General & Others Crew duos + a standout

[yorosenpai]

It funny that this cover has more character that are way more popular than the Yonkos who should be their superior.
Zoro&Katakuri&Sabo&Marco are in the top 20 popularity all around the world. What a bad job is doing Oda with the Yonko (not even reaching the top 50 with 2 whole arc dedicate to them)

Second in command are more popular aka giving more money to Oda enterprise aka are more important for Oda

 

[Albino 👑]

It means even if Ray loses to Shanks it would be a high diff fight, them both having comparable CoC and now being used in combat that means a lot.

If it said the absolute most amount of Fishman they'd be able to defeat even if there were more than yes but it doesn't say that
If you can beat up 7 out of a group of 20 ten year olds before but the hulk and mike Tyson can beat up all 20 does that mean those 2 are on the same level?

 

[Marimo_420]

Cope.

Old Ray ~ < Prime Shanks.

Prime Ray > your headcannon.

 

[mly90]

Ray> Oden> Scopper
Oden> Marco> Ace
King> Yamato> Queen
Shiryu> Aokiji> Lafitte

Ray is depicted as the Pirate Kings partner and hinted to have been WSS which automaticałly puts him above Oden. With training Oden might have got closer but who says Ray stopped? He is in top shape swimming the calm belt at 77.

Oden was depicted as Worlds strongest mans little brother, to strong to be a son (underling) automaticałly puts him above young Marco and young Ace. Marco is at his peak clearly below Oden. Whitebeard stated Oden > Ace but Ace had potential to be Pirate King.

King is depicted to the strongest BP commander. BMP-crew clearly respect him a lot and BM even wanted him to join. Yamato, a wild card outside the crew, is a prodigy with Kaido-level potential but in my opinion has yet to surpass King. Kaido seemed to hold back a lot even though he said the opposite, it looked like tough love similar to Garp.

Shiryu was depicted to be equal to Magellan who is leagues above Jinbei, Ivankov, Crocodile. With New World exposure and a new Devil fruit his power level has risen. Aokiji on the other hand lacks a leg and a arm so he is weaker even though he can compensate.

This is perfect the ranking that makes most sense

 

[ConquistadoR]

Oden's armament is just as advanced as the scabbards and zoro if not more so do none of them have that technique of armament down?

Ray and shanks being able to knock out all 100,000 there still doesn't mean if there were 100 million they'd be able to ko the same amount. It also doesn't mean other conquerors couldn't either because even fmi luffy could ko half of them. It just means they could ko all Fishman available there

And thats an sbs question from vol 65 when we were still in fmi. The only people that were confirmed to use coc were luffy, ray, shanks, boa, and whitebeard at the time.

Rays best haki feat is breaking chains odens best haki feat is scaring kaido

Oden's Armament is the same thing as the Scabbards and Zoro. Barrier Haki.

Rayleigh's Armament is a level above that lol. Its the same thing that Luffy does. And ONLY Luffy and Rayleigh have used that technique in the series till date.

The point isnt about whether Rayleigh would be as strong as Shanks when it comes to basic CoC not at all. Oda chose to put Rayleigh in the same conversation as Shanks and Whitebeard twice when he was given the chance.

Zoro scarred Kaido and the near EoS version of Zoro is Rayleigh.

Roger didn't scar Kaido as well so is Oden's feat above Roger? No lol, it simply means they didn't fight in a 1v1 like that.

 

[Albino 👑]

Oden's Armament is the same thing as the Scabbards and Zoro. Barrier Haki.

Rayleigh's Armament is a level above that lol. Its the same thing that Luffy does. And ONLY Luffy and Rayleigh have used that technique in the series till date.

The point isnt about whether Rayleigh would be as strong as Shanks when it comes to basic CoC not at all. Oda chose to put Rayleigh in the same conversation as Shanks and Whitebeard twice when he was given the chance.

Zoro scarred Kaido and the near EoS version of Zoro is Rayleigh.

Roger didn't scar Kaido as well so is Oden's feat above Roger? No lol, it simply means they didn't fight in a 1v1 like that.

