General & Others Balance of Powers of the Marines, Yonko and Shichibukai

[kom5]

The WG arent a factor. The THREE world powers are the marines, shichibukai and yonko. Garp said 2 of the world powers are allied against the remaining one.

The yonko being disunited of course plays a factor, as it keeps the yonko in a deadlock but the WG still needs the marines+shichibukia and rival their strength and influence combined as it convinces people to become an outlaw or not.

If the Marines+Shichibukai are only as strong a single yonko crew, how come they are still around when they are scattered across 170 countries?

They arent Marines HQ and Shichibukai are stronger than a single Yonko but not that they can stomp them that means the top brasses of a yonko can match them

If we take MF
Wb hadnt got Oden his first mate fighter and got stabbed which also triggered his illness despite that the HQ and Shichibukai didnt destroy the WBP in fact the WBP penetrate the Marineford defense despite outnumbered so the edaquate

Admiral= Yonko is far from it

Its YC executive=<Admiral

 

[Uncle Van]

They arent Marines HQ and Shichibukai are stronger than a single Yonko but not that they can stomp them that means the top brasses of a yonko can match them

If we take MF
Wb hadnt got Oden his first mate fighter and got stabbed which also triggered his illness despite that the HQ and Shichibukai didnt destroy the WBP in fact the WBP penetrate the Marineford defense despite outnumbered so the edaquate

Admiral= Yonko is far from it

Its YC executive=<Admiral

The wording is making it hard to understand.

WB was decisively stronger than an emperor and same goes for his crew. An emperor typically has 3 commanders and WB had 6 to 7, one of them being a top tier(Oden). Over the years, the WBP got nerfed to the level of a standard yonkp crew and they got crushed by the Marines.

-the admrials could go all out
-WBP got reinforcements
-3 of the warlords helped the WBP
-Not all the Marines were present in MF as they were still scattered through out the world
-Garp and Sengoku mostly watched
-Only notable losses for the Marines were John Giant and Lonz.

Individual power levels hardly matter. Marines were the much stronger force. Even Kaido, despite having the much stronger army, was afraid of BM starting a war with her small group on his territory.

 

[Luffy is the mc]

The balance works as long as the yonko are not allied. I think the alliance between luffy and law really broke the wheels.
There is no balance anymore. No more warlords, 2 yonko allied, the marines don't know what to do.
Pre ts it was perfect, I think there was an implicit agreement where nobody was doing anything against the other because it would mean too much casualties on each side.

Now it's too late. Can't wait to see the final war and the battles and events that will precede it.

 

[Ravagerblade]

Whitebeard Pirates are weaker than the others Yonko crews... they piggybacked onto Whitebeards coattails all their life.

 

[Warchief Sanji D Goat]

Great post as always @Van :cheers: I agree with you especially when it comes to influence and balance in this OP world. Once the wheel broke (For example, when Luffy took down a Warlords or when a Yonko got killed or even when a Admiral got stepped down) the balance is no more. It's just chaos at that point

 

[ShinmenTakezo]

I disagree that individual powers do not matter, the top tiers are like the equivalent of nuclear bombs in the One Piece world, and matching each side´s amount of bombs is crucial, hence you had something like cold war and race of arms in the real world.

Having said that, yes, people do not understand the intricacies of the balance, goes right above their heads.

 

[HA001]

I disagree that individual powers do not matter, the top tiers are like the equivalent of nuclear bombs in the One Piece world, and matching each side´s amount of bombs is crucial, hence you had something like cold war and race of arms in the real world.

Having said that, yes, people do not understand the intricacies of the balance, goes right above their heads.

