General & Others Next Straw Hat Crew Members and the Grand Fleet

[Sir Yasheen]

And, not everything has to be taken at a face value... right? Context matters.

"What we consume, Shapes us"


His past reflects how badly he was mistreated - shame of elbaph, curse and perhaps WG is behind the king's death but Loki took the blame.

That's what shaped him.

Once he will get redeemed, I am confident we will see somewhat different Loki.

And, nika has accute observation of feelings....

Robin's case is classic example.

I don’t think Loki needs redemption. He’s not a bad guy, but he just doesn’t share the same views and ideals as those who make up the straw hats.

Just like with Yamato I don’t expect oda to suddenly Change them just to make them fight alongside the straw hats. Just think how many times Yamato fans tried to push that Yamato would abandon her oden schtick cause of Luffy.

Loki wants to destroy the world. He hates how Elbaf has become and has shown he’s willing to destroy it for the sake of that desire. It’s not a straw hat type dream.

 

[Naomi]

That's just your bias talking lol

i can find you moments where goofy acted that exact same way with vivi yamatoe etc

Goofy will release loki. But it will be because he's needed to beat imu and co here. Just like yamatoe was needed to stall kaido in wano.

There's more narrative hints about loki and hajrudin reconciling and becoming the co leaders of elbaf than there is for loki nakama.

It's not bias. lol

That is basically what oda has layed out for anyone to read.

Also imu want loki dead if he does not join the holy knights. Loki wont stay in elbaf, and he still has a score to settle with shamrock.

joining luffy is the outcome oda is showing.

 

[Etzel Andergast]

We are against the wings existence

 

[Mr. Reloaded]

We are against the wings existence

Stussy is dead. The wings are eternal

 

[Uncle Van]

Is that even English you're replying to?

 

[Mr. Reloaded]

Is that even English you're replying to?

I've read significantly worse

 

[Reborn]

I don’t think Loki needs redemption. He’s not a bad guy, but he just doesn’t share the same views and ideals as those who make up the straw hats.

Just like with Yamato I don’t expect oda to suddenly Change them just to make them fight alongside the straw hats. Just think how many times Yamato fans tried to push that Yamato would abandon her oden schtick cause of Luffy.

Loki wants to destroy the world. He hates how Elbaf has become and has shown he’s willing to destroy it for the sake of that desire. It’s not a straw hat type dream.

I think Loki's character is quite misunderstood

From the day he was born

He was called a curse/shame of Elbaf by his own people -----> Blamed for dishonor (Lola incident) -----> blamed for miseries on Elbaph -----> Mistreated and isolated by his own people ------> perhaps lost even those few people who liked him -----> Internalized guilt, confusion, and rage in loneliness and no freedom ------> World Government kills the king ------> Feels betrayed by both his people and the world ---------> Falls into despair.

Then, he learns about Nika of Past - The Sun God who frees the oppressed ....The liberator

Twists Nika’s story in his mind as a symbol of rebellion and developed God's complex

Sees himself as the next Nika meant to bring freedom by fire


Vows to destroy the world that cursed him



Until this happened....

Finally someone saw good in him. Someone was there to give him freedom and protect him.

This simple sentence which you people are taking as "meh it means nothing" means a lot for someone like Loki.

You people need to come out of M3 dynamic and see what narrative context is unfolding

Luffy has sharp sense or instincts when it comes to such matters.

Loki will get respect from Elbaph. Loki will realize it's Luffy who is next Nika and will follow him because Luffy is the only one who willingly wants to give freedom to Loki even when Loki didn't ask and saw good in him when whole world wants to banish him.

 

[Uncle Van]

I've read significantly worse

I need to work on my autocorrect

 

[Reborn]

I am interested in having a bet

 

[Uncle Van]

I think Loki's character is quite misunderstood

From the day he was born

He was called a curse/shame of Elbaf by his own people -----> Blamed for dishonor (Lola incident) -----> blamed for miseries on Elbaph -----> Mistreated and isolated by his own people ------> perhaps lost even those few people who liked him -----> Internalized guilt, confusion, and rage in loneliness and no freedom ------> World Government kills the king ------> Feels betrayed by both his people and the world ---------> Falls into despair.

Then, he learns about Nika of Past - The Sun God who frees the oppressed ....The liberator

Twists Nika’s story in his mind as a symbol of rebellion and developed God's complex

Sees himself as the next Nika meant to bring freedom by fire


Vows to destroy the world that cursed him



Until this happened....

Finally someone saw good in him. Someone was there to give him freedom and protect him.

This simple sentence which you people are taking as "meh it means nothing" means a lot for someone like Loki.

You people need to come out of M3 dynamic and see what narrative context is unfolding

Luffy has sharp sense or instincts when it comes to such matters.

