Future Events Justice Opposes Freedom - Why Only the World Government are Fit to be the Final Villains
- Thread starter Elder Lee Hung
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Why is his existence hidden in the first place if he's such an almighty figure?
Why is he hiding in the lower floors of pangea castle, ripping bounty posters apart like a butthurt kid. Honestly, dude looks pretty paranoid of Luffy/Blackbeard.
The Gorosei though, have battle scars, graded weapons and gave no fucks in front of a Yonko and Fleet Admiral
Why is he hiding in the lower floors of pangea castle, ripping bounty posters apart like a butthurt kid. Honestly, dude looks pretty paranoid of Luffy/Blackbeard.
The Gorosei though, have battle scars, graded weapons and gave no fucks in front of a Yonko and Fleet Admiral
Imagine Luffy about to fight Akainu but then Sabo arrives and says, "Luffy, leave the fodder to me, you go and fight the King of the World'. Then turns to Akainu and says, "Let's see if I can win a fight with my natural enemy... This one's for Ace'. cringe
Or he be doing that because he considers them worthless fodder. Vivi Hype.
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Or he be doing that because he considers them worthless fodder. Vivi Hype.
I agree and thought it was fairly obvious, but having seen comments throughout the One piece community it is truly astounding how many people disparage the World Government, the overarching antagonistic force of the series for centuries.
Powerscaling does seem to play into it, but I would like to think that One Piece isn't the only story that most of the community has read before and understand the most basic of storytelling tropes.
It is quite possible that some people do it to be cheeky (though their persistence says otherwise) but it boggles the mind how some people could think that the person responsible for the Main Character's greatest physical and emotional trauma could be somehow sidelined.
There are other things to be considered of course, but One Piece is still an emotional story and shines brightest in that regard. The answer to the polls' question is pretty obvious. Nothing is as ideologically opposed to Utmost Freedom than Absolute Justice. Luffy can never be free as long as the WG continues to reign as they have for 800 years. The entire purpose of the One Piece could not be fulfilled if the WG is not taken out. No single pirate crew comes close to the domination of the WG. Standing on top of the pirating world is something the previous PK already achieved. He was too early to challenge the WG with 800 years of history to answer for, so that is what Luffy is going to do. Blackbeard, a threat that just arose in 2 years of history simply doesn't have the gravitas to compare.
The misgivings of the those with different perspectives on this cannot be dismissed of course. Blackbeard seems like such a monster, but that doesn't mean that other antagonists cannot present a suitable challenge. Disparage Akainu all you want but he is still the deadliest person to face in the story so far. Putting holes in people will never not be a problem no matter who you are dealing with, and he has the most prolific pedigree in that regard.
Simply put, no one in the list is as emotionally tied to Luffy. Akainu is not one to shy away from running his mouth either, so provocation is not even in question. Even now we have Oda trying to establish the most tenuous relationship with Ace to the current saga to add a personal investment for our MC, but it obviously still doesn't come anywhere close to what has been established with Akainu.
I'm not Oda, and he does have a propensity for throwing surprises at the readers. So in the end, Blackbeard, Akainu, Im? Who knows. From everything that has been established though...from the emotional apex of the first part of the story, the confrontation I am looking forward to the most at this point without question is Luffy vs Akainu.
Powerscaling does seem to play into it, but I would like to think that One Piece isn't the only story that most of the community has read before and understand the most basic of storytelling tropes.
It is quite possible that some people do it to be cheeky (though their persistence says otherwise) but it boggles the mind how some people could think that the person responsible for the Main Character's greatest physical and emotional trauma could be somehow sidelined.
There are other things to be considered of course, but One Piece is still an emotional story and shines brightest in that regard. The answer to the polls' question is pretty obvious. Nothing is as ideologically opposed to Utmost Freedom than Absolute Justice. Luffy can never be free as long as the WG continues to reign as they have for 800 years. The entire purpose of the One Piece could not be fulfilled if the WG is not taken out. No single pirate crew comes close to the domination of the WG. Standing on top of the pirating world is something the previous PK already achieved. He was too early to challenge the WG with 800 years of history to answer for, so that is what Luffy is going to do. Blackbeard, a threat that just arose in 2 years of history simply doesn't have the gravitas to compare.
The misgivings of the those with different perspectives on this cannot be dismissed of course. Blackbeard seems like such a monster, but that doesn't mean that other antagonists cannot present a suitable challenge. Disparage Akainu all you want but he is still the deadliest person to face in the story so far. Putting holes in people will never not be a problem no matter who you are dealing with, and he has the most prolific pedigree in that regard.
Simply put, no one in the list is as emotionally tied to Luffy. Akainu is not one to shy away from running his mouth either, so provocation is not even in question. Even now we have Oda trying to establish the most tenuous relationship with Ace to the current saga to add a personal investment for our MC, but it obviously still doesn't come anywhere close to what has been established with Akainu.