One of the biggest reasons of the balance is fear of a third party taking advantage.
2 forces could go at it even if one wins they will be severely weakened and a third party can take advantage. Heck in marineford vs wb pirates we had kaido a yonko try jump in and had shanks another yonko there too (after stopping kaido)

 

[ShinmenTakezo]

One of the biggest reasons of the balance is fear of a third party taking advantage.
2 forces could go at it even if one wins they will be severely weakened and a third party can take advantage. Heck in marineford vs wb pirates we had kaido a yonko try jump in and had shanks another yonko there too (after stopping kaido)

Yep, the balance as it is is something that could potentially happen down the line, it´s to be prepared for the worst case scenario.
That´s why even Yonkou meeting, let alone fighting, can have serious consequences.
Of course if they can take care of each other, it would be beneficial for the WG, but the seas getting restless will create a situation in which down the line, a single power could emerge encompassing them all, and then you would have a force that can extremely push the entire WG with its forces.
And now we have such a situation, BM and Kaidou allying can lead to possibly matching the WG down the line (hence why Akainu says the balance can tip against them, not that it already has, which would be if it was just regarding one Yonkou), considering then can draw in other powers now which are not their match.
This train of thought was what Garp alluded to here https://v217.mangabeast.com/manga/One-Piece/0907-006.png

 

[kom5]

The wording is making it hard to understand.

WB was decisively stronger than an emperor and same goes for his crew. An emperor typically has 3 commanders and WB had 6 to 7, one of them being a top tier(Oden). Over the years, the WBP got nerfed to the level of a standard yonkp crew and they got crushed by the Marines.

-the admrials could go all out
-WBP got reinforcements
-3 of the warlords helped the WBP
-Not all the Marines were present in MF as they were still scattered through out the world
-Garp and Sengoku mostly watched
-Only notable losses for the Marines were John Giant and Lonz.

Individual power levels hardly matter. Marines were the much stronger force. Even Kaido, despite having the much stronger army, was afraid of BM starting a war with her small group on his territory.

As I told I'm from germany and grammar is not my strong point

WB was not he was equal to them no Yonko is significantly stronger than the other there is a gap but not that big
And whats more MF WB was far from yonko level

he couldnt even properly use COO while in Wano he sensed Oden miles far also he didnt use advanced haki to stab Kuzan if he would then even if Kuzan would create a hole the invisible armour would hit Kuzan haki wise he was down to minumum level

physically he was in bad condition despite that he held his own against the marines
So MF-WB just shows how big a gap exist between a healthy yonko and a admiral

This didnt go all out argument is also true for Marco who didnt go hybird mode also for Vista and WB didnt also go all out or couldnt go all out

for the crew dynamic
WB lost Oden his VC-level fighter and WB nerfed himself the grew gathered more followeres the quality did go down by losing Oden and Thatch
Also the decreasing health of WB

At all BMP and BP seem to be stronger
BMP are far bigger
BP are in a competition with each other
for the top three WB had
Oden, Marco and Vista

WB got reinforcement but the marines got the pacifista whic turned the tide of the battle for 1 hour and half the battle was equally fought until the pacifista appeared

Yes the marines are a greater force but they gathered there most elite soldier from all over the world together so WB fought the core elite troops of the marines

Yes they did because WB was on death doors the assassination did a good work

Of course youre right the marines are a greater force but the equation 1 Yonko= 1 Admiral cant be true otherwise
In fact its 1YC= 1 Admiral

 

[Sanji D Cook]

This was an interesting read. My take on the balance is that you have the 4 Emperors on one side and on the other you have the 7 Warlords and the Navy. 1vs1 match does not equate into this. It's all 4 Emperors vs the 7 Warlords and the full might of Navy.

 

[Veljko]

Yonko alliance have stronger force
With 4 Yonko they could >=<{depends on your opinion but i belive YONKO shall High diff any Admiral expect Akainu who gonna get extreme high diff}
Then unlike Navy Yonko have at least 12 high tiers (top commanders) and for sure over 20 veterans combined, we saw WBP allied captains clash with notable named VAs and Momonga and Boa interactions, then Maynard and Bastille types of VA,
Just by sheer power Yonko team wins,
Resources while very important doesn’t mean win, there were examples of in history for this.

