Character Discussion Name one stat where Kaidou is average, because as far as I know, he's 100% in EVERYTHING.

[MonsterKaido]

Except for his TB, his attack most of time got portrayed as not that swift.

Even TB meant for luffy was blocked by rooftop Zoro.

So, you agree that his speed is average?

Panel of zoro blocking Kaido's TB? Kaido never used TB on zoro.

Also these below are not TB's --

 

[Reborn]

Panel of zoro blocking Kaido's TB? Kaido never used TB on zoro.

Also these below are not TB's --

He used it on Luffy and zoro blocked it


As I said, short burst yes but not in totality. His attacks are not wired for speed. He swings. His big size doesn't help either.

He has other stats which make up for this but there is no denying that his speed is average in comparison to his other stats and like those of kiz.

 

[MonsterKaido]

He used it on Luffy and zoro blocked it


As I said, short burst yes but not in totality. His attacks are not wired for attacks. His big size doesn't help either.

He has other stats which make up for this but there is no denying that his speed is average in comparison to his other stats and like those of kiz.

Show me the panel of zoro blocking TB. It never happened. Kaido uses no named attack against asura bro.

I most fighters not speed based like that. Current sanji , Marco , Kizaru are exceptions in that regard.

 

[Reborn]

Show me the panel of zoro blocking TB. It never happened. Kaido uses no named attack against asura bro.

I most fighters not speed based like that. Current sanji , Marco , Kizaru are exceptions in that regard.

It was Hakai - not TB. My bad

So, you know he's not speed based which means you agree that his speed is an average stat - my point exactly

 

[Kurozumi Wiwi]

Kaido is like Zoro where they can show great speed for a specific move/short burst but their overall speed is average for their tier. We don't scale Zoro's general speed in combat to his Ashura that blitzed Kaido

 

[GalaxyLevelShanks]

Has better gravity feats as Fuji
Has better heat feats as Akainu

I agree with Kaido being physically stronger than Kuzan. I disagree but can definitely see why people would think Kaido is faster than Kizaru.

How do you even come to this conclusion for this two though? lol

 

[Killerj]

Speed and mentality are his bad stats
Blud was frozen when he saw oden and was blitzed cuz that
His df is not that competitive in the endgame meta either

 

[GalaxyLevelShanks]

Kaido is like Zoro where they can show great speed for a specific move/short burst but their overall speed is average for their tier. We don't scale Zoro's general speed in combat to his Ashura that blitzed Kaido

This is the main reason why I think Kiz is faster than Kaido since he can maintain his combat speed for far longer, you can make a good argument based off feats for Kaido having greater attack speed but we know Kiz hasn’t gone all out yet.

 

[MonsterKaido]

It was Hakai - not TB. My bad

So, you know he's not speed based which means you agree that his speed is an average stat - my point exactly

We judge a character by their best feats always. Kizaru does not spam accelerated speed which he used against snakeman for example.

 

[L57]

Except for his TB, his attack most of time got portrayed as not that swift.

Even TB meant for luffy was blocked by rooftop Zoro.

So, you agree that his speed is average?

When did zoro blocked tb

 

[Reborn]

We judge a character by their best feats always. Kizaru does not spam accelerated speed which he used against snakeman for example.

And, I prefer to write based on the question raised in the title and op of a thread. See it yourself

When did zoro blocked tb

I corrected myself

 

[MonsterKaido]

And, I prefer to write based on the question raised in the title and op of a thread. See it yourself

His attack speed is good. I think you are confusing reaction and movement speed with attack speed.

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Kaido is like Zoro where they can show great speed for a specific move/short burst but their overall speed is average for their tier. We don't scale Zoro's general speed in combat to his Ashura that blitzed Kaido

Kaido’s speed is equivalent to his rival, exhausted and wounded base Luffy

 

[Reborn]

His attack speed is good. I think you are confusing reaction and movement speed with attack speed.

Nope

His attack speed is short burst, not precise and not swift. He mainly swings hard mixed with rapid but short movement speed

 

[Kurozumi Wiwi]

This is the main reason why I think Kiz is faster than Kaido since he can maintain his combat speed for far longer, you can make a good argument based off feats for Kaido having greater attack speed but we know Kiz hasn’t gone all out yet.

Kaido had the longest fight in the series of course he'd manage to land hit (and thus get speed feats) against Luffy as a good fight is a back and forth but he got tagged too and and looked clueless too many times for me to believe Oda sees him as particularly fast character.
Kaido wasn't taking hits on purpose all the time either (as I saw this argument used) before. He was already trying to dodge hits by the time Luffy used Red Hawk.

