Versus Battle Ouki Vs Moubu

[Lee Ba Shou]

Haha obviously

Qin are the MC and Zhao is the main foe and antagonist of the manga. Obviously they are greater quality proportionally compared to other states.

Riboku the main antagonist and the most dangerous man in China.
Houken the strongest martially
Rénpa the most versatile guy ever etc etc

Chu is a big fucking state and the next wall but Hara focused much more on Zhao than any other foe.

So yeah there won’t be at all 6/7 guys wil 97/98 + STR. It’s not proportional at all.

The strength of the state is proportional to the narrative. Not to numbers.

and obviously Narratively Man U isn’t your run of the mil opponent. And he is an opponent for Moubu the strongest.

If Man U was just your random guy he would have been killed right away. Not living, summoned by Karin and having a future with the Mou.

Post automatically merged: Nov 26, 2023

lol you really think Chu is as strong as all the northern states combined ?

Zhao and Qin together (full power with everyone) would likely erase Chu

This may be the most retarded post in the history of WorstGen Kingdom posting lol. Dear Lord I don’t think I could write a dumber post if I even tried lol. I mean that seriously, I’ve been all up in this kingdom sub since 2019 and I would give this post the gold metal in absolute retardation.

L Rayan. Fucking L lol.

 

[RayanOO]

This may be the most retarded post in the history of WorstGen Kingdom posting lol. Dear Lord I don’t think I could write a dumber post if I even tried lol. I mean that seriously, I’ve been all up in this kingdom sub since 2019 and I would give this post the gold metal in absolute retardation.

L Rayan. Fucking L lol.

Lmao Lee roasted me for free

I’m honored by the compliment of being number 1

(But you know you’re wrong babe)

 

[Rumble]

Hara didn't make Karin as big as Kanmei as one of the few only females with such ridiculous size, having her showcase that strength by killing an officer with a kick just for her to not be relevant martially.

I agree that Man'U is one of the strongest Chu fighters but Lee isn't entirely wrong by calling Man'U the Rozo of Chu.

Ka Rin is not going to be in the conversation for strongest Chu general. Her martial ability is not her primary method of fighting, strategy is.

Man’U is definitionally some random Chu Lord. He is just one lord of one Chu territory. A strong Chu territory to be sure but otherwise irrelevant to Chu overall.

Can't believe I have to ask, but do you even know what the word "random" means, because you're using it incorrectly. There is nothing random about an outsider like Man'U who came to be a part of Chu through tragic circumstances detailed in his background story.

Again, that is literally the opposite of what the word means.

I love how hard you had to twist what happened between Chu and Man’U to make Man’U look far more important than he actually is lol. “MAN’U WAS SO POWERFUL THAT THEY GAVE HIM HIS OWN TERRITORY TO KEEP HIM IN CHECK” lmfao, bro please. They gave Man’U Juukou because it was far easier to have him defend that territory than it was for them to have to find someone else to do it lol. Chu has a dozen Juukou’s and a dozen Man’U’s lol.

Facts don't require twisting.

Chu gave Juuko to Man'U because he was a menace and though it better to bring him in the fold. That's what happened.

I don't even know what to say about the bold, really. It's like you're not even reading the manga. Juuko is a strategic stronghold of enormous importance. Great enough to convince Go Hou Mei to agree to Qin's terms of alliance for 3 years. Like, what are you doing, my guy? What purpose does this hyperbole serve besides increasing the degree to which you are wrong?

I imagine Chu quite literally has dozens of generals like Sento Un or Gen’U. I think it was Rokuomi who even said you can’t cross the street in Chu without running into Generals who are former Great Generals/heads of state for destroyed states. If you think Man’U is unique in Chu, you are in for a rude awakening.

You have an overactive imagination and ought to learn to separate what you're told from what you're shown.

Sen To'Un said ROM would probably measure up to just a 1K Commander in Chu. Reasonably intelligent people understood that to be trashtalk. Dumbs dumbs took it seriously. Which one are you?

Like I said, Man’U is Chu’s Rozo. Just like how Rozo was a great warrior lord but ultimately Zhao had plenty of other warrior generals on his level or perhaps above, Man’U will be the same. An exceptional warrior to be sure but Chu will have several other warriors on his level or above

Rozo and Man'U are nothing alike. For one, the former is not on the level of the later, so Zhao having multiple individuals on Rozo's level (though not that many) is a moot point. Individuals that can clash with Mou Bu don't grow on trees, as we learned during Mou Bu's duel with Kan Mei, who himself also rarely got to cut lose against an equal opponent.