Ngl surprised to hear you say luffy has better armament mastery than zoro 🗿
Tho doesn't the fact that theyre able to draw blood and cut kaido imply zoro and the scabbards can bypass his scales eith their armament. Like maybe its the case but i feel like it feels weird that "basic" barrier haki can bypass kaido. Especially with it being a technique zoro knew prior to wana but still wasn't able to hurt kaido like the other scabbards without the enma boost

Yes because rayleigh was extremely strong and was a top tier pirate in his prime. I just think oden was even stronger

Only reason i mentioned it is because you said feat wise oden has never done anything on the level of rayleigh which isn't true. If were specifically talking feat wise tho a characters strength in relation to another 90% of the time isn't about feats but portrayal and hype in comparison

 

[123456]

If Oden > Ray then he will be drawn along with Captains or Great pirates in colour spread

 

[Shanal]

Rayleigh definitely stronger than Oden lol. Garp put Old fucking Rayleigh in same category as Whitebeard in terms of threat to navy during war.

Ace can't tie Marco's shoes. Marco was a fucking Yonko candidate, has far better feats, too.

Only Teach without DF was part of WB pirates. Yami Teach wasn't.

Yamato isn't even part of Kaido's crew. She's literally his enemy.

Also, literally every single person you state is fucking dead or has left the crew. There's a reason why Sabo is there and not Kuma. The cover page represents the most latest right hands- and literally all right hands in present day are stronger than anyone but their captain.

 

[ConquistadoR]

Tho doesn't the fact that theyre able to draw blood and cut kaido imply zoro and the scabbards can bypass his scales eith their armament. Like maybe its the case but i feel like it feels weird that "basic" barrier haki can bypass kaido. Especially with it being a technique zoro knew prior to wana but still wasn't able to hurt kaido like the other scabbards without the enma boost

The scabbards barely cut Kaido. Paper cuts at best and stuff he casually healed from.
Zoro's Tatsumaki overpowered Kaido's tatsumaki and cut his scales. Ashura perma scarred him.
If you're talking about the Rengoku Onigiri, there was no koka on the swords.

Yes because rayleigh was extremely strong and was a top tier pirate in his prime. I just think oden was even stronger

Rayleigh has everything Oden had and then some with the Internal Destruction CoA. It's obvious who was stronger and Oda even went out of his way to show that with this colour spread.

If were specifically talking feat wise tho a characters strength in relation to another 90% of the time isn't about feats but portrayal and hype in comparison

So what does Oden have over Rayleigh, the person who's been compared to Shanks and Whitebeard by Oda?

 

[Finalbeta]

Prime Rayleigh is absolutely underrated. The guy is supposed to be consistently more powerful than his Old counterpart lacking stamina issues. When we do some calculations he could of been stronger than Kizaru himself eventually or on that general ballpark.

 

[Albino 👑]

The scabbards barely cut Kaido. Paper cuts at best and stuff he casually healed from.
Zoro's Tatsumaki overpowered Kaido's tatsumaki and cut his scales. Ashura perma scarred him.
If you're talking about the Rengoku Onigiri, there was no koka on the swords.

Yes zoro is overall stronger but were specifically talking about armament

And zoro and the scabbards were able to hurt kaido just as much as eachother with them being able to make kaido bleed but not doing any legit "deep cuts". Again specifically when it comes to armament

Zoro who likely knew how to use barrier armament on his swords even before wano was not able to cut kaido like the scabbards before unleashing more of enma. While zoro's attacks are obviously stronger than someone like kiku's they were not actually able to hurt kaido before enma because of armament

Unless zoro never really had legit mastery over barrier armament prior to enma and the way they were all cutting kaido was that with penetration armament being ability needed to scar him

And you dont need hardening on your blades to use armament

Rayleigh has everything Oden had and then some with the Internal Destruction CoA. It's obvious who was stronger and Oda even went out of his way to show that with this colour spread.