Losing a clash and getting blitzed by Rooftop Zoro (sfx are that of weapons colliding)

Blitzed by base Luffy

Him and Yamato were portrayed to have the same attack speed

His powered up drunk self got shit on by G2 Luffy

Couldn't handle Snakeman punches at all prior to FS and shapeshifting to dragon form, suggesting his hybrid form is not nimble enough to get around it


Blitzed by a much slower looking G5 attack than WSG despite putting a guard

Now he does have great speed feats against Luffy strongest forms too , but overall I think he's supposed to have the speed needed of a high top tier and nothing more, aka he's capable of quick bursts making him able to tag anybody but speed is not supposed to be a shining stat, he has too many mediocre showings in that area from stuff much slower WSG for it to all be outliers. I picked a few examples where Kaido was in combat mode, and none of them are cheapshots or Kaido taking the hits on purpose outside of headcanons. I'm being extremely fair considering people pick moments like Sentoumaru tagging Kizaru where he was obviously being reminiscent of the past and showing off his defense or him trying to ignore Rayleigh that was next him to downplay his speed. If I wanted to argue in bad faith for agenda sake I could show examples of Kaido getting tagged and ragdolled by scabbards but I won't because I'm aware Oden PTSDs were kicking in.

 

[ZenZu]

Kaido had the longest fight in the series of course he'd manage to land hit against Luffy as a good fight is a back and forth but he got tagged too and and looked clueless too many times for me to believe Oda sees him as particularly fast character.
Kaido wasn't taking hits on purpose all the time either (as I saw this argument used) before. He was already trying to dodge hits by the time Luffy used Red Hawk.

Losing a clash and getting blitzed by Rooftop Zoro (sfx are that of weapons colliding)

Blitzed by base Luffy

Him and Yamato were portrayed to have the same attack speed

His powered up drunk self got shit on by G2 Luffy

Couldn't handle Snakeman punches at all prior to FS and shapeshifting to dragon form, suggesting his hybrid form is not nimble enough to get around it


Blitzed by a much slower looking G5 attack than WSG despite putting a guard

Now he does have great speed feats against Luffy strongest forms too , but overall I think he's supposed to have the speed needed of a high top tier and nothing more, aka he's capable of quick bursts making him able to tag anybody but speed is not supposed to be a shining stat, he has too many mediocre showings in that area from stuff much slower WSG for it to all be outliers. I picked a few examples where Kaido was in combat mode, and none of them are cheapshots or Kaido taking the hits on purpose outside of headcanons. I'm being extremely fair considering people pick moments like Sentoumaru tagging Kizaru where he was obviously being reminiscent of the past and showing off his defense or him trying to ignore Rayleigh that was next him to downplay his speed. If I wanted to argue in bad faith for agenda sake I could show examples of Kaido being tagged and ragdolled by scabbards but I won't because I'm aware Oden PTSDs were kicking in.

This all goes back to my post in the thread, his reactions are below average. He couldn't even perceive snake man punches at all, forget even reacting to them.

I wouldn't call his attack speed slow though. He can be incredibly fast. He just has pretty piss poor reaction speed.

 

[Alarica]

COC?

 

[MonsterKaido]

Nope

His attack speed is short burst, not precise and not swift. He mainly swings hard mixed with rapid but short movement speed

Bruh if they are not precise and swift , how is he blitzing G4 and G5 luffy?

Kaido showed if he wants he can out sped G5 luffy at the end.

Sanji does not uses high invisible speed throughout ; marco could easily react and intercept Kizaru but got caught by BM etc

Characters are not always using their max speed.

 

[Bad English]

Based on? Garp doesn't need paw fruit to move fast. His combat speed is high enough to speed blitz Kuzan.

Garps gets dura , endurance , stats boosts and island level fire mode

So Garp basically gets nothing from Dragon's fruit? he already have all of that dura, speed, island lvl AP etc.

Garp with PawPaw fruit gets heal, durability negation and ability to repel caused damage, pain and almost any attack. The point is that abilities are unique and not something you can get just through hard training, haki.

PawPaw Garp winner for me, sorry Monster Kaido

 

[MonsterKaido]

So Garp basically gets nothing from Dragon's fruit? he already have all of that dura, speed, island lvl AP etc.

Garp with PawPaw fruit gets heal, durability negation and ability to repel caused damage, pain and almost any attack. The point is that abilities are unique and not something you can get just through hard training, haki.

PawPaw Garp winner for me, sorry Monster Kaido

He can stack his raw stats with dragon DF stats.

Paw fruit does not have healing. The pain will get absorbed eventually to garp. You repeated yourself with heal/repel caused damage, pain thing but no when a user removes it , it can not stay out of user's body for long. It comes back.

In utility but not in power

Lets agree to diasgree if you think otherwise