General & Others Oda's Obsession With Originality and Shockvalue And Why The Story Suffers
- Thread starter Rosella.Fiamingo
- Start date
Lol
Basic and Oda dont match
Oda always trying to be creative and different and he always succeeds
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Haki is a simple power
It is not like nen
Who has a greater haki will win
Thats why law beated verga and doffy beated law
And luffy couldnt beat doffy without the gamma knife from law
I see that haki is very understandable
Why you making problems out of no where
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Haki is confirmed after smoker df introduced
Enel and luffy fight was just physical but luffy was stronger
Basic and Oda dont match
Oda always trying to be creative and different and he always succeeds
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He could avoided all of that by not making Logia users intangible.
It is not like nen
Who has a greater haki will win
Thats why law beated verga and doffy beated law
And luffy couldnt beat doffy without the gamma knife from law
I see that haki is very understandable
Why you making problems out of no where
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Haki is confirmed after smoker df introduced
Enel and luffy fight was just physical but luffy was stronger
The point is that the fight wasn’t as simple as “I’m going to win by punching my enemy in the face”, there was more going on in those fights than that. Luffy vs Croc in particular, Luffy had to be a bit more creative in how he won that fight. Same with Luffy vs Magellan, he and Mr. 3 had to team up to succeed.
But team ups aren’t always going to be possible, and Luffy won’t always be able to exploit someone’s weakness. Enter Haki, the magic fight-winning powerup that will always be rewritten to be whatever it needs to be in order to defeat an opponent by repeatedly punching them in the face without any real ingenuity or brain power required, until Oda decides that they are done fighting and Luffy wins.
Haki itself isn’t a bad concept, what’s bad about Haki is that it only exists because Oda made it impossible on himself for Haki not to exist. He introduced invincible logias without knowing how he was going to have Luffy win against them, so then he wrote Haki as a non-specific and lazy solution. He made Kaido invincible without actually knowing how Luffy would win, so he had to write a flashback that destroyed Whitebeard’s character to explain the powerup that Luffy was about to get, and even then we still don’t really know what AdCoC is or how it works.
It’s another symptom of Oda establishing interesting storylines but not knowing how to resolve them.
But team ups aren’t always going to be possible, and Luffy won’t always be able to exploit someone’s weakness. Enter Haki, the magic fight-winning powerup that will always be rewritten to be whatever it needs to be in order to defeat an opponent by repeatedly punching them in the face without any real ingenuity or brain power required, until Oda decides that they are done fighting and Luffy wins.
Haki itself isn’t a bad concept, what’s bad about Haki is that it only exists because Oda made it impossible on himself for Haki not to exist. He introduced invincible logias without knowing how he was going to have Luffy win against them, so then he wrote Haki as a non-specific and lazy solution. He made Kaido invincible without actually knowing how Luffy would win, so he had to write a flashback that destroyed Whitebeard’s character to explain the powerup that Luffy was about to get, and even then we still don’t really know what AdCoC is or how it works.
It’s another symptom of Oda establishing interesting storylines but not knowing how to resolve them.
Really this is the worst comment ive ever read
For ryou
Ryou first appeared in sabaody
Oda wrote ryou then wrote kaido
Wrote haki then wrote logia
Everything is planned and everything is foreshadowed
You critisize him for doing things he never did
He made the power and opposite from the beggining
Dont say things like lazy writing when things are obvious
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Oda use the backward writing
He knew how everything will end
He just add small details
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Destroyed whitebeard character ? Really ???
Do you even understanded it ?
For ryou
Ryou first appeared in sabaody
Oda wrote ryou then wrote kaido
Wrote haki then wrote logia
Everything is planned and everything is foreshadowed
You critisize him for doing things he never did
He made the power and opposite from the beggining
Dont say things like lazy writing when things are obvious
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Oda use the backward writing
He knew how everything will end
He just add small details
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Destroyed whitebeard character ? Really ???
Do you even understanded it ?
You're not straightforward when you withhold information just for the sake of withholding information.
I said that I won't spend time giving examples of how Haki renders the plot incoherent because there are too many to name but If you want some here goes.
1. A character with really good COO like Katakuri and can see the literal future couldn't detect his little sister being there, and giving him aid and assistance the entire fight.
2. The whole Katakuri fight was rendered incoherent because Katakuri was simply made far too strong as a result of his Haki prowess and mastery to the point where he literally had to dumb down Katakuri and pull so much PIS to have Luffy survive that fight. Considering the circumstances of why Luffy was there (To Kill his Mother, having already hurt his precious siblings), he resorts to being lazy, dropping his weapon, injuring himself and letting Luffy win. And don't say it was an idealogical battle because it was not. The circumstances of that fight was a result of Oda hyper focusing on Katakuri's Haki and making him an impossible challenge for Luffy only to pull a million bullshits for Luffy to survive
3. Lol, Kaido's entire durability same for Linlin. The Haki Luffy knows is something Top Tiers at a minimum should have developed considering you have two durability freaks running around. How convenient that the strongest people in the world are being left in the dust by a literal 19 year old.
