Controversial Beckman pretty much neg diffed Wano Kidd

[Thaidakar]

I said specifically “assuming the BB Pirates fight will take place on Elbaf”

These are basically how strong the straw hats should be when Luffy becomes Pirate King.

Do you still support this assessment?
Technically I agree but, no trolling, I can't imagine sanji ever being close to Akainu. Robin and Franky need heavy haki improvements to reach these levels. Oda didn't even bother to give Brook and Franky any haki feats so far. Franky oneshot an admiral, yes. But I wished he'd have shown some Haki feats before. Brook has so much potential too.

Imo current Shanks (and some others) are already above prime WB. I see no rule that prevents them from being strobger than a guy who roared the seas 20+ years ago.

What the SHPs need to improve are panels. Panel time. But post-wano Oda doesn't seem to care about them at all unfortunately. The screentime gap is bigger than ever before and Sanji is the last SH that barely reaches the numbers he should. Everyone below is basically an actual side character for world building.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Do you still support this assessment?
Technically I agree but, no trolling, I can't imagine sanji ever being close to Akainu. Robin and Franky need heavy haki improvements to reach these levels. Oda didn't even bother to give Brook and Franky any haki feats so far. Franky oneshot an admiral, yes. But I wished he'd have shown some Haki feats before. Brook has so much potential too.

Imo current Shanks (and some others) are already above prime WB. I see no rule that prevents them from being strobger than a guy who roared the seas 20+ years ago.

What the SHPs need to improve are panels. Panel time. But post-wano Oda doesn't seem to care about them at all unfortunately. The screentime gap is bigger than ever before and Sanji is the last SH that barely reaches the numbers he should. Everyone below is basically an actual side character for world building.

I still stand by it that Pirate King Luffy’s crew should stand here.

I just have not seen anything from Shanks to put him on Primebeards level, I think he’s a solid tier below. Shanks imo is Prime Ray level, not Roger level. Shanks’ haki was compared to Rayleighs by Oda in an SBS, but not Roger’s. If Shanks does have Roger’s haki level (I need to see something more than what he’s shown to assume that) that still just means that Shanks is comparable to a Gura-less Primebeard.

IMO Franky and Robin don’t need haki since they’ve already shown that their unique abilities can already handle haki users and I’m sure Frankys tech is going to get even more nutty. And Robin will gain new abilities too.

And Sanji imo has shown the potential to hit Sakazuki level by the time Luffy becomes the Pirate King. His current level already gives him… unique abilities that shocked even Kizaru.

 

[BigAmmi]

That sucks I hope you heal fast

The only argument to use against who consider mihawk stronger than roger

It's more than enough

 

[MonsterKaido]

Benn has no feats, taking Kids arm aint that special.

Problem is his screen time. Rayleigh is so much more popular and hyped that people have a hard time seeing Shanks having a Prime Ray level character alongside him. Even now many people put Prime Ray equal to or in same tier as Shanks (to the point that Prime Ray is placed even above Mihawk).

I dont know which Zboys want to downplay Benn but so far he just hasnt shown much and all thats going for him is that he is mid gen equivalent of Ray and Zoro and that databook statement of him being equal to Shanks.

In contrast Kings stocks have been sky rocketing in Egghead, there is legit argument for him being one of the strongest RHMs only behind Prime Ray/Oden/Zoro etc.

Kata fans are retards to think he is above any other YC1

Monster King

 

[сука]

The only argument to use against who consider mihawk stronger than roger

It's more than enough

The ONLY argument against Mihawk > Roger is an insult?

So essentially you acknowledge there is no canon argument against Mihawk > Roger. Fair enough.

 

[BigAmmi]

I just have not seen anything from Shanks to put him on Primebeards level, I think he’s a solid tier below..

And this is the only possible outcome here.

It's very simple: prime shanks is even canonically weaker than old wb (not sick wb). There is a canon title who put wb stronger than shanks even in his old days. Roger was as strong as prime wb. And, of course, prime wb is strong/way stronger than the old version of himself.

Prime wb = prime roger > shanks, is canon.

Shanks is not even on their level. Having shanks above them is simply ridiculous. Is the level that prime luffy will reach.

