Powers & Abilities General CoA Discussion - Basic & Advanced

[OEKaneki]

Look at the spoilers with Koshiro's words and Hyogoro's words. They're all from Viz. What's the difference between the two?

There's also this, again from Viz.

What's different about it? Please give an answer that's more than "No they're different". Oda's a good writer who brings up plot points that he seeded into the story like 20 years ago, and you don't think Oda consciously made the decision to make Zoro's unique-and-totally-not-haki ability sound EXACTLY like Ryuo-which-is-Haki-in-Wano? :unsure:

Why are they different? They both mention the will of the swordsman to cut what they want to cut and what they don't want to cut. They both use paper and steel as examples. Did Oda bring that up just to confuse readers who paid attention and made the connection?

Maybe you should read my post to @Vlad D. Impaler, where I already explained the difference between JB and Viz, and explained what Viz did as opposed to JB, as well as how Viz doesn’t equate the two.

 

[ZoroGang]

Maybe you should read my post to @Vlad D. Impaler, where I already explained the difference between JB and Viz, and explained what Viz did as opposed to JB, as well as how Viz doesn’t equate the two.

So if that’s not haki what the hell is it?

 

[Reborn]

Look at the spoilers with Koshiro's words and Hyogoro's words. They're all from Viz. What's the difference between the two?

There's also this, again from Viz.

What's different about it? Please give an answer that's more than "No they're different". Oda's a good writer who brings up plot points that he seeded into the story like 20 years ago, and you don't think Oda consciously made the decision to make Zoro's unique-and-totally-not-haki ability sound EXACTLY like Ryuo-which-is-Haki-in-Wano? :unsure:

Why are they different? They both mention the will of the swordsman to cut what they want to cut and what they don't want to cut. They both use paper and steel as examples. Did Oda bring that up just to confuse readers who paid attention and made the connection?

No! There is a difference. Zoro doesn't have advanced CoA. How come two strongest swordsman of their era with black blades can have highly advanced CoA? You guys are reading op too carefully. It doesn't matter how kuch sense you guys will bring, I can turn myself blind to facts and twist facts meaning to call your arguments headcannon

 

[Cyrus the Cactus]

The viz version of the scene clears this nonsense up anyway. In the JB version, it’s worded like haki and breath of all things are connected. In the Viz scan, they’re presented as two different ideas, with the boat sentence being a reinforcement of what he’s trying to teach Luffy.

He says “in Wano too, there is an invisible power that stems from the body and can be infused with the blade.”

That’s the end of that one thought. And in this thought, he’s clearly talking about haki. And then he says:

“A good katana will cut through steel when you want it to. And it will not break a sheet of paper if you wish it so. It is all according to the desire of the swordsman.”

He’s basically using breath of all things as an example to tell Luffy that to use the barrier, he has to simply will it to be so, just like to cut steel or to cut nothing at all, the swordsman must will it to be so. What Zoro did in Alabasta was not haki, as the breath of all things and haki are not related at its core. Breath of all things is a principle of swordsmanship that he was trying to teach Luffy so that he could use the barrier.

...this makes no sense. It's more like Hyo is elaborating on what Ryuo can do. How is what Zoro did in Alabasta different than what Luffy learned now? They both revolve around the will of the fighter being used to damage objects that pure power can't deal with.

 

[Inspector_Mu]

...this makes no sense. It's more like Hyo is elaborating on what Ryuo can do. How is what Zoro did in Alabasta different than what Luffy learned now? They both revolve around the will of the fighter being used to damage objects that pure power can't deal with.

Then tell me where did his haki go?

You still haven't answered the question why is it that breath of all things couldn't do a thing even when zoro wanted to hurt Logia pre ts ? Why is it he didnt cut birdcage if he has adCoA?

The man even mentions ho ViZ translation differs and clear the madbess you guys re creating.

Nobody unlocked advanced haki before luffy
No stawhat unlocked haki before luffy

Luffy is the first strawhat to unlock haki and first to get advanced CoO and CoA.
These are facts!

