Spoiler One Piece Chapter 1001 Spoilers Discussion
- Thread starter Gol D. Roger
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I expected that being a mod, you'd actually read my posts, and maybe you know, actually try to understand where im coming from. But clearly you and those biased to Mihawk don't and never seem to actually try to.
I've clearly said Mihawk could probably defeat Shanks in a 1v1 duel exclusively with swords. The problem with that is that in One Piece, everyone, even the most basic characters, have their own fighting style. You said it before, people like Cabaji use their own tricks outside of swordsmanship and are still considered swordsmen. However, that doesn't make Cabaji EXCLUSIVELY a swordsman. No, Cabaji is an acrobat, and applies acrobatic techniques as well as circus act tricks to his moveset. Hes NOT just a swordsman.
- Big Mom is NOT just a swordsman
- Law is NOT just a swordsman
- Fujitora is NOT just a swordsman
- Kaku is NOT just a swordsman
All 5 examples have displayed powers, techniques, and abilities that essentially can be used outside of swordsmanship (and have shown as such), and gave done so in a variety of ways. I bring up Kaku especially because Kaku used his swords. Then stopped using them, then used them again for a bit. He is NOT a just a swordsman as a result.
Now, we "could" get all technical and say the same thing about Zoro, but Zoro's only other attribute is his pure strength and haki. This is how we have known him for a 1000 chapters in the manga. Sometimes he throws a punch, sometimes he lifts a building. In the end he uses his swords and is pretty much a full blown swordsman user outside of his personal strengths. There is a clear difference between Zoro and everyone on that list.
Then you have people like Roger, Rayleigh or Shanks. All 3 embody a "classic" pirate in their own ways, accustomed to a typical pirate sword. Roger is a swordsman, but has been shown to use guns. However, does anyone not believe that Roger couldn't just drop his swords and NOT fight like Luffy or Garp? Is he just exclusively this swordsman outside of the 1 technique and clash we have of him? What if the manga shows him fighting with his fists in a very serious way?
That said, what if the same is true for Rayleigh and Shanks? We don't know their upper limits right? Rayleigh has stopped Kizaru only with his foot, matching Kizaru's kick. He also stopped an elephant with level 2 armament, without a sword. Is Rayleigh still a full swordsman? What if Oda just starts drawing Shanks in a way where when/if he fights Luffy, he doesn't use Gryphon? What if he just starts fighting with 1 arm hand to hand. What if he uses his arm/legs with Haki just like Luffy does? Is he a full swordsman then?
Nothing I said here was cold hard fact, nor did I care about it being fact, my original post was poking fun at Mihawk fans because Kaido only seemed to remember other major "swordsmen" or blade users but not Mihawk. I just found it funny and it does not mean anything.
I think people need to stop looking at everything so Black and White, especially since we virtually know nothing about Mihawk and Shanks. So again, yes, as a mod I expected you probably have a more open mind about peoples opinions and views on characters in the story.
Edit: Once again, it all comes down to your definition of "swordsman" which brings me back to my original point: The argument between any character over a title is pointless because powerscaling and interpretations of power are all over the place in One Piece. I mean we have Kaido as the WSC and he lost 7 times to other people! The thing is we don't know the circumstances, and thats precisely my point. We dont "know" if Mihawk defeated Shanks. We dont "know" if he's actually stronger than him.
Like, what if Shanks didn't care about the WSS at all, and Mihawk just gained that title after Shanks lost his arm and they never fought again? Clearly that would be in line with your thinking that Shanks is a swordsman completely, but it would entirely prove neither person won. Its a hypothetical, but its something that can happen because dont have evidence otherwise of what happened between them aside from a "title"
I've clearly said Mihawk could probably defeat Shanks in a 1v1 duel exclusively with swords. The problem with that is that in One Piece, everyone, even the most basic characters, have their own fighting style. You said it before, people like Cabaji use their own tricks outside of swordsmanship and are still considered swordsmen. However, that doesn't make Cabaji EXCLUSIVELY a swordsman. No, Cabaji is an acrobat, and applies acrobatic techniques as well as circus act tricks to his moveset. Hes NOT just a swordsman.
