Fanclub The V̶i̶n̶s̶m̶o̶k̶e̶ Sanji FC: The Prince of love

[Max]

I'm very confident but it's not that deep tbh.
I'm not really a fan of bets to take something from someone else.
We all view the story from different perspectives and can have disagreements on this ^^
Sorry if I came across as a bit to aggressive on the Lafitte ting
From my perspective it's a "why can't you see it, it's bloody obvious" type of ting even more so if the person I'm debating is a fellow Sanji fan like myself but well again nothing is set in stone till it's set in stone lol

Just on the topic of Sanji's BB matchup, trickiness aside what makes you think Pizarro is going to be Sanji's opponent?
I'd be honest, I extremely dislike the character lol so I wouldn't really call myself neutral but even if I try to take of my rose tinted glasses I can't really see it tbh

For example in Rayan's case, he thinks it's gonna be Vasco simply coz he really likes the character which is fine but deep down I'm sure he knows it's cope lol

It's all good, no worries. I was afraid you were offended after what I said, sorry if I seemed annoying.

As for the bet, I just thought the winner could choose the loser's avy, that's all I had in mind. But it's ok if you're not interested.

I'm not convinced his opponent will be Pizarro, it's just his personality matching Sanji's opponents' behavior that makes me think he's a possibility. But Burgess has the same kind of personality. I'm not sure who Sanji is gonna fight.

Goofy is such a simplistic term do describe Sanji's opponents. He typically fights eccentric characters, they don't literally have to be wearing a clown nose and get humiliated, that's not even an accurate representation of who he fights. Queen, Jabra and Bon were brutal, cunning, unconventional, theatrical, flamboyant and challenged Sanji on a moral/ideological level. Laffitte checks all of those boxes and Oda can easily add a quirk or two for some comedy. We haven't even been properly introduced to him as a character to explore his idiosyncrasies.

I didn't say anything about wearing a clown nose or getting humiliated. I don't really see the difference between being goofy and eccentric. No need to argue semantics, the point is his opponents are loud, theatrical and flamboyant, like you said. Lafitte doesn't check those boxes at all, he's a pretty quiet and serious guy. Burgess and Pizarro are the ones who check those boxes.

Any of them can "challenge Sanji on an ideological level", they're all a bunch of psychopaths. Let's not act like it only applies to Lafitte.

Yes, Oda can easily adds quirks to Lafitte. But I speculate about Sanji's matchup based on what I know now.

Kalifa had the "everything is sexual harassment" jokes.
Blueno had hair shaped a bull horns. How's that not goofy?

The character doesn't have to act like a "clown" in order to be goofy. They can have design cues, or other gags.


Also, Sanji doesn't have a "type" of enemy.
Gin, Kuroobi, Mr2, Satori (very weird to count, because it was a team fight), Jabra, Absalom, Wadatsumi (also not a 1v1), Queen.
You can't simply pick and choose some of them and condense them into one trait that YOU think fits "a typical sanji opponent".
You are not the first to do something like that, m8. I've been discussing these false "sanji matchup" theories for more than a decade.

Wanna know what Sanji fights have in common? They are almost impossible to pinpoint UNTIL the moment they happen or Oda shoves in our face the 3rd strongest thing, or we go for a process of elimination by first removing Zoro's opponent from the poll.
But these are just "trends". They aren't hard irrefutable science.
Jabra and Queen are the most blatantly obvious "3rd" strongest tropes because of Doukiri and the card game ranks from Kaido's crew.
People on this fandom speculate on many different matchups for Sanji from BBP.
Lafitte just happens to be the most popular (honestly, idk. before garp and coby shitting on Pizarro, Pizarro might've actually been even more popular than Lafitte).
We have people cheering for Vasco, Burgess, some even go on a wild curve and push sanji vs aokiji.

It all happens because Sanji's matchups are historically hard to lock on.

Post automatically merged: Wednesday at 8:08 AM

Conveniently these people forget that Zoro put his dream second for Luffy.
Which is basically why Mihawk accepts him.
LMAO.

Well, if even a tiny detail about a character makes them goofy, then I guess pretty much every character is goofy. Again, we can argue semantics, but the point is Sanji's opponents all behave the same way. I already explained why Kuroobi and Gin are disingenuous examples (I don't mean the person using them is disingenuous), as it was before Oda established a clear pattern he's been using for decades.

