Current Events Did you really expect everyone vs Kaido from start to finish? The 1 vs 1 Luffy vs Kaido was obvious
- Thread starter Mugiwara56
- Start date
What were you expecting? All power creeps are better to be addressed now than at the final war, Oda doesn’t have the luxury of time to write Wano and Kaido’s defeat for 350 chapters. Everybody jumped power levels at a somewhat unsatisfying rate
ACoC was also designed to be the most op powerup. It was hyped up for at least 600 chapters in which admirals and top tiers was even alarmed at a pre-ts Luffy showing it.
You can say that aCoC is what separated top tiers from high tiers, and the jump is enormous once you unlock this specific powerup. Luffy and Zoro for example were already high tiers, so them unlocking this would make them jump to competing with top tiers immediately (at least AP-wise).
You can also say that Luffy’s using aCoC to strengthen his armament haki. That’s why he’s not getting one-shotted anymore, although I’m not sure with this one. ACoC might just be an AP amplifier, but it also looks like it amplifies ryuo when they are used in conjunction. This is what I believe creates the no touch application, so who’s to say that the durability of armament can’t also be amplified
Besides Oda still managed to portray the impressiveness of a yonko, in which Kaido would still take Luffy to an extreme diff slug fest after his stamina’s depleted from all the fighting and lifting a gigantic island
ACoC was also designed to be the most op powerup. It was hyped up for at least 600 chapters in which admirals and top tiers was even alarmed at a pre-ts Luffy showing it.
You can say that aCoC is what separated top tiers from high tiers, and the jump is enormous once you unlock this specific powerup. Luffy and Zoro for example were already high tiers, so them unlocking this would make them jump to competing with top tiers immediately (at least AP-wise).
You can also say that Luffy’s using aCoC to strengthen his armament haki. That’s why he’s not getting one-shotted anymore, although I’m not sure with this one. ACoC might just be an AP amplifier, but it also looks like it amplifies ryuo when they are used in conjunction. This is what I believe creates the no touch application, so who’s to say that the durability of armament can’t also be amplified
Besides Oda still managed to portray the impressiveness of a yonko, in which Kaido would still take Luffy to an extreme diff slug fest after his stamina’s depleted from all the fighting and lifting a gigantic island
No dude you are completely wrong. Oda had no reason at all to make Kaido one-shot Luffy at beginning of Wano and made Luffy getting knocked out so easily by Apoo struggling with Ulti+P1.
There is no logic saying Wano would last 350 chapter without Luffy getting insanely stronger for no reason. Is simply Oda doesn't make Luffy being so weak compared to Yonko. Many like me were already expecting Luffy to be Admiral level since timeskip specially with G4 so the gap shouldn't be one-shot material. Is ridiculous to think Yonkos can literally one-shot their right hands.
CoC wasn't hyped enough to justify ACoC. Pre-timeskip CoC was usefull because power levels were so low that you actually benefits from knocking out fodders with it. But after timeskip CoC is kind of useless(and not much used) because stronger opponents are not affected by it.
If ACoC would be a issue for Marine then Luffy's bounty after Marineford should be much higher, Luffy's bounty after Dressrosa much higher. Only Luffy's bounty after WCI makes sense taking in consideration his CoC.
To me ACoC doesn't separate high from top tiers but immediately puts anyone who has it at top tier rank. To me Luffy was high-high tier before and became low-top tier after. Yamato is a low-top tier stronger than Luffy and Zoro was already low-top tier(weaker than Yamato and current Luffy) and now(since 1010) he is mid-top tier.
Luffy not being knocked out again is unjustified. There is no panel for you to argue that Luffy is using ACoC or any kind of haki while tanking Kaido's blows. And is pure headcannon to say he is using ACoC + Ryou(that is not advanced armament aka internal damage) or anything else.
Top tiers and even lower tiers are portrayed to fight for days so that bullshit excuse that Kaido is getting tired/weakened doesn't fit. Oda is portraying everyone much stronger than early of Wano G4 Luffy for being able to hurt Kaido, including Kid's WWE moves and Law's stones.
Again, Kaido is a Mythical Zoan. Where his DF durability, endurance, strength boost since a Paramecia can rival with it?
There is no logic saying Wano would last 350 chapter without Luffy getting insanely stronger for no reason. Is simply Oda doesn't make Luffy being so weak compared to Yonko. Many like me were already expecting Luffy to be Admiral level since timeskip specially with G4 so the gap shouldn't be one-shot material. Is ridiculous to think Yonkos can literally one-shot their right hands.
CoC wasn't hyped enough to justify ACoC. Pre-timeskip CoC was usefull because power levels were so low that you actually benefits from knocking out fodders with it. But after timeskip CoC is kind of useless(and not much used) because stronger opponents are not affected by it.
If ACoC would be a issue for Marine then Luffy's bounty after Marineford should be much higher, Luffy's bounty after Dressrosa much higher. Only Luffy's bounty after WCI makes sense taking in consideration his CoC.