4. The SN and Strawhats being capable of sneaking into the festival. We've seen several instances where characters who aren't even actively using COO can sense the presence of strong people passively. Yet, no such thing occurred with what one must expect multiple competent Haki users on Kaido's crew.
And no, there was little build up in Luffy's Bull shit COC powerup. It's something the fanbase somewhat guessed but there was literally no build up for it at all in the Wano Arc. The entirety of the arc has been focused on Luffy mastering COA. I don't care that he did it, I care that he literally pulls it out of his ass within a single chapter and is now pummeling Kaido with it.
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Honestly, yes! I don't think I could put it any better as well. I had a lot of thoughts writing that and one thing I forgot to note down as explicitly as you have done is his withholding of information just for the sake of it as a means of slipping out of the impossible situations he creates and to avoid consequences.
And it's crazy to say that the pre-time skip actually had more tangible and lasting consequences for the strawhats even though the stakes were far lower. Luffy and CO are running through the territories of the most dangerous pirates and people in the world and are coming out scott free and are leaving with only gains. Not a single thing has been lost by Luffy and CO despite the New World being hyped up as a dangerous cruel place for the weak.
Luffy and CO are not weak but they are nowhere as strong or as connected as the people they're messing with yet they come out squeaky clean each time. I can't tell you how disappointed I was when Jinbei came back seemingly ok. Im still holding out hope that he falls over and dies soon but I doubt it. I'm not even asking for characters to die but, there should be real consequences to their actions.
I would have been able to swallow WCI shenanigans if Luffy lost a limb or something against Cracker or Katakuri or if that Mogura wound became a permanent scar that didn't heal as a reminder of his reckless behavior.
I said that I won't spend time giving examples of how Haki renders the plot incoherent because there are too many to name but If you want some here goes.
1. A character with really good COO like Katakuri and can see the literal future couldn't detect his little sister being there, and giving him aid and assistance the entire fight.
2. The whole Katakuri fight was rendered incoherent because Katakuri was simply made far too strong as a result of his Haki prowess and mastery to the point where he literally had to dumb down Katakuri and pull so much PIS to have Luffy survive that fight. Considering the circumstances of why Luffy was there (To Kill his Mother, having already hurt his precious siblings), he resorts to being lazy, dropping his weapon, injuring himself and letting Luffy win. And don't say it was an idealogical battle because it was not. The circumstances of that fight was a result of Oda hyper focusing on Katakuri's Haki and making him an impossible challenge for Luffy only to pull a million bullshits for Luffy to survive
3. Lol, Kaido's entire durability same for Linlin. The Haki Luffy knows is something Top Tiers at a minimum should have developed considering you have two durability freaks running around. How convenient that the strongest people in the world are being left in the dust by a literal 19 year old.
4. The SN and Strawhats being capable of sneaking into the festival. We've seen several instances where characters who aren't even actively using COO can sense the presence of strong people passively. Yet, no such thing occurred with what one must expect multiple competent Haki users on Kaido's crew.
And no, there was little build up in Luffy's Bull shit COC powerup. It's something the fanbase somewhat guessed but there was literally no build up for it at all in the Wano Arc. The entirety of the arc has been focused on Luffy mastering COA. I don't care that he did it, I care that he literally pulls it out of his ass within a single chapter and is now pummeling Kaido with it.
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Honestly, yes! I don't think I could put it any better as well. I had a lot of thoughts writing that and one thing I forgot to note down as explicitly as you have done is his withholding of information just for the sake of it as a means of slipping out of the impossible situations he creates and to avoid consequences.
And it's crazy to say that the pre-time skip actually had more tangible and lasting consequences for the strawhats even though the stakes were far lower. Luffy and CO are running through the territories of the most dangerous pirates and people in the world and are coming out scott free and are leaving with only gains. Not a single thing has been lost by Luffy and CO despite the New World being hyped up as a dangerous cruel place for the weak.
Luffy and CO are not weak but they are nowhere as strong or as connected as the people they're messing with yet they come out squeaky clean each time. I can't tell you how disappointed I was when Jinbei came back seemingly ok. Im still holding out hope that he falls over and dies soon but I doubt it. I'm not even asking for characters to die but, there should be real consequences to their actions.
I would have been able to swallow WCI shenanigans if Luffy lost a limb or something against Cracker or Katakuri or if that Mogura wound became a permanent scar that didn't heal as a reminder of his reckless behavior.