Not sure what your point is about "discussing false Sanji matchups for years". Is that supposed to mean you know more than I do on the subject? I've been reading One Piece for 20 years and discussed it on many manga forums before. I was right about Queen being Sanji's opponent when many people thought it'd be King, I was right about Zoro fighting King and about a lot of other matchups. I'm not a 15 yo who started reading OP yesterday and skipped the pre-timeskip arcs.

I'm not trying to brag, I've also been wrong on some things, of course. But I think it's a bit weird to talk about me as if I was just a side character passing by in your story or something. We all have our story and shouldn't assume we know more than someone else we barely know.

The only thing that matters is whether you can prove the pattern I'm talking about is wrong. And as of now, you can't.

 

[Doggo]

Well, if even a tiny detail about a character makes them goofy, then I guess pretty much every character is goofy. /QUOTE]
YES.
THAT'S EXACTLY THAT.
It's one piece.
90% of the characters are goofy in some way.

 

[PuckTheGreat]

@PuckTheGreat pardon my ignorance, but I have the impression that, usually, eastern folklore is very keen on "destiny" and "birthright" hooks. Like in the sense that, for instance, someone's personality is directly affected by their birth parents, no matter how much influence they actually have on the character's upbringing. Like "blood" dictates "soul".
Not saying this is restricted to eastern storytelling, but I've always had this impression.
The biggest trope is usually how, for instance, Luffy's will is "justified" by being the son of Dragon, or grandson to Garp.
Which might be why we have this tendency of thinking CoC is "inherited" through genetics.
Any thoughts on this matter?

I'm not asian so can't really say tbh but it does seem to be a trend in eastern comics. Like you kinda almost expect the dad of the main character to be a monster for example
With the topic of CoC in general I do think it's hereditary to a degree as almost every child of every CoC user introduced so far has it or is expected to get it as long as they have some sort of plot relevance.
I'm not really a fan of this whole "you are born a conqueror" nonsense though. Ability to conqueror should be determined by said characters personality and personalities are usually built by the environment you are brought up in.

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

I'm not asian

Could've sworn you're Japanese

 

[PuckTheGreat]

Could've sworn you're Japanese

I'm Nigerian ^^
Just been living in Japan for ages

 

[Doggo]

I'm Nigerian ^^
Just been living in Japan for ages

The more you know.

 

[Juanpiz]

I'm Nigerian ^^
Just been living in Japan for ages

 

[Max]

I think the most irritating thing is people endlessly bringing up the "kingly ambition" thing and every time it's debunked, they just ignore it. They can't refute factual examples, so they just pretend nothing was said and keep repeating the same thing over and over. That's how you know it's just wishful thinking.

YES.
THAT'S EXACTLY THAT.
It's one piece.
90% of the characters are goofy in some way.

Who do you see as Sanji's BB opponent?

 

[kekaro]

Morj farming ls again i see
This is a good sign last time he said Zoro will clash with Kizaru on egghead

 

[Julius]

This is a quite ignored hint/gag for Sanji's CoC

There is actually a few of them in WCI, which goes against what some people claim, curiously. Oda wouldn't simply write this "aura" thing without a clear intention.

And with all the info we got now, it's more obvious than ever

 

[PuckTheGreat]

I’m not convinced Sanji’s gonna get CoC you know. Putting aside all of the fan criteria nonsense, I still think Oda could potentially write Sanji in a different way which I’ll honestly be cuul with tbh long as it’s interesting & unique so I’d advice not to die on the CoC hill just yet.

One ting that sticks out to me with last chapter is that even though, Zoro only just realized that he can use CoC, Gaban said that his body seems to have already acclimatized itself to using it. Moreover Gaban last chapter also emphasized the ‘how’ being important with regards to using conqueror’s Haki and also stated that Haki can only really be utilized to its fullest when you are aware of it, so feels to me like this arc will involve polishing that base to take it to the next level. So is Sanji going to build a base this arc and then take it up to the se level as Zoro & or Luffy or like those 2 will Sanji also build on his base? 🤔 Realistically speaking I think it has to be the latter. Moreover you gotta consider that PoL is still yet to be fleshed out. What do y’all think?

 

[Julius]

We definitely getting the "Zoro vs Sanji" sooner than we imagine

 

[Rumble]

I still think Oda could potentially write Sanji in a different way which I’ll honestly be cuul with tbh long as it’s interesting & unique so I’d advice not to die on the CoC hill just yet.

