Powers & Abilities Does Kaido or Big Mom have Ryuo or what?
- Thread starter ImmaIvanoM
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Because Zoro has never shown it or said to have mastered it at any point in the manga? What more proof do I need to claim a character doesn't have something aside form the fact that it has never shown or implied to possess it?
In what way is it not comparable? You were literally claiming COC black lightning from BM before she attacked PO is different from the same freaking thing from Luffy because it was emanating from him during the attack and you've given no explanation for it whatsoever.
I've never denied the similarities b/w Luffy and BM's attacks. I only ever said there is no way to tell what type of COA they're using just from the looks alone because the only similarity b/w BM and Luffy as far it concerns COA is the black shading on their arms which can't be used to say she's using the same kind of COA as Luffy. Because that's the same as claiming every character with black coating on their hands is using internal destruction Haki. I even gave you a panel of Luffy without black coating for you to better understand what I was talking about. I've been speaking only of COA from the very beginning.
I was talking about COA coating dude.
Because that's how logic works! You are allowed to claim someone doesn't have something when it was not confirmed nor implied they have it. Or do you perhaps suggesting that I need a certificate of approval from Oda every time I wanna claim a character doesn't have an ability that it has never shown/hinted at or implied to possess?
In what way is it not comparable? You were literally claiming COC black lightning from BM before she attacked PO is different from the same freaking thing from Luffy because it was emanating from him during the attack and you've given no explanation for it whatsoever.
I've never denied the similarities b/w Luffy and BM's attacks. I only ever said there is no way to tell what type of COA they're using just from the looks alone because the only similarity b/w BM and Luffy as far it concerns COA is the black shading on their arms which can't be used to say she's using the same kind of COA as Luffy. Because that's the same as claiming every character with black coating on their hands is using internal destruction Haki. I even gave you a panel of Luffy without black coating for you to better understand what I was talking about. I've been speaking only of COA from the very beginning.
I was talking about COA coating dude.
Because that's how logic works! You are allowed to claim someone doesn't have something when it was not confirmed nor implied they have it. Or do you perhaps suggesting that I need a certificate of approval from Oda every time I wanna claim a character doesn't have an ability that it has never shown/hinted at or implied to possess?
The leg switch right ankle kick destroyed Sanji's armament infused shin
@Gol D. Roger why is the Vergo having internal destruction thread closed when it is the most reasonable take that he used it, yet there is no indication whatsoever that Big Mom has it
But how would you know when Zoro is using it since he is a swordsman? How would you know?
Something not being shown yet isn't proof that it doesn't exist especially when we don't even know how it looks like.
For Example,
Does WB have internal destruction haki?
By your logic, the answer would be no.
Everyway because the necessary variable isn't there.
One comes as the effect of an attack, the other happens before an attack. Those are variables which indicates difference.
>Explanation: Prior to the recent chapters, Luffy didn't have the "streaming haki" prior to an attack but he and multiple characters had the " black zapping/lightning" during a clash. So how can you claim that both are the same especially when the moment "streaming haki" prior to attacks was indicated, it showed Luffy using both adCOA and adcoc.
You claimed there was no implication of the two using the same type of COA. If you are agreeing that the panels are similar then that clearly means that there's an implication.
That doesn't change my point. WB and Roger were also coating with COA
I'm suggesting that you need a fact or evidence or even an implication that the person doesn't have.
But one can't just make a blanket Statement of something not existing simply because there's no counter evidence especially in a manga where things keep getting discovered sometimes hundreds of chapters later.
It will be like if someone claimed that Zoro didn't have COA after seeing the character only during the time he cut the ship in FI.
Something not being shown yet isn't proof that it doesn't exist especially when we don't even know how it looks like.
For Example,
Does WB have internal destruction haki?
By your logic, the answer would be no.
Everyway because the necessary variable isn't there.
One comes as the effect of an attack, the other happens before an attack. Those are variables which indicates difference.
>Explanation: Prior to the recent chapters, Luffy didn't have the "streaming haki" prior to an attack but he and multiple characters had the " black zapping/lightning" during a clash. So how can you claim that both are the same especially when the moment "streaming haki" prior to attacks was indicated, it showed Luffy using both adCOA and adcoc.
You claimed there was no implication of the two using the same type of COA. If you are agreeing that the panels are similar then that clearly means that there's an implication.
That doesn't change my point. WB and Roger were also coating with COA
I'm suggesting that you need a fact or evidence or even an implication that the person doesn't have.
But one can't just make a blanket Statement of something not existing simply because there's no counter evidence especially in a manga where things keep getting discovered sometimes hundreds of chapters later.
It will be like if someone claimed that Zoro didn't have COA after seeing the character only during the time he cut the ship in FI.
Yeah, I get your point. Thing is, Big Mom probably can't explain half the stuff she can pull, she's just raw natural talent. It is very normal for people like that to pull stuff as if breathing.
Remember pre skip concept of Haki, it was perceived as something only the chosen ones could do. And yet, after Skip even most of the characters introduced before were able to use it.
I believe the same concept applies here. I could be wrong though
Remember pre skip concept of Haki, it was perceived as something only the chosen ones could do. And yet, after Skip even most of the characters introduced before were able to use it.