We can't know exactly how much stronger roger was, but we at least know for sure that he was stronger than him.

Facts, not opinions.

Post automatically merged: Tuesday at 4:06 PM

The ONLY argument against Mihawk > Roger is an insult?

So essentially you acknowledge there is no canon argument against Mihawk > Roger. Fair enough.

Stop quote me, you are brainless

I don't talk with trolls

 

[Finalbeta]

The RH Pirates are something else.

Even Kaido and his crew chose not to step on their boots.

 

[grey matter]

Doubt that, if their haki is equal and if Shanks has shown better attack (comparing their DDs) then this CQC advantage is head canon.

Kaido ranked them equal

Kaido ranked them as just characters capable of fighting him.
That doesn't mean equal.

It can mean fight and lose extreme diff (bare minimum criteria to be present in his "top 5"), or fight and win (here extreme diff or even stomp doesn't matter).

If haki is equal, physicals make the difference.
Roger can go for two handed swing with more power behind it, something Shanks can't do anymore.

I said specifically “assuming the BB Pirates fight will take place on Elbaf”

These are basically how strong the straw hats should be when Luffy becomes Pirate King.

Commanders are kinda a big deal.
Can't see anyone aside from Franky making it to even Jack-Queen, by end of series.

Sanji becoming as strong as Akainu even EoS is doubtful, let alone post BBP fight.

Jinbe already peaked, dude isn't touching low top tier.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Kaido ranked them as just characters capable of fighting him.
That doesn't mean equal.

It can mean fight and lose extreme diff (bare minimum criteria to be present in his "top 5"), or fight and win (here extreme diff or even stomp doesn't matter).

If haki is equal, physicals make the difference.
Roger can go for two handed swing with more power behind it, something Shanks can't do anymore.



Commanders are kinda a big deal.
Can't see anyone aside from Franky making it to even Jack-Queen, by end of series.

Sanji becoming as strong as Akainu even EoS is doubtful, let alone post BBP fight.

Jinbe already peaked, dude isn't touching low top tier.

Commanders are a big deal to current yonko standards, but this is a pirate king crew. Franky incorporating some ancient Kingdom tech from Egghead would definitely give him the potential to hit this level.

And Sakazuki is a big deal; but Sanjis a wing of the pirate king. He needs to be a top tier when Luffy becomes King of the Pirates cause just as Luffy should be ~ Roger, and Zoro should be ~ Roger’s second strongest (Rayleigh imo) Sanji should be ~ Roger’s third strongest (Oden imo) and of course all this is the assumption that the BBP are the final step before Raftel.

And maybe Low top tier is the wrong term, Jinbe is a special individual to scale cause he’s location based. Imo we’ll see Jinbe fight at a coast (like in his fight with Ace) during the BBP fight and he’ll be comparable to a billion berry commander, which will mean underwater he’ll be even above that.

 

[grey matter]

Commanders are a big deal to current yonko standards, but this is a pirate king crew. Franky incorporating some ancient Kingdom tech from Egghead would definitely give him the potential to hit this level.

And Sakazuki is a big deal; but Sanjis a wing of the pirate king. He needs to be a top tier when Luffy becomes King of the Pirates cause just as Luffy should be ~ Roger, and Zoro should be ~ Roger’s second strongest (Rayleigh imo) Sanji should be ~ Roger’s third strongest (Oden imo) and of course all this is the assumption that the BBP are the final step before Raftel.

And maybe Low top tier is the wrong term, Jinbe is a special individual to scale cause he’s location based. Imo we’ll see Jinbe fight at a coast (like in his fight with Ace) during the BBP fight and he’ll be comparable to a billion berry commander, which will mean underwater he’ll be even above that.

Yeah, Franky is the only character with hope to get to mid or even upper commander levels.
Oda is certainly building him up well, his stocks are high in Egghead
With basic haki and some ancient tech, possible to maybe even get to high commander level EoS.

I don't doubt Sanji being top tier EoS at all. I am even fairly certain he would be. I have EoS Sanji ~ Aokiji/Kizaru.
Akainu however is a high-end top tier IMO, could just be me overrating him for narrative reasons tho.

