Character Discussion How can Admiral fans still believe Akainu will fight Luffy?
- Thread starter Swallalala
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I never said that Akainu is the biggest threat to Luffy’s freedom. You are projecting.
The issue isn’t resolved with Sabo doing anything because it was Luffy’s inability to defend his brother that he considers a failure. If Luffy isn’t even needed to protect the ones he loves, then his gaining strength is pointless.
If he doesn’t face down the one who killed the person dearest to him…that made him give up on his dream…that even imprinted that failure on his very body, then where is the resolution?
Why would you even want the most personal conflict for Luffy to be glossed over in the first place? That’s very odd. It’s storytelling 101.
How is it irrelevant? It’s a staple of storytelling itself. A main character defeating the antagonist who killed the person dearest to them is a given across all forms of media for a reason.
DBZ, Naruto, HxH, AoT, Nanatsu no Taizai, FMA, etc.
Spider-Man, Batman, Superman, the Flash
It’s the maximum conflict and emotion that can be drawn from a narrative…so it is the farthest thing possible from “irrelevant”
The real question is why someone would want it to be irrelevant, because it indicates that they care about something other than storytelling…
The issue isn’t resolved with Sabo doing anything because it was Luffy’s inability to defend his brother that he considers a failure. If Luffy isn’t even needed to protect the ones he loves, then his gaining strength is pointless.
If he doesn’t face down the one who killed the person dearest to him…that made him give up on his dream…that even imprinted that failure on his very body, then where is the resolution?
Why would you even want the most personal conflict for Luffy to be glossed over in the first place? That’s very odd. It’s storytelling 101.
How is it irrelevant? It’s a staple of storytelling itself. A main character defeating the antagonist who killed the person dearest to them is a given across all forms of media for a reason.
DBZ, Naruto, HxH, AoT, Nanatsu no Taizai, FMA, etc.
Spider-Man, Batman, Superman, the Flash
It’s the maximum conflict and emotion that can be drawn from a narrative…so it is the farthest thing possible from “irrelevant”
The real question is why someone would want it to be irrelevant, because it indicates that they care about something other than storytelling…
Sure.
See. This is the problem, you earlier said that Akainu is against his freedom then after I said Sabo can take care of that, you go back in avenging Ace and Blah blah blah.
You said you didn't say Akainu is the biggest threat to Luffy's freedom cause you well know that it is Imu and the WG that is the biggest threat to Luffy's freedom. His very goal is to defeat the system not to defeat a replaceable henchman or to avenge Ace.
If the only reason you have is avenging Ace and freedom(which Akainu is not even the biggest threat to, in fact Akainu being a threat to Luffy right now might not even be true), then it is just a side quest.
See. This is the problem, you earlier said that Akainu is against his freedom then after I said Sabo can take care of that, you go back in avenging Ace and Blah blah blah.
You said you didn't say Akainu is the biggest threat to Luffy's freedom cause you well know that it is Imu and the WG that is the biggest threat to Luffy's freedom. His very goal is to defeat the system not to defeat a replaceable henchman or to avenge Ace.
If the only reason you have is avenging Ace and freedom(which Akainu is not even the biggest threat to, in fact Akainu being a threat to Luffy right now might not even be true), then it is just a side quest.
I’m not sure why you are trying to separate fighting for his freedom and defeating the person who killed his beloved brother. They are part and parcel of the same narrative.
How can he be free if his brother’s killer is still targeting him and trying to exterminate him and his friends? How is the very issue that caused the time skip resolved if he doesn’t face down that killer and show that he can now protect his loved ones so they don’t get killed in front of him?
Is the scar right there in the middle of his chest going to keep aching without Luffy freeing himself from it? What kind of failed storytelling would that be…
Oda went out of his way to even insert Ace into the Wano arc just to lend a modicum of personal stakes for Luffy…and you think that the one that even killed Ace himself will be kept from Luffy?
Either way, Akainu will always be a threat to Luffy until the end, although that indicates the underlying reason why you’re trying to dismiss the most personal mutual conflict in the series as “irrelevant.” Don’t like that Luffy’s foe is that strong?
Even right now Luffy is trying to flee from just a fraction of the forces the man commands.
How can he be free if his brother’s killer is still targeting him and trying to exterminate him and his friends? How is the very issue that caused the time skip resolved if he doesn’t face down that killer and show that he can now protect his loved ones so they don’t get killed in front of him?
Is the scar right there in the middle of his chest going to keep aching without Luffy freeing himself from it? What kind of failed storytelling would that be…
Oda went out of his way to even insert Ace into the Wano arc just to lend a modicum of personal stakes for Luffy…and you think that the one that even killed Ace himself will be kept from Luffy?
Either way, Akainu will always be a threat to Luffy until the end, although that indicates the underlying reason why you’re trying to dismiss the most personal mutual conflict in the series as “irrelevant.” Don’t like that Luffy’s foe is that strong?
Even right now Luffy is trying to flee from just a fraction of the forces the man commands.
Ace was a pirate. Luffy knew the consequences on that.
Is Luffy gonna demolish the whole marines then? Cause by EOS they will still hunt them. Is he gonna kill everyone who is a threat to his friends?
Weak bait. He won't be a threat anymore if Sabo beats him. He might not even be a threat anymore. He lets Momo and Scabbards fight GB. That's how much threatened he is.
He was willing to fight Fuji, enter a government territory and was eating while GB was fighting. We will see if he wants to escape or his crew tells him to.
There an isssue too that if Luffy fights Akainu that would mean the whole straw hats will have to defeat the whole marines. Would that he necessary if Marines would still exist by the end of the series? It is irrelevant to defeat the whole marines on an arc.
