Chapter Discussion ONE PIECE CHAPTER: 1161 : A LOVE BALLAD IN HAIL OF ARROWS

[ZenZu]

They are obviously in the same ballpark. Unless Garp wanted to fight Shiki for days and destroy Marineford in the process, there was no reason not to make it a 2 on 1.

It's not like we are saying Garp solos 3 Yonko, we are saying the fact that a Whitebeard who wasn't more or less in his prime than Garp (similar age + old Garp showing way better feats than God Valley Garp) immediately decided to back off while backed up by a 30 year old Linlin and Kaido (though kaido as a 18 year old without his DF has the best excuse) kinda speaks for Garp in a direct 1 on 1 comparison, even if the gap is small. as @ZenZu phrased it, saying Garp is at least = Whitebeard based on recent portrayal would have a solid ground.

Anyone who has Garp below Whitebeard after these last few chapters is on copium. I had Garp clearly below WB and Roger for years, I even had him below Rayleigh. I couldn't have been more wrong.

Garp sits at the very top of the pecking order. Some can join him at worst, he's not below anyone (mayybe Xebec).

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Clearly it was not as personal as you want it to be. In manga Sengoku was very calculated character and praised by Whitebeard himself .

Sengoku accepting Garp help does not prove he would lose in actual 1 vs 1 .

It was personal enough for Sengoku to actively refuse Garps assistance and outwardly call Shiki “My Business”

It was personal. However, Sengoku is a calculated character. He knows his limitations, and if he isn’t certain he can beat Shiki alone, he’ll accept help. As we saw in Marineford.

It shows Garp ~ Sengoku ~ Shiki which is stated again when oda had Shiki and Roger fight a war to a draw and Shiki say that he and Whitebeard were similar level with Roger being the only wall for both. Despite BM being on the sea

 

[fanboy]

Dragon will die next chapter and Dika will awaken.

 

[comrade]

Anyone who has Garp below Whitebeard after these last few chapters is on copium. I had Garp clearly below WB and Roger for years, I even had him below Rayleigh. I couldn't have been more wrong.

Same here, I believed Garp had the short stick as compared to Roger and Whitebeard. It was the Pirate King and his equal after all. But now Warp is actually Roger's and Whitebeard's ceiling.

 

[Philosoraptor]

Anyone who has Garp below Whitebeard after these last few chapters is on copium. I had Garp clearly below WB and Roger for years, I even had him below Rayleigh. I couldn't have been more wrong.

Garp sits at the very top of the pecking order. Some can join him at worst, he's not below anyone (mayybe Xebec).

Still below Whitebeard and has nothing to do with copium.

What this chapter did do was solidified what we always knew via Garp=Roger. And with WB always holding back his powers

 

[Djordje]

It was personal enough for Sengoku to actively refuse Garps assistance and outwardly call Shiki “My Business”

It was personal. However, Sengoku is a calculated character. He knows his limitations, and if he isn’t certain he can beat Shiki alone, he’ll accept help. As we saw in Marineford.

It shows Garp ~ Sengoku ~ Shiki which is stated again when oda had Shiki and Roger fight a war to a draw and Shiki say that he and Whitebeard were similar level with Roger being the only wall for both. Despite BM being on the sea

I understand your point but so far nothing precisely puts old generation above likes of Kaido / Big Mom. Yes they do have a slightly better portrayal but that alone is not nearly enough. Maybe end of GV will reveal more about their power levels.

 

[Tora]

Dragon is an MVP.

17 year old rookie marine, gets pierced by a character way above his current league & proceeds to save Shanks.

I really like how Dragon is just a common 17 y.o rookie unlike his son. Dragon‘s strength will be organic

Agreed.

Tons of people are upset that they see Dragon as weakling, but this is proper writing IMO.

We'll probably see more tragedy/sad story that motivates Dragon to be strong.

 

[Blahmigooo]

" God valley will break the internet "
- famous word from op fans around the globe

Let's see if the execution is superb and worth the hype of the greatest battle after Void century war.
One of the main plot is finish, this may continue tho as The Rocks pirate might still like to get back Shakky and fight the Roger pirates.

Xebec eccentric chapter should start next chapter.
Warp was gassed by Oda to oblivion, that panel was single most wank panel I've ever seen in one piece.
But Whitebeard word was legit too, there's no point fighting Garp and better stick to their main objectives.
He had no problem fighting Roger later when their objectives are on the line.

 

[Redditworstgencancer]

Agreed.

Tons of people are upset that they see Dragon as weakling, but this is proper writing IMO.

We'll probably see more tragedy/sad story that motivates Dragon to be strong.