 

[Trueprodigy]

They arent Marines HQ and Shichibukai are stronger than a single Yonko but not that they can stomp them that means the top brasses of a yonko can match them

If we take MF
Wb hadnt got Oden his first mate fighter and got stabbed which also triggered his illness despite that the HQ and Shichibukai didnt destroy the WBP in fact the WBP penetrate the Marineford defense despite outnumbered so the edaquate

Admiral= Yonko is far from it

Its YC executive=<Admiral

This is utter nonsense. It CANNOT be the case. Not only through feats, but through a world balance perspective. Kaido one shot commander level luffy, are you implying an emperor can one shot an admiral? Not only that, but if an admiral attacked kaido the way luffy did, they would do little to no damage too??? XDDDDDDDDDDD

 

[kom5]

This is utter nonsense. It CANNOT be the case. Not only through feats, but through a world balance perspective. Kaido one shot commander level luffy, are you implying an emperor can one shot an admiral? Not only that, but if an admiral attacked kaido the way luffy did, they would do little to no damage too??? XDDDDDDDDDDD

exactly due balance perspective it had to be like that otherwise if admiral=yonko
then why did they even bother gather 100k against wb plus shichibukai

In fact WB quite weakend two shoted Akainu and Kaido can prob do that too
In fact Kaido hit Luffys face it was a sucker punch if he would hit other parts I dont thing it would be a one shot anyway what Kaido did to Luffy he could do to an admiral

 

[Shiroyru]

Don Chinjao says Admirals=Yonko "You think you can beat the Yonko and the Admirals and become the Pirateking?"

Luffy says Admirals=Yonko "I don't care if It's an Admiral or a Yonko I won't run anymore" + "I've already taken on guys like them" as an answer to Caesar threatening him about being backed up by Kaido+Doffy

Feats says Admirals=Yonko (Marineford nuff said + Garp and Sengoku being recognized by Roger as rivals)

Story says Admirals = Yonko (4 Emperors+their crews = Marine HQ+Shichibukai, 4 Yonko=3Admirals+FA, Shichibukai are there to make up for YCs being >> VA as a whole)

Promotional material says Admirals=Yonko (Shanks as strong as an Admiral according to magazines, same magazines Yonko wankers tried to use as solid evidence countless times)

Delusional 10 years old fanboys says Yonko>Admirals, same crowd of people that were saying Doffy was close to Kuzan's level back in the days btw.

Can you please explain to me how Marines + Warlords = all 4 Yonko? Even if we say Yonko = Admiral:

4 Yonko = Fleet Admiral + 3 Admirals
Beckman + Roo + Yasopp beat Mihawk
The All Stars = Garp (I doubt that Garp could actually take all 3 at once)
The Sweet Commanders = Sengoku (I doubt that Sengoku could actually take all 3 at once)
Marco = Doffy + Crocodile
Jozu = Kuma (doubt Kuma is actually this strong)
Vista = Hancock
Ace = Jinbe+ Moriah (even though Ace is clearly stronger)


This leaves WB’s 12 other Division Commanders, Shanks’s 5 other elite fighters, Big Mom’s 5 Vets, Kaido’s Flying 5, Whitebeard’s 43 allied captains, Big Mom’s 75 other children as well as her other fighters like Tamago and Pekoms, Kaido’s ~50 headliners, Kaido’s 500 Gifters, Kaido’s 10 Numbers, all of Orochi’s forces, and whatever low tiers Shanks has, and the giant army of fodders that the Yonko have vs the Vice Admirals and 100000 Marines. The Marines get stomped

 

[Uncle Van]

Can you please explain to me how Marines + Warlords = all 4 Yonko? Even if we say Yonko = Admiral:

4 Yonko = Fleet Admiral + 3 Admirals
Beckman + Roo + Yasopp beat Mihawk
The All Stars = Garp (I doubt that Garp could actually take all 3 at once)
The Sweet Commanders = Sengoku (I doubt that Sengoku could actually take all 3 at once)
Marco = Doffy + Crocodile
Jozu = Kuma (doubt Kuma is actually this strong)
Vista = Hancock
Ace = Jinbe+ Moriah (even though Ace is clearly stronger)