Rayleigh has not shown to be able to have the voice of all things or coc coating (if that is what's needed to scar kaido). And if internal armament is needed to cut kaido than oden has definitely shown it

The color spread highlights right hand mans not strongest characters to be under each leader. Same reason Marco is on it but not oden (plus with Oden just being dead🗿)

So what does Oden have over Rayleigh, the person who's been compared to Shanks and Whitebeard

Hype by the world's strongest man, world's strongest creature, pirate king, all of wano, shanks, all had the most massive hard on for Oden and his hype. Even the marines acknowledge how much they all were so hyped on him. Man was an enigma just as the top captains of his generation and still would've been to this day if he was still alive. The man literally popped out the pussy built different.
Rayleigh was definitely a top tier but his hype doesn't compare to odens

 

[ConquistadoR]

Yes zoro is overall stronger but were specifically talking about armament

And zoro and the scabbards were able to hurt kaido just as much as eachother with them being able to make kaido bleed but not doing any legit "deep cuts". Again specifically when it comes to armament

Zoro who likely knew how to use barrier armament on his swords even before wano was not able to cut kaido like the scabbards before unleashing more of enma. While zoro's attacks are obviously stronger than someone like kiku's they were not actually able to hurt kaido before enma because of armament

He didn't even use hardening in Rengoku Onigiri. You may argue he used Armament there but it is definitely not coated with Ryou. And by unleashing Enma, he probably started using hardening + Ryou. Every Ryou user hardens their fist or weapon first in the post timeskip.

And you dont need hardening on your blades to use armament

True but you cannot argue that he used Ryou in that attack when he didn't even use Hardening. Characters have used Armament w/o Hardening but have never used Ryou without Hardening.

Rayleigh has not shown to be able to have the voice of all things or coc coating (if that is what's needed to scar kaido). And if internal armament is needed to cut kaido than oden has definitely shown it

The color spread highlights right hand mans not strongest characters to be under each leader. Same reason Marco is on it but not oden (plus with Oden just being dead🗿)

VOAT is useless in combat.
Rayleigh can use Conquerors Haki comparable to the likes of Shanks and knows to flow his Armament Haki outside of his body - the two essentials of Conquerors coating. Ofcourse he uses Conquerors Coating.

Unless your argument is that Rayleigh, the Haki master who taught Luffy, cannot figure out after a lifetime of travelling and fighting alongside Roger what Luffy figured out in Chapter 1010 after a couple of minutes of fighting Kaido.

The color spread highlights right hand mans not strongest characters to be under each leader. Same reason Marco is on it but not oden (plus with Oden just being dead🗿)

Yes it does. All of them are the second strongest under their Captains. Oden died and Marco was the strongest under his captain. Yamato is not a part of the Beast Pirates and never was under Kaido, ever since the age of 8.

Hype by the world's strongest man, world's strongest creature, pirate king, all of wano, shanks, all had the most massive hard on for Oden and his hype. Even the marines acknowledge how much they all were so hyped on him. Man was an enigma just as the top captains of his generation and still would've been to this day if he was still alive. The man literally popped out the pussy built different.

And still no one ever put him on the same pedestal as Whitebeard and Shanks which Oda did to Rayleigh twice. Rayleigh is stronger lol.

 

[qwe]

Currently I have Oden > Rayleigh
if Rayleigh shows Adcoc and Oden is not drawn in Great Pirates colour spread ( if Oda ever draws it ) then Ray > Oden

 

[Finalbeta]

Oden's AP is massive but when it comes to defensive output he is no match to Zoro. If I had to suggest Zoro is likely robustly superior to Oden but he is also superior to Old Rayleigh as well.

I would have loved to see Oden vs Old Rayleigh happening.

 

[Albino 👑]

didn't even use hardening in Rengoku Onigiri. You may argue he used Armament there but it is definitely not coated with Ryou. And by unleashing Enma, he probably started using hardening + Ryou. Every Ryou user hardens their fist or weapon first in the post timeskip.

Ryuu is armament same as mantra is observation. The scabbards didn't need to harden their blades to cut kaido

True but you cannot argue that he used Ryou in that attack when he didn't even use Hardening. Characters have used Armament w/o Hardening but have never used Ryou without Hardening.

The scabbards

VOAT is useless in combat.
Rayleigh can use Conquerors Haki comparable to the likes of Shanks and knows to flow his Armament Haki outside of his body - the two essentials of Conquerors coating. Ofcourse he uses Conquerors Coating.