I'm not Oda, and he does have a propensity for throwing surprises at the readers. So in the end, Blackbeard, Akainu, Im? Who knows. From everything that has been established though...from the emotional apex of the first part of the story, the confrontation I am looking forward to the most at this point without question is Luffy vs Akainu.
The problem with Akainu being final villain is the Gorosei already made it clear in their talk with Akainu how much they think of him in the grand scheme of things,and we know it is not very much tbh.
The discussion of the Gorosei made it sound like they could just off Akainu at any moment if he becomes too problematic for them.
The greatest threat to Luffy should be Imu + Gorosei,those guys are actually talking about cleansing with Imu having posters of Blackbeard/ Luffy and Vivi which hints at his interest at Ancient weapons and Will of D.
Imu is the one at the head of the organization which strips the world of its freedom and dreams so he is the biggest ideological opposite of Luffy and thus the final villain.
Akainu is just Imu's unknowing henchman,when he tries to revolt,he is getting cleansed too.
The discussion of the Gorosei made it sound like they could just off Akainu at any moment if he becomes too problematic for them.
The greatest threat to Luffy should be Imu + Gorosei,those guys are actually talking about cleansing with Imu having posters of Blackbeard/ Luffy and Vivi which hints at his interest at Ancient weapons and Will of D.
Imu is the one at the head of the organization which strips the world of its freedom and dreams so he is the biggest ideological opposite of Luffy and thus the final villain.
Akainu is just Imu's unknowing henchman,when he tries to revolt,he is getting cleansed too.
Sorry, but I can't see anyone other than Blackbeard being qualified as the final villain of the series. He is bar none the longest built up antagonist for Luffy, and essentially Luffy's polar opposite. This is how they were introduced to each other on Jaya. What Blackbeard loved, Luffy hated, and what Luffy loved, Blackbeard hated. This served as a precursor to showcase what I believe will be a major clash in ideologies, when these two finally meet for the final time.
Oda stated in an interview that in the original setting of the Yami Yami no mi, Blackbeard was undefeatable even to all three Admirals. Clearly Oda changed his mind on that concept, as it wouldn't have made sense in how he typically goes about balancing Devil Fruits, to make one Devil Fruit that overpowered. But I don't think Oda scrapped the idea of making Blackbeard himself that powerful, but rather changed up how he went about it, and that was by giving him multiple devil fruits. This way individual devil fruits can still remain somewhat balanced, but the character himself becomes immensely powerful.
Now this doesn't mean that the Navy and the World Government won't be apart of the Final War/Arc for the Straw Hats, as I believe that is definitely going to be where the final battle takes place, but for Luffy, his final opponent will be Blackbeard during this confrontation. There is a reason why Oda has set up such an intricate plot point involving the Revolutionaries, and them directly opposing the World Government.
Dragon's main goal is to put a stop to the injustice of the World Government and the Marines, while Luffy's main goal is to become Pirate King. Luffy is not the type to want to change the World, and whatever he learns about the World Government on Laugh Tale, shouldn't change that. Not for someone as simplistic in nature as Luffy. Oda would have to do a complete personality shift of Luffy's character to make something like that believable, which I doubt he would ever do.
To me, Luffy's Journey started with him taking out a Pirate, and should end with him taking out a Pirate. Ironically (or maybe intentionally) with Oda revealing the existence of Rocks, and how he is slowly building up Blackbeard to be his second coming, then I wouldn't be surprised if Luffy and Koby team up reminiscent of Roger and Garp to take down Blackbeard's newly formed (which was hinted at) Rocks pirates. Luffy's Journey started with Koby being there, and comes full circle with it ending with Koby being there. That would be one hell of a way for the things to start the wrap up of the series.
Oda stated in an interview that in the original setting of the Yami Yami no mi, Blackbeard was undefeatable even to all three Admirals. Clearly Oda changed his mind on that concept, as it wouldn't have made sense in how he typically goes about balancing Devil Fruits, to make one Devil Fruit that overpowered. But I don't think Oda scrapped the idea of making Blackbeard himself that powerful, but rather changed up how he went about it, and that was by giving him multiple devil fruits. This way individual devil fruits can still remain somewhat balanced, but the character himself becomes immensely powerful.
Now this doesn't mean that the Navy and the World Government won't be apart of the Final War/Arc for the Straw Hats, as I believe that is definitely going to be where the final battle takes place, but for Luffy, his final opponent will be Blackbeard during this confrontation. There is a reason why Oda has set up such an intricate plot point involving the Revolutionaries, and them directly opposing the World Government.
