Speculations How Oda will make Mihawk be Zoro's final opponent?
- Thread starter Etzel Andergast
- Start date
It’s going to happen because of Buggy. Luffy and Buggy since entering the grand line together have constantly grown side by side in notoriety due to their fate.
Calling it a gag is fair, but Buggys ability to constantly falling upwards due to outside effects in the world isn’t stopping now.
- Because of Ace being kidnapped, Luffy invaded Impel Down at the exact same time Buggy escaped his cell allowing Buggy to not only escape, but to empower his crew with dozens of famous criminals allowing him to become a warlord which he then gained more notoriety to strengthen his crew even more
- Because of Law and Luffys team up, Fujitora was sent to Dressrosa and because of Doflamingo getting exposed the Warlord system was dissolved which led to the formation of Cross Guild which elevated Buggy to the samw
Notoriety as Luffy again as an Emperor of the Sea
It’s going to happen a third time when Luffy becomes the Pirate King. Buggy and cross guild will elevate itself to rulers of the world.
It’s the most logical way for Mihawk vs Zoro to occur as Zoros last fight.
Calling it a gag is fair, but Buggys ability to constantly falling upwards due to outside effects in the world isn’t stopping now.
- Because of Ace being kidnapped, Luffy invaded Impel Down at the exact same time Buggy escaped his cell allowing Buggy to not only escape, but to empower his crew with dozens of famous criminals allowing him to become a warlord which he then gained more notoriety to strengthen his crew even more
- Because of Law and Luffys team up, Fujitora was sent to Dressrosa and because of Doflamingo getting exposed the Warlord system was dissolved which led to the formation of Cross Guild which elevated Buggy to the samw
Notoriety as Luffy again as an Emperor of the Sea
It’s going to happen a third time when Luffy becomes the Pirate King. Buggy and cross guild will elevate itself to rulers of the world.
It’s the most logical way for Mihawk vs Zoro to occur as Zoros last fight.
meh
we've seen how Mihawk and Zoro operate
even if they are in the middle of something else, they will stop what they are doing and focus on what they want
Zoro didn't give a shit about Krieg and what was happening, once he saw Mihawk show up in Baratie
Mihawk didn't care about Marineford war, once he set his eyes on Luffy and testing his "luck"
if there's a massive end war, and Zoro and Mihawk are there and meet each other in the battlefield, they might ignore everything and fight each other
in fact, that's how i personally would write it
i think it would be best if there's a bunch of people around to witness it, just like the Baratie
Zoro doesn't just want to be the best, he wants his name to reach the heavens
what better way than to defeat Mihawk in front of everybody in the middle of the final war? while everyone is watching through Den Den Mushi streams thanks to Morgans
we've seen how Mihawk and Zoro operate
even if they are in the middle of something else, they will stop what they are doing and focus on what they want
Zoro didn't give a shit about Krieg and what was happening, once he saw Mihawk show up in Baratie
Mihawk didn't care about Marineford war, once he set his eyes on Luffy and testing his "luck"
if there's a massive end war, and Zoro and Mihawk are there and meet each other in the battlefield, they might ignore everything and fight each other
in fact, that's how i personally would write it
i think it would be best if there's a bunch of people around to witness it, just like the Baratie
Zoro doesn't just want to be the best, he wants his name to reach the heavens
what better way than to defeat Mihawk in front of everybody in the middle of the final war? while everyone is watching through Den Den Mushi streams thanks to Morgans
you guys are way too stuck in a formula
i will say this
i think at least some of these fights won't happen
people expect Zoro to still fight: Admiral, Shiryu, Beckman, Mihawk and Nusjuro.
i think at most, two of these will be full on fights, while the other two could just be clashes / struggles in the middle of war
if i had to bet
i would pick Mihawk and Nusjuro, one is his dream and the other is part of the big bad group of the world, it makes sense
and there's a way to do both in the same war, before Luffy becomes PK
i will say this
i think at least some of these fights won't happen
people expect Zoro to still fight: Admiral, Shiryu, Beckman, Mihawk and Nusjuro.
i think at most, two of these will be full on fights, while the other two could just be clashes / struggles in the middle of war
if i had to bet
i would pick Mihawk and Nusjuro, one is his dream and the other is part of the big bad group of the world, it makes sense
and there's a way to do both in the same war, before Luffy becomes PK
For Zoro individually, maybe, but would be "abandon everything" just fight a "passing" Mihawk when at that time they will have probably already discovered the horrifying deeds of the WG and what lies at Raftel?
