General & Others Haki vs sword vs science

[Albino 👑]

While oda could technically just have zoro and sanji go the same route as luffy when it comes to strengthening their haki with powers like internal destruction or future sight i personally doubt he will

I think wano is likely good insight into how oda will choose to develop their haki. Specially when it comes to how he depicted their armament

Luffy just developing it in a more linear fashion getting the most advanced form of armament with internal along with unlocking external

Zoro already having external armament (something he’s been capable of since daz) and instead of just advancing his armament further he got enma. A blade that strengthens his armament by increasing his output and overflow. Him being capable of king of hell mode because of his mastery of the blade

Sanji having the most basic form of armament but instead of specifically boosting it he stacks the toughness of armament with the toughness of his exoskeleton to develop ifrit jambe

I think that that pattern might also apply to their other forms

1. Luffy more directly just upgrading his haki
2. Zoro through mastering blades
3. Sanji tied to his scientific upgrades

Even when it comes to conquerors it seems like it’s going to be the same pattern

1. Luffy unlocking and better mastering it just because he’s naturally proficient at using haki
2. Zoro unlocking it through his mastery of enma. Him even saying he’ll become the king of hell knowing that’s enmas nickname as well
3. Sanji is extremely likely to unlock his conquerors when reflecting and embracing his germa genetics

Id even go as far to say zoro’s asura and sanji’s jambe might end up being related to their sword and genetics respectively?

Asura being a power connected to sandai kitetsu “cursed” strength.
Jambe being related to the drug sora took that helped Sanji keep his humanity

 

[Black]

I didn't read all of this tbh but the title is definitly ragebait. In elbaf zoro, luffy, sanji will get coc related pu's.

 

[kekaro]

sanji can use swords science and haki
truely top 1, thanks again bino sama for making it clear

 

[Rumble]

Why do you fuckers always overlook the fact Sanji's fighting is defined by being a skilled martial artist?

He takes pride in his martial ability.

The ability his father trained him in.

 

[CbShadow]

You should have said df vs sword vs science. They all use haki and their biggest growth comes from haki. Luffy needed it to beat Kaido. Zoro needed it to beat King. Sanji will need it to beat Killingham.

 

[Fn Lucci]

1. Luffy is a really fast learner but I think it's just time for him to get more potent. He's learned all of these advanced techniques but his DF takes him much further still

2. Zoro is overly skewed towards hardening. He could use better observation but I feel like Oda will double down on CoC strength.

3. I really don't know where Oda has been going with Sanji's flames. Like even in the EL explanation it was weird but acceptable given everything else in the series. And now there's hints of something else. I didn't think he had anything to do with Lunarians when Queen said it but with his other trait being extreme durability, Idk what else

I didn't read all of this tbh

Are you kidding?

 

[Cruxroux]

What is this even about ?

 

[Shikoku]

I don’t see three different Haki-development routes here. They all use Haki through their established fighting styles:

Luffy with his brawler style & DF
Zoro with his swordmanship & meitos
Sanji with his martial arts, Jambe and exoskeleton

Enma did not create Zoro’s Haki, and Sanji’s exoskeleton did not create his Armament. They are tools or physical components layered onto Haki.
The rest is speculative. Daz being emission is unconfirmed, Asura has no established link to Sandai, and Jambe has not been confirmed as either Germa science or Sora’s drug,Sanji himself attributes it to his passion or “power of love.”

 

[Roo]

a better title would be

df vs sword vs science

haki is just an amp to all their primary fighting tools

 

[Rukusho]

a better title would be

df vs sword vs science

haki is just an amp to all their primary fighting tools

This ...

 

[Albino 👑]

You should have said df vs sword vs science. They all use haki and their biggest growth comes from haki. Luffy needed it to beat Kaido. Zoro needed it to beat King. Sanji will need it to beat Killingham.

