General & Others Next Strawhat Crew Members and the Grand Fleet

[Kurodiamondo]

That build up could be resolved with minks and samurai showing up in the end with the rest of the fleet rather than with joining the crew, if it was for nakama reasons then Momonosuke or Hiyori would also join with Carrot since that build up is tied to the relationship with minks and the Kozuki clan

Oh I wish it could be that easy. But I dont think so. Plus it's not like minks will live on zunisha for another century

I do think a kozuki and a minks joining the crew

 

[MonsterKaido]

Oda -- You like sulong? I will give you something better -- Yamato's devil fruit

 

[thedarkdragon11]

I think for this part Oda gave Franky’s role to Jinbe to avoid the obvious clue that Yamato is joining. When Yamato joins, Jinbe could be the uncle of the family, Yamato can be the aunt of the family, and Franky will be back to his status as father of the family.

I think she'll be the eldest daughter...

If Yamato powers happen to be like a better version of Carrot Sulong, there's no hope for the Mink.



In the reality i think Carrot is a paralel to Inu and Neko when they joined the Roger Pirates. They hide to enter the ship, spend a time with the crew, but weren't really full members and didnt go to Laftel with the crew. Think with Carrot is the same, she hide to enter the ship, get in a adventure with the crew in WCI, and Wano to a extent, but will be just that. After Wano, if Inu dies, she will go back to Zou with Neko, Wanda and the other minks and we are going to see her again when Zunesha role came into play in the Final War.

For a random mink to have travled once with the Pirate King crew will be a great adventure, and probably she will be the future ruler of the Minks.

I can see the grass eater potentially becoming Pedro's replacement in the unified Mink army, as the d'Artagnan with the Musketeers... That's the best logical path for her...

The Peros skirmish is no different from Law vs. Vergo, Kyros vs. Diamante and Pedro vs. Tamago...

 

[Date]

No hope for minks?


I think it's the opposite. Minks has some build up for final plot like the memories of sulong and why they separate themselves so much, just like fishman and wano

We are in the chapter where the main villain is kaido. Obviously that yamato got a lot of focus. But kaido is not the main reason why mokomo dukedom and wano was isolated. The reveal will certainly happen but much later. You can expect their relevance later

Im almost certain that there should be one mink on the crew. But if yamato and minks negating each other, then imo minks win

Reread what u quoted, pehaps u will understand this time

 

[Kurodiamondo]

Reread what u quoted, pehaps u will understand this time

I dont. Tell me

Nvm i get it. You only talking about "the mink". But my point still stand. Yamato df form vs sulong form in general. Im not even defending carrot

 

[vikas]

A closer look at why Yamao's big anticipated df reveal was so underwhelming and doesn't compare to actual straw hats.

Your whole point is depended on this subjective assumption.

 

[Cozy Sofa]

Luffys grand fleet consists of

Super rookies (Cavendish, Bartolomeo)
Fleet admirals (Sai, Orlumbus)
Special races (Hajrudin, Leo)
Bounty Hunter/Special Lone wolfs (Ideo)

My guess is he'll keep adding members/fleets of that kind. I think we'll see sake being shared att the end of this arc and some will join later on

Super rookies (Caribou, *spy* Marines Drake)
Fleet admirals (Kinemon, Mr 2)
Special races (Inu/Neko, Alladine)
Bounty Hunter/Special Lone wolfs (Bellamy, *spy* CP0)

15 fleets

 

[vikas]

Bounty Hunter/Special Lone wolfs (Bellamy, *spy* CP0)

Didn't Bellamy join someone? Spy in WG is interesting.... though its just a pipe dream. Even if someone will be added, it will just be used as some sort of plot convinience.

 

[Cozy Sofa]

Bellamy quit pirating and began making flags. But he kept Luffys Vivre Card.