Agreed. It's still possible.

So is Sanji going to build a base this arc and then take it up to the se level as Zoro & or Luffy

It's One Piece.

I don't expect the fight to last long enough to tell after Sanji awakens CoC.

 

[PuckTheGreat]

Agreed. It's still possible.



It's One Piece.

I don't expect the fight to last long enough to tell after Sanji awakens CoC.

Fair but I just have a strong inkling that Sanji’s path forward isn’t going to be Haki and Julius’ panel above just solidified that feeling. It’s a gag but Jinbe’s words there stick out to me (i.e not Haki)

 

[Sir Yasheen]

I’m not convinced Sanji’s gonna get CoC you know. Putting aside all of the fan criteria nonsense, I still think Oda could potentially write Sanji in a different way which I’ll honestly be cuul with tbh long as it’s interesting & unique so I’d advice not to die on the CoC hill just yet.

One ting that sticks out to me with last chapter is that even though, Zoro only just realized that he can use CoC, Gaban said that his body seems to have already acclimatized itself to using it. Moreover Gaban last chapter also emphasized the ‘how’ being important with regards to using conqueror’s Haki and also stated that Haki can only really be utilized to its fullest when you are aware of it, so feels to me like this arc will involve polishing that base to take it to the next level. So is Sanji going to build a base this arc and then take it up to the se level as Zoro & or Luffy or like those 2 will Sanji also build on his base? 🤔 Realistically speaking I think it has to me the latter. Moreover you gotta consider that PoL is still yet to be fleshed out. What do y’all think?

I think we need to learn more about the brand of CoC that can hurt the immortalities. For example I can see oda having it being that the CoC needs to be applied internally to do lasting damage which means since Sanjis been using internally damaging attacks with his fire for years now he’d have an easier job applying this specific technique than that of Luffy

 

[Julius]

Fair but I just have a strong inkling that Sanji’s path forward isn’t going to be Haki and Julius’ panel above just solidified that feeling. It’s a gag but Jinbe’s words there stick out to me (i.e not Haki)

That is no different from this panel if you ask me. Oda isn't simply going to reveal important things about Sanji's in gags that last 3 to 4 panels tho

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Fair but I just have a strong inkling that Sanji’s path forward isn’t going to be Haki and Julius’ panel above just solidified that feeling. It’s a gag but Jinbe’s words there stick out to me (i.e not Haki)

Imo sanjis going to have a bit of everything. Hell have the PoL to boost his defensive capabilities and Haki to fuel his fire to boost his offensive capabilities.

 

[PuckTheGreat]

I think we need to learn more about the brand of CoC that can hurt the immortalities. For example I can see oda having it being that the CoC needs to be applied internally to do lasting damage which means since Sanjis been using internally damaging attacks with his fire for years now he’d have an easier job applying this specific technique than that of Luffy

Hmmn…I think it is very unlikely that what you’re insinuating happens. It’d be one ting if you’re talking about CoO but Sanji being more proficient at applying CoC than Luffy is pretty far-fetched imo.

Post automatically merged: Wednesday at 4:18 PM

That is no different from this panel if you ask me. Oda isn't simply going to reveal important things about Sanji's in gags that last 3 to 4 panels tho

Fundamental difference between the Sanji panel & this one is that Sanji’s is said not to be Haki whereas with Zoro the assumption is that it is Haki. Panels are similar yet different.

 

[Julius]

I can already see Sanji EoS having to force Germa to support the Strawhats against the WG or something. Judge shows up to try his last opportunity to somehow make fun of Sanji, surrounded by Germa's clones, then after hearing a lot of wafflin from Judge, he knocks out everyone around with a CoC wave with hands in his pocket.

"To think the Sanji i knew has the color of the Supreme King "

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Hmmn…I think it is very unlikely that what you’re insinuating happens. It’d be one ting if you’re talking about CoO but Sanji being more proficient at applying CoC than Luffy is pretty far-fetched imo.

it’s not a proficiency, it’s using previous experience for a new application.

Sanjis been attacking characters internally since Ennies Lobby. His fire already does a lot of internal damage with IJ. If he can imbue that fire with CoC he’ll be doing internal CoC damage as well.

Luffy so far has just been coating his attacks in CoC, externally.

It’s not Sanji being more proficient with CoC, it’s Sanji allowing his fire to do most of the work and just imbuing it with the haki.