Loki will get respect from Elbaph. Loki will realize it's Luffy who is next Nika and will follow him because Luffy is the only one who willingly wants to give freedom to Loki even when Loki didn't ask and saw good in him when whole world wants to banish him.

You say people need to "see what narrative context is unfolding", but demand people to overlook one of the most important narrative dynamics of the entire series, which is Luffy, Zoro, Sanji always being the top 3 and monster trio. They are Luffy's wings, and we've gotten a direct comparison to Ray and Gaban who were called Roger's wings, making them to top 3 of the crew.

It's always Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji together, handling the strong enemies and defending the crew. There is a reason this dynamic has been shown and emphasized since Arlong Park. There is a reason that at least one of them is often around to defend the rest.

The very fact that Loki is so strong and breaks that dynamic is an extreme negative against him. There's also the fact that we've seen people even with great narrative importance get invites, ask for invites, and have Luffy turn their lives around, yet stay where they are.

This makes all of the pro-Loki arguments come off as forced, especially considering it relies on one of the most significant dynamics and narrative points in this series becoming worthless outta nowhere.

 

[Reborn]

You say people need to "see what narrative context is unfolding", but demand people to overlook one of the most important narrative dynamics of the entire series, which is Luffy, Zoro, Sanji always being the top 3 and monster trio. They are Luffy's wings, and we've gotten a direct comparison to Ray and Gaban who were called Roger's wings, making them to top 3 of the crew.

It's always Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji together, handling the strong enemies and defending the crew. There is a reason this dynamic has been shown and emphasized since Arlong Park. There is a reason that at least one of them is often around to defend the rest.

The very fact that Loki is so strong and breaks that dynamic is an extreme negative against him. There's also the fact that we've seen people even with great narrative importance get invites, ask for invites, and have Luffy turn their lives around, yet stay where they are.

This makes all of the pro-Loki arguments come off as forced, especially considering it relies on one of the most significant dynamics and narrative points in this series becoming worthless outta nowhere.

I already said I understand M3 dynamics issue in my previous posts here.

And, no other people enjoyed the portrayal Loki has. You are comparing apples and oranges.


Anyway, why don't we settle this with bet between us.


Let's up the stakes - one week of ban for me vs one week of modship for me

What say Mr. Van?

 

[Etzel Andergast]

Stussy is dead. The wings are eternal

https://x.com/GenG/status/1944258904474759233?t=1p4tec8lsIvtgqOnxjFl7Q&s=19

 

[soupongo]

You say people need to "see what narrative context is unfolding", but demand people to overlook one of the most important narrative dynamics of the entire series, which is Luffy, Zoro, Sanji always being the top 3 and monster trio. They are Luffy's wings, and we've gotten a direct comparison to Ray and Gaban who were called Roger's wings, making them to top 3 of the crew.

It's always Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji together, handling the strong enemies and defending the crew. There is a reason this dynamic has been shown and emphasized since Arlong Park. There is a reason that at least one of them is often around to defend the rest.

The very fact that Loki is so strong and breaks that dynamic is an extreme negative against him. There's also the fact that we've seen people even with great narrative importance get invites, ask for invites, and have Luffy turn their lives around, yet stay where they are.

This makes all of the pro-Loki arguments come off as forced, especially considering it relies on one of the most significant dynamics and narrative points in this series becoming worthless outta nowhere.

We are in the *final saga*. On what basis is the M3 required by some law to exist forever? Has Oda even said anything like that? What matters is that Luffy has to become the PK and beat the WG, and a character like Loki can obviously be useful for him to pursue that. If you want parallels, we know that the Roger pirates recruited a prince on their last voyage who had kings Haki, just like Loki.

 

[Mr. Reloaded]

 

[Monet]

Lol I remember the days 🤣 of theories about monet Rebecca , Cavendish and barto
And many others before and after.
At the end no one joined after jinbe
Not even Larrot the shit rabbit or delusional Oni
.
Just give up
Loki is even more wired choice than those before him and you want him join
....
Loki is suited to rule elbaf cuz there's no ruler there for Along time. He is not joining he is similar to vivi and momo.
Hajurden more fitted as characters as king but he is weak as fuck, a revolt by elbaf citizens will kill him .
...


But there could be one joining for short trip like momo and vivi and carrot but those usually before we reach their home town.
....

I think Loki's character is quite misunderstood

From the day he was born

He was called a curse/shame of Elbaf by his own people -----> Blamed for dishonor (Lola incident) -----> blamed for miseries on Elbaph -----> Mistreated and isolated by his own people ------> perhaps lost even those few people who liked him -----> Internalized guilt, confusion, and rage in loneliness and no freedom ------> World Government kills the king ------> Feels betrayed by both his people and the world ---------> Falls into despair.