And you can't use the storytelling 101 since Oda is willing to break the norm.
Is Luffy gonna demolish the whole marines then? Cause by EOS they will still hunt them. Is he gonna kill everyone who is a threat to his friends?
Weak bait. He won't be a threat anymore if Sabo beats him. He might not even be a threat anymore. He lets Momo and Scabbards fight GB. That's how much threatened he is.
He was willing to fight Fuji, enter a government territory and was eating while GB was fighting. We will see if he wants to escape or his crew tells him to.
There an isssue too that if Luffy fights Akainu that would mean the whole straw hats will have to defeat the whole marines. Would that he necessary if Marines would still exist by the end of the series? It is irrelevant to defeat the whole marines on an arc.
And you can't use the storytelling 101 since Oda is willing to break the norm.
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And? Did Ace being a pirate stop Luffy from breaking down and nearly dying? Or giving up on his dream of becoming Pirate King? What kind of excuse is that…
Akainu is the one targeting Luffy. Other marines don’t care, and some even like him like Koby and Fujitora. Even on Marineford, it was Akainu going out of his way to chase him while the rest barely cared.
He won’t be a threat if he drops dead of a heart attack. That’s irrelevant. The point is that Luffy failed to protect his loved one and will now succeed in doing so. That’s not resolved with Luffy not doing anything. Do your not understand conflict > resolution? Luffy going on a timeskip to gain strength to better protect his friends would be pointless if they can just tell him to get lost because he isn’t even needed.
Again, why would you even want Luffy’s most personal conflict to be taken from him? It’s storytelling 101 as already mentioned. It’s kinda bizarre…
The very fact that Luffy left the party on Wano to go and watch over the samurai shows that he was concerned. He let them take a go at Kaido first too, so did you think he wasn’t concerned? Even another Yonko thought it necessary to step in when Greenbull’s intent turned murderous. The double standards and excuses don’t work any better than when people tried them last year.
The point is that Luffy still sees just a fraction of the Navy as a threat, not whether he wants to fight or not. He’s always wanted to fight anybody, that’s nothing new.
Not sure how you came to the conclusion that Luffy fighting Akainu means the entire Marines must be defeated. That’s a non sequitur. The excuses are just getting odder.
Oda follows the norm tooth and nail. He changes superficial details here and there but always embraces that One Piece is a shounen in the vein of DBZ, even going so far as to throw in tropes when they don’t fit like the Nika retcon.
What you’re suggesting is as silly as Piccolo defeating Frieza after he killed Krillin in front of him.
As already said, it’s the best thing that a story can offer. Again, why would you not want that? What concerns trump great storytelling for you? Terrible powerscaling? Ridiculous
Akainu is the one targeting Luffy. Other marines don’t care, and some even like him like Koby and Fujitora. Even on Marineford, it was Akainu going out of his way to chase him while the rest barely cared.
He won’t be a threat if he drops dead of a heart attack. That’s irrelevant. The point is that Luffy failed to protect his loved one and will now succeed in doing so. That’s not resolved with Luffy not doing anything. Do your not understand conflict > resolution? Luffy going on a timeskip to gain strength to better protect his friends would be pointless if they can just tell him to get lost because he isn’t even needed.
Again, why would you even want Luffy’s most personal conflict to be taken from him? It’s storytelling 101 as already mentioned. It’s kinda bizarre…
The very fact that Luffy left the party on Wano to go and watch over the samurai shows that he was concerned. He let them take a go at Kaido first too, so did you think he wasn’t concerned? Even another Yonko thought it necessary to step in when Greenbull’s intent turned murderous. The double standards and excuses don’t work any better than when people tried them last year.
The point is that Luffy still sees just a fraction of the Navy as a threat, not whether he wants to fight or not. He’s always wanted to fight anybody, that’s nothing new.
Not sure how you came to the conclusion that Luffy fighting Akainu means the entire Marines must be defeated. That’s a non sequitur. The excuses are just getting odder.
Oda follows the norm tooth and nail. He changes superficial details here and there but always embraces that One Piece is a shounen in the vein of DBZ, even going so far as to throw in tropes when they don’t fit like the Nika retcon.
What you’re suggesting is as silly as Piccolo defeating Frieza after he killed Krillin in front of him.
As already said, it’s the best thing that a story can offer. Again, why would you not want that? What concerns trump great storytelling for you? Terrible powerscaling? Ridiculous
So what then? Did he kill himself? Doesn't he want to become pirate king anymore? Didn't he overcome this things iirc one chapter after?
Do you mean they won't hunt down Luffy after final war? LOL So marines will have biases?
And do you really think that SHs will fight the marines solely for Luffy's personal conflict? They will need to defeat not only those who are bad marines but also those who are doing their duty?
Isn't this the same if Sabo kills him? LOL
Never said it is what I want. Where did you get that idea? I just think it is irrelevant for them to fight.
Story wise, beating Akainu won't move the story forward. What would Luffy gain from it? Would he be closer to becoming Pirate king or claiming one piece? Nope. Would he gain freedom? Nope. WG would still be there. They could just replace Akainu.
Nah, Luffy knew there were an army of Sulong waiting for Kaido, what Luffy didn't know is that Jack and few more would follow. While Luffy didn't move a muscle while Momo was being strangled.
When did Luffy say that he sees this as a threat when he literally was willing to enter a government territory?
So you are telling me that marines would just let Luffy walk pass and fight Akainu? LOL
Different situation. If it was Gohan who went Super Saiyan and beat Frieza then I wouldn't mind it.