Yep. Just because Garp is his father and Luffy being his son, doesn‘t mean a teen Dragon needed to be strong..

I mean he still took a beam of a Holy Knight and ran away with Shanks. That is a W

Actually I bet out of the 3 Luffy was probably the strongest as a 17 year old.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

I understand your point but so far nothing precisely puts old generation above likes of Kaido / Big Mom. Yes they do have a slightly better portrayal but that alone is not nearly enough. Maybe end of GV will reveal more about their power levels.

I’d say the way Big Mom specifically talks about Whitebeard puts them above.

Look at how she mentioned the Yonko in WCI when discussing Lokis failed marriage:
“I’d have defeated Shanks, Kaido, and EVEN WHITEBEARD…” Big Mom herself put Whitebeard on a level separate from Shanks and Kaido. Everything we’ve seen and heard from she and Kaido consistently keeps Roger and WB (and Shiki/Garp/Sengoku by extension) as a separate level back in their primes

 

[park_min young]

Is it just me or does Whitebeard’s face look way off? It’s like Oda forgot how to draw him, man looks like Phineas throughout the chapter.

 

[Tora]

Yep. Just because Garp is his father and Luffy being his son, doesn‘t mean a teen Dragon needed to be strong..

I mean he still took a beam of a Holy Knight and ran away with Shanks. That is a W

Actually I bet out of the 3 Luffy was probably the strongest as a 17 year old.

Probably.

Luffy is definitely the one with the fastest growth at their age.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Yep. Just because Garp is his father and Luffy being his son, doesn‘t mean a teen Dragon needed to be strong..

I mean he still took a beam of a Holy Knight and ran away with Shanks. That is a W

Actually I bet out of the 3 Luffy was probably the strongest as a 17 year old.

Garp was beating up tigers on his own when he was 6. I feel like Garp was absolutely the strongest 17 year old.

 

[Philosoraptor]

I’d say the way Big Mom specifically talks about Whitebeard puts them above.

Look at how she mentioned the Yonko in WCI when discussing Lokis failed marriage:
“I’d have defeated Shanks, Kaido, and EVEN WHITEBEARD…” Big Mom herself put Whitebeard on a level separate from Shanks and Kaido. Everything we’ve seen and heard from she and Kaido consistently keeps Roger and WB (and Shiki/Garp/Sengoku by extension) as a separate level back in their primes

Both GV BM and Emperor BM thinks she can take on WB.

Without overanalyzing confirmation bias you can easily read that the World puts WB on a different pedestal for being more famous or having a superior limelight.

It's much easier to read this as intended then trying to make words pitted against each other, just for the sake of your position to be right

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Both GV BM and Emperor BM thinks she can take on WB.

Without overanalyzing confirmation bias you can easily read that the World puts WB on a different pedestal for being more famous or having a superior limelight.

It's much easier to read this as intended then trying to make words pitted against each other, just for the sake of your position to be right

Emperor BM didn’t think she’d beat WB Without the army of Elbaf. She never showed that she was confident she’d beat him without them.

 

[ZenZu]

I understand your point but so far nothing precisely puts old generation above likes of Kaido / Big Mom. Yes they do have a slightly better portrayal but that alone is not nearly enough. Maybe end of GV will reveal more about their power levels.

The only thing holding this generation of pirates back is Kaidou. He is an Oden victim, Oden is arguably 4th in Roger Pirates pecking order, but at the very least he is clearly below RogerBeard.

If we didn't know Kaidou was an Oden victim I would be open to Kaidou above or atleast equal with those guys but it's too much of a reach as it stands.

 

[Redditworstgencancer]

Garp was beating up tigers on his own when he was 6. I feel like Garp was absolutely the strongest 17 year old.

Dependable if Garp with 17 could beat Enel, Sir Crocodile, Gecko Moriah, Rob Lucci, survive Magellan and even go cause havoc at Marineford. He also „tanked“ a punch of Sengoku in his buddha form

Maybe he could. who knows

 

[Philosoraptor]

Emperor BM didn’t think she’d beat WB Without the army of Elbaf. She never showed that she was confident she’d beat him without them.

Yes she did. The army reference was regarding WB's own army.

She literally believed she can no diff him. Delusional but still affirms her mindset

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Yes she did. Any army reference was regarding WB's own army.

She literally believed she can no diff him. Delusional but still affirms her mindset

When she mentioned Elbafs army she didn’t mention Whitebeards army, just that she’d finally be able to beat Whitebeard himself.

 

[Tora]

Since Dragon notice Garp's presence here, I'm really hoping to see Dragon and Garp interaction during this flashback.

I'm interested to see the dynamics between the two.