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1- they said that she is a silent assassin and he was already fighting
You just dont concentrate when you watch
SILENT ASSASSIN
2-katakuri didnt love his mother as a son
He was doing his duty
We will know in the future more about him
For the CoC point
Luffy uses it with know efficiency
He wont master it
He will use it like he used the sword for the first time
You just dont concentrate when you watch
SILENT ASSASSIN
2-katakuri didnt love his mother as a son
He was doing his duty
We will know in the future more about him
For the CoC point
Luffy uses it with know efficiency
He wont master it
He will use it like he used the sword for the first time
Who cares if she is silent?
CoO is a magical sonar.
An ability to remain hidden from detection from a CoO user would be yet ANOTHER thing Oda would pull out of his ass, since it is currently not a thing.
CoO is the most INCONSISTENT garbage Oda has created. It is amazing how simple and ok it was when it was just "Mantra". Then Oda decides to make it "omg so op so good" and fucks it up at every chance he gets.
CoO is a magical sonar.
An ability to remain hidden from detection from a CoO user would be yet ANOTHER thing Oda would pull out of his ass, since it is currently not a thing.
CoO is the most INCONSISTENT garbage Oda has created. It is amazing how simple and ok it was when it was just "Mantra". Then Oda decides to make it "omg so op so good" and fucks it up at every chance he gets.
Nope, unless Oda has made it possible to conceal your presence, your voice (thats the thing that COO users are able to track one another with. They dont track through physical sensation.)
Katakuri doesn't need to love his mother. In fact, he can hate her but his Duty to protect his family ought to be enough to be reason to Kill Luffy for hurting his beloved siblings and trying to kill his mother who by the way if she was gone, his entire family would be in existential danger due to other Yonko and pirates swooping in capitalize on her death.
For COC, nothing will make him jumping back up (After a COC named attack) with no visible damage and start pounding on Kaido with something he just learned out of the blue not bullshit. Theres no build up or foreshadowing.
Katakuri doesn't need to love his mother. In fact, he can hate her but his Duty to protect his family ought to be enough to be reason to Kill Luffy for hurting his beloved siblings and trying to kill his mother who by the way if she was gone, his entire family would be in existential danger due to other Yonko and pirates swooping in capitalize on her death.
For COC, nothing will make him jumping back up (After a COC named attack) with no visible damage and start pounding on Kaido with something he just learned out of the blue not bullshit. Theres no build up or foreshadowing.
D
Tbh I think Kawamatsu is more ridiculous but I understand your point
One reason Oda keeps them hidden might be due to unfinished character design, the oden silhouette we have in chapter 958, literally one chapter before the start of his flashback, has different hair style than the current Oden
Even the anime team has no idea what he looks like, they drew his hair as a hat during Kine'mon's story telling lol
One reason Oda keeps them hidden might be due to unfinished character design, the oden silhouette we have in chapter 958, literally one chapter before the start of his flashback, has different hair style than the current Oden
Even the anime team has no idea what he looks like, they drew his hair as a hat during Kine'mon's story telling lol
Tbh I think Kawamatsu is more ridiculous but I understand your point
One reason Oda keeps them hidden might be due to unfinished character design, the oden silhouette we have in chapter 958, literally one chapter before the start of his flashback, has different hair style than the current Oden
Even the anime team has no idea what he looks like, they drew his hair as a hat during Kine'mon's story telling lol
One reason Oda keeps them hidden might be due to unfinished character design, the oden silhouette we have in chapter 958, literally one chapter before the start of his flashback, has different hair style than the current Oden
Even the anime team has no idea what he looks like, they drew his hair as a hat during Kine'mon's story telling lol
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I think any creativity regarding how to counter Law's devil fruit was binned because of "Haki"
Are you defending Whitebeard’s decision not to avenge Oden? That’d be like if I said that Whitebeard shouldn’t have tried to save Ace, because Whitebeard himself said he had no interest in Roger’s legacy or the Pirate King title.
Whitebeard tried to save Ace because Ace was like a son to him. He should’ve tried to avenge Oden for the same reason.
Whitebeard tried to save Ace because Ace was like a son to him. He should’ve tried to avenge Oden for the same reason.
Exactly, Oda should have established clear rules and limitations for haki. Look at stands or nen, you have range as a factor, environment, conditions, equal cost to reward etc. I think haki should have also been uniquely integrated to ones own devil fruit ability rather than be used the exact same way by everyone that would have added an element of personalization aswell as thought provoking fights where you and the character are trying to figure out how this ability functions using the parameters the author set. The best way to describe it is in dimensions, the devil fruit is two dimensional and haki makes it three dimensional its simply taking the same shape and making it more complex but you are not abandoning the shape itself kind of making it obsolete.