I don’t see three different Haki-development routes here. They all use Haki through their established fighting styles:

Luffy with his brawler style & DF
Zoro with his swordmanship & meitos
Sanji with his martial arts, Jambe and exoskeleton

Enma did not create Zoro’s Haki, and Sanji’s exoskeleton did not create his Armament. They are tools or physical components layered onto Haki.
The rest is speculative. Daz being emission is unconfirmed, Asura has no established link to Sandai, and Jambe has not been confirmed as either Germa science or Sora’s drug,Sanji himself attributes it to his passion or “power of love.”

a better title would be

df vs sword vs science

haki is just an amp to all their primary fighting tools

1. Luffy’s haki power ups post time skip have nothing to do with his devil fruit just the fact he’s skilled at using haki
   • Armament: Luffy just advanced it further unlocking external and internal armament
   • Conquerors: Luffy unlocking basic conquerors and infusion are not tied to his devil fruit at all naturally just unlocking them
2. Zoro’s post time skip haki power ups are directly tied to his swords specifically enma
   • Armament: his armament output is stronger because of his mastery of enma. That being the blades main ability
   • Conquerors: he unlocked it after better mastering enma even calling himself the king of hell the same nickname as the blade
3. Sanji’s post time skip haki power ups are directly tied to germa
   • Armament: he honestly didn’t really get an armament power up in wano he just stacked it on top of his new exoskeleton
   • Conquerors: him unlocking it will very likely tie to him fully accepting himself and his germa blood

 

[Shikoku]

Luffy’s haki power ups post time skip have nothing to do with his devil fruit just the fact he’s skilled at using haki

• Armament: Luffy just advanced it further unlocking external and internal armament
• Conquerors: Luffy unlocking basic conquerors and infusion are not tied to his devil fruit at all naturally just unlocking them

of course I remember Gear CoA or Gear CoO, or the famous awakening of his CoC to reach Gear Conquerer, the ceiling of power (by his own admission)

 

[Cruxroux]

Luffy’s haki power ups post time skip have nothing to do with his devil fruit just the fact he’s skilled at using haki

• Armament: Luffy just advanced it further unlocking external and internal armament
• Conquerors: Luffy unlocking basic conquerors and infusion are not tied to his devil fruit at all naturally just unlocking them

Wrong.
Post time skip,
- First he mastered Gear 2/3 (Fishmen and Punk Hazard)(No haki improvement)
- Second he mastered Gear 4 in Dress rosa. (No haki improvement)
- Third Gear 4 Snakesman, Again DF based ability, yes he got FS as well but snakesman was built for FS. You will never see FS with boundman.
*AdCoA/ID*
- Fourth gear 5, adcoc came into clutch as well.

He has more DF upgrades than Haki Upgrades.

Zoro’s post time skip haki power ups are directly tied to his swords specifically enma

• Armament: his armament output is stronger because of his mastery of enma. That being the blades main ability
• Conquerors: he unlocked it after better mastering enma even calling himself the king of hell the same nickname as the blade

Zoro powers aren't tied to his Sword either.
- Post time skip, Bqsic Haki upgrade (No sword upgrade)
- Second Armanent Haki in Dressrosa, again no Sword upgrade
- third (He already had Ryou, strong one at that, He controlled enma in his first try as well)
*Enma came into clutch*
- Haki upgrade, no sword involved. AdCoC.

Sanji’s post time skip haki power ups are directly tied to germa

• Armament: he honestly didn’t really get an armament power up in wano he just stacked it on top of his new exoskeleton
• Conquerors: him unlocking it will very likely tie to him fully accepting himself and his germa blood

His Haki never improved, atleadt not even on screen, none of you can even provide me with a panel of him using even hardening.
- Post time skip, better at movements, More speed. No science/Haki related upgrade.
- Second WCI, His Observation improved or he already had that since Post time skip,
- Third, Raid suit, science related but destroyed.
- fourth, Exoskeleton + Speed, again science + speed.


Luffy most of the power ups are Df related
Zoro most of the powers are Haki related
Sanji most of the powers are Science+Speed (Physical atribute)+ Flames which is likely a combination of stuff or PoL.