It is a great story telling for you. It is not for me, I could see it as irrelevant fight. Why are you inserting powerscaling? When my very reason is not about powerscaling? LOL
Do you mean they won't hunt down Luffy after final war? LOL So marines will have biases?
And do you really think that SHs will fight the marines solely for Luffy's personal conflict? They will need to defeat not only those who are bad marines but also those who are doing their duty?
Isn't this the same if Sabo kills him? LOL
Never said it is what I want. Where did you get that idea? I just think it is irrelevant for them to fight.
Story wise, beating Akainu won't move the story forward. What would Luffy gain from it? Would he be closer to becoming Pirate king or claiming one piece? Nope. Would he gain freedom? Nope. WG would still be there. They could just replace Akainu.
Nah, Luffy knew there were an army of Sulong waiting for Kaido, what Luffy didn't know is that Jack and few more would follow. While Luffy didn't move a muscle while Momo was being strangled.
When did Luffy say that he sees this as a threat when he literally was willing to enter a government territory?
So you are telling me that marines would just let Luffy walk pass and fight Akainu? LOL
Different situation. If it was Gohan who went Super Saiyan and beat Frieza then I wouldn't mind it.
It is a great story telling for you. It is not for me, I could see it as irrelevant fight. Why are you inserting powerscaling? When my very reason is not about powerscaling? LOL
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It’s like you are asking me to lecture you on the most basic things in the series.
Jimbe had to remind Luffy that he still had people that he loves that he has to protect. That’s what brought him out of the fog of Akainu killing Ace. That’s why it’s important for him to be able to protect his nakama from Akainu.
Of course Marines have biases. Have you not been paying attention to the series? Garp was chasing Roger and didn’t give a damn about Big Mom or Kaido. He respected Roger enough to protect his son from the WG. If your excuses have to be this terrible, what does that say about your position?
Sabo ain’t killing anybody. And once again, that doesn’t resolve the issue that triggered the entire time skip: Luffy being unable to protect his brother. There’s no resolution of Luffy isn’t even needed and wasted his time trying to get stronger to do so only for it to turn out that Luffy’s anguish was for nothing because Ace should just have been strong enough to not need him.
…Do you even understand what a story is? Do you know how insane it is to claim that the MC defeating the person that killed the one dearest to them in the world is “irrelevant?”
Have you just never read a story before? Conflict, emotional stakes, narrative…do this terms not mean anything to you?
As I’ve said over and over and over again, it’s storytelling itself you are railing against. Whether in manga or anime, Western or Eastern media, all forms of entertainment, it is a staple of storytelling itself because it’s the MAX you could draw from it.
Not wanting the best for a story you claim to like is incredibly odd in and of itself.
Again, you are claiming that the MOST personal conflict for the MC in the story is irrelevant and adamantly defending that claim, so it’s obviously something you want, otherwise we wouldn’t be discussing it.
If it were irrelevant, Oda would have had a random no-name marine kill Ace by accident, lmao!
He wouldn’t have had Akainu imprint his mark right on Luffy’s chest, something no other antagonist has done.
So now you thought that Luffy expected the Minks to beat Kaido? Do you not realize how your excuses are only getting worse? Why was he still trying to get to the roof of that were the case? Come on now.
Double standards always make you look terrible.
Where did Luffy say he sees this as a threat? When he decided to take a hostage to run from it, lmao.
Which fodder are you expecting to stop Luffy from getting to Akainu? Which fodder do you think Akainu is going to let get in his way from going after Luffy?
It seems that you keep on forgetting that the conflict is mutual. Akainu states himself that he didn’t care if anyone else escaped on Marineford as long as he got to kill Ace & Luffy. You think if Luffy shows up in front of him he would suddenly change his mind?
Gohan wasn’t even involved in the Namek saga at all. That would be even worse than Piccolo doing it. You’re just emphasizing how silly it is to so desperately want anybody but the MC to deal with their own personal conflict!
Frieza kills Goku’s best friend, yet it’s his ignorant son that should appear to defeat Frieza? Can’t make this stuff up…
It’s great storytelling for anyone who’s read a story before because it’s universal to storytelling itself. You don’t like it because of silly powerscaling, yet somehow every major shounen author, or even writers in general have thought it’s a “no duh!” From time immemorial.
I wonder why….
Jimbe had to remind Luffy that he still had people that he loves that he has to protect. That’s what brought him out of the fog of Akainu killing Ace. That’s why it’s important for him to be able to protect his nakama from Akainu.
Of course Marines have biases. Have you not been paying attention to the series? Garp was chasing Roger and didn’t give a damn about Big Mom or Kaido. He respected Roger enough to protect his son from the WG. If your excuses have to be this terrible, what does that say about your position?
Sabo ain’t killing anybody. And once again, that doesn’t resolve the issue that triggered the entire time skip: Luffy being unable to protect his brother. There’s no resolution of Luffy isn’t even needed and wasted his time trying to get stronger to do so only for it to turn out that Luffy’s anguish was for nothing because Ace should just have been strong enough to not need him.
…Do you even understand what a story is? Do you know how insane it is to claim that the MC defeating the person that killed the one dearest to them in the world is “irrelevant?”
Have you just never read a story before? Conflict, emotional stakes, narrative…do this terms not mean anything to you?
As I’ve said over and over and over again, it’s storytelling itself you are railing against. Whether in manga or anime, Western or Eastern media, all forms of entertainment, it is a staple of storytelling itself because it’s the MAX you could draw from it.
Not wanting the best for a story you claim to like is incredibly odd in and of itself.
Again, you are claiming that the MOST personal conflict for the MC in the story is irrelevant and adamantly defending that claim, so it’s obviously something you want, otherwise we wouldn’t be discussing it.