Dragon's main goal is to put a stop to the injustice of the World Government and the Marines, while Luffy's main goal is to become Pirate King. Luffy is not the type to want to change the World, and whatever he learns about the World Government on Laugh Tale, shouldn't change that. Not for someone as simplistic in nature as Luffy. Oda would have to do a complete personality shift of Luffy's character to make something like that believable, which I doubt he would ever do.
To me, Luffy's Journey started with him taking out a Pirate, and should end with him taking out a Pirate. Ironically (or maybe intentionally) with Oda revealing the existence of Rocks, and how he is slowly building up Blackbeard to be his second coming, then I wouldn't be surprised if Luffy and Koby team up reminiscent of Roger and Garp to take down Blackbeard's newly formed (which was hinted at) Rocks pirates. Luffy's Journey started with Koby being there, and comes full circle with it ending with Koby being there. That would be one hell of a way for the things to start the wrap up of the series.
Yeah, not clear whether Luffy fights BB pre or post becoming PK, but either way. WG will be admirals + CP0 + SSG weapon + Gorosei and Im (who might even have an ancient weapon, who knows). So I don't get why admirals get the sole attention as EOS villains. Kaido is undoubtedly stronger than any admiral. And Big Mom is close enough to him. If Luffy surpasses Kaido powerwise, the admirals are gone. One could say, Luffy only beats Kaido in a group effort. But in this case the EOS villains are still weaker. And it would have a bad taste that Luffy hasn't surpassed Kaido in terms of power when becoming the PK.
BB will be Luffy's final opponent for the PK title.
He won't be the final villain of the series, that's reserved for Im/WG in the big final war.
Oda has basically spoonfed us this setup since the timeskip or even earlier since the introduction of the ponegliffs.
It's all about bringing the Dawn to the world and freeing it from the WG.
Becoming PK is still cool and probably also necessary for that, as seen by Roger's "we were too early for that" comment, but it's still a quite significantly smaller goal than freeing the world from the WG. Luffy is necessary for that to happen, which Oda has told us over and over again.
Oda's own comment that "the most adventurous/exciting part of OP will be finished in 5 years" underlines this imho. He worded it that way with a clear intention:
Luffy will become PK and finish his journey in 5 years aka defeat BB by then.
After that (!) the final war against the WG is only about to start.
He won't be the final villain of the series, that's reserved for Im/WG in the big final war.
Oda has basically spoonfed us this setup since the timeskip or even earlier since the introduction of the ponegliffs.
It's all about bringing the Dawn to the world and freeing it from the WG.
Becoming PK is still cool and probably also necessary for that, as seen by Roger's "we were too early for that" comment, but it's still a quite significantly smaller goal than freeing the world from the WG. Luffy is necessary for that to happen, which Oda has told us over and over again.
Oda's own comment that "the most adventurous/exciting part of OP will be finished in 5 years" underlines this imho. He worded it that way with a clear intention:
Luffy will become PK and finish his journey in 5 years aka defeat BB by then.
After that (!) the final war against the WG is only about to start.
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It’s such a shockingly obvious concept that you may think saying something this glaringly straightforward is unnecessary, but there are somehow people who still don’t get it, so this is indeed a necessary thread.
Pirates embody freedom in One Piece. This is how Oda has always presented them, for the most part, always attempting to impose their own personal methods of freedom upon the rest of the World.
The World Government represents authority, their own mantras on “Justice” define their desire to take people’s freedoms away from them.
Luffy believes the Pirate King is the “most free man on the Sea,” and the World Government are the only faction trying to snuff out such Freedom while every other Pirate is trying to embody this idea, in one way or another.
This is how you write a story, when you know what you’re doing. You start with an idea, and then you explore variations on that idea.
Luffy is a variation of Oda’s own view of what Freedom is. So is Blackbeard. So is Whitebeard. So is Law. So is Doflamingo. So is Kaido.
Pirates in One Piece are meant to embody the idea Living Freely in one way or another, and thus no Pirate in this manga is fit to be the ultimate opposition to the idea of Freedom.
The ultimate opposition to Freedom, within One Piece, is Justice-the idea of taking someone’s freedom away from them. The World Government are the ones attempting to do this on the largest scale imaginable. They are literally trying to bury the legacy of the Pirate King and Pirates along with it.
No Pirate is fit to be the ultimate enemy of this manga, because ideologically they cannot be. Pirates are all about their own views and beliefs surrounding freedom, and the Government is all about destroying that very freedom.
In conclusion, only the ones who embody Justice are fit to be the Final Villains. And on that note,
@Light D Lamperouge @Owl Ki @Luthon @Blackbeard @HA001 @Van @MarineHQ62 @Sentinel @playa4321 @RayanOO @Dragomir @Jiihad @Den_Den_Mushi @dizzy2341
Pirates embody freedom in One Piece. This is how Oda has always presented them, for the most part, always attempting to impose their own personal methods of freedom upon the rest of the World.
