Character Discussion Loki’s attacks...

[The DevilMaster]

I gave you three feats, including the two Gear 5 feats that you asked for, and you only commented on one of them. Lol

Quite frankly the Snake Man feat is the only feat that we need. Kaido needed alcohol to buff himself up to Snake Man level, and then failed to defeat Gear 4 which Kizaru dealt with very quickly.

Kaido could not push Luffy into Gear 4 without alcohol, meanwhile Kizaru pushed Luffy into Gear 5 after just one attack. Lol

When you start being dishonest and using panels like these, we know exactly who won the debate, Elder.

You only have one little paper cut to argue with. LOL

Loser. Dishonest as fuck. So you're telling me that when Luffy throws himself in front of attacks that aren't even aimed at him and swallows them like they're Swiss cheese, that somehow counts as a feat for Kizaru? LMAO

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Alright, one attack is the paper cut, and the second one? That second attack where Luffy swallowed Kizaru's laser like it was breakfast eggs doesn't count as an attack. That was literally just a walking meme.

Not to mention that attack wasn't even aimed at Luffy in the first place, so Kizaru didn't actually MANAGE TO HIT LUFFY.

Luffy literally screamed out in pain over a casual finger laser from Kizaru lol. That’s not a meme, that’s what it looks like when Gear 5 actually takes damage (since Kaido fans don’t know what it looks like when Gear 5 takes damage since Luffy was trolling during his bout with Crydo)

 

[Djordje]

Alright, one attack is the paper cut, and the second one? That second attack where Luffy swallowed Kizaru's laser like it was breakfast eggs doesn't count as an attack. That was literally just a walking meme.

Not to mention that attack wasn't even aimed at Luffy in the first place, so Kizaru didn't actually MANAGE TO HIT LUFFY.

Post 2 attacks of Luffy sucesfully hitting / grabbing Kizaru without doing it from behind when Kizaru´s focus was on someone else ???

C´mon loser just 2 attacks.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Post 2 attacks of Luffy sucesfully hitting / grabbing Kizaru without doing it from behind when Kizaru´s focus was on someone else ???

C´mon loser just 2 attacks.

He can’t even post an attack of bloodlusted hybrid Kaido overpowering Gear 2. Lol

 

[The DevilMaster]

Luffy literally screamed out in pain over a casual finger laser from Kizaru lol. That’s not a meme, that’s what it looks like when Gear 5 actually takes damage (since Kaido fans don’t know what it looks like when Gear 5 takes damage since Luffy was trolling during his bout with Crydo)

You lost. If I were you, I'd be embarrassed to defend Kizaru. You and I both know he's the biggest embarrassment among the top tiers.

In a full fight against Luffy in Gear 5, the last damage Kizaru managed to inflict was a paper cut.

He never dominated Luffy even once, never dealt any serious damage to Luffy, never speed-blitzed Luffy even once, and couldn't actually land a hit on Luffy. The one time he did, it was just a glancing hit.

And you want to compare that performance to the man who was folding Gear 5?

Now THIS is a real performance. A beast. A monster.
​

Now, getting turned into a ping-pong ball and being completely unable to dish out the same humiliation back is exactly what Kizaru did throughout their fight.

 

[Djordje]

You lost. If I were you, I'd be embarrassed to defend Kizaru. You and I both know he's the biggest embarrassment among the top tiers.

In a full fight against Luffy in Gear 5, the last damage Kizaru managed to inflict was a paper cut.

He never dominated Luffy even once, never dealt any serious damage to Luffy, never speed-blitzed Luffy even once, and couldn't actually land a hit on Luffy. The one time he did, it was just a glancing hit.

And you want to compare that performance to the man who was folding Gear 5?

Now THIS is a real performance. A beast. A monster.
​

He is spamming acoc named attacks , hitting Luffy directly into head and yet failing miserably to put him down

Crydo is a joke with trash AP.

 

[The DevilMaster]

He can’t even post an attack of bloodlusted hybrid Kaido overpowering Gear 2. Lol

LOL... G2/G3 > GEAR 5?

 

[The DevilMaster]

Luffy literally screamed out in pain over a casual finger laser from Kizaru lol. That’s not a meme, that’s what it looks like when Gear 5 actually takes damage (since Kaido fans don’t know what it looks like when Gear 5 takes damage since Luffy was trolling during his bout with Crydo)

Damn, look at this. He buried Gear 5's face. Gear 5 does all kinds of clown shit to Kaido, and Kaido immediately dishes it back. Gear 5 does literally anything to Kizaru, and Kizaru is completely incapable of retaliating.

Truly, Gear 5's ping-pong ball. @Elder Lee Hung

 

[Tyki_Mikk]

Tired Hybrid Kaido could literally speed-blitz Gear 5. Landing hits on Gear 5 was never a problem for him, and neither was damaging him.