Secondly, thematically, these two could hardly be more opposite. Man'U was a selfless hero the people and was betrayed by them. Rozo was a ruthless, brutal tyrant that cared for no one. Again, what are you doing, my guy? This is obviously not a sensible comparison to make, never a mind a good one.

You have absolutely nothing to base your assertions on beyond wishful thinking. I think we both know that.

 

[Bepo]

Ka Rin is not going to be in the conversation for strongest Chu general. Her martial ability is not her primary method of fighting, strategy is.



Can't believe I have to ask, but do you even know what the word "random" means, because you're using it incorrectly. There is nothing random about an outsider like Man'U who came to be a part of Chu through tragic circumstances detailed in his background story.

Again, that is literally the opposite of what the word means.



Facts don't require twisting.

Chu gave Juuko to Man'U because he was a menace and though it better to bring him in the fold. That's what happened.

I don't even know what to say about the bold, really. It's like you're not even reading the manga. Juuko is a strategic stronghold of enormous importance. Great enough to convince Go Hou Mei to agree to Qin's terms of alliance for 3 years. Like, what are you doing, my guy? What purpose does this hyperbole serve besides increasing the degree to which you are wrong?



You have an overactive imagination and ought to learn to separate what you're told from what you're shown.

Sen To'Un said ROM would probably measure up to just a 1K Commander in Chu. Reasonably intelligent people understood that to be trashtalk. Dumbs dumbs took it seriously. Which one are you?



Rozo and Man'U are nothing alike. For one, the former is not on the level of the later, so Zhao having multiple individuals on Rozo's level (though not that many) is a moot point. Individuals that can clash with Mou Bu don't grow on trees, as was we learned during Mou Bu's duel with Kan Mei, who himself also rarely got to cut lose against an equal opponent.

Secondly, thematically, these two could hardly be opposites. Man'U was a selfless hero the people and was betrayed by them. Rozo was a ruthless, brutal tyrant that cared for no one. Again, what are you doing, my guy? This is obviously not a sensible comparison to make, never a mind a good one.

You have absolutely nothing to base your assertions on beyond wishful thinking. I think we both know that.

I don't think the comparison was literal in the sense that Man'U and Rozo are literally on the same level but more so relative in terms of roles, it seems like every state has powerfull commanders that are (somewhat) relegated to a certain area, Rozo was in charge of Ryouyou and the Zhao government turned a blind eye. Similarly, Man'U was given control over Juuko, a significant stronghold but given the fact that Chu is huge there are likely plenty of powerfull commanders that control other territories.

 

[Lee Ba Shou]

There is nothing random about an outsider like Man'U who came to be a part of Chu through tragic circumstances detailed in his background story.

You say I have an overactive imagination, and then you went on to straw man the absolute fuck out of my post but we’ll get to that later.

So yes. Juukou is just a random Chu territory. A strong territory to be sure, and an important territory, but Chu encompasses thousands of miles worth of territory, and you are absolutely deluded if you think Juukou is a one of a kind territory. Pretty sure current Chu is still at 99% of their power level despite losing Juukou. It is nowhere as important of a territory as you two clowns are making it out to be. If Juukou was that important, Karin would’ve gone herself to protect it, or she would’ve sent more than two rookie generals and 30,000 men. Karin has 300,000 men personally loyal to her, but she sent two 28 year olds and 30k men to defend Juukou. And when Juukou was lost, Karin didn’t really seem to care much at all. That is because Juukou is not that important.

I don’t understand the tendency of you people to blow every minor story detail massively out of proportion. “Man’U got a backstory, obviously he is the Chu Christ, no other character in Kingdom got a backstory ever so Man’U must be the new main character now.”

So Rozo’s strength stat is 95. I’m now going to list some generals who got heavily emotional backstories with a lower strength stat than 95:

-Gyou’Un
-Chou Garyuu
-Mangoku
-The entire Kanki clan

And this is just off the top of my head. The deluded belief that Hara only ever gives the strongest characters backstories is straight up ass cancer and I have no idea how you possibly deluded yourself into that belief @RayanOO .