Idk, It would be quite shameful as a RHM at least.
Also, Mihawk should have his own objective too, and it's not like he would not be able to fight Zoro after that.
I can see a public duel, but more during the final stages of the PK race than the final War.
Aside from everything, I doubt Oda wants to portray Buggy as a real villain, someone really bad as the CD.
Idk, It would be quite shameful as a RHM at least.
Also, Mihawk should have his own objective too, and it's not like he would not be able to fight Zoro after that.
I can see a public duel, but more during the final stages of the PK race than the final War.
Aside from everything, I doubt Oda wants to portray Buggy as a real villain, someone really bad as the CD.
not at all
Luffy understands Zoro's dream, it's his promise to both Kuina and Luffy himself
Luffy would tell Zoro to fight Mihawk right then and there
the Straw Hats are not heroes, their focus is not defeating the WG, that's the Revolutionaries job
the Straw Hats wants to achieve their dreams
Zoro himself has said many times he doesn't care if he is seen as the bad guy, as long as he gets to achieve his dream
and during Wano, Zoro has re-awakened his own dream
Zoro's arc pre-ts was one of choosing Luffy and the crew over his ambition
but in Wano, Zoro met King, who also abandoned his own ambition for the sake of his captain
Zoro ends that fight coming to the conclusion that he can do both
There's no shame in Zoro focusing on fighting Mihawk in the middle of war, it's literally his character's goal
and Luffy knows that
Mihawk's objective is to fight an worthy foe who follows the way of the blade
it's literally Zoro and there's no one else
he doesn't want to be a Yonko, he doesn't care about the One Piece
he just wants to enjoy a great fight, using everything he has
when they both meet again, it's gonna be time
Luffy understands Zoro's dream, it's his promise to both Kuina and Luffy himself
Luffy would tell Zoro to fight Mihawk right then and there
the Straw Hats are not heroes, their focus is not defeating the WG, that's the Revolutionaries job
the Straw Hats wants to achieve their dreams
Zoro himself has said many times he doesn't care if he is seen as the bad guy, as long as he gets to achieve his dream
and during Wano, Zoro has re-awakened his own dream
Zoro's arc pre-ts was one of choosing Luffy and the crew over his ambition
but in Wano, Zoro met King, who also abandoned his own ambition for the sake of his captain
Zoro ends that fight coming to the conclusion that he can do both
There's no shame in Zoro focusing on fighting Mihawk in the middle of war, it's literally his character's goal
and Luffy knows that
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Mihawk's objective is to fight an worthy foe who follows the way of the blade
it's literally Zoro and there's no one else
he doesn't want to be a Yonko, he doesn't care about the One Piece
he just wants to enjoy a great fight, using everything he has
when they both meet again, it's gonna be time
Well yeah, cause that’s what Imu would be for. Once Oda showcased how shit the Gorosei are, the idea that these geezers are final villains despite being easily replaceable at a moments notice went out the window. As such Imu needs to instead get viable subordinates for when he fights Luffy. So we have a leader with no good subordinates in Imu, and a crew with a fake leader in Buggy.
Perfect fit.
Perfect fit.
As I said, that may be true if that was the only opportunity Zoro will ever have to fight Mihawk, but it wouldn't be.
We discard the possibility of Zoro vs Mihawk happening after the final war for narrative reasons, but characters could not and should not reason with that. We already know BB will fail and Luffy will win not matter what...but BB doesn't know and shouldn't know.
Also, Mihawk should have a reason to fight in the final war too, be It for power or even to face Gandhi or Garling.
I don't see Mihawk vs Zoro happening in a totally unrelated bubble compared to what Is happening in the rest of the world and in the most important event of the manga. However, I can see It happening during the race for the PK if a battle royal happens.
