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I understand Oden's line of thinking. He exercised Utilitarianism, which means he believed his actions were justified if they are useful or beneficial to the majority. In other words, the needs of the many outweigh those of the few.
Sure he was naive, sure he could have gathered Hyo and the others to attack Kaido and Orochi, but I think Oda wanted to show the growth of Oden in regards to his new mentality and a deeper level of maturity.
Hate him or love him, he's still in my top 5 fav characters
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This is a great chapter and an emotional one we finally learned what happen behind the scene with Oden and his motives..
yes, Oden did made a terrible mistake for trusting Kaido and Orochi for five years thinking they would keep their promise but I also don't think a plan b or c to rebel wouldn't work base on how we know Oden personality he's the "i'll do it alone" type of person ever since his introduction he faces Ashura and his gang alone not even asking for his retainers for help, he clash with WB alone, even he already has the 2nd division he still went on first to face the Roger Pirates alone this is what seperates him from Luffy.
Luffy believes in his crew unlike Oden so him asking Hyou and the other samurai to go to war against Kaido isn't very Oden like that's why he did what he have to do shouldering all the responsibilities alone even in his upcoming death.
other than that the art is great especially the double spread of Oden lifting the scabbards and the last panel such a badass.
yes, Oden did made a terrible mistake for trusting Kaido and Orochi for five years thinking they would keep their promise but I also don't think a plan b or c to rebel wouldn't work base on how we know Oden personality he's the "i'll do it alone" type of person ever since his introduction he faces Ashura and his gang alone not even asking for his retainers for help, he clash with WB alone, even he already has the 2nd division he still went on first to face the Roger Pirates alone this is what seperates him from Luffy.
Luffy believes in his crew unlike Oden so him asking Hyou and the other samurai to go to war against Kaido isn't very Oden like that's why he did what he have to do shouldering all the responsibilities alone even in his upcoming death.
other than that the art is great especially the double spread of Oden lifting the scabbards and the last panel such a badass.
Great chapter.
Man this chapter was darkk, oda has done that a lot the 2 arcs especially.
Oden was a true monster holy shit, the way he let himself get boiled in oil just to protect his retainers.
Shinobu telling the.citizen what was.the reason behind odens dancing leads me to believe she is definitely not the traitor.
The part of Toki smiling in regarding Oden getting boiled in oil is confusin as hell, why the hell would she be smiling that her husband is getting boiler alive.
No King in this chapter ): lol
Man this chapter was darkk, oda has done that a lot the 2 arcs especially.
Oden was a true monster holy shit, the way he let himself get boiled in oil just to protect his retainers.
Shinobu telling the.citizen what was.the reason behind odens dancing leads me to believe she is definitely not the traitor.
The part of Toki smiling in regarding Oden getting boiled in oil is confusin as hell, why the hell would she be smiling that her husband is getting boiler alive.
No King in this chapter ): lol
also disagree, we needs 5 year to fit shiraoshi's pophecy . Also its not really oden will dance for a finite number of year, its just in the 5th year kaido kills the yakuza which enrage oden.
timing is one thing I can say the post time skip improve upon pretimeskip. In pre we didnt really have a sense of time passing (zou is pretty much where we start to be able to make detail about the timing of the story)
timing is one thing I can say the post time skip improve upon pretimeskip. In pre we didnt really have a sense of time passing (zou is pretty much where we start to be able to make detail about the timing of the story)
Why don’t people understand this simple fact. Oden was left with 2 choices:
1. Get all the people of Wano to fight alongside him against Kaido Orochi Alliance who legit didn’t care about the country and the people. Even if he chose to fight them, they would have won the battle but lost the war. Collateral damage would have been too high.
2. Agree to their terms and hope to get them leave his country where no one would be harmed. Also he saw how Kurozumi family were disrespected and wanted to make it up for his ancestors as well as Wano itself.
I think the choice is simple here for the man like Oden.
1. Get all the people of Wano to fight alongside him against Kaido Orochi Alliance who legit didn’t care about the country and the people. Even if he chose to fight them, they would have won the battle but lost the war. Collateral damage would have been too high.
2. Agree to their terms and hope to get them leave his country where no one would be harmed. Also he saw how Kurozumi family were disrespected and wanted to make it up for his ancestors as well as Wano itself.
I think the choice is simple here for the man like Oden.
But to some people he just idiot because he dare to have hope that Orochi and Kaido would leave, he dared to make a leap of faith, he dared to not fight them regardless of the life of the citizen and his crime he dared to no have as much knowledge as the readers.
In short, he is an idiot because he was wrong. Basically, for them the « smart » way would have been to burn Wano down
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When he was in the castle? No. He was alone against Kaido and two other guys with hax DFs. If he doesn't agree to the deal, he will probably lose and gets executed on the spot.
Once he agreed to the deal, it was Orochi's and Kaido's victory, since all heroes in this series are honorable guys, Oden included of course. He would never break an oath. He trusted them to at least keep their promise after all the embarassment he took on him.
The Sanji-comparison is valid. Sanji is a kind man and tried to save the SHs by marrying into BM's family. He actually had even less reason than Oden to agree to the deal. He was on Zou, hundreds of miles away from BM, no immediate threat being there (Sanji, the other SHs and the minks would've obliterated Capone if it came to a fight) and he still decided to go to the wedding.
He also believed in the enemy in some way.
Some other thoughts: It was an amazing chapter again. The symbolism is absolutely stunning. Oden is taking a time-limit-deal from one of the Yonkou once again. First it was WB who told him he could join the crew, if he only manages to hang onto the rope for three days. Now it's taken to the next level with Kaido telling him he will get to live, if he manages to withstand the seething oil for an hour.