Anyway, Oden was a temp member of Roger pirates. He was basically the Rayleigh of Whitebeard, with a slightly lesser portrayal (partner vs little brother).
Sanji of Roger pirates was Scopper.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Yeah, Franky is the only character with hope to get to mid or even upper commander levels.
Oda is certainly building him up well, his stocks are high in Egghead
With basic haki and some ancient tech, possible to maybe even get to high commander level EoS.

I don't doubt Sanji being top tier EoS at all. I am even fairly certain he would be. I have EoS Sanji ~ Aokiji/Kizaru.
Akainu however is a high-end top tier IMO, could just be me overrating him for narrative reasons tho.

Anyway, Oden was a temp member of Roger pirates. He was basically the Rayleigh of Whitebeard, with a slightly lesser portrayal (partner vs little brother).
Sanji of Roger pirates was Scopper.

I’m not talking about individual characters. I’m talking about Luffys pirate crew is going to be ~ Roger’s when he becomes Pirate king at worse. As such, yes that does include Sanji at minimum being ~ the third strongest Roger Pirate when Roger became pirate king which is Oden minimum. Even if you consider oden a temp member, he’s still part of the pirate kings crew and is referred to as such.

And I personally have Oden around Akainu tbh which is why I say post BB Sanji (assuming BB is the final fight prior to Luffy becoming pirate king) will be about Sakazuki level. Just like I have Prime Rayleigh at Shanks level.

After all, there’s no reason to assume Oda would make Luffys PK crew weaker than Roger’s.

 

[сука]

Stop quote me, you are brainless

I don't talk with trolls

Your Freudian slip, not mine. Take it out on yourself instead of insulting me you little cuck.

 

[BigAmmi]

Your Freudian slip, not mine. Take it out on yourself instead of insulting me you little cuck.

Go to a therapist, you need urgent help and medication

Mihawk won't save your life, it's time to turn off your pc and live your life

Good luck

 

[сука]

Go to a therapist, you need urgent help and medication

Mihawk won't save your life, it's time to turn off your pc and live your life

Good luck

 

[BoaHancocksHusband]

Its not really comparable tbh

by portrayal, Beckman can probably low diff Doffy

Maybe

Post automatically merged: Tuesday at 9:11 PM

Go to a therapist, you need urgent help and medication

Mihawk won't save your life, it's time to turn off your pc and live your life

Good luck

Mihawk>>>>>mook rat

 

[Shiroyru]

Zoro fans don't hate Ben
They simply, rightly, assume that Zoro claps Ben.

 

[Monster Zoro's Tesla Supplier]

The RH Pirates are something else.

Even Kaido and his crew chose not to step on their boots.

One: Kaido only went there with King. Not his entire crew.
Two: It's not because RHP > BP (even if that's true, Kaido not having a long fight with Shanks and his goonies isn't proof of that), it's because fighting them would take a long time no matter the outcome and thus they ywouldn't make it to Marineford on time.

 

[BoaHancocksHusband]

Get Ben Beckmann past current Brook or Jinbe

Post automatically merged: Wednesday at 12:10 AM

Yup just like Doflamingo neg diffed Wano Law

Law is a bigger fraud than Kidd and everyone should know this

Gassed up by Oda cuz he's "popular".
Given Zenkai boosts on par with Cucklin er I mean Krillin after years of not training in the Android and Cell Saga.
Same thing with Crocodile.
Oda goes out of his way to disrespect characters like Moria that are unpopular with the fanbase
Same with Kidd

 

[Finalbeta]

One: Kaido only went there with King. Not his entire crew.
Two: It's not because RHP > BP (even if that's true, Kaido not having a long fight with Shanks and his goonies isn't proof of that), it's because fighting them would take a long time no matter the outcome and thus they ywouldn't make it to Marineford on time.

Isn't that just a theory that he was only accompanied by King?

While Kaido was considered WSC Whitebeard was also considered WSM but we all know Whitebeard lost his title when it comes to reality so titles are not necessarily absolute.

I'm not saying Shanks > Kaido is a given, but holds a level of probability not to discard entirely.