I believe the same concept applies here. I could be wrong though
Since Kaido asked them if Ryou was being utilized he probably could't perform those moves too other than simply being unaware of their name, that would differently implicate he was just curious of the name of something Kaido himself was capable of but unaware of the name, and he probably didn't use it at least to our knowledge from what it was shown, this is why I specified in the form they were using it at least. But I share your point.
You only need proof to claim something exists. You absolutely have no reason to collect proof to prove something doesn't exist when there is no proof it existed in the first place. That's how logic and reasoning works on the blue planet. How am I even supposed to prove something that doesn't exist does not exist? Do I need to submit proof to say Roger wasn't the last user of Ope Ope no Mi when it was never even hinted that he was? And Yes, WB can't be a confirmed user of internal destruction until proven otherwise. Sure, you can make a case for him saying someone of his caliber should possess it which you can do to even BM but you can't outright claim he/she has it.
I am not blind enough to deny everything just because there is no proof dude. I've been in this business for as long as if not longer than you. I know how things work too. I am not outright claiming BM and Kaido can't have ADCOA because they haven't shown it. I am actually open to the idea that they have it which I've mentioned multiple times in this very thread. All I am saying is you can't say they have it without at least an ounce of hint. Why is it so hard to accept someone who is not confirmed or implied to have an ability doesn't have it until proven otherwise?
I wonder if you're just arguing for the sake of arguing at this point.
Can you seriously not tell the difference b/w these two lightning effects?
The black matter is clearly leaking or emanating from Luffy's leg the same as how it was emanating from Big Mom's hand.
And you can't tell if WB and Roger were using ADCOA too.
Unfortunately, I can't reverse their actions unless I get their approval. I think the forum isn't ready to handle Vergo's wank yet so I must ask you to consider reducing the intensity a bit.
I am not blind enough to deny everything just because there is no proof dude. I've been in this business for as long as if not longer than you. I know how things work too. I am not outright claiming BM and Kaido can't have ADCOA because they haven't shown it. I am actually open to the idea that they have it which I've mentioned multiple times in this very thread. All I am saying is you can't say they have it without at least an ounce of hint. Why is it so hard to accept someone who is not confirmed or implied to have an ability doesn't have it until proven otherwise?
I wonder if you're just arguing for the sake of arguing at this point.
Can you seriously not tell the difference b/w these two lightning effects?
The black matter is clearly leaking or emanating from Luffy's leg the same as how it was emanating from Big Mom's hand.
And you can't tell if WB and Roger were using ADCOA too.
Post automatically merged:
good thing you can open it then :cheers:
Its obvious they cant use internal destruction, but the one whose armament is "usntoppable" can
Its obvious they cant use internal destruction, but the one whose armament is "usntoppable" can
@5000 ng/dl or death See told you fujitora has advanced conquers,
black lighting is leaking out his blade. 
@5000 ng/dl or death See told you fujitora has advanced conquers,
black lighting is leaking out his blade.
If Fuji was drafted, it must mean he was part of some military prior to this (same with Ryokugo). You have any idea where Fuji may have been at before becoming admiral?
@5000 ng/dl or death See told you fujitora has advanced conquers,
black lighting is leaking out his blade.
But that's the thing though. Not only has it not been hinted but we have manga facts proving that it isn't possible.
However in Big Mom's case, there is a hint (the panels) and there isn't anything indicating that it isn't possible.
Take Future sight for example, we can factually claim that Big Mom doesn't have FS not merely because she hasn't used it but because we have a side by side comparison with her and Katakuri showing she doesn't have it.
Exactly and can he be confirmed to not to be a user of internal destruction? Obviously not.
I Haven't made an outright claim in this argument that Big Mom does have it. I only claimed that there's an implication, which is more in line with possibility than actual fact.
Then that means that logic in itself is faulty. That aside, I have actually agreed that one can't factually say that Big Mom has it because there's know outright proof. My point has been about the possibility through the implication of the similarity of the panels.
Yamato's panel is not clash.
Also like I've stated before and you've ignored, can you claim as fact that Luffy isn't using penetrating haki in that panel? No because penetrating haki can be used without coating.
Exactly so how can you know that Zoro wasn't using adCOA when we can't even tell how it looks when a swordsman is using it
However in Big Mom's case, there is a hint (the panels) and there isn't anything indicating that it isn't possible.
Take Future sight for example, we can factually claim that Big Mom doesn't have FS not merely because she hasn't used it but because we have a side by side comparison with her and Katakuri showing she doesn't have it.
Exactly and can he be confirmed to not to be a user of internal destruction? Obviously not.
I Haven't made an outright claim in this argument that Big Mom does have it. I only claimed that there's an implication, which is more in line with possibility than actual fact.
Then that means that logic in itself is faulty. That aside, I have actually agreed that one can't factually say that Big Mom has it because there's know outright proof. My point has been about the possibility through the implication of the similarity of the panels.
wonder if you're just arguing for the sake of arguing at this point.
Can you seriously not tell the difference b/w these two lightning effects?
The black matter is clearly leaking or emanating from Luffy's leg the same as how it was emanating from Big Mom's hand.
Can you seriously not tell the difference b/w these two lightning effects?
Also like I've stated before and you've ignored, can you claim as fact that Luffy isn't using penetrating haki in that panel? No because penetrating haki can be used without coating.
Exactly so how can you know that Zoro wasn't using adCOA when we can't even tell how it looks when a swordsman is using it
@Gol D. Roger Kaido's coa+ coc > Luffy's proved