What you are doing is mental gymnastic

 

[Vlad D. Impaler]

They wont give an answer
It seems like zoro haki can only cut steel lol
Somehow he couldnt even cause trouble to any Logia pre ts... even Apoo landed a hit on kizru
Zoro with his so called haki got no diffed by Enel

Also, if it was advanced CoA that Zoro used to cut steel than I guess all the swordsmen shown Pre TS like T-Bone who could cut steel have advanced CoA. Not to mention in New World cutting steel seems like a ordinary quality even for fodder swordsmen , and Brook too post TS can cut steel like cheese then all of them should have highly advanced CoA, although Brook himself denied having any type of haki when Luffy asked him.

 

[nik87]

Then tell me where did his haki go?

You still haven't answered the question why is it that breath of all things couldn't do a thing even when zoro wanted to hurt Logia pre ts ? Why is it he didnt cut birdcage if he has adCoA?

The man even mentions ho ViZ translation differs and clear the madbess you guys re creating.

Nobody unlocked advanced haki before luffy
No stawhat unlocked haki before luffy

Luffy is the first strawhat to unlock haki and first to get advanced CoO and CoA.
These are facts!

What you are doing is mental gymnastic

We told you several times what and how. You keep repeating your own headcanon. No need to bother with two-piece readers.

 

[OEKaneki]

...this makes no sense. It's more like Hyo is elaborating on what Ryuo can do. How is what Zoro did in Alabasta different than what Luffy learned now? They both revolve around the will of the fighter being used to damage objects that pure power can't deal with.

It makes perfect sense. He was using the breath of all things, a swordsmanship technique, to help Luffy understand what he was trying to do.

He was basically saying that if swordsman want to cut steel, they will their sword to do so. And if they want their swords to cut nothing, they will their swords to do so. He was telling Luffy that he must do similarly with his haki, if he wants it to form a barrier, he must will it to do so. Which is why later he went on to teach Luffy the specifics. He presented a general concept and then later taught Luffy exactly how to do it.

The difference is that Zoro could not use haki before the timeskip. He was using a swordsmanship technique, not haki.

 

[nik87]

It makes perfect sense. He was using the breath of all things, a swordsmanship technique, to help Luffy understand what he was trying to do.

He was basically saying that if swordsman want to cut steel, they will their sword to do so. And if they want their swords to cut nothing, they will their swords to do so. He was telling Luffy that he must do similarly with his haki, if he wants it to form a barrier, he must will it to do so. Which is why later he went on to teach Luffy the specifics. He presented a general concept and then later taught Luffy exactly how to do it.

The difference is that Zoro could not use haki before the timeskip. He was using a swordsmanship technique, not haki.

Hyogoro explains Luffy what Ryo is, talks about it not cutting paper when used on a sword, Koushiro talks about not cutting paper, Zoro doesnt cut tree leaves.
OEKaneki: It is not the same.
Time to stop spreading your headcanon and accept the facts from manga. This lasted way too long.

 

[ZoroGang]

It makes perfect sense. He was using the breath of all things, a swordsmanship technique, to help Luffy understand what he was trying to do.

He was basically saying that if swordsman want to cut steel, they will their sword to do so. And if they want their swords to cut nothing, they will their swords to do so. He was telling Luffy that he must do similarly with his haki, if he wants it to form a barrier, he must will it to do so. Which is why later he went on to teach Luffy the specifics. He presented a general concept and then later taught Luffy exactly how to do it.

The difference is that Zoro could not use haki before the timeskip. He was using a swordsmanship technique, not haki.

Luffy was trying to learn haki so hyo demonstrates that but according to you he explained a swordsman technique that’s is exactly like haki but isn’t.

 

[Inspector_Mu]

Also, if it was advanced CoA that Zoro used to cut steel than I guess all the swordsmen shown Pre TS like T-Bone who could cut steel have advanced CoA. Not to mention in New World cutting steel seems like a ordinary quality even for fodder swordsmen , and Brook too post TS can cut steel like cheese then all of them should have highly advanced CoA, although Brook himself denied having any type of haki when Luffy asked him.

Yep
They thinking cutting steel = haki/advanced haki
When people can cut these stuff without using haki even.

 

[ZoroGang]

Yep
They thinking cutting steel = haki/advanced haki
When people can cut these stuff without using haki even.

Who? Show a panel right now of someone cutting steel without haki

 

[Cyrus the Cactus]

Who? Show a panel right now of someone cutting steel without haki

Coincidentally everyone who can cut steel is a confirmed Haki user. It's almost like there's a connection there.