Kuma - RA spy in WG
Stussy - WG spy in BM
Drake - Marines spy in BP
Vergo - Doflamingos spy in Marines
X - ... spy in SHP
Y - ... spy in RHP
Z - ... spy in BBP

 

[Roo]

So one argument for Carrot is that the Straw Hats need a token mink?

kinda racist

 

[Garp the Fist]

Then why even set up the first interaction to begin with if it couldn't be seen through until later on?

-he had set up Marco vs Big Mom and Perospero already and needed something to stop that
-he wanted to show Carrot’s Su Long again, and Wanda’s for the first time, and since it seems Su Long will play no other part in Wano, it had to happen then
-he was putting all the other Minks on the roof so he needed to show why Carrot and Wanda weren’t with them

This also disregards the words said to Carrot. Perospero told Carrot that she's not fit to deal with pirates and essentially that she should've just stayed on Zou. As enjoyable as he is, he's still the "baddie" and Carrot is the "goodie". His statement is just begging to be subverted at some point. In other words, Carrot will make it very clear that although she did totally underestimate what she was in for, she is still fit to keep moving forward like Pedro told her and face pirates out on the seas.

No, disregarding it would be if it ended there, Carrot stayed on the ground, nothing else happened. There will be a conclusion to Carrot vs Perospero where Perospero gets whats coming to him.

But since Oda has spent a grand total of five pages (and a solitary panel) on Carrot in the 28 chapters since she went after Perospero, with huge chunks of time where he didn’t bother even cutting to it to get a catchup of how Carrot is doing, I don’t expect it to get the focus that Carrot going SunLong the first time did got.

How does that work for the climax of her arc? How does the biggest and most significant moment happen in the middle? How is the climatic resolution inferior to the build up?

Can you name another instance in the story like this. Where the resolution of a character's arc was not the most impactful, significant moment for them?

Resolution and climax are not the same thing. A climax is the highest point of drama, regardless of when it falls. A resolution is the end.

Robin’s I want to live was far more memorable and impactful than her actually beating Spandam at the end of the arc, or thanking the crew for rescuing her.

Wyper killing Enel was his standout moment, more than knocking down the Giant Jack or seeing the party of both Skypiean and Shandoran.

The resolution of Kyros and Rebecca’s story wasn’t them beating Diamente, it was them deciding to live together in peace.

The biggest example in fiction I can think if is the resolution of Frodo’s story being to leave the Shire, but the climax being his decision to keep the Ring and him and Gollum struggling in Mount Doom.

With the way Carrot’s story has went since, I very much doubt beating Perospero will match the impact that her first Su Long transformation had. Carrot’s Su Long was the first time we’d seen it from any Mink, the sacrifice of Pedro was fresh in the memory, it was only five people against an entire fleet, there was only three plotlines of note to be focused on (Sunny escapes, Luffy vs Katakuri, Sanji and the cake).

Here
-Pedro died ages ago and it’s not especially relevant to the arc as a whole, which is all about avenging Oden and freeing Wano. Carrot and Perospero (and Big Mom) very much feel like interlopers who are only here to get the plotline solved quickly
-it’s not especially high stakes. On WCI it was the Strawhats surronded, if Carrot hadn’t turned Su Long they might not have escaped. Here, if Carrot doesn’t beat Perospero, it’s no biggie, there’s tonnes of other powerful fighters that can do it
-rather than the three broad plotlines of the escape of WCI, here Carrot vs Perospero is only one plotline- with barely any focus and the least to do with the purpose of the arc- competing with two fights with a Yonko, three fights with a Calamity, two fights between the Worst Gen, five fights against the Flying Six, the fights against the Kurozumi clan. And that’s just taking a broad outline of the plots, it can be zoomed further in (what will each Scabbard do, what will Momo do, what is Hiyori up to, what will Marco do, what about Yamato, CP-0, etc etc).

 

[Formerly Seth]

X - ... spy in SHP
Y - ... spy in RHP
Z - ... spy in BBP

SHP = Caribou

RHP = Rockstar.

BBP = Kuzan.

 

[Cozy Sofa]

SHP = Caribou

RHP = Rockstar.

BBP = Kuzan.

Why not? Fits well.

