Imu would've nothing to gain from participating in the public. It's not like he compromises his well being by being absent of social interactions. That aside, it's obviously a storytelling perspective, by portraying him as a "hidden" boss.
But what do you mean with respectful guests? If they got their own territory there, why would Garling intervene? The reason Garling punished Mjosgard is because Mjosgard attacked Carlos for trying to enslave Shirahoshi, hence Garling referred to the act of "protecting trash" as being even bigger trash and that was the cause of the punishment.
Also, then again, who gives the holy knights such authority? The WG has vast resources and military might, why would they even subjugate themselves to the holy knights? Are they tied to the one(s) who according to you are scarier to the Gorosei? Who are they supposed to be? And why would they tolerate the influence of the WG instead of claiming it themselves?
The WG and its agenda exists for hundreds of years and is older than the holy knights, even in the recent past we have seen Saturn being much older than a yet young Garling, unless you say there is a cycle of holy knights iterating over millennia.
Also, why weren't the holy knights and Garling introduced as a different entity, rather than being tied to the Celestial Dragons? We know that in God Valley, the Native Hunting Competition was considered as a sport conducted by the Celestial Dragons, with one of them saying that the WG should claim that "God Valley" as their own in the process. And Dragon himself says that their true enemies are the Celestial Dragons and in this context refers to the holy knights that will be "utilized".
So far more hints towards the holy knights just being the supreme soldiers of the World Nobles rather than a separate entity.
But what do you mean with respectful guests? If they got their own territory there, why would Garling intervene? The reason Garling punished Mjosgard is because Mjosgard attacked Carlos for trying to enslave Shirahoshi, hence Garling referred to the act of "protecting trash" as being even bigger trash and that was the cause of the punishment.
Also, then again, who gives the holy knights such authority? The WG has vast resources and military might, why would they even subjugate themselves to the holy knights? Are they tied to the one(s) who according to you are scarier to the Gorosei? Who are they supposed to be? And why would they tolerate the influence of the WG instead of claiming it themselves?
The WG and its agenda exists for hundreds of years and is older than the holy knights, even in the recent past we have seen Saturn being much older than a yet young Garling, unless you say there is a cycle of holy knights iterating over millennia.
Also, why weren't the holy knights and Garling introduced as a different entity, rather than being tied to the Celestial Dragons? We know that in God Valley, the Native Hunting Competition was considered as a sport conducted by the Celestial Dragons, with one of them saying that the WG should claim that "God Valley" as their own in the process. And Dragon himself says that their true enemies are the Celestial Dragons and in this context refers to the holy knights that will be "utilized".
So far more hints towards the holy knights just being the supreme soldiers of the World Nobles rather than a separate entity.