To me ACoC doesn't separate high from top tiers but immediately puts anyone who has it at top tier rank. To me Luffy was high-high tier before and became low-top tier after. Yamato is a low-top tier stronger than Luffy and Zoro was already low-top tier(weaker than Yamato and current Luffy) and now(since 1010) he is mid-top tier.
Luffy not being knocked out again is unjustified. There is no panel for you to argue that Luffy is using ACoC or any kind of haki while tanking Kaido's blows. And is pure headcannon to say he is using ACoC + Ryou(that is not advanced armament aka internal damage) or anything else.
Top tiers and even lower tiers are portrayed to fight for days so that bullshit excuse that Kaido is getting tired/weakened doesn't fit. Oda is portraying everyone much stronger than early of Wano G4 Luffy for being able to hurt Kaido, including Kid's WWE moves and Law's stones.
Again, Kaido is a Mythical Zoan. Where his DF durability, endurance, strength boost since a Paramecia can rival with it?
Yes there are a lot of inconsistencies such as Apoo knocking out Luffy. The CoC was still the hyped up a decent amount pre-ts, and Oda made sure it remained a mystery so I was personally expecting a Super Saiyan-esque powerup once we finally get to see its use outside of knocking out fodder. Anyways, we all were speculating that CoC was probably the most important powerup even more so than awakening
Maybe Luffy got knocked out the first time because he got hit with a very clean shot, he then trained and got physically stronger and buffer
Anyways, it’s either the first one-shot was the anomaly or Luffy just got stronger. Oda was always inconsistent on how he portrayed Luffy, that’s why a lot are in disbelief and reluctant to put him in top tier now. Example is him vs Ulti, and Apoo. Oda is to blame for that, but I personally always believed that Luffy was far stronger than Apoo and Ulti. Both circumstances, Luffy was just distracted and if he really wanted he would low diff them.
The timeframes regarding the biblical fights of top tiers (3 days, 3 nights) were never accurate. Sanji and Zoro defeated top commanders in 15 minutes. Strawhat fights are an exception to that kind of timeframe, and they’re gonna need to beat the bad guys because of the plot-driven situations (Onigashima annihilating the Flower Capital). That’s why I personally believe that Luffy fighting Katakuri for 12 hours was the better portrayal of a fight on that level. WCI was actually a lot more consistent in terms of powerscaling. My earlier comment of how powercreeps should all happen now still makes sense. At least all matchups for upcoming battles later on won’t feel as cheap and inconsistent as the one in Wano. The problem here is that the Strawhats should have probably had 1 more arc in between Wano. Oda could have given them powerups there, and then things like aCoC in Wano. That would feel more organic I guess.
Maybe Luffy got knocked out the first time because he got hit with a very clean shot, he then trained and got physically stronger and buffer
Anyways, it’s either the first one-shot was the anomaly or Luffy just got stronger. Oda was always inconsistent on how he portrayed Luffy, that’s why a lot are in disbelief and reluctant to put him in top tier now. Example is him vs Ulti, and Apoo. Oda is to blame for that, but I personally always believed that Luffy was far stronger than Apoo and Ulti. Both circumstances, Luffy was just distracted and if he really wanted he would low diff them.
The timeframes regarding the biblical fights of top tiers (3 days, 3 nights) were never accurate. Sanji and Zoro defeated top commanders in 15 minutes. Strawhat fights are an exception to that kind of timeframe, and they’re gonna need to beat the bad guys because of the plot-driven situations (Onigashima annihilating the Flower Capital). That’s why I personally believe that Luffy fighting Katakuri for 12 hours was the better portrayal of a fight on that level. WCI was actually a lot more consistent in terms of powerscaling. My earlier comment of how powercreeps should all happen now still makes sense. At least all matchups for upcoming battles later on won’t feel as cheap and inconsistent as the one in Wano. The problem here is that the Strawhats should have probably had 1 more arc in between Wano. Oda could have given them powerups there, and then things like aCoC in Wano. That would feel more organic I guess.
I agree that CoC was hyped up pre-timeskip. My point is post timeskip. Luffy uses CoC much less than he should. His biggest feat so far is Fishmen Island knocking out 50k fishmen fodders.
He should have used much more against fodders. For example at WCI against those mini people army(not sure what are those).
At Onigashima when running to Kaido/Rooftop instead of punching/kicking fodders he and Kid should be using CoC.
You are misunderstanding "top" tiers capability to fight their equals with their capability to fight stronger opponents. There is no problem top tier being defeated in less than a day because King and Queen were fighting stronger opponents. But with Kaido is different because Luffy is not stronger than him, the excuse is that he is getting tired and weakened for fighting many others(mostly fodders) before him.
He should have used much more against fodders. For example at WCI against those mini people army(not sure what are those).
At Onigashima when running to Kaido/Rooftop instead of punching/kicking fodders he and Kid should be using CoC.
You are misunderstanding "top" tiers capability to fight their equals with their capability to fight stronger opponents. There is no problem top tier being defeated in less than a day because King and Queen were fighting stronger opponents. But with Kaido is different because Luffy is not stronger than him, the excuse is that he is getting tired and weakened for fighting many others(mostly fodders) before him.