We discard the possibility of Zoro vs Mihawk happening after the final war for narrative reasons, but characters could not and should not reason with that. We already know BB will fail and Luffy will win not matter what...but BB doesn't know and shouldn't know.
Also, Mihawk should have a reason to fight in the final war too, be It for power or even to face Gandhi or Garling.
I don't see Mihawk vs Zoro happening in a totally unrelated bubble compared to what Is happening in the rest of the world and in the most important event of the manga. However, I can see It happening during the race for the PK if a battle royal happens.
the problem comes from these conflicting ideas of:
having the big war against the WG
and having a race for the One Piece and becoming PK
it already feels like Elbaf is gonna be a big arc of 3~4 years
if the war happens after that, that's also gonna be huge
and people still want a battle royale, race for the One Piece after that?
isn't the climax of struggle defeating Imu and the WG?
IMO, everything needs to be resolved in a single battle
the Throne Wars, like Doflamingo said
everyone will be there
Marines, Five Elders, Holy Knights, Imu, Cross Guild, Yonkous, Warlords, Last-Gen still alive, Revolutionaries
literally everybody
that war will decide everything
having the big war against the WG
and having a race for the One Piece and becoming PK
it already feels like Elbaf is gonna be a big arc of 3~4 years
if the war happens after that, that's also gonna be huge
and people still want a battle royale, race for the One Piece after that?
isn't the climax of struggle defeating Imu and the WG?
IMO, everything needs to be resolved in a single battle
the Throne Wars, like Doflamingo said
everyone will be there
Marines, Five Elders, Holy Knights, Imu, Cross Guild, Yonkous, Warlords, Last-Gen still alive, Revolutionaries
literally everybody
that war will decide everything
There are problems imho
First one is that WB's words first and the Oden's made clear the final war will be after the OP.
From Oden we have learnt that the knowledge of the Void century Is Indeed at Raftel too, so how can they fight the Goverment before discovering what happend during the Void century?
Sure, that seems long, but what can we do? Tbh, I think Shanks Is falling this arc (Oda hinted It and even hinted It before the end of the year) and the BB plot Is starting to kick in (Shanks, the ancient Weapons finally). Shanks will be one down after Erbaf.
The Rev too will be destroyed shortly, since we know they can't win: Luffy will win, not Dragon.
We can have a final battle Royal with Luffy, Buggy and Teach after Erbaf and then final war.
First one is that WB's words first and the Oden's made clear the final war will be after the OP.
From Oden we have learnt that the knowledge of the Void century Is Indeed at Raftel too, so how can they fight the Goverment before discovering what happend during the Void century?
Sure, that seems long, but what can we do? Tbh, I think Shanks Is falling this arc (Oda hinted It and even hinted It before the end of the year) and the BB plot Is starting to kick in (Shanks, the ancient Weapons finally). Shanks will be one down after Erbaf.
The Rev too will be destroyed shortly, since we know they can't win: Luffy will win, not Dragon.
We can have a final battle Royal with Luffy, Buggy and Teach after Erbaf and then final war.