- Big Mom is NOT just a swordsman
- Law is NOT just a swordsman
- Fujitora is NOT just a swordsman
- Kaku is NOT just a swordsman
All 5 examples have displayed powers, techniques, and abilities that essentially can be used outside of swordsmanship (and have shown as such), and gave done so in a variety of ways. I bring up Kaku especially because Kaku used his swords. Then stopped using them, then used them again for a bit. He is NOT a just a swordsman as a result.
Now, we "could" get all technical and say the same thing about Zoro, but Zoro's only other attribute is his pure strength and haki. This is how we have known him for a 1000 chapters in the manga. Sometimes he throws a punch, sometimes he lifts a building. In the end he uses his swords and is pretty much a full blown swordsman user outside of his personal strengths. There is a clear difference between Zoro and everyone on that list.
Then you have people like Roger, Rayleigh or Shanks. All 3 embody a "classic" pirate in their own ways, accustomed to a typical pirate sword. Roger is a swordsman, but has been shown to use guns. However, does anyone not believe that Roger couldn't just drop his swords and NOT fight like Luffy or Garp? Is he just exclusively this swordsman outside of the 1 technique and clash we have of him? What if the manga shows him fighting with his fists in a very serious way?
That said, what if the same is true for Rayleigh and Shanks? We don't know their upper limits right? Rayleigh has stopped Kizaru only with his foot, matching Kizaru's kick. He also stopped an elephant with level 2 armament, without a sword. Is Rayleigh still a full swordsman? What if Oda just starts drawing Shanks in a way where when/if he fights Luffy, he doesn't use Gryphon? What if he just starts fighting with 1 arm hand to hand. What if he uses his arm/legs with Haki just like Luffy does? Is he a full swordsman then?
Nothing I said here was cold hard fact, nor did I care about it being fact, my original post was poking fun at Mihawk fans because Kaido only seemed to remember other major "swordsmen" or blade users but not Mihawk. I just found it funny and it does not mean anything.
I think people need to stop looking at everything so Black and White, especially since we virtually know nothing about Mihawk and Shanks. So again, yes, as a mod I expected you probably have a more open mind about peoples opinions and views on characters in the story.
Edit: Once again, it all comes down to your definition of "swordsman" which brings me back to my original point: The argument between any character over a title is pointless because powerscaling and interpretations of power are all over the place in One Piece. I mean we have Kaido as the WSC and he lost 7 times to other people! The thing is we don't know the circumstances, and thats precisely my point. We dont "know" if Mihawk defeated Shanks. We dont "know" if he's actually stronger than him.
Like, what if Shanks didn't care about the WSS at all, and Mihawk just gained that title after Shanks lost his arm and they never fought again? Clearly that would be in line with your thinking that Shanks is a swordsman completely, but it would entirely prove neither person won. Its a hypothetical, but its something that can happen because dont have evidence otherwise of what happened between them aside from a "title"
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Just the sword, all other signs point to Luffy.
Luffy is the man Oden and Roger was waiting for.
Yamato admitted Luffy was "more Oden than her"
Luffy is the man who found Momo.
Luffy is the man who allied with Momo.
Luffy is the man who gave Momo courage to lead and courage to put his life on the line.
Luffy is the man who fought Kaido 1vs1 already and is the one that will take Kaido down in the end- this is OP, do you really expect anything else?
Luffy is the man Oden and Roger was waiting for.
Yamato admitted Luffy was "more Oden than her"
Luffy is the man who found Momo.
Luffy is the man who allied with Momo.
Luffy is the man who gave Momo courage to lead and courage to put his life on the line.
Luffy is the man who fought Kaido 1vs1 already and is the one that will take Kaido down in the end- this is OP, do you really expect anything else?
You're saying my statements aren' "valid" cause subjective but I'm bringing you manga facts: dynamics during their fight, Zoro-Killer interaction in this chapter, their general portrayal as first mates and so on
How are these arguments not valid cause of subjectivity? All these things are drawn black and white in the manga
How are these arguments not valid cause of subjectivity? All these things are drawn black and white in the manga
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