Strength =/= narrative importance, what kind of fucking idiot do you need to be to make that argument lmfao…Is Ei Sei going to beat Rozo 1v1? Ei Sei is far more important than Rozo after all. Is Kaine going to beat Rozo 1v1? Kaine is incredibly important after all. I guess Karyo Ten would bend Rozo over and spank him. Ten has a back story and she’s an MC, Hara would never let Ten lose 1v1 to someone like Rozo who was merely portrayed as the warrior king of the mythically important Quanrong tribe, the personal elite warriors of the King of the mythical Joko (or whatever) dynasty during the times of gods and men as stated by Hara. Nah, I’m sure Rozo would lose a fight to goddamn Seikyou.

Juuko is a strategic stronghold of enormous importance.

So is every fucking territory lol. Hara has popped up five enormously important strategic territories in Zhao alone. First it was Gyou, then Atsuyo, then Gian, now Hango. Every territory is of huge territorial significance in a war.

You have an overactive imagination and ought to learn to separate what you're told from what you're shown.

Ah yes, because I failed to realize that backstories are the true way we can tell strong characters from weak ones. Karyo Ten is obviously stronger than Moubu, what was I thinking lol.

Individuals that can clash with Mou Bu don't grow on trees

My guy,

A literal Chu fodder blocked one of Moubu’s mace swings.

I don’t feel like going back to find the panel but go back and reread Juukou. Now obviously not any fighter can clash equally with Moubu yes, but there are surely plenty of other martial, backstory-possessing generals who can undoubtedly clash with Moubu.

Man'U was a selfless hero the people and was betrayed by them. Rozo was a ruthless, brutal tyrant that cared for no one. Again, what are you doing, my guy? This is obviously not a sensible comparison to make, never a mind a good one.

Then it’s a good thing I didn’t make that comparison and only an absolute fucking moron would even imply this was the comparison I was trying to make, lol.

Man’U and Rozo are both similar in that they are lords of relatively unimportant territories of their respective states.

And yes, before your dumbass assumes Juukou is a top 3 most important Chu territory just because Juukou has had one very minor story arc and we haven’t reached inner Chu yet,

Juukou is going to be a pretty minor Chu territory in the grand scheme of things. If you think Juukou is important, wait until you see how deathly seriously Karin will defend the territories surrounding the Chu capital, the capital itself, the southern territories bordering the Baiyue tribes, actual officially designated strongholds of the main Chu military, etc…

You have absolutely nothing to base your assertions on beyond wishful thinking. I think we both know that.

Well, I certainly can’t back up any of the claims you accused me of making. It’s a good thing I wasn’t making any of those claims, then lol.

 

[MarineHQ]

Ka Rin is not going to be in the conversation for strongest Chu general. Her martial ability is not her primary method of fighting, strategy is.

She'll clearly be in consideration for the Top 3. This statement as well as the visual showing of her next to Kanmei wasn't just a coincidence.

Spoiler

Karin also seems to not shy away from direct confrontation with generals that are monsters martially. We know from earlier examples in the series what kind of effect combat based generals have on non-combat based generals.

She wasn't intimidated even in the slightest and it's not like she's protected by higher status, Kanmei was her superior.

 

[TheKnightOfTheSea]

Chu is likely filled with so many ex great generals like the Juuko 4. We're talking legit top tiers and Heavenly King level characters.

Remember how Ordo's invasion got fucked because he invaded Seika? Chu is filled with such a large pool of talent that any visit to the wrong castle could end in disaster. One of the scariest parts of Chu.

The fact that there's a bunch of talent wasting away in places like Juuko is why Kouen said Chu wasn't using its full resources

That being said I don't see Man'U being below top 3 martially in Chu by the time of the Chu Arcs, but maybe I just rate Man'U higher than most people

 

[Rumble]

She'll clearly be in consideration for the Top 3. This statement as well as the visual showing of her next to Kanmei wasn't just a coincidence.

Spoiler

Karin also seems to not shy away from direct confrontation with generals that are monsters martially. We know from earlier examples in the series what kind of effect combat based generals have on non-combat based generals.

She wasn't intimidated even in the slightest and it's not like she's protected by higher status, Kanmei was her superior.

Correlation does not mean cause. Whether Kan Mei intimidated her or not is hardly relevant when we've seen plenty of politician types unintimidated by monstrously strong individuals, e.g. Ryo Fui, Shun Shin Kun, the politicians of Beki and more.