This leaves WB’s 12 other Division Commanders, Shanks’s 5 other elite fighters, Big Mom’s 5 Vets, Kaido’s Flying 5, Whitebeard’s 43 allied captains, Big Mom’s 75 other children as well as her other fighters like Tamago and Pekoms, Kaido’s ~50 headliners, Kaido’s 500 Gifters, Kaido’s 10 Numbers, all of Orochi’s forces, and whatever low tiers Shanks has, and the giant army of fodders that the Yonko have vs the Vice Admirals and 100000 Marines. The Marines get stomped

Marines+Shichibukai~4 Yonko because the manga said so. Garp's statement directly told you so.

This is nothing but made up statistics on your part.

 

[Shiroyru]

Marines+Shichibukai~4 Yonko because the manga said so. Garp's statement directly told you so.

This is nothing but made up statistics on your part.

So ignore the obvious because of your subjective interpretation of a statement?

 

[Uncle Van]

So ignore the obvious because of your subjective interpretation of a statement?

You talking about you denying direct statements because it doesnt fit your power scaling? Yes.

We have a direct statement that has been supported throughout the series. Garp said Yonko, Shichibukai and Yonko are the 3 Great Powers and 2 of these great powers are allied to counter balance the Emperors. What exactly is subjective about that?

You don't have to say statements are illegitimate just because it doesnt fit your power scaling.

 

[Extravlad]

Sengoku expected WB to be WSM before Marineford

Then he admitted he had underestimated WB during Marineford

And went on to call him greater than any other pirate alive after Marineford

There's no way around it, MF WB > Sengoku's expectation of WB > rest of the Yonko

Beckman + Roo + Yasopp beat Mihawk

Based on what? Could these 3 beat their captain Shanks? Mihawk is even stronger than Shanks.

The All Stars = Garp (I doubt that Garp could actually take all 3 at once)

Garp beats them. An injured Sakazuki was taking on all commanders bar Jozu and Ace and was winning.


4 Yonko = 3 Admirals + FA
Garp+Sengoku is a monstrous force that no one but the Yonko themselves can handle on the Pirate sides.
Shichibukai + these 2 + strong VAs like the nearly Admirals candidates+Tsuru are more than enough to handle the top YC commanders, then we've already seen Momonga,Dobberman,Onigumo being able to go toe to toe with NW Captains which should be comparable to Veterans

 

[Shiroyru]

You talking about you denying direct statements because it doesnt fit your power scaling? Yes.

We have a direct statement that has been supported throughout the series. Garp said Yonko, Shichibukai and Yonko are the 3 Great Powers and 2 of these great powers are allied to counter balance the Emperors. What exactly is subjective about that?

You don't have to say statements are illegitimate just because it doesnt fit your power scaling.

Because a part of the balance of powers is that the Yonko are each other’s enemies...

Post automatically merged: Nov 20, 2020

Sengoku expected WB to be WSM before Marineford

Then he admitted he had underestimated WB during Marineford

And went on to call him greater than any other pirate alive after Marineford

There's no way around it, MF WB > Sengoku's expectation of WB > rest of the Yonko


Based on what? Could these 3 beat their captain Shanks? Mihawk is even stronger than Shanks.


Garp beats them. An injured Sakazuki was taking on all commanders bar Jozu and Ace and was winning.


4 Yonko = 3 Admirals + FA
Garp+Sengoku is a monstrous force that no one but the Yonko themselves can handle on the Pirate sides.
Shichibukai + these 2 + strong VAs like the nearly Admirals candidates+Tsuru are more than enough to handle the top YC commanders, then we've already seen Momonga,Dobberman,Onigumo being able to go toe to toe with NW Captains which should be comparable to Veterans

Akainu had HALF OF THE MARINES supporting him. The DCs weren’t even fighting him like 1 minute later

 

[JazzMazz]

Like, the marines and the warlords of the sea hold a military advantage over the forces of an emperor, providing they don’t do something crazy like team up or anything like that...