Unless your argument is that Rayleigh, the Haki master who taught Luffy, cannot figure out after a lifetime of travelling and fighting alongside Roger what Luffy figured out in Chapter 1010 after a couple of minutes of fighting Kaido.

Its still an ability thar points to Oden being an extremely special person.
Comparable as to both have way stronger coc than Fishman island luffy yes.
Rayleigh probably can but we have to see him do it first. And if thats what Oden used to scar kaido then that means he can use advanced coa too

Yes it does. All of them are the second strongest under their Captains. Oden died and Marco was the strongest under his captain. Yamato is not a part of the Beast Pirates and never was under Kaido, ever since the age of 8.

Second strongest with asterisks
Marco was weaker than oden in the past and was gonna be surpassed by ace in the soon future
Yamato while not "technically" being one kaido himself still had plans of treating him as one with makin him shogun. Just like all the othet all stars have their own region of wano

And still no one ever put him on the same pedestal as Whitebeard and Shanks which Oda did to Rayleigh twice. Rayleigh is stronger lol.

Yes a dead oden that was not known to use till wano was not put in the same sentences as them way beforehand

 

[ConquistadoR]

Rayleigh probably can but we have to see him do it first. And if thats what Oden used to scar kaido then that means he can use advanced coa too

There are TWO levels of advanced CoA itself breh what are you on? There's the barrier one and the internal destruction one. Oden has only used barrier till date while Rayleigh and Luffy alone have used internal destruction.

Marco was weaker than oden in the past and was gonna be surpassed by ace in the soon future
Yamato while not "technically" being one kaido himself still had plans of treating him as one with makin him shogun. Just like all the othet all stars have their own region of wano

Oden died.
And Marco was always stronger than Ace when he was alive. All in all, he's been the VC for the longest and the second strongets WBP for the longest.

Kaido had plans for Yamato and Yamato was legit fighting him on the regular. Yamato was NEVER a subordinate of Kaido and never accepted him as his superior and that's all that counts.

 

[Shanal]

Yes zoro is overall stronger but were specifically talking about armament

And zoro and the scabbards were able to hurt kaido just as much as eachother with them being able to make kaido bleed but not doing any legit "deep cuts". Again specifically when it comes to armament

Zoro who likely knew how to use barrier armament on his swords even before wano was not able to cut kaido like the scabbards before unleashing more of enma. While zoro's attacks are obviously stronger than someone like kiku's they were not actually able to hurt kaido before enma because of armament

Unless zoro never really had legit mastery over barrier armament prior to enma and the way they were all cutting kaido was that with penetration armament being ability needed to scar him

And you dont need hardening on your blades to use armament

Rayleigh has not shown to be able to have the voice of all things or coc coating (if that is what's needed to scar kaido). And if internal armament is needed to cut kaido than oden has definitely shown it

The color spread highlights right hand mans not strongest characters to be under each leader. Same reason Marco is on it but not oden (plus with Oden just being dead🗿)

Hype by the world's strongest man, world's strongest creature, pirate king, all of wano, shanks, all had the most massive hard on for Oden and his hype. Even the marines acknowledge how much they all were so hyped on him. Man was an enigma just as the top captains of his generation and still would've been to this day if he was still alive. The man literally popped out the pussy built different.
Rayleigh was definitely a top tier but his hype doesn't compare to odens

pre-WCI Luffy has shown Voice of All Things, Kaido didn't. Guess he's stronger than Kaido.

Oden has absolutely zero instance of using CoC coating. The only reason we know he even has CoC is because of comments of other people. He's essentially feat-less in its usage.

 

[Monkey D. Luffy]

Zoro > Sanji > Jimbei > etc.
Pica >/= Vergo > Diamante > Trebol, etc.
Katakuri > Smoothie > Cracker > etc.
King > Queen > Jack > etc.
Ben > Shanks's YC2 > Shanks's YC3, etc.
Marco >/= Ace > Jozu > Vista, etc.
Rayleigh >/= Oden > Gaban > Roger's YC3, tc.

 

[Seth]

Oden > rayleigh and scopper

Clown take.

 

[Hanzo hattori]

A 70 year old washed up Rayleigh is the only person to ever make Kizaru bleed on panel lmfao

Sneak attack Kizaru wanted to kill the strawhats