Known
Kuma - RA spy in WG
Stussy - WG spy in BM
Drake - Marines spy in BP
Vergo - Doflamingos spy in Marines
Kanjuro - BP spy in Wano

Speculation
Caribou - BBP spy in SHP
Rockstar - BM spy in RHP
Kuzan - Marines spy in BBP
X (Koala?) - RHP spy in RA

Leaves SHP as the only ones without a spy. Best fit would obviously have been Robin in RA or Sanji in BM but the SHP don't play that way. If I'd take a guess the spy might be Koala.

 

[dizzy2341]

Your whole point is depended on this subjective assumption.

If you read the post then you'd know that's not the case.

-he had set up Marco vs Big Mom and Perospero already and needed something to stop that
-he wanted to show Carrot’s Su Long again, and Wanda’s for the first time, and since it seems Su Long will play no other part in Wano, it had to happen then
-he was putting all the other Minks on the roof so he needed to show why Carrot and Wanda weren’t with them

-Could've just had meme lose interest, claim she didn't have soul weapons to spare and then run off to the dome, which was the actual in-canon reason for her leaving. Sulongs weren't necessary to facilitate that.
-He could've showed it off by having them fight fodder like everyone else
-That's kinda circular logic, no? "Why did Oda have Carrot and Wanda fight Perospero?" "Because they weren't fighting on the roof with the other minks".

No, disregarding it would be if it ended there, Carrot stayed on the ground, nothing else happened. There will be a conclusion to Carrot vs Perospero where Perospero gets whats coming to him.

But since Oda has spent a grand total of five pages (and a solitary panel) on Carrot in the 28 chapters since she went after Perospero, with huge chunks of time where he didn’t bother even cutting to it to get a catchup of how Carrot is doing, I don’t expect it to get the focus that Carrot going SunLong the first time did got.

Oda's went 19 chapters without focusing on Jinbe vs Who's Who. All he got was like 2 or 3 tiny close up panels that didn't actually show anything. The same deal happened with Robin vs BM. They're still going to get a chapter and a half dedicated to them. This is supposedly Carrot's exit from the story. She is still one of the most popular characters in the entire story. Even if for nothing else, for that reason alone she would warrant a worthwhile sending off.

Resolution and climax are not the same thing. A climax is the highest point of drama, regardless of when it falls. A resolution is the end.

Mixed up the words a bit, but I'm talking about climax of character arcs, not the narrative at large.

Robin’s I want to live was far more memorable and impactful than her actually beating Spandam at the end of the arc, or thanking the crew for rescuing her.

Wyper killing Enel was his standout moment, more than knocking down the Giant Jack or seeing the party of both Skypiean and Shandoran.

The resolution of Kyros and Rebecca’s story wasn’t them beating Diamente, it was them deciding to live together in peace.

Robin's I want to live was the climax of her character arc. It's what everything in her character had been building up towards and marked the great change for her personally. Just like Rebecca proclaiming herself the daughter of Kyros was the climax of hers. Wyper killing Enel was a standout moment, it wasn't the standout moment. That would actually be this:

Spoiler

That's what marked the actual change in his character arc. But the difference is that Wyper's story was about him coming to trust and work with others and not letting his inherited obligation to Noland and the Shandians consume him with violence. Carrot on the other hand has an arc about becoming a mighty warrior, to keep moving forward, realising the true importance of the straw hats and that she'll get her time to shine.

So whilst Wyper's climatic moment is him longingly cheering on an outsider in Luffy instead of fighting him out of hatred, Carrot's moment will highlight her strength, her recognition of the straw hats and her intention to keep moving forward.

The biggest example in fiction I can think if is the resolution of Frodo’s story being to leave the Shire, but the climax being his decision to keep the Ring and him and Gollum struggling in Mount Doom.

Haven't read LoTR.