 

[Vlad D. Impaler]

Who? Show a panel right now of someone cutting steel without haki

Brook and T-Bone.

 

[ZoroGang]

Brook and T-Bone.

Show me brook cutting steel

Post automatically merged: Sep 22, 2019

Show me brook cutting steel

T bone can have haki marine fodders have haki if brook cut steel
Then you might have something

 

[OEKaneki]

Brook and T-Bone.

Oh, and Zoro. Don’t forget Zoro. :sneaky:

 

[Rivaille]

Neither Brook nor T-Bone cut steel neither pre-TS nor post TS.
In PH while Brook was next to him, Zoro asked Kinemon if he can cut steel.
Why asking this question to a stranger when your nakama is next to you and apparently can do the same thing?

Post automatically merged: Sep 23, 2019

It makes perfect sense. He was using the breath of all things, a swordsmanship technique, to help Luffy understand what he was trying to do.

He was basically saying that if swordsman want to cut steel, they will their sword to do so. And if they want their swords to cut nothing, they will their swords to do so. He was telling Luffy that he must do similarly with his haki, if he wants it to form a barrier, he must will it to do so. Which is why later he went on to teach Luffy the specifics. He presented a general concept and then later taught Luffy exactly how to do it.

The difference is that Zoro could not use haki before the timeskip. He was using a swordsmanship technique, not haki.

So if I understand well :

-There is a swordsmanship technic that work exactly like advanced haki
-To illustrate, to a non swordsman, how to use advaced haki Hyo took for example a swordsmanship technic
-Because what a swordsman is able to do with his will (cutting or not) Luffy should be able to do it with his own haki (projecting his will out of his body)

I disagree but for the sake of the argument let say that you are right:

What you are saying is that even tho Zoro did not have advanced haki in Alabasta, he can use it now because he has mastery over the swordsmanship technic and over haki. Therefore, like Hyo and Luffy, he just have to use the swordsmanship technic that he already mastered on his own haki to produce advanced haki.

 

[Vlad D. Impaler]

Show me brook cutting steel

Post automatically merged: Sep 22, 2019

T bone can have haki marine fodders have haki if brook cut steel
Then you might have something

Neither Brook nor T-Bone cut steel neither pre-TS nor post TS.
In PH while Brook was next to him, Zoro asked Kinemon if he can cut steel.
Why asking this question to a stranger when your nakama is next to you and apparently can do the same thing?

Post automatically merged: Sep 23, 2019

So if I understand well :

-There is a swordsmanship technic that work exactly like advanced haki
-To illustrate, to a non swordsman, how to use advaced haki Hyo took for example a swordsmanship technic
-Because what a swordsman is able to do with his will (cutting or not) Luffy should be able to do it with his own haki (projecting his will out of his body)

I disagree but for the sake of the argument let say that you are right:

What you are saying is that even tho Zoro did not have advanced haki in Alabasta, he can use it now because he has mastery over the swordsmanship technic and over haki. Therefore, like Hyo and Luffy, he just have to use the swordsmanship technic that he already mastered on his own haki to produce advanced haki.

T-Bone cut the train carriage in half. And in Punk Hazard Brook cut Vegapunk's Dragon, whose scales were said to be even stronger than steel. So yes, Brook can cut materials which are even harder than steel without any CoA.
Also when Zoro asked Kinemon if he could cut steel, it was done to showcase Kinemon's strength, not to downplay Brook's skill.

 

[Rivaille]

T-Bone cut the train carriage in half. And in Punk Hazard Brook cut Vegapunk's Dragon, whose scales were said to be even stronger than steel. So yes, Brook can cut materials which are even harder than steel without any CoA.
Also when Zoro asked Kinemon if he could cut steel, it was done to showcase Kinemon's strength, not to downplay Brook's skill.

The train carriage is made of wood.
Brook use his fruit to ennhance his swordsmanship to hurt the dragon. The one who cut him is Kinemon.

 

[stealthblack]

avanced haki is shields that can be used for both offense and defense like bartolomeo's shields and gamma knife.


so advanced haki is like bartolomeo's barrier and law's gamma knife at the same time.