I don't know, i can see it
Maybe Luffy vs Blackbeard happens during the war, and it's a massive battle
it takes everything from Luffy to defeat him, and then he is in his old man state really fucked up, and Chopper is doing everything he can to save him
then Imu shows up, and it's a struggle between everyone, trying to keep Imu down, but they keep losing
until the very end when Luffy gets healed back up, and defeats Imu
a lot like Kaido in Wano
or Oars in Thriller Bark
that way both villains get big fights against Luffy
the fact of the matter is, only one of the two gets to be the last
and thematically speaking, Imu, unfortunately, fits better
since Imu is all about control, and Luffy is all about freedom
defeating Imu is saving the world from the WG
even though i hate Imu and wish Blackbeard was the final villain
Maybe Luffy vs Blackbeard happens during the war, and it's a massive battle
it takes everything from Luffy to defeat him, and then he is in his old man state really fucked up, and Chopper is doing everything he can to save him
then Imu shows up, and it's a struggle between everyone, trying to keep Imu down, but they keep losing
until the very end when Luffy gets healed back up, and defeats Imu
a lot like Kaido in Wano
or Oars in Thriller Bark
that way both villains get big fights against Luffy
the fact of the matter is, only one of the two gets to be the last
and thematically speaking, Imu, unfortunately, fits better
since Imu is all about control, and Luffy is all about freedom
defeating Imu is saving the world from the WG
even though i hate Imu and wish Blackbeard was the final villain
There's a problem here
the final war can't just be Straw Hats + Revolutionaries against WG
Oda himself said Marineford would look cute compared to the Throne Wars
it needs everybody there
all the Yonkou going down before the final war, makes the final war meh
since most of the fan favorites are in the yonkou crews
people want to see Shanks, Blackbeard, Beckman, Shiryu, Mihawk, way above Imu and the Five Elders
and Oda knows this, that's why we're getting so much more from Imu and the Five Elders now, despite not knowing much shit about Shanks, Blackbeard or Mihawk yet
even though it's messy
i think the only way this story ends, it's a single huge battle with everyone
with all factions fighting to see who comes out on top and can go to Laugh Tale after that
the final war can't just be Straw Hats + Revolutionaries against WG
Oda himself said Marineford would look cute compared to the Throne Wars
it needs everybody there
all the Yonkou going down before the final war, makes the final war meh
since most of the fan favorites are in the yonkou crews
people want to see Shanks, Blackbeard, Beckman, Shiryu, Mihawk, way above Imu and the Five Elders
and Oda knows this, that's why we're getting so much more from Imu and the Five Elders now, despite not knowing much shit about Shanks, Blackbeard or Mihawk yet
even though it's messy
i think the only way this story ends, it's a single huge battle with everyone
with all factions fighting to see who comes out on top and can go to Laugh Tale after that
Imo it makes no sense for the two to be in the same arc.
Imu has always been set up as a post PK villain since that’s what Whitebeard set up as the man who finds the one piece will be the one to shoulder the centuries history.
The way I see it:
Elbaf -> Luffy defeats Sakazuki/Blackbeard defeats Shanks
God Valley -> Luffy defeats Blackbeard
Mariejoa -> Luffy defeats Imu
Yeah it’s long about 2 years for Elbaf, 1 year for God Valley, and 2 years for Mariejoa but unless Oda retcons Whitebeards final speech it makes the most sense.
It’s not that they’re lame, it’s that they’re geezers. Oda has never had geezers be comparable to their prime strength. He may respect geezers, but they’re not going to be final villains.
The fact that they’re easily replaceable just shows Imu has zero loyalty in these dudes anyways so will swap them out at his leisure.
Imu has always been set up as a post PK villain since that’s what Whitebeard set up as the man who finds the one piece will be the one to shoulder the centuries history.
The way I see it:
Elbaf -> Luffy defeats Sakazuki/Blackbeard defeats Shanks
God Valley -> Luffy defeats Blackbeard
Mariejoa -> Luffy defeats Imu
Yeah it’s long about 2 years for Elbaf, 1 year for God Valley, and 2 years for Mariejoa but unless Oda retcons Whitebeards final speech it makes the most sense.
It’s not that they’re lame, it’s that they’re geezers. Oda has never had geezers be comparable to their prime strength. He may respect geezers, but they’re not going to be final villains.
The fact that they’re easily replaceable just shows Imu has zero loyalty in these dudes anyways so will swap them out at his leisure.
Strawhat + Rev + Law e Kidd + all their allied Kingdoms + Ancient Weapons + all the Marine + all WG (Imu/Gorosei/HK) + maybe Adult Seraphims and whatnot fits the bill form me.
Biggest war in the manga.
Not to mention, you saw Wano and how awafully It was managed? Can you image how It would he with ten times more important character?
God forbid.
Not a coincidence that Oda never addressed that part; probably Imu's powers at work there.
Also, there are not just there, but Garling, Gandhi, etc. have the standing to be + Imu + Shanks' brother + obv. the Marine (if they don't rebel).
Biggest war in the manga.
Not to mention, you saw Wano and how awafully It was managed? Can you image how It would he with ten times more important character?
God forbid.
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Not a coincidence that Oda never addressed that part; probably Imu's powers at work there.
Also, there are not just there, but Garling, Gandhi, etc. have the standing to be + Imu + Shanks' brother + obv. the Marine (if they don't rebel).