Rules Kingdom General Discussion

Rumble

Rumble

‎
#2,861
#2,861
Elder Lee Hung said:
1. Ousen’s locus strategy was completely made up. Traditional strategists including Riboku had never even heard of it before. Kyoukai realizing the locus strategy just stressed that she does not know traditional strategy.

The Nanyou moment was the same, not fighting is not really a traditional strategy, just her intuition lol. All of the actual generals in the room including Ten were ready to laugh at her when she even brought it up.

I think you are confusing traditional strategy (the thing Kanki doesn’t know) with unique intuition (the thing Kyoukai has lol).
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You're conflating knowing strategies with being good at strategy. Strategy is not a knowledgebase, it's a discipline. The skill is not in its study but its application.

The difference between formally studying it and applying it like the difference between knowing the law and how to apply it in practice.

Kan Ki's canonical weakness isn't that he posssessed unorthodox strategy and didn't know how to counter orthox strategy - his weakness was that he flat out didn't know strategy. As absurd as that is.

Elder Lee Hung said:
Why would he bother learning traditional strategy when that went against his entire philosophy of “doing things his own way” lol
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My point is that Kan Ki should've have learned it with without making an effort to.
 
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Elder Lee Hung

Elder Lee Hung

Conqueror of the Stars
‎
#2,862
#2,862
Rumble said:
You're conflating knowing strategies with being good at appying strategy. Strategy is not a knowledgebase, it's a discipline. The skill is not in its study but its application.
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Strategy is absolutely a knowledge base. That’s why strategy academies like Shouheikun’s exist. You can’t apply principals you never learned. You can’t apply a discipline when you don’t know the discipline. Shouheikun isn’t teaching his students philosophy lol, he is teaching them military principals and strategic knowledge.

Rumble said:
The difference between formally studying it and applying it like the difference between knowing the law and how to apply it in practice.
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How can you apply the law if you don’t know the law?

Rumble said:
Kan Ki's canonical weakness isn't that he posssessed unorthodox strategy and didn't know how to counter orthox strategy - his weakness that he flat out didn't know strategy. As absurd as that is.
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Kanki doesn’t possess any strategy. He doesn’t possess formal military knowledge or training. Every single “tactic” Kanki employed on the battlefield was based on survival principals he learned when facing other bandit clans. Which has almost nothing to do with how armies battle each other.

Rumble said:
My point is that Kan Ki should've have learned it with without making an effort to.
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His whole character revolved around him not wanting to do that lol. He wanted to win wars his own way because that was how he had found success. That’s the opposite of bad writing lol.
 
Rumble

Rumble

‎
#2,863
#2,863
Elder Lee Hung said:
Strategy is absolutely a knowledge base. That’s why strategy academies like Shouheikun’s exist. You can’t apply principals you never learned. You can’t apply a discipline when you don’t know the discipline. Shouheikun isn’t teaching his students philosophy lol, he is teaching them military principals and strategic knowledge.
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Do you think SHK is good at strategy because he knows a lot or because he knows how to apply them?

Again, going back to the law analogy: a lawyer isn't good because they know the law, they're good because they're good at applying their lawyering skills. Likewise, a strategist isn't good because they know strategies, they're good at applying them.

The most well read strategist isn't likeliest the win. The better strategist is simply better at applying what they know.

By definition, strategy is a discipline. It is a skillset. It is NOT a knowledgebase.

Elder Lee Hung said:
How can you apply the law if you don’t know the law?
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You can know the law and not know how to apply it

You can not know the law and still prevail by successfully arguing your case.

Both are extremely common. You would be absolutely SHOCKED at how little being a good lawyer has to do with cracking a book or citing precedents.

Elder Lee Hung said:
Kanki doesn’t possess any strategy. He doesn’t possess formal military knowledge or training. Every single “tactic” Kanki employed on the battlefield was based on survival principals he learned when facing other bandit clans. Which has almost nothing to do with how armies battle each other.
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Which is an absurdity to me.

Elder Lee Hung said:
His whole character revolved around him not wanting to do that lol. He wanted to win wars his own way because that was how he had found success. That’s the opposite of bad writing lol.
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I should've realised this would be a foreign concept to you: smart people often just absorb knowledge without trying, intending or even wanting to through sheer observation and proximity.

:kailaugh:
 
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Elder Lee Hung

Elder Lee Hung

Conqueror of the Stars
‎
#2,864
#2,864
Rumble said:
Do you think SHK is good at strategy because he knows a lot or because he knows how to apply them?
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It’s both. Strategic generals have different philosophies. Some are offensive strategists like Kyou, some are more defensive and passive like Tou, some are a mix like Ouki. Learning strategy is not learning philosophy or application, learning strategy is learning the principals of army vs army combat.

Rumble said:
You can know the law and not know how to apply it

You can not know the law and still prevail by successfully arguing your case.

Both are extremely common. You would be absolutely SHOCKED at how little being a good lawyer has to do with cracking a book or citing precedents.
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A lawyer who wins a case by not arguing the law did not apply the law. Lol

That’s like calling Moubu a brilliant strategist because he beat Kanmei in a duel lmfao. A lawyer who wins a case by not applying the law by definition did not apply the law.

Rumble said:
I should've realised this would be a foreign concept to you: smart people often just absorb knowledge without trying, intending or even wanting to through sheer observation and proximity.
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This has never once happened in Kingdom. We’ve never seen characters who aren’t specifically trained in strategy magically learn strategy. It didn’t happen with Duke Hyou, it didn’t happen with Gyou’Un, it didn’t happen with any character ever who wasn’t trained in strategy by someone else. So why would it happen for a guy who actively avoided learning strategy because it would cramp his style? Lmfao
 
Daniel

Daniel

‎‎‎‎
#2,871
#2,871
Rumble said:
Alright, take it easy.

I have him as stronger than Sen To'un, but weaker than Man'U.
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I always thought that Ouhon may have outright surpassed him (debatable) in the next arc after the whole Qin vs Wei fiasco, despite what the character statistics might suggest.

As for Man'U, he and Gaimou should be in the same ballpark although Man'U might have a slight edge due to that Moubu fight where he knocked off Moubu off his horse.
 
Daniel

Daniel

‎‎‎‎
#2,874
#2,874
God Buggy said:
Looking forward to seeing other great spearmen. Ouhon will probably face at least a couple more of those.

Somewhere lies a Qin 6 tier spearmen which has reduced everyone he faced into dust lol.
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I pray to Hara that a duel between Ka En (Ka Rin's younger brother) and Ou Hon be made, seeing that both are wielders of the spear and the Chu arc is something that is supposed to happen in the future...
 
Elder Lee Hung

Elder Lee Hung

Conqueror of the Stars
‎
#2,875
#2,875
Daniel said:
I pray to Hara that a duel between Ka En (Ka Rin's younger brother) and Ou Hon be made, seeing that both are wielders of the spear and the Chu arc is something that is supposed to happen in the future...
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Ouhon high diffs currently, it’s arguably a mid diff by the time Ouhon comes face to face with Chu again lol
 
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