If it were irrelevant, Oda would have had a random no-name marine kill Ace by accident, lmao!
He wouldn’t have had Akainu imprint his mark right on Luffy’s chest, something no other antagonist has done.
So now you thought that Luffy expected the Minks to beat Kaido? Do you not realize how your excuses are only getting worse? Why was he still trying to get to the roof of that were the case? Come on now.
Double standards always make you look terrible.
Where did Luffy say he sees this as a threat? When he decided to take a hostage to run from it, lmao.
Which fodder are you expecting to stop Luffy from getting to Akainu? Which fodder do you think Akainu is going to let get in his way from going after Luffy?
It seems that you keep on forgetting that the conflict is mutual. Akainu states himself that he didn’t care if anyone else escaped on Marineford as long as he got to kill Ace & Luffy. You think if Luffy shows up in front of him he would suddenly change his mind?
Gohan wasn’t even involved in the Namek saga at all. That would be even worse than Piccolo doing it. You’re just emphasizing how silly it is to so desperately want anybody but the MC to deal with their own personal conflict!
Frieza kills Goku’s best friend, yet it’s his ignorant son that should appear to defeat Frieza? Can’t make this stuff up…
It’s great storytelling for anyone who’s read a story before because it’s universal to storytelling itself. You don’t like it because of silly powerscaling, yet somehow every major shounen author, or even writers in general have thought it’s a “no duh!” From time immemorial.
I wonder why….
Dude take a chill pill. Is your keyboard still in one piece? LMAO
You are adding shit up to support your narrative. LOL. Jinbe never mentioned protecting his friends.
I never said they don't have biases. I said they will have biases. Marines will be reformed by EOS. If they stay the same then whats the point of their Motto justice. When did Luff say he wants to to get stronger to defeat the one that killed Ace? Cause it is irrelevant. Even now Luffy never mentioned to fight Akainu, not even when Jinbe mentioned it in Fishman Island. It is never his goal. Even Luffy knows there is nothing to gain in beating Akainu. When did I say Luffy thought Minks can defeat Kaido?
He thought that Sulong Minks could help the Scabbards to at least not get easily murdered before he arrives.
While with GB, he didn't move a muscle even if Momo was being strangled. LOL
Making a run doesn't mean he is threaten by them. He has nothing to gain if he defeats them So they will just 1v1 while the whole marines are watching? LMAO that's the stupidest thing ever. And even if by a miracle Akainu decide to do this, the Gorosei will not allow it. The possibility that they will lose their FA will not only affect world balance, it will also affect their image. If Akainu vs Luffy will happen it will be a full war, the gorosei will not allow that 1v1 stupidity. Aside from Gorosei has higher authority than Akainu, Akainu himself follows the Gorosei. So yes, if Akainu falls so does the marines. Krillin and Gohan did hell each other in Namek, probably saved each other a few times. Goku craves battle to the point where he is will to risk some things while Gohan symbolizes peace and future. So yeah Gohan could have been a good candidate. I didn't know you were a psychology doctor. You can read people's mind LOL. I don't think it will happen because it doesn't move the story forward. From the start of the series and even now most of the arcs has connection to Luffy's goal. Create a pirate crew, be pirate king, claim one piece.
You are adding shit up to support your narrative. LOL. Jinbe never mentioned protecting his friends.
I never said they don't have biases. I said they will have biases. Marines will be reformed by EOS. If they stay the same then whats the point of their Motto justice. When did Luff say he wants to to get stronger to defeat the one that killed Ace? Cause it is irrelevant. Even now Luffy never mentioned to fight Akainu, not even when Jinbe mentioned it in Fishman Island. It is never his goal. Even Luffy knows there is nothing to gain in beating Akainu. When did I say Luffy thought Minks can defeat Kaido?
He thought that Sulong Minks could help the Scabbards to at least not get easily murdered before he arrives.While with GB, he didn't move a muscle even if Momo was being strangled. LOL
Making a run doesn't mean he is threaten by them. He has nothing to gain if he defeats them So they will just 1v1 while the whole marines are watching? LMAO that's the stupidest thing ever. And even if by a miracle Akainu decide to do this, the Gorosei will not allow it. The possibility that they will lose their FA will not only affect world balance, it will also affect their image. If Akainu vs Luffy will happen it will be a full war, the gorosei will not allow that 1v1 stupidity. Aside from Gorosei has higher authority than Akainu, Akainu himself follows the Gorosei. So yes, if Akainu falls so does the marines. Krillin and Gohan did hell each other in Namek, probably saved each other a few times. Goku craves battle to the point where he is will to risk some things while Gohan symbolizes peace and future. So yeah Gohan could have been a good candidate. I didn't know you were a psychology doctor. You can read people's mind LOL. I don't think it will happen because it doesn't move the story forward. From the start of the series and even now most of the arcs has connection to Luffy's goal. Create a pirate crew, be pirate king, claim one piece.
Dude take a chill pill. Is your keyboard still in one piece? LMAO
You are adding shit up to support your narrative. LOL. Jinbe never mentioned protecting his friends.
I never said they don't have biases. I said they will have biases. Marines will be reformed by EOS. If they stay the same then whats the point of their Motto justice.
When did Luff say he wants to to get stronger to defeat the one that killed Ace?
Cause it is irrelevant. Even now Luffy never mentioned to fight Akainu, not even when Jinbe mentioned it in Fishman Island. It is never his goal. Even Luffy knows there is nothing to gain in beating Akainu.
When did I say Luffy thought Minks can defeat Kaido? He thought that Sulong Minks could help the Scabbards to at least not get easily murdered before he arrives.