On top of that it also emphasizes Oden's character and his ultimate downfall once again: He tries to do it all by himself. It's honorable, yes, but not fully believing in your subordinates will be your downfall. They even tell him that they would go in there with him and together hold him up for a while, yet he himself is the only one going in, carrying all other 9 scabbards.
As for the traitor: Shinobu is out of the conversation after this chapter.
Kanjuro is still the leading favorite, but it's a bit of a flag against him, that he was literally one-inch away of getting burned alive in the oil, too.
Then there is Toki, who gets more mysterious (why is she still so relaxed and smiling all the time?) chapter by chapter ...
Once he agreed to the deal, it was Orochi's and Kaido's victory, since all heroes in this series are honorable guys, Oden included of course. He would never break an oath. He trusted them to at least keep their promise after all the embarassment he took on him.
The Sanji-comparison is valid. Sanji is a kind man and tried to save the SHs by marrying into BM's family. He actually had even less reason than Oden to agree to the deal. He was on Zou, hundreds of miles away from BM, no immediate threat being there (Sanji, the other SHs and the minks would've obliterated Capone if it came to a fight) and he still decided to go to the wedding.
He also believed in the enemy in some way.
Some other thoughts: It was an amazing chapter again. The symbolism is absolutely stunning. Oden is taking a time-limit-deal from one of the Yonkou once again. First it was WB who told him he could join the crew, if he only manages to hang onto the rope for three days. Now it's taken to the next level with Kaido telling him he will get to live, if he manages to withstand the seething oil for an hour.
On top of that it also emphasizes Oden's character and his ultimate downfall once again: He tries to do it all by himself. It's honorable, yes, but not fully believing in your subordinates will be your downfall. They even tell him that they would go in there with him and together hold him up for a while, yet he himself is the only one going in, carrying all other 9 scabbards.
As for the traitor: Shinobu is out of the conversation after this chapter.
Kanjuro is still the leading favorite, but it's a bit of a flag against him, that he was literally one-inch away of getting burned alive in the oil, too.
Then there is Toki, who gets more mysterious (why is she still so relaxed and smiling all the time?) chapter by chapter ...
It's totally cool with me if people like Oden and think he's a great character.
However, i think whatever Oda intended to do with Oden ended up in an epic fail, and now the only way to overshadow past events is to make him go out as epic as possible so that this will just be remembered when it comes to his character.
A shame, i was very excited for his character at first.
However, i think whatever Oda intended to do with Oden ended up in an epic fail, and now the only way to overshadow past events is to make him go out as epic as possible so that this will just be remembered when it comes to his character.
A shame, i was very excited for his character at first.
Boiled alive
Cover: we see Gotti chasing the marines who captured Chiffon.
We see a very brief overview of the Oden family and an exchange of words between Toki and Momonosuke. The mother tries to reassure her children as much as possible. But this is not enough to reassure Momo, who starts to cry. He knows about the imminent death of his father.
On the other hand, we see Oden and the Nine who have to throw themselves into a pot of boiling oil. A truly tragic scene.
To assist the execution, there are also Kaido and Orochi. A subordinate of the Shogun, due to his clumsiness, ends up falling into the oil, he also manages to emerge again, but is completely burnt.
Oden, to save his companions, poses a challenge to Kaido: if he resists in the pot for an hour, with his companions on him, then the latter will be free.
Another very strong scene is seen, when he lifts his companions into a container, while he holds up to the boiling oil.
It is a tribute to a truly existed samurai, Goemon Ishikawa (the same name as Lupine's partner). He too died boiled alive during a death execution. Except that he kept his young son up instead of his companions.
The theme of sacrifice is recurring in the world of One Piece: there are many characters who give their life (or at least try) for a greater common good.
We learn about the sad fate of Orochi's family, the Kurozumi, and we understand, in part, his resentment for the world, and also his desire for revenge.
In addition to this, Shinobu also reveals the reasons that led Oden to dance for five years: how to forgive the Kurozumi clan and to save a hundred people.
In the end, we see Oden still in the pot. The flashback, at the speed at which Oda is going, could also last two more chapters.
Rating: 6.5 / 10
Cover: we see Gotti chasing the marines who captured Chiffon.
We see a very brief overview of the Oden family and an exchange of words between Toki and Momonosuke. The mother tries to reassure her children as much as possible. But this is not enough to reassure Momo, who starts to cry. He knows about the imminent death of his father.
On the other hand, we see Oden and the Nine who have to throw themselves into a pot of boiling oil. A truly tragic scene.
To assist the execution, there are also Kaido and Orochi. A subordinate of the Shogun, due to his clumsiness, ends up falling into the oil, he also manages to emerge again, but is completely burnt.
Oden, to save his companions, poses a challenge to Kaido: if he resists in the pot for an hour, with his companions on him, then the latter will be free.
Another very strong scene is seen, when he lifts his companions into a container, while he holds up to the boiling oil.
It is a tribute to a truly existed samurai, Goemon Ishikawa (the same name as Lupine's partner). He too died boiled alive during a death execution. Except that he kept his young son up instead of his companions.
The theme of sacrifice is recurring in the world of One Piece: there are many characters who give their life (or at least try) for a greater common good.
We learn about the sad fate of Orochi's family, the Kurozumi, and we understand, in part, his resentment for the world, and also his desire for revenge.
In addition to this, Shinobu also reveals the reasons that led Oden to dance for five years: how to forgive the Kurozumi clan and to save a hundred people.
In the end, we see Oden still in the pot. The flashback, at the speed at which Oda is going, could also last two more chapters.
Rating: 6.5 / 10
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