Powers & Abilities General CoA Discussion - Basic & Advanced

[HPsyche]

Essentially.....both invisible and black haki are....well invisible. For the sake of not confusing the reader, Armament Hardening is shaded black while normal COA is left alone.

The confusion is Yoru and Shusui? Both being swords that are literally black unlike other blades that are called 'black' due to their sturdiness?

Am I following correctly?

What I'm saying is what you just said in your first paragraph. They are saying the invisible is invisible while the black shaded haki is literally black.

The new argument they've made is because normal swords shaded in black look like Shusui, they must therefore be the same. Therefore, Haki is literally black.

The reality is colour in One Piece or rather, in a Manga is far more nuanced. Can only draw in either black or white. So, just because black means something for 1 thing doesn't mean it's the same in another instance is my argument.
2 characters wearing black shaded shoes doesn't necessarily mean they have the same coloured shoes or shoes with similar properties. There's just limitations that can't really be avoided due to the fact drawing in Manga is binary.

 

[HA001]

Just to describe how bad the argument is.

1. Part of the Sword is shaded white.
2. Concrete is shaded white.
3. The Air is shaded in white.

If I use the apparently astounding logic being used for Haki being Black because blades look like Shusui.... I can say that...

1. Because the air is transparent or invisible but coloured white, that the white part of Swords are also transparent permanent. We know that's bad reasoning.
2. or Because Blades are steel, and the Blades are shaded white, the ground in One Piece is made of metal. Bad reasoning.
3. or Because the Ground is White and made of Concrete. the white part of Swords must therefore be Concrete. Bad reasoning.

Just because 2 things have similar design doesn't mean they're the same thing. Just because literal black things in One Piece are shaded Black doesn't mean something else shaded black is the same thing.

Hell, the Marines are wearing black shaded suits in the Manga, how do you know another Marine wearing black shaded suits doesn't mean he's wearing a dark blue suit or a brown suit or dark green suit?

Germa are wearing the same design. Doesn't mean it's exactly the same thing.

It's a Manga, everythihng can only be drawn in either black or white.

Artistic limitations.

Shusui a sword coloured black... having the same design as other swords shaded in black... doesn't mean they're exactly conveying the same thing anymore than we can claim white parts of sword means swords are transparent permanently because the air is shaded white and transparent.

No the design on enma is different. When oden kokas it as opposed to its normal version. Its not a case of the white side just being shaded in. There is a clear change.

 

[HPsyche]

No the design on enma is different. When oden kokas it as opposed to its normal version. Its not a case of the white side just being shaded in. There is a clear change.

Again, it's irrelevant.

If the best argument you can make is design, you have no argument.

 

[HA001]

Again, it's irrelevant.

If the best argument you can make is design, you have no argument.

No its just you dont have an answer so youre acting like a 2 year old.
A whole design change on all zoros swords when he adds koka to them isnt just visual shading.

 

[HPsyche]

No its just you dont have an answer so youre acting like a 2 year old.

Had no idea 2 year olds actually use evidence to make sound argument. Interesting.

A whole design change on all zoros swords when he adds koka to them isnt just visual shading.

Sure, design means whatever you want it to mean.

That's your best argument, great.

I'll stick to using the Manga to prove my points and you can arbitrarily make up things about what designs mean.

2 things shaded black look black, wow. No way to refute that.

 

[HA001]

Had no idea 2 year olds actually use evidence to make sound argument. Interesting.


Sure, design means whatever you want it to mean.

That's your best argument, great.

I'll stick to using the Manga to prove my points and you can arbitrarily make up things about what designs mean.

2 things shaded black look black, wow. No way to refute that.

Not what i said is it. You can stop being a bitch and actually try refuting the point on why swords with kokas whole design changes. As opposed to just shading the white sides in most swords black.
Rogers is another the blade of the sword changes design too when koka is used.

 

[HPsyche]

Not what i said is it. You can stop being a bitch and actually try refuting the point on why swords with kokas whole design changes. As opposed to just shading the white sides in most swords black.
Rogers is another the blade of the sword changes design too when koka is used.

Mind your language.

Just because you're upset doesn't mean you act like a kid and throw tantrums.

Point is your argument is bad, design means nothing, it simply means that's the design.

 

[Jo_Ndule]

Haki is and has always been invisible. Rayleigh and Hyou confirms that.

Just cause Oda shades the person or blades to showcase hardening and visual effects, doesn't mean the colour of haki is black.

About black blade , only one known fact:
*Forged via many battles.

It's not said you gotta be strongest CoA master or CoO.
Also black blades are tougher, they hardly gets scratched.

 

[HA001]

Mind your language.

Just because you're upset doesn't mean you act like a kid and throw tantrums.

Point is your argument is bad, design means nothing, it simply means that's the design.

Lol stfu.

My argument is bad because you dont have an answer and instead of having the balls to admit you are wrong you avoid giving a point to refute it.

 

[HA001]

Haki is and has always been invisible. Rayleigh and Hyou confirms that.

Just cause Oda shades the person or blades to showcase hardening and visual effects, doesn't mean the colour of haki is black.

About black blade , only one known fact:
*Forged via many battles.

It's not said you gotta be strongest CoA master or CoO.
Also black blades are tougher, they hardly gets scratched.

Why did oden not make enma black despite fighting with it for decades ?

 

[nik87]

Haki is and has always been invisible. Rayleigh and Hyou confirms that.

Just cause Oda shades the person or blades to showcase hardening and visual effects, doesn't mean the colour of haki is black.

About black blade , only one known fact:
*Forged via many battles.

It's not said you gotta be strongest CoA master or CoO.
Also black blades are tougher, they hardly gets scratched.