The World Government represents authority, their own mantras on “Justice” define their desire to take people’s freedoms away from them.
Luffy believes the Pirate King is the “most free man on the Sea,” and the World Government are the only faction trying to snuff out such Freedom while every other Pirate is trying to embody this idea, in one way or another.
This is how you write a story, when you know what you’re doing. You start with an idea, and then you explore variations on that idea.
Luffy is a variation of Oda’s own view of what Freedom is. So is Blackbeard. So is Whitebeard. So is Law. So is Doflamingo. So is Kaido.
Pirates in One Piece are meant to embody the idea Living Freely in one way or another, and thus no Pirate in this manga is fit to be the ultimate opposition to the idea of Freedom.
The ultimate opposition to Freedom, within One Piece, is Justice-the idea of taking someone’s freedom away from them. The World Government are the ones attempting to do this on the largest scale imaginable. They are literally trying to bury the legacy of the Pirate King and Pirates along with it.
No Pirate is fit to be the ultimate enemy of this manga, because ideologically they cannot be. Pirates are all about their own views and beliefs surrounding freedom, and the Government is all about destroying that very freedom.
In conclusion, only the ones who embody Justice are fit to be the Final Villains. And on that note,
@Light D Lamperouge @Owl Ki @Luthon @Blackbeard @HA001 @Van @MarineHQ62 @Sentinel @playa4321 @RayanOO @Dragomir @Jiihad @Den_Den_Mushi @dizzy2341
They desire freedom and there are many variations of it , but someone's "freedom" can also take the freedom of other pirates/marines or civilians. We even have an instance where a PK helped the World Nobles to stop another pirate from overthrowing them. There should be a good reason for why Roger did it.
Xebec's lust for freedom doesn't stop at being the pirate king, he wants to seize all the power. I mean Kaido and Meme alliance did want to conquer the world together but Oda made it clear that Xebec was the only one who could nearly do it by forcing pirates/marines put their differences aside and work together.
Using a political meter:
Im/Sakazuki are oppressive order
Xebec/BB are oppressive chaos
Roger/Luffy are just in the middle
So yes, i think Im, Teach and Sakazuki are main, secondary and tertiary antagonists respectfully.
I wouldn't go into political or ideological stuff, because this is not something Luffy would understand. When he finds out about the atrocities of the WG, he's likely to be very angry, but we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.
For me Blackbeard is the only "opposite" of Luffy. This panel in particular stood out, and I'm not sure it's without reason:
They've been portrayed as two sides of the same coin. They believe in fundamental ideas of freedom, piracy and dreams, but with opposite means.
For me Blackbeard is the only "opposite" of Luffy. This panel in particular stood out, and I'm not sure it's without reason:
They've been portrayed as two sides of the same coin. They believe in fundamental ideas of freedom, piracy and dreams, but with opposite means.
Is he though?
I mean first off Oda decided that the two chief news Luffy and we as the audience should know about are
> Sakazuki's victory over Kuzan
> Teach's rise to being a Yonko
I mean he even drew them in the exact same manner
Let's even compare the reactions Luffy has to both of them.
> Luffy sitting idly and listening to a story about Sakazuki and at the mention of Sakazuki's name his scar starts throbbing in pain and he starts sweating showing visible anxiety at the mere mention of Sakazuki
> Whereas, when it comes to Teach, Luffy doesn't care and is spacing out and focusing on other things, such as eating
And the reactions make perfect sense. One Piece is a story and one in particular in which "ambition", "determination", drive", "willpower" or whatever other synonyms one prefers directly confers martial prowess. This concept is so prevalent that it is physically instantiated in the phenomenon known as haki:
And who was the one that made Luffy doubt himself? Who was the one that broke that indomitable will, spirit, or whatever you prefer?
It was Sakazuki of course. When he killed his brother in front of his eyes
> Sakazuki broke that spirit. Sakazuki made Luffy doubt himself. Out of countless ruthless enemies, it was Sakazuki, and Sakazuki alone that achieved that.
> Coupled with the symbolism in One Piece that scars represent, Sakazuki and Luffy are destined to meet and fight.
I mean first off Oda decided that the two chief news Luffy and we as the audience should know about are
> Sakazuki's victory over Kuzan
> Teach's rise to being a Yonko
I mean he even drew them in the exact same manner
> Luffy sitting idly and listening to a story about Sakazuki and at the mention of Sakazuki's name his scar starts throbbing in pain and he starts sweating showing visible anxiety at the mere mention of Sakazuki
And the reactions make perfect sense. One Piece is a story and one in particular in which "ambition", "determination", drive", "willpower" or whatever other synonyms one prefers directly confers martial prowess. This concept is so prevalent that it is physically instantiated in the phenomenon known as haki:
It was Sakazuki of course. When he killed his brother in front of his eyes