While with GB, he didn't move a muscle even if Momo was being strangled. LOL
Making a run doesn't mean he is threaten by them. He has nothing to gain if he defeats them
So they will just 1v1 while the whole marines are watching? LMAO that's the stupidest thing ever. And even if by a miracle Akainu decide to do this, the Gorosei will not allow it. The possibility that they will lose their FA will not only affect world balance, it will also affect their image. If Akainu vs Luffy will happen it will be a full war, the gorosei will not allow that 1v1 stupidity. Aside from Gorosei has higher authority than Akainu, Akainu himself follows the Gorosei. So yes, if Akainu falls so does the marines.Krillin and Gohan did hell each other in Namek, probably saved each other a few times. Goku craves battle to the point where he is will to risk some things while Gohan symbolizes peace and future. So yeah Gohan could have been a good candidate.
I didn't know you were a psychology doctor. You can read people's mind LOL. I don't think it will happen because it doesn't move the story forward. From the start of the series and even now most of the arcs has connection to Luffy's goal. Create a pirate crew, be pirate king, claim one piece.
You are adding shit up to support your narrative. LOL. Jinbe never mentioned protecting his friends.
I never said they don't have biases. I said they will have biases. Marines will be reformed by EOS. If they stay the same then whats the point of their Motto justice.
When did Luff say he wants to to get stronger to defeat the one that killed Ace?
Cause it is irrelevant. Even now Luffy never mentioned to fight Akainu, not even when Jinbe mentioned it in Fishman Island. It is never his goal. Even Luffy knows there is nothing to gain in beating Akainu.
When did I say Luffy thought Minks can defeat Kaido?
He thought that Sulong Minks could help the Scabbards to at least not get easily murdered before he arrives.While with GB, he didn't move a muscle even if Momo was being strangled. LOL
Making a run doesn't mean he is threaten by them. He has nothing to gain if he defeats them
So they will just 1v1 while the whole marines are watching? LMAO that's the stupidest thing ever. And even if by a miracle Akainu decide to do this, the Gorosei will not allow it. The possibility that they will lose their FA will not only affect world balance, it will also affect their image. If Akainu vs Luffy will happen it will be a full war, the gorosei will not allow that 1v1 stupidity. Aside from Gorosei has higher authority than Akainu, Akainu himself follows the Gorosei. So yes, if Akainu falls so does the marines.Krillin and Gohan did hell each other in Namek, probably saved each other a few times. Goku craves battle to the point where he is will to risk some things while Gohan symbolizes peace and future. So yeah Gohan could have been a good candidate.
I didn't know you were a psychology doctor. You can read people's mind LOL. I don't think it will happen because it doesn't move the story forward. From the start of the series and even now most of the arcs has connection to Luffy's goal. Create a pirate crew, be pirate king, claim one piece.
You just keep proving you don’t even read the series. Jimbe’s words were: “Your brother was your guiding light on the seas. You failed to save him…but what is it that you still have?”
And Luffy’s replies: “I have my nakama.”
The entire point is that he couldn’t save Ace because “all those formidable enemies took away your confidence”…but he still had his nakama whom he could protect.
Don’t be shameless now. Your comments are above in plain view for all to see. You said:” LOL so the marines will have biases?”
I’m the one who had to tell you yes they will.
Strawman arguments won’t help you. Luffy didn’t specifically say that he has to defeat the one who killed Ace…but he has said that he has to be able to defeat anyone who would take his friends from him, including Admirals like Akainu.
Do you think that Luffy won’t fight Blackbeard? Do you think that’s irrelevant? Go ahead and expose your hypocrisy.
As I already said, Luffy has already listed the Admirals as people he has to be able to defeat. He shows clear animosity for Akainu, even over Blackbeard whose name he ignored and continued eating obliviously.
You are only deluding yourself if you think that Luffy and Akinu aren’t going to get right down to it if they show up in front of each other.
That’s the farthest thing from itrelevant no matter how hard you try to pretend.
lol, you answered yourself: Luffy thought the Scabbards with Yamato could not get easily murdered before he could intervene. Yamato alone held Kaido for several minutes. So why the silly double standard trying to use that against Greenbull but not Kaido? Do you understand how transparently hypocritical that is?
You know how to apply context when it comes to a Yonko…but when it’s an Admiral your brain shuts off out of hate. Childish.
Greenbull wanted the Scabbards to bring Luffy to him and was clearly playing around. That’s the very same reason Shanks didn’t intervene until GB’s intent turned murderous. But apparently you just forgot or didn’t even bother to read. Smh
You don’t hold a hostage if you think that your opponent can’t threaten you, lol.
Surely you must be pretending at this point. You’re really going to sit there and act like it’s Luffy alone that’s going to walk up to New Marineford and request a honorable duel? Don’t be silly. Other will obviously be fighting the rest while Luffy fights Akainu. Fodder has no place in such a battle when they could be melted by sheer proximity. Conjuring bizarre addendums and criteria like the entire Navy must be present spectating just indicates how desperate you are to avoid the idea. As if we don’t already have plenty of examples of Luffy fighting the leader of an organization without everyone else needing to be present let alone defeated.
Oh lord! You’re actually trying to sit there and pretend that Gohan all of a sudden fighting Frieza after he killed Krillin while Goku himself sits back to watch makes any lick of sense? LMAO!
So do you think that Rock Lee should have fought Pain after he killed Hinata in front of Naruto?
Or that Spider-Man should have asked Ironman to defeat Green Goblin for him after he killed Gwen Stacy in front of him?
Even in the goddamn movies, after Green Goblin killed Aunt May in NWH, were you expecting Dr. Strange or the old movie Spidermen to defeat him instead of Tom Holland Spider-Man?