Then, he learns about Nika of Past - The Sun God who frees the oppressed ....The liberator

Twists Nika’s story in his mind as a symbol of rebellion and developed God's complex

Sees himself as the next Nika meant to bring freedom by fire


Vows to destroy the world that cursed him



Until this happened....

Finally someone saw good in him. Someone was there to give him freedom and protect him.

This simple sentence which you people are taking as "meh it means nothing" means a lot for someone like Loki.

You people need to come out of M3 dynamic and see what narrative context is unfolding

Luffy has sharp sense or instincts when it comes to such matters.

Loki will get respect from Elbaph. Loki will realize it's Luffy who is next Nika and will follow him because Luffy is the only one who willingly wants to give freedom to Loki even when Loki didn't ask and saw good in him when whole world wants to banish him.

Your reasons are good 👍 😌
But it's the same for old candidates

There's always good reason that it make sense ,but everytime oda answer is
Since dressrorsa and thought decade this is always oda reply

.......

Those good old days
I only joined orojacson for theories section

 

[Uncle Van]

We are in the *final saga*. On what basis is the M3 required by some law to exist forever? Has Oda even said anything like that? What matters is that Luffy has to become the PK and beat the WG, and a character like Loki can obviously be useful for him to pursue that. If you want parallels, we know that the Roger pirates recruited a prince on their last voyage who had kings Haki, just like Loki.

Do you have evidence that Loki is so special that Oda will break it now?

 

[Reborn]

Lol I remember the days 🤣 of theories about monet Rebecca , Cavendish and barto
And many others before and after.
At the end no one joined after jinbe
Not even Larrot the shit rabbit or delusional Oni
.
Just give up
Loki is even more wired choice than those before him and you want him join
....
Loki is suited to rule elbaf cuz there's no ruler there for Along time. He is not joining he is similar to vivi and momo.
Hajurden more fitted as characters as king but he is weak as fuck, a revolt by elbaf citizens will kill him .
...


But there could be one joining for short trip like momo and vivi and carrot but those usually before we reach their home town.
....


Your reasons are good 👍 😌
But it's the same for old candidates

There's always good reason that it make sense ,but everytime oda answer is
Since dressrorsa and thought decade this is always oda reply

.......

Those good old days
I only joined orojacson for theories section

I am aware of past precedents and especially the case of wano.

Tbh, call me naive but I don't see oda repeating the wano thing again....it created a bit of fuss online and I feel if oda still goes forward with something similar but even on bigger scale due to Loki's portrayal then we will see it happen this time.

 

[soupongo]

Do you have evidence that Loki is so special that Oda will break it now?

Since the SHP first started exploring Elbaf, we see Luffy having an interest in Loki

then after 20 chapters of talking to him, talking to other people about Loki until he was asked to join

He has parallels with Zoro in his introduction arc

has Parallels with Luffy's relationship with Shanks, with Rocks.

typical SHP sob story


Talking about Loki being special is almost not even worth it. Big Mom, the WG and Elbaf all think this is one of the most important guys around. He isn't in competition with Carrot, who got way less focus in Zou then Loki has in Elbaf.

 

[Uncle Van]

Since the SHP first started exploring Elbaf, we see Luffy having an interest in Loki

then after 20 chapters of talking to him, talking to other people about Loki until he was asked to join

He has parallels with Zoro in his introduction arc

has Parallels with Luffy's relationship with Shanks, with Rocks.

typical SHP sob story


Talking about Loki being special is almost not even worth it. Big Mom, the WG and Elbaf all think this is one of the most important guys around. He isn't in competition with Carrot, who got way less focus in Zou then Loki has in Elbaf.

I asked for evidence that Oda will randomly break one of the most significant dynamics in the series because Loki is special enough to warrant such a thing......

This is all just useless subjective fluff.....why would Oda suddenly stop making Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji the top 3? Especially after he further emphasized that dynamic a few chapters ago infront of Loki?

 

[Reborn]

Since the SHP first started exploring Elbaf, we see Luffy having an interest in Loki

then after 20 chapters of talking to him, talking to other people about Loki until he was asked to join

He has parallels with Zoro in his introduction arc

has Parallels with Luffy's relationship with Shanks, with Rocks.

typical SHP sob story


Talking about Loki being special is almost not even worth it. Big Mom, the WG and Elbaf all think this is one of the most important guys around. He isn't in competition with Carrot, who got way less focus in Zou then Loki has in Elbaf.

Loki's significance and him being different or special can also be gauged by the fact that we heard first about him around chapter 860. That's almost 7-8 years before we get to his arc - an arc which is tied to one of the SHs dream - Usopp and with Nika as well.

This isn't the case with any of the past SHs candidates - Yamao, Carrot, Rebecca, Barto or anyone else.