Why is Kokuto black?
Why did Kaku see Asura if it is invisible?

 

[Zowo]

@HPsyche why enma turned black when it took zoro s ryou?

 

[HA001]

@HPsyche why enma turned black when it took zoro s ryou?

And why did the pattern of the sword change when that happened ?

 

[Uncle Van]

What I'm saying is what you just said in your first paragraph. They are saying the invisible is invisible while the black shaded haki is literally black.

The new argument they've made is because normal swords shaded in black look like Shusui, they must therefore be the same. Therefore, Haki is literally black.

The reality is colour in One Piece or rather, in a Manga is far more nuanced. Can only draw in either black or white. So, just because black means something for 1 thing doesn't mean it's the same in another instance is my argument.
2 characters wearing black shaded shoes doesn't necessarily mean they have the same coloured shoes or shoes with similar properties. There's just limitations that can't really be avoided due to the fact drawing in Manga is binary.

Ah I gotcha and it's very simple n' easy to understand.

1. Haki is invisible
2. Haki is shaded black in the manga and colored black in the anime as to not confuse the reader.
3. OP characters can sense haki
4. Shusui and Yoru are literal black blades renowned for their tougheness.
5. Swordsman can turn swords permanently black not in color, but in durability and power.

 

[nik87]

5. Swordsman can turn swords permanently black not in color, but in durability and power.

Durability and power dont have a color. Kokuto is literally black and everyone can see it.

 

[HPsyche]

why swords with kokas whole design changes. As opposed to just shading the white sides in most swords black.

Your point here is as irrelevant as this:

Pica on the right has no Haki, his spade is black.

When he has Haki, it's white.

Guess that means somethnig special? No, Oda just creates contrast to make the Haki stand out.

So, just because a Sword had white bits shaded here and there or not is irrelevant, it's design.

There's no other character other than Pika who has gone from black to white when imbued with Haki, to you that must mean he's special or something.

Like I said before, your argument really is non-existent, it's desperate.

 

[HPsyche]

1. Haki is invisible
2. Haki is shaded black in the manga and colored black in the anime as to not confuse the reader.
3. OP characters can sense haki
4. Shusui and Yoru are literal black blades renowned for their tougheness.
5. Swordsman can turn swords permanently black not in color, but in durability and power.

4 & 5, I'd change slightly.

4. Shusui and Yoru are like you said, renonwned black blades known for their toughness. Their transformation into literal black blades is why they're tough.

5. Swordsmen can literally change Swords black permanently.

However, what most Swordsmen are only able to achieve is simply imbuing Swords with Haki which can emulate or copy the hardness of the "Literal black swords like Yoru and Shusui".

It does seem however that only a couple of Swordsmen (Ryuma and Mihawk) have achieved the feat of turning a blade permanently black.

 

[HA001]

Your point here is as irrelevant as this:

Pica on the right has no Haki, his spade is black.

When he has Haki, it's white.

Guess that means somethnig special? No, Oda just creates contrast to make the Haki stand out.

So, just because a Sword had white bits shaded here and there or not is irrelevant, it's design.

There's no other character other than Pika who has gone from black to white when imbued with Haki, to you that must mean he's special or something.

Like I said before, your argument really is non-existent, it's desperate.

No its not.
Pica hasnt changed his design just colour

The swords change their designs not just colour

Next ?

 

[HPsyche]

Pica hasnt changed his design just colour

Colour change is part of design bud.

Again, like I said, if your best argument is some pedantic difference in detail, then you have no valid argument.

Valid arguments are:

• Rayleigh states Armament is invisible.
  Spoiler

  
• Hyo states Armament is invisible.
  Spoiler

  
• Haki was never shaded pre-skip because it was Invisible and the idea no one used Hardened Armament pre-skip makes no sense especially at Marineford.
• Haki was never shaded pre-skip until Luffy learnt to use Haki meaning he could only sense it after he'd learnt it.
• Panels that were not shaded pre-skip are now shaded post-skip after Luffy can use Haki.
  Spoiler

  
• No where in the series has anyone ever mentioned that a character turned a part of their body black.
• 

Franky didn't know Luffy was a Haki user despite the fact his fists were entirely black at the start of the time-skip... Big black fists can't be missed.
Nami, Robin, Chopper... no one said wow Luffy's got a big black fist. They likely would have if they'd just seen Luffy's skin colour change from white to black suddenly. Doubt that's something people see and just don't mention.

If Haki were literally black, some none-Haki user would at least have mentioned or referenced that people were turning black momentarily. Never happened. 900+ chapters, never happened.

 

[Talkshit D Gethit]

Don't know if anyone has said this but imo i believe that only those with COC can use the most advanced types of haki. The only people shown thus far using them Future sight, penetration haki ect have CoC. There has to be a reason why everyone at marine ford freaked dick and said it was a terrifying ability when luffy used it. I mean as if high ups at marineford would care if all it does is knockout folder.

On to the black blade.
I think like it says in the panel when zoro found out about permanent black blade it is done through countless battles of using the flowing Coa.

My theory is that everytime you haki up the blade and go through battle little bit of thar haki stays in until eventually it becomes a blackblade. So yeah it doesn't require penetration haki i think it just requires countless battle like it was stated in manga by Oda.

Even if you don't agree you know it makes sense. I could be wrong and the penetration destruction technique and permanent black blade could be the same but then ask yourself why the fuck can't old hyogoro who said coa is a specialty in wano and obviously has trained alot lot lot of years could never reach the penetration technique that luffy can do after like a week of training I'll tell ya COC MATEEEEE

Edit it's a mixture of both coc and coa at same time willing your haki through living objects with there own haki. Like coc by it self uses your will to defie the others will and over powerit. Yeahhhhhhhh boiii!!!!