I don’t want to drag this into spoilers for other series or shows, but go ahead and try to name a single time in any form of entertainment where someone else defeating the antagonist who killed the MC’s loved one could remotely work better than the MC himself doing it. I’ll wait. You can go through Comics, Cartoons, IMDB’s top 250 movies or TV Shows, Literature from Greek plays to the 2020s…
Let’s see how your idea of “great storytelling” stands up to actual stories from time immemorial.
Ridiculous…
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Dude take a chill pill. Is your keyboard still in one piece? LMAO
You are adding shit up to support your narrative. LOL. Jinbe never mentioned protecting his friends.
I never said they don't have biases. I said they will have biases. Marines will be reformed by EOS. If they stay the same then whats the point of their Motto justice.
When did Luff say he wants to to get stronger to defeat the one that killed Ace?
Cause it is irrelevant. Even now Luffy never mentioned to fight Akainu, not even when Jinbe mentioned it in Fishman Island. It is never his goal. Even Luffy knows there is nothing to gain in beating Akainu.
When did I say Luffy thought Minks can defeat Kaido? He thought that Sulong Minks could help the Scabbards to at least not get easily murdered before he arrives.
While with GB, he didn't move a muscle even if Momo was being strangled. LOL
Making a run doesn't mean he is threaten by them. He has nothing to gain if he defeats them
So they will just 1v1 while the whole marines are watching? LMAO that's the stupidest thing ever. And even if by a miracle Akainu decide to do this, the Gorosei will not allow it. The possibility that they will lose their FA will not only affect world balance, it will also affect their image. If Akainu vs Luffy will happen it will be a full war, the gorosei will not allow that 1v1 stupidity. Aside from Gorosei has higher authority than Akainu, Akainu himself follows the Gorosei. So yes, if Akainu falls so does the marines.Krillin and Gohan did hell each other in Namek, probably saved each other a few times. Goku craves battle to the point where he is will to risk some things while Gohan symbolizes peace and future. So yeah Gohan could have been a good candidate.
I didn't know you were a psychology doctor. You can read people's mind LOL. I don't think it will happen because it doesn't move the story forward. From the start of the series and even now most of the arcs has connection to Luffy's goal. Create a pirate crew, be pirate king, claim one piece.
You are adding shit up to support your narrative. LOL. Jinbe never mentioned protecting his friends.
I never said they don't have biases. I said they will have biases. Marines will be reformed by EOS. If they stay the same then whats the point of their Motto justice.
When did Luff say he wants to to get stronger to defeat the one that killed Ace?
Cause it is irrelevant. Even now Luffy never mentioned to fight Akainu, not even when Jinbe mentioned it in Fishman Island. It is never his goal. Even Luffy knows there is nothing to gain in beating Akainu.
When did I say Luffy thought Minks can defeat Kaido?
He thought that Sulong Minks could help the Scabbards to at least not get easily murdered before he arrives.While with GB, he didn't move a muscle even if Momo was being strangled. LOL
Making a run doesn't mean he is threaten by them. He has nothing to gain if he defeats them
So they will just 1v1 while the whole marines are watching? LMAO that's the stupidest thing ever. And even if by a miracle Akainu decide to do this, the Gorosei will not allow it. The possibility that they will lose their FA will not only affect world balance, it will also affect their image. If Akainu vs Luffy will happen it will be a full war, the gorosei will not allow that 1v1 stupidity. Aside from Gorosei has higher authority than Akainu, Akainu himself follows the Gorosei. So yes, if Akainu falls so does the marines.Krillin and Gohan did hell each other in Namek, probably saved each other a few times. Goku craves battle to the point where he is will to risk some things while Gohan symbolizes peace and future. So yeah Gohan could have been a good candidate.
I didn't know you were a psychology doctor. You can read people's mind LOL. I don't think it will happen because it doesn't move the story forward. From the start of the series and even now most of the arcs has connection to Luffy's goal. Create a pirate crew, be pirate king, claim one piece.
That’s still a terrible excuse anyway, because by your own reasoning Sabo could beat Blackbeard for Luffy and you’re in the same boat, lol.
The “WHO” and “WHY” still matter for a narrative, even if you don’t seem to understand that like you’ve never read a story before.
well….asking for Gohan to defeat Frieza instead of Goku already tells it all
"Able to defeat" and "should defeat" are 2 different things
He will cause BB is still fighting to be a pirate king.
Are we comparing an army fighting Kaido and a few injured Scabbards fighting GB? Luffy was even rushing to go up the rooftop while he was eating while watching LOL The point is how Luffy reacts, one is rushing while one is chillin'
Threaten to defeat them? Nah. Threaten to get his Crew mates get injured against an army? Sure why not.
Lmao. I never imply that. Have you read Marineford war? The admiral even the FA doesn't abandon their post. They let minor fighters fight first. Akainu follows this.
And outside Akainu vs Luffy fight, what would the other characters be fighting for? Just because Luffy wants to fight Akainu? And you actually believe that Oda would dedicate 50+ chapters of skirmish? LMAO
Can you enumerate then. Haha
Who said Goku would just sit and watch? He could be defeated in the process. In fact, Gohan was supposed to be the next main character
Is this your fave quote? Lmao
Iron man never defeated Bucky, Pepper never defeated Killmonger and Fury never defeated Pym in What if. Fury never killed Gravik.
Like I said Blackbeard is a top tier who is still a contender to pirate king. When was Luffy's main goal to defeat Akainu?
He will cause BB is still fighting to be a pirate king.