With the way Carrot’s story has went since, I very much doubt beating Perospero will match the impact that her first Su Long transformation had. Carrot’s Su Long was the first time we’d seen it from any Mink, the sacrifice of Pedro was fresh in the memory, it was only five people against an entire fleet, there was only three plotlines of note to be focused on (Sunny escapes, Luffy vs Katakuri, Sanji and the cake).

I'm not even certain Carrot's moment will be Perospero related at all. Pedro told her to "move forward". By trying to get revenge on Perospero she's stuck in the past and hung up on Pedro's death instead of focusing on the straw hat's, the people Pedro told her were actually important. She'll still subvert his comments about her going back to Zou, but she'll do so in a way that makes it clear she's looking to the future, not the past.

-Pedro died ages ago and it’s not especially relevant to the arc as a whole, which is all about avenging Oden and freeing Wano. Carrot and Perospero (and Big Mom) very much feel like interlopers who are only here to get the plotline solved quickly
-it’s not especially high stakes. On WCI it was the Strawhats surronded, if Carrot hadn’t turned Su Long they might not have escaped. Here, if Carrot doesn’t beat Perospero, it’s no biggie, there’s tonnes of other powerful fighters that can do it
-rather than the three broad plotlines of the escape of WCI, here Carrot vs Perospero is only one plotline- with barely any focus and the least to do with the purpose of the arc- competing with two fights with a Yonko, three fights with a Calamity, two fights between the Worst Gen, five fights against the Flying Six, the fights against the Kurozumi clan. And that’s just taking a broad outline of the plots, it can be zoomed further in (what will each Scabbard do, what will Momo do, what is Hiyori up to, what will Marco do, what about Yamato, CP-0, etc etc).

The dawn is the plot that's very relevant, and that's the plot Pedro associated Carrot with in his final words. This wasn't just any random conversation. Pedro literally knew he was about to die and his very final message to Carrot was to tell her that the straw hats are going to bring the dawn, keep moving forward. That can't be taken lightly. And it absolutely did not need to happen if nothing was gonna come of it.

 

[Roo]

Why not? Fits well.

Known
Kuma - RA spy in WG
Stussy - WG spy in BM
Drake - Marines spy in BP
Vergo - Doflamingos spy in Marines
Kanjuro - BP spy in Wano

Speculation
Caribou - BBP spy in SHP
Rockstar - BM spy in RHP
Kuzan - Marines spy in BBP
X (Koala?) - RHP spy in RA

Leaves SHP as the only ones without a spy. Best fit would obviously have been Robin in RA but the SHP don't play that way. If I'd take a guess the spy might be Koala.

I don't think the RHP have a spy. Sengoku said they're the closest crew and are impenetrable

 

[Cozy Sofa]

I don't think the RHP have a spy. Sengoku said they're the closest crew and are impenetrable

Yeah, all the better. Rockstar joined just 2 years ago. What if he is one of the Blackbeard pirates? A trojan horse who destroys the impenetrable RHP from within?

 

[Roo]

Yeah, all the better. Rockstar joined just 2 years ago. What if he is one of the Blackbeard pirates? A trojan horse who destroys the impenetrable RHP from within?

I doubt it. Shanks and Luffy are similar characters and big thing about Luffy is that he’s a good judge of character

 

[Cozy Sofa]

I doubt it. Shanks and Luffy are similar characters and big thing about Luffy is that he’s a good judge of character

Sure. But we've had several hints about pirates betraying each other. Look att WB who ultimately met his demise due to BB and Squardo betraying him. And he was probably a decent judge of characters but pirates are not to be trusted

 

[Roo]

Sure. But we've had several hints about pirates betraying each other. Look att WB who ultimately met his demise due to BB and Squardo betraying him. And he was probably a decent judge of characters but pirates are not to be trusted

I honestly believe all of that is there to showcase Luffy as above other pirates.

 

[Chaves]

Regardless of whether Carrot will join the strawhatz or not. Surely there will be her moment of redemption against Perosperos.
Look at the moment when Peros defeated and humiliated her, and as Pedro's moment was still reinserted, it is clear as the light that there will be a 2nd round.

Peros vs Carrot is still going to happen.