But the same counts for Luffy too, he never had any problem to speedblitz Kaido or hit him.
Luffy barely had two hits on a nerfed Kizaru who supported him without fighting all out.
Meanwhile Luffy hit all out Kaido again and again.

Kaido tagging Luffy was never the problem, the fact his defense was wide open is the problem here, depends on future sight...
Kizaru in otherhand put Snakeman into sleep without getting even hit for once, meanwile Kaido need to go all out...

The problem starts that Kaido fought a Luffy who JUST learned adv CoC, he fought a Luffy who just learned awakening...
Meanwhile Kizaru nerfed/supporting Luffy, faced a Luffy version who was stronger.

Kizaru knew that Luffy defeated Kaido, yet wasn´t even for once scared of him.
Oda way to put Kizaru over Kaido.
He did the same with Loki, making Gaban praising Luffy for beating Kaido yet still doubting him to fight off Loki...

 

[The DevilMaster]

But the same counts for Luffy too, he never had any problem to speedblitz Kaido or hit him.
Luffy barely had two hits on a nerfed Kizaru who supported him without fighting all out.
Meanwhile Luffy hit all out Kaido again and again.

Kaido tagging Luffy was never the problem, the fact his defense was wide open is the problem here, depends on future sight...
Kizaru in otherhand put Snakeman into sleep without getting even hit for once, meanwile Kaido need to go all out...

The problem starts that Kaido fought a Luffy who JUST learned adv CoC, he fought a Luffy who just learned awakening...
Meanwhile Kizaru nerfed/supporting Luffy, faced a Luffy version who was stronger.

Kizaru knew that Luffy defeated Kaido, yet wasn´t even for once scared of him.
Oda way to put Kizaru over Kaido.
He did the same with Loki, making Gaban praising Luffy for beating Kaido yet still doubting him to fight off Loki...

All of that is nice, but it still doesn't answer the question: why couldn't Kizaru do any of that against Luffy in Gear 5?
He couldn't even land a single hit on Gear 5, let alone dominate him.

Look at this. Now THIS is what truly humiliating someone looks like:

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Damn, look at this. He buried Gear 5's face. Gear 5 does all kinds of clown shit to Kaido, and Kaido immediately dishes it back. Gear 5 does literally anything to Kizaru, and Kizaru is completely incapable of retaliating.

Truly, Gear 5's ping-pong ball. @Elder Lee Hung

How many times are you going to dodge the fact that Kaido was buffed against a trolling Gear 5? Lmfao

You keep spamming the same panels of Kaido using a foreign substance to buff his strength against an opponent that was not taking him seriously LMFAO. What exactly does that prove?

Kizaru didn’t want to kill or even hurt Goofy

Meanwhile bloodlusted Kaido is acknowledging Gear 2/3 Luffy as his equal:

No matter how many energy steroids Kaido takes, his maximum is Gear 2/3 Luffy level, no further. Posting panels of Kaido on energy steroids landing cheap shots on troll mode Goofy doesn’t change anything lol. Meanwhile Gear 5 is Kizaru’s floor. Lol

 

[The DevilMaster]

How many times are you going to dodge the fact that Kaido was buffed against a trolling Gear 5? Lmfao

You keep spamming the same panels of Kaido using a foreign substance to buff his strength against an opponent that was not taking him seriously LMFAO. What exactly does that prove?

Kizaru didn’t want to kill or even hurt Goofy

Meanwhile bloodlusted Kaido is acknowledging Gear 2/3 Luffy as his equal:

No matter how many energy steroids Kaido takes, his maximum is Gear 2/3 Luffy level, no further. Posting panels of Kaido on energy steroids landing cheap shots on troll mode Goofy doesn’t change anything lol. Meanwhile Gear 5 is Kizaru’s floor. Lol

Lmao. You're out of arguments. There is no answer.

Tired Kaido, literally on his knees from exhaustion, still went there and beat the shit out of Gear 5, humiliated him, slammed his face into the ground just to show who was really in control, damaged him, and wiped the floor with Gear 5.

Kizaru, on the other hand, went there and did absolutely NOTHING to Gear 5. He didn't wipe the floor with him, didn't land nearly as many hits as Kaido, and didn't cause any damage to him.

 

[The DevilMaster]

How many times are you going to dodge the fact that Kaido was buffed against a trolling Gear 5? Lmfao

You keep spamming the same panels of Kaido using a foreign substance to buff his strength against an opponent that was not taking him seriously LMFAO. What exactly does that prove?

Kizaru didn’t want to kill or even hurt Goofy

Meanwhile bloodlusted Kaido is acknowledging Gear 2/3 Luffy as his equal:

No matter how many energy steroids Kaido takes, his maximum is Gear 2/3 Luffy level, no further. Posting panels of Kaido on energy steroids landing cheap shots on troll mode Goofy doesn’t change anything lol. Meanwhile Gear 5 is Kizaru’s floor. Lol

Look at what the guy who's supposedly equal to Base Luffy in G2/G3 did to Gear 5's face. LOL

 

[Tyki_Mikk]

All of that is nice, but it still doesn't answer the question: why couldn't Kizaru do any of that against Luffy in Gear 5?

