Powers & Abilities They showed eveything...

I

Inspector_Mu

#1
#1
Both of them have shown their arsenals from 2 years training already. There isnt much that's why Oda gave them RS and Enma in order to compete with YC tiers next.
You will say " but but Zoro didnt show Ashura ..."
He will show it again this arc because Enma will boost his powers.

Achievements:

Zoro training and biggest achievement was coating his sword in CoA that's why he was happy to finally do it at DR. he showed improved skills + a new signature move.

Sanji created Hell Memories his new signature move and Could Skywalk + great CoO.

Luffy brought out G4 which was his biggest achievement during

Issues :
Luffy only problem was Haki to tackle monsters as Kata Yonko and admirals.
Zoro needed new swords to tackle high tiers , he has decent CoA , he might get haki upgrade next arc or so. This is why Oda will give him not just Enma but Kitestu Nidai too.

Sanji weakness was his durability and strength that's why he was given RS to boost him.


I know you will call me names but think for yourself; why give Sanji and Zoro new stuff prior big fights if they didnt show everything yet, if they were strong already to beat commanders?

But Look at their fights in NW, it is a slower growth pace than Luffy's :
Luffy : Hody > Ceasar > Chinjao > Doffy> Cracker > Katakuri > base Kaido (lost). Clashed with base BM (got slapped tho) . Luffy has beaten more high tiers than both.
Zoro: Hyouzou > Pica > Kamazou Killer. Clashed with Gyukumaru and
Sanji: Wadatsumi > Yonji > (Lost) Judge > P1 (with RS) . Clashed evenly with Vergo and also clashed wiyh Daifuku.

Zoro fights Pica (Veteran tier best) midd diff, couldn't tag the golem until he was helped by orlumbus ,
he couldn't dominate pica in their first clash, but later on he wins when Pica stood there as a fool coz he thought his haki was better.

Zoro fights Kamazou Killer (Veteran tier) high diff , he called him strong, they were evenly matched until Gyukumaru intervened , zoro wins but he is also KOed by a hakiless stab.

Sanji uses ultimate attack to finish Wada , Jinbei also fought wada. Since then he only beat Yonji offscreen and dominated base Vergo. His base couldnt beat any Veteran until he got RS.

If Zoro and Sanji still had some stuff from their 2 years, Oda was gonna make them use them before handing them RS and new swords.
 
ShinmenTakezo

ShinmenTakezo

‎
#2
#2
The entire progression did not make any sense. Even assuming they showed everything, which is highly doubtful, Oda never showed them against significant opponents.
If Hell´s Memories is Sanji´s main power-up over the TS, why not show it against Vergo, or in WCI? Instead he has been spamming either base or DJ kicks. And then something which was also presented as huge power-up for Sanji, geppou/Sky Walk and connected Blue Walk, was shit on in WCI nonchalantly. One can argue HM is Sanji´s equivalent of G4, and he used it one time against fodder Wadatsumi.
If Oda argued that Sanji´s strength was not enough, he should have shown HM failing against a significant opponent, like let´s say he did in Water 7/Enies Lobby, where the Strawhats needed powerups against their opponents.

Zoro is not such a significant case like Sanji, because getting a new sword is by far not on the same level as getting a suit that increases every stat, and also gives you invisibility, especially if we assume that invisibility actually helps/evades CoO.

So yeah, i think Sanji showed everything, but why he has not shown it more often does not make sense.
And Zoro i do not think he has shown everything (Asura was a big powerup pre-TS, and Zoro showed improvement in every major attack compared to post-TS, the same will apply to Asura) but it will not be the uber powerful thing Zoro fans try to make it out to be.
 
S

Sword God Ryuma

‎
#3
#3
Jo_Ndule said:
Both of them have shown their arsenals from 2 years training already. There isnt much that's why Oda gave them RS and Enma in order to compete with YC tiers next.
You will say " but but Zoro didnt show Ashura ..."
He will show it again this arc because Enma will boost his powers.

Achievements:

Zoro training and biggest achievement was coating his sword in CoA that's why he was happy to finally do it at DR. he showed improved skills + a new signature move.

Sanji created Hell Memories his new signature move and Could Skywalk + great CoO.

Luffy brought out G4 which was his biggest achievement during

Issues :
Luffy only problem was Haki to tackle monsters as Kata Yonko and admirals.
Zoro needed new swords to tackle high tiers , he has decent CoA , he might get haki upgrade next arc or so. This is why Oda will give him not just Enma but Kitestu Nidai too.

Sanji weakness was his durability and strength that's why he was given RS to boost him.


I know you will call me names but think for yourself; why give Sanji and Zoro new stuff prior big fights if they didnt show everything yet, if they were strong already to beat commanders?