 

[Albino 👑]

of course I remember Gear CoA or Gear CoO, or the famous awakening of his CoC to reach Gear Conquerer, the ceiling of power (by his own admission)

That’s the point Luffy’s haki upgrades aren’t tied to anything including his fruit

Zoro’s power ups so far are tied to enma
Sanji’s power ups so far are tied to germa

 

[Shikoku]

I wanted to like your post, but I was reminded how bottomlessly biased you are.

Zoro powers are tied to his Sword either.
- Post time skip, Bqsic Haki upgrade (No sword upgrade)

Basic Haki upgrade for Zoro over the TS.

His Haki never improved, atleadt not even on screen, none of you can even provide me with a panel of him using even hardening.
- Post time skip, better at movements, More speed. No science/Haki related upgrade.

For sanji? Let’s ignore him getting from haki the TS.

 

[Shikoku]

That’s the point Luffy’s haki upgrades aren’t tied to anything including his fruit

Zoro’s power ups so far are tied to enma
Sanji’s power ups so far are tied to germa

You are just random stuff at this point. What are the criteria for tying updates to something?

Your point is super unclear.

 

[nik87]

Haki is a general tool that buffs everyone capable of harnessing it.
This is about DF merchant, Sword merchant and Science merchant.

 

[Albino 👑]

You are just random stuff at this point. What are the criteria for tying updates to something?

Your point is super unclear.

Idk how I can get more clear

Luffy is directly advancing his haki further
Zoro and Sanji’s power ups are being directly tied to enma and germa

1. Luffy learned both external and internal armament and is naturally advancing his conquerors
2. Zoro’s been had external armament but it is strengthened due to enma and he unlocked conquerors through his better mastery of the blade
3. Sanji still only has basic armament but he stacks it his germa exoskeleton to become even tougher. Him unlocking conquerors is very likely going to tie back to germa as well

 

[Shikoku]

Luffy is directly advancing his haki further

So is Zoro. Enma does not give him Haki. It forces out more of Zoro’s own Haki, and mastering that output is the advancement.

Sanji still only has basic armament but he stacks it with his germa exoskeleton

Then that is not a separate Haki-development route. It is basic Armament combined with a physical power-up, exactly like Luffy and Zoro combine Haki with their own combat systems.

Him unlocking conquerors is very likely going to tie back to germa as well

That is just a prediction. Gaban told him to become a king. Nothing there ties his CoC to Germa blood. From where does your „very likely“ stem from?

You keep switching categories. For Luffy you isolate the Haki itself. For Zoro and Sanji you include every sword or body power involved alongside it.

 

[Albino 👑]

So is Zoro. Enma does not give him Haki. It forces out more of Zoro’s own Haki, and mastering that output is the advancement.

Then that is not a separate Haki-development route. It is basic Armament combined with a physical power-up, exactly like Luffy and Zoro combine Haki with their own combat systems.

That is just a prediction. Gaban told him to become a king. Nothing there ties his CoC to Germa blood. From where does your „very likely“ stem from?

You keep switching categories. For Luffy you isolate the Haki itself. For Zoro and Sanji you include every sword or body power involved alongside it.

Zoro just has a stronger version of haki he already had because of enma. Take away enma from Zoro or Oden and they automatically become weaker because they can’t unleash as much haki as they could without the blade

Luffy learned new haki
Zoro and Sanji were given power ups that strengthen abilities they already had. They didn’t learn new abilities or haki they just strengthened powers they already had

It’s pretty obvious that Sanji’s self hate and doubt is tied to his germa blood man. Once he fully accepts himself for everything he is he’ll likely finally unlock conquerors



Luffy’s haki upgrades whether is future observation, external/internal armament, or infusing conquerors have nothing at all to do with his devil fruit or anything else besides directly advancing his haki

In Zoro and Sanji’s cases it’s extremely in your face that their respective power ups are directly tied to enma and germa