Simple:
He didn´t want it.
Deep in heart he supported Luffy, he didn´t want to fight him, a reason why he feeded him rather to kill Luffy there.

Kizaru never gone all out, Saturn even pointed that out.
Kizaru didn´t used awakening and still could keep up with G5...

Kaido without drunken mode would get clapped by G5 as example, that is how nerfed Kizaru was.

 

[The DevilMaster]

Simple:
He didn´t want it.
Deep in heart he supported Luffy, he didn´t want to fight him, a reason why he feeded him rather to kill Luffy there.

Kizaru never gone all out, Saturn even pointed that out.
Kizaru didn´t used awakening and still could keep up with G5...

Kaido without drunken mode would get clapped by G5 as example, that is how nerfed Kizaru was.

KAIDO WITHOUT DRUNKEN MODE

“But but but Kizaru didn't want to do that, but but but Kizaru has an awakening, bro.”
“But but but Kizaru has this, but Kizaru has that.”

You fucking loser. Speculation is all you have. You can't answer the simple question of why Kaido was able to humiliate Gear 5 while Kizaru couldn't. In fact, Kizaru was the one getting humiliated.

I post panels of a tired and exhausted Kaido, still in Hybrid form, beating the shit out of Luffy, and you just close your eyes to it,
“Kizaru was nerfed.” Yeah, and was Kaido fresh? You fucking animal. The guy was literally dropping to his knees from exhaustion, and even while on his knees, he was STILL better than PIZZARU.



Kaido was carrying an entire island and was literally dropping to his knees from exhaustion, yet he still went ahead and completely destroyed Gear 5, something Kizaru was incapable of doing.

 

[Garps tekkai]

The fact Kizaru left the island without any big injurie/scratch after facing G4 + G5(twice) is insane, given he even feed Luffy and was nerfed, didn´t used awakening aswell.

Let be honest, all out Kizaru would defeat Luffy there..
Nerfed Kizaru had better performance against G5 then Kaido had vs G5.

Have in mind Egghead Luffy>Wano Luffy....
Strawhats growing very fast in power...

People will understand that, when the admirals finally get their CoC revealed.

Then you can add aCoC to both parties retrospectively and the non believers will notice, that fuck Kizaru really could have also handled Snakeman and G5 using aCoC, as in all out.

Add in a a handful of Pika no mi awakening moves and suddenly post Kaido-Luffy sweating bullets sensing Kizaru and the "I see you are really the man who defeated Kaido" line will all make a lot of sense.

Thing is, if someone really refuses to even imagine them having CoC or more than their canon 3 named moves, you cannot really change their minds.

But when Kizaru starts to go lightspeed with a CoC infused lightsaber in his hand or starts to throw a light version of Nemesis around, everyone will suddenly claim to be a fan since day 1.

 

[Tyki_Mikk]

KAIDO WITHOUT DRUNKEN MODE

He was, after he drunk, he was permanent in drunken modus.
It never changed.

Even his form was different to his normal hybrid form.
There is no proof that he changed back and was without his drunken modus.

Speculation is all you have.

it is not a speculation, it is a fact and only people like you ignore that fact.
But Saturn and Oda himself made it pretty clear, he was nerfed, feed up his enemy.

He never planed to defeat Luffy or have a serious fight with him.

 

[Zoinks52]

Black lightning and its consequences have been a disaster for this manga ngl.

 

[The DevilMaster]

He was, after he drunk, he was permanent in drunken modus.
It never changed.

Even his form was different to his normal hybrid form.
There is no proof that he changed back and was without his drunken modus.



it is not a speculation, it is a fact and only people like you ignore that fact.
But Saturn and Oda himself made it pretty clear, he was nerfed, feed up his enemy.

He never planed to defeat Luffy or have a serious fight with him.

This is how Pizzaru ended up: even with help from a Gorosei, he got destroyed.
Kaido destroyed the same guy who took down Kizaru + a Gorosei, all by himself.

Look, this is Pizzaru even with help, getting treated like this:

And this is Luffy vs. Kaido:

Do you realize that even with a Gorosei helping Kizaru, he still couldn't dominate Gear 5 the way Kaido did?

Not to mention that Kizaru went down to an extremely weak attack, while Luffy had to use the strongest attack in the series to finish off an already exhausted Kaido.

 

[Shimotsuki Fenaker]

I do agree, Old Rayleigh ~ 1 light clone >> Yawnco Luffy > Kaido

Old Rayleigh > Kizaru since he hurt the real one easily