Are we comparing an army fighting Kaido and a few injured Scabbards fighting GB? Luffy was even rushing to go up the rooftop while he was eating while watching LOL The point is how Luffy reacts, one is rushing while one is chillin'
Threaten to defeat them? Nah. Threaten to get his Crew mates get injured against an army? Sure why not.
Lmao. I never imply that. Have you read Marineford war? The admiral even the FA doesn't abandon their post. They let minor fighters fight first. Akainu follows this.
And outside Akainu vs Luffy fight, what would the other characters be fighting for? Just because Luffy wants to fight Akainu? And you actually believe that Oda would dedicate 50+ chapters of skirmish? LMAO
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Can you enumerate then. Haha
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Who said Goku would just sit and watch? He could be defeated in the process. In fact, Gohan was supposed to be the next main character
Is this your fave quote? Lmao
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Iron man never defeated Bucky, Pepper never defeated Killmonger and Fury never defeated Pym in What if. Fury never killed Gravik.
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Like I said Blackbeard is a top tier who is still a contender to pirate king. When was Luffy's main goal to defeat Akainu?
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So you’re just solidifying the double standards.
Akainu is still leading the organization that fights pirates, so that’s no different than your excuse for Blackbeard fighting to become PK. You have to be consistent or you just expose your biases and hypocrisy.
Yamato counts more than the fodder Mink army that was taken out by Jack. Even trying to still use that is just embarrassing.
What’s your excuse for Luffy leaving Franky & Brook to deal with Big Mom while laughing? I guess Kaido’s partner was not a threat, right?
At least now you’ve unwittingly admitted that the Navy forces are indeed a threat. If Luffy thinks they can injure his crewmates even with him there, then that obviously means they are a threat…unless you don’t even know the definition of the word (which seems very likely now). Took you long enough.
Of course I read Marineford, but you clearly didn’t. Akainu chased down Ace & Luffy himself to kill them. He didn’t wait for fodder to try, lmao. Even with Whitebeard still rampaging he didn’t give a damn and went straight for Luffy.
So amnesia won’t help you. If Luffy shows up in front of him, who do you think that Akainu would go after? Someone whose name he hasn’t even mentioned once? Brilliant!
And oh geez, what would the pirates be fighting for if the Navy is trying to kill them? Surely that’s a mystery for the ages. Guess the pirates would just sit and welcome their extermination. There’s no way even you yourself believe these excuses you are giving. This is a story for kids, and I assume you’re a grown ass man…so why pretend to not understand something a 12 year old could?
Don’t be silly, every single major fight of Luffy has him fighting the leader alone in the end, even when Oda has to stretch the circumstances.
This probably the most pointless of your excuses.
Oh, now it’s getting interesting. So you wanted Frieza to beat Goku after already killing Krillin, then Gohan would then defeat him?
So you want Akainu to defeat Luffy and then Sabo now has to step in to save him?
That’s even worse, lmao!
Oh boy, now you’re trying to resort to “What if?” Stories. The entire premise based on alternatives to the canon timeline?
Iron Man wasn’t the main character of Captain America: Civil War. In fact, he’s one of the antagonists.
Black Panther does defeat Killmonger in the 1st movie, and Shuri defeats Namor who killed her mother in the 2nd one.
Gi’ah, the daughter of Talos whom Gravik killed defeats him. Fury’s most loved person was his wife, Gi’ah’s was Talos.
All you’ve done is prove my point over and over again.
Let’s not forget: Thor defeating Malekith who killed his mother, Spider-man defeating Green Goblin as already mentioned, Steve Rogers defeating Red Skull while he thought killed Bucky, Peter Quill for Ego who killed his mother, Rocket Raccoon for the High Evolutionary who killed his friends.
That’s only the MCU too. Care to try again?
Again, your excuse works both ways. Sabo can defeat Blackbeard so Luffy doesn’t have to bother, so that means it’s irrelevant according to you.
That’s all you ever get from silly double standards.
Akainu is still leading the organization that fights pirates, so that’s no different than your excuse for Blackbeard fighting to become PK. You have to be consistent or you just expose your biases and hypocrisy.
Yamato counts more than the fodder Mink army that was taken out by Jack. Even trying to still use that is just embarrassing.
What’s your excuse for Luffy leaving Franky & Brook to deal with Big Mom while laughing? I guess Kaido’s partner was not a threat, right?
At least now you’ve unwittingly admitted that the Navy forces are indeed a threat. If Luffy thinks they can injure his crewmates even with him there, then that obviously means they are a threat…unless you don’t even know the definition of the word (which seems very likely now). Took you long enough.
Of course I read Marineford, but you clearly didn’t. Akainu chased down Ace & Luffy himself to kill them. He didn’t wait for fodder to try, lmao. Even with Whitebeard still rampaging he didn’t give a damn and went straight for Luffy.
So amnesia won’t help you. If Luffy shows up in front of him, who do you think that Akainu would go after? Someone whose name he hasn’t even mentioned once? Brilliant!
And oh geez, what would the pirates be fighting for if the Navy is trying to kill them? Surely that’s a mystery for the ages. Guess the pirates would just sit and welcome their extermination. There’s no way even you yourself believe these excuses you are giving. This is a story for kids, and I assume you’re a grown ass man…so why pretend to not understand something a 12 year old could?
Don’t be silly, every single major fight of Luffy has him fighting the leader alone in the end, even when Oda has to stretch the circumstances.
This probably the most pointless of your excuses.
Oh, now it’s getting interesting. So you wanted Frieza to beat Goku after already killing Krillin, then Gohan would then defeat him?
So you want Akainu to defeat Luffy and then Sabo now has to step in to save him?
That’s even worse, lmao!