Man'U, Sen To'Un and Kou Yoku are already stronger fighters than Ka Rin, so there goes Top 3.

Haku Rei (92) is likely to surpass her (94) and Kou En is very likely to have at least one bruiser stronger than her.

Ka Rin is likelier to be out of the Top 5 than in it.

You say I have an overactive imagination, and then you went on to straw man the absolute fuck out of my post but we’ll get to that later.

You don't know what a strawman is.

So yes. Juukou is just a random Chu territory. A strong territory to be sure, and an important territory, but Chu encompasses thousands of miles worth of territory, and you are absolutely deluded if you think Juukou is a one of a kind territory.

lol

Spoiler

Pretty sure current Chu is still at 99% of their power level despite losing Juukou.

Fighting strength, sure.

Juukou wasn't about sapping their fighting strength though, at least not directly.

It was about depriving Chu of an enormously valuable strategic stronghold at the border of four states. Losing it has made Chu more vulnerable.

It is nowhere as important of a territory as you two clowns are making it out to be. If Juukou was that important, Karin would’ve gone herself to protect it, or she would’ve sent more than two rookie generals and 30,000 men. Karin has 300,000 men personally loyal to her, but she sent two 28 year olds and 30k men to defend Juukou. And when Juukou was lost, Karin didn’t really seem to care much at all. That is because Juukou is not that important.

Ka Rin is both Great General and Prime Minister, and Juukou is considered an infallible military stronghold. The Juukou generals sent armies coming to claim it packing for years, including a Han army just 6 months prior.

Ka Rin nevertheless sent two of Chu's most promising young generals to reinforce them with 30K. The Chu had more firepower on that battlefield, they just weren't accounting for the possibility Wei would send a separate army unit to besiege the city in their absence.

I don’t understand the tendency of you people to blow every minor story detail massively out of proportion. “Man’U got a backstory, obviously he is the Chu Christ, no other character in Kingdom got a backstory ever so Man’U must be the new main character now.”

If you were capable of understanding the irony of this, you'd be giggling your ass off at yourself.

So Rozo’s strength stat is 95. I’m now going to list some generals who got heavily emotional backstories with a lower strength stat than 95:

-Gyou’Un
-Chou Garyuu
-Mangoku
-The entire Kanki clan

And this is just off the top of my head. The deluded belief that Hara only ever gives the strongest characters backstories is straight up ass cancer and I have no idea how you possibly deluded yourself into that belief @RayanOO .

Strength =/= narrative importance, what kind of fucking idiot do you need to be to make that argument lmfao…Is Ei Sei going to beat Rozo 1v1? Ei Sei is far more important than Rozo after all. Is Kaine going to beat Rozo 1v1? Kaine is incredibly important after all. I guess Karyo Ten would bend Rozo over and spank him. Ten has a back story and she’s an MC, Hara would never let Ten lose 1v1 to someone like Rozo who was merely portrayed as the warrior king of the mythically important Quanrong tribe, the personal elite warriors of the King of the mythical Joko (or whatever) dynasty during the times of gods and men as stated by Hara. Nah, I’m sure Rozo would lose a fight to goddamn Seikyou.

This is what an strawman actually is.

No one asserted that Man'U is strong because he has a backstory. I rebutted your assertion he was some "random Chu lord" because there is nothing random about his character or background that has set up him as an obvious foil for Mou Bu, with whom he is at odds ideologically.

So is every fucking territory lol. Hara has popped up five enormously important strategic territories in Zhao alone. First it was Gyou, then Atsuyo, then Gian, now Hango. Every territory is of huge territorial significance in a war.

Gyou was the second largest city of Zhao. It is the only target in this list that can be compared to Juukou, because taking it came with a ton of Zhao's western territories, which are now in Qin hands.

Atsuyo's importance was only insofar as setting up Gi'an, whose importance is down to cutting off the escape path of royals. Had they taken Gi'an, they would've subsumed Hango into the fold in one fell swoop. The aim is still to take Gi'an, they just have to get to Hango first and go from there.

Ah yes, because I failed to realize that backstories are the true way we can tell strong characters from weak ones. Karyo Ten is obviously stronger than Moubu, what was I thinking lol.

As established, you don't do much thinking.

My guy,

A literal Chu fodder blocked one of Moubu’s mace swings.

I don