But Look at their fights in NW, it is a slower growth pace than Luffy's :
Luffy : Hody > Ceasar > Chinjao > Doffy> Cracker > Katakuri > base Kaido (lost). Clashed with base BM (got slapped tho) . Luffy has beaten more high tiers than both.
Zoro: Hyouzou > Pica > Kamazou Killer. Clashed with Gyukumaru and
Sanji: Wadatsumi > Yonji > (Lost) Judge > P1 (with RS) . Clashed evenly with Vergo and also clashed wiyh Daifuku.

Zoro fights Pica (Veteran tier best) midd diff, couldn't tag the golem until he was helped by orlumbus ,
he couldn't dominate pica in their first clash, but later on he wins when Pica stood there as a fool coz he thought his haki was better.

Zoro fights Kamazou Killer (Veteran tier) high diff , he called him strong, they were evenly matched until Gyukumaru intervened , zoro wins but he is also KOed by a hakiless stab.

Sanji uses ultimate attack to finish Wada , Jinbei also fought wada. Since then he only beat Yonji offscreen and dominated base Vergo. His base couldnt beat any Veteran until he got RS.

If Zoro and Sanji still had some stuff from their 2 years, Oda was gonna make them use them before handing them RS and new swords.
Click to expand...
Your whole promise of this thread makes no sense after you said Zoro hasn't shown Ashura yet. Which means he hasn't shown everything.
 
HA001

HA001

World's Strongest Swordsman
‎
#4
#4
Noodle stop fucking lying. Does oden have 2 magic swords now ????
Take the L. Enma is just a high grade sword and only hurt kaido because of odens coa. It aint no super sword like you peddled. He doesn't have one magic sword one normal sword. And as i told you before shusui > enma.
 
Chrono

Chrono

‎
#5
#5
ShinmenTakezo said:
The entire progression did not make any sense. Even assuming they showed everything, which is highly doubtful, Oda never showed them against significant opponents.
If Hell´s Memories is Sanji´s main power-up over the TS, why not show it against Vergo, or in WCI? Instead he has been spamming either base or DJ kicks. And then something which was also presented as huge power-up for Sanji, geppou/Sky Walk and connected Blue Walk, was shit on in WCI nonchalantly. One can argue HM is Sanji´s equivalent of G4, and he used it one time against fodder Wadatsumi.
If Oda argued that Sanji´s strength was not enough, he should have shown HM failing against a significant opponent, like let´s say he did in Water 7/Enies Lobby, where the Strawhats needed powerups against their opponents.

Zoro is not such a significant case like Sanji, because getting a new sword is by far not on the same level as getting a suit that increases every stat, and also gives you invisibility, especially if we assume that invisibility actually helps/evades CoO.

So yeah, i think Sanji showed everything, but why he has not shown it more often does not make sense.
And Zoro i do not think he has shown everything (Asura was a big powerup pre-TS, and Zoro showed improvement in every major attack compared to post-TS, the same will apply to Asura) but it will not be the uber powerful thing Zoro fans try to make it out to be.
Click to expand...
Sanji hasnt gone all out against a tuff opponent which is the problem. And the lvl of ease he was able to get HM makes me think he has lvls to it. Stronger attacks with it that we havent seen.

Im pretty sure of Sanji defeated those 99 okama masters he would have done more than base and DJ.

Anyways I dont see the RS staying, Sanji will probably get it ripped up and unlock a PU.
 
I

Inspector_Mu

#6
#6
As much we hate the idea... In Oda's mind, Sanji and Zoro needed something new .to him they have nothing else to showcase from their training.
 
HA001

HA001

World's Strongest Swordsman
‎
#7
#7
Jo_Ndule said:
As much we hate the idea... In Oda's mind, Sanji and Zoro needed something new .to him they have nothing else to showcase from their training.
Click to expand...
Youve been proven wrong so put the shovel down. Enma is a downgrade. You are not that thick that you think the first thing mihawk taught zoro was all he taught him for 2 years. Admit you are wrong instead of tunnelling your head.
 
Haku

Haku

‎
#18
#18
HA001 said:
Yeah and ryuma made that sword black by protecting the country singlehandedly something oden and enma couldnt do.
Click to expand...
So the key factor here is who used the swords, not the swords themselves... Enma did nothing neither did Shusui. Is not that Enma couldn't do it is that Oden couldn't do it...
 
Haku

Haku

‎
#20
#20
HA001 said:
Which goes back to ryuma pouring his haki into shusui over time enough to turn it black. One of only 2. Mihawks yoru being theh other.
Click to expand...
And that means nothing that haki is no longer there... we know because when Zoro used shusui on Monet without haki it did nothing more than freak her out because she was scared


There is really no reason why Shusui should be the superior sword apart from it's cultural value... Having a sword that got black because some else pour haki into it is not gona make Zoro stronger or weaker if he picks a sword that hasn't be turned black...
 
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