Oh boy, now you’re trying to resort to “What if?” Stories. The entire premise based on alternatives to the canon timeline?
Iron Man wasn’t the main character of Captain America: Civil War. In fact, he’s one of the antagonists.
Black Panther does defeat Killmonger in the 1st movie, and Shuri defeats Namor who killed her mother in the 2nd one.
Gi’ah, the daughter of Talos whom Gravik killed defeats him. Fury’s most loved person was his wife, Gi’ah’s was Talos.
All you’ve done is prove my point over and over again.
Let’s not forget: Thor defeating Malekith who killed his mother, Spider-man defeating Green Goblin as already mentioned, Steve Rogers defeating Red Skull while he thought killed Bucky, Peter Quill for Ego who killed his mother, Rocket Raccoon for the High Evolutionary who killed his friends.
That’s only the MCU too. Care to try again?
Again, your excuse works both ways. Sabo can defeat Blackbeard so Luffy doesn’t have to bother, so that means it’s irrelevant according to you.
That’s all you ever get from silly double standards.
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Law had 3 RP, Kidd had 3 RP, Shanks have 3 RP, BB have 3 RP, Luffy has 3 RP and Marines never did take action to it. They are all one step closer to becoming PK. While BB Shanks and Luffy are in a race to become PK. And when was the last time Akainu went to hunt pirates, in marineford WB was the one who went to marineford.
LOL that is the dumbest analogy I have seen in my life, Sabo can't become the MC while Gohan could have been. And I never that the situation would all be the same, in fact I already said the situation is not the same. LMAO honestly you are making me laugh at your arguement. The dumbest thing ever hahahaha What's next? You will tell me "You think Goku wants to be King of Saiyans because Luffy wants to be PK?"
You think fasting Yamato can take out an army of Sulong Minks? Numbers matter. Jack also brought his army to help him.
What do you mean he didn't wait for fodder to try? LMAO Did Akainu go try to get to Luffy just after they drop from the sky. Even in WB's case, it was Aokiji and Kizaru who went to immediately fight WB, Akainu only fought WB after the stab. Clearly you forgot.
If the Marines would attack them, then why not escape to avoid casualties. It unimportant for them to fight. And SHs attacks marineford, then why? What would be the purpose of the rest of SH + grand fleet to fight the marines. Clearly not just because of grudge match.
You getting stress out. Never said Luffy doesn't fight the leader alone. The question is does Akainu fall when Marines fall?
What does Killmonger in Black Panther have to do with anything being discussed?
You said any kind of literature, What If is one:holdthisl:
And Giah wasn't the main character though Fury was:holdthisl:
Never read Batman comics and haven't watch all Batman movies but surely mojority of them Batman never went to beat up the killer of his parents.
In Game of Thrones, Jon Snow never killed Geoffrey, Bolton and Frey.
I didn't know you are limited only to MCU main universe.
Malekith never killed Thor mother, IIRC Rogers never thought Red Skull kill Bucky
And of course I never said there aren't any vengeance story, I say there are stories where MC's don't take vengeance:holdthisl:
Obviously you are cherry picking stories that would support your narrative.
Nah, never said fighting BB is irrelevant. The purpose of the fight gives it relevance. A fight for PK(which is Luffy's one of main goals) vs a fight for vengeance( which is irrelevant to the story)
I'm starting to think your intelligence ain't that well. I gave example of stories where the MC never defeated the killer and all I see are "BUTs". You are pointing out things I never said or argue for. We can do this for years and you won't change my mind. The fight with Akainu is irrelevant.
LOL that is the dumbest analogy I have seen in my life, Sabo can't become the MC while Gohan could have been. And I never that the situation would all be the same, in fact I already said the situation is not the same. LMAO honestly you are making me laugh at your arguement. The dumbest thing ever hahahaha What's next? You will tell me "You think Goku wants to be King of Saiyans because Luffy wants to be PK?"
You think fasting Yamato can take out an army of Sulong Minks? Numbers matter. Jack also brought his army to help him.
What do you mean he didn't wait for fodder to try? LMAO Did Akainu go try to get to Luffy just after they drop from the sky. Even in WB's case, it was Aokiji and Kizaru who went to immediately fight WB, Akainu only fought WB after the stab. Clearly you forgot.
If the Marines would attack them, then why not escape to avoid casualties. It unimportant for them to fight. And SHs attacks marineford, then why? What would be the purpose of the rest of SH + grand fleet to fight the marines. Clearly not just because of grudge match.
You getting stress out. Never said Luffy doesn't fight the leader alone. The question is does Akainu fall when Marines fall?
What does Killmonger in Black Panther have to do with anything being discussed?
You said any kind of literature, What If is one:holdthisl:
And Giah wasn't the main character though Fury was:holdthisl:
Never read Batman comics and haven't watch all Batman movies but surely mojority of them Batman never went to beat up the killer of his parents.
In Game of Thrones, Jon Snow never killed Geoffrey, Bolton and Frey.
I didn't know you are limited only to MCU main universe.
Malekith never killed Thor mother, IIRC Rogers never thought Red Skull kill Bucky
And of course I never said there aren't any vengeance story, I say there are stories where MC's don't take vengeance:holdthisl:
Obviously you are cherry picking stories that would support your narrative.
Nah, never said fighting BB is irrelevant. The purpose of the fight gives it relevance. A fight for PK(which is Luffy's one of main goals) vs a fight for vengeance( which is irrelevant to the story)
I'm starting to think your intelligence ain't that well. I gave example of stories where the MC never defeated the killer and all I see are "BUTs". You are pointing out things I never said or argue for. We can do this for years and you won't change my mind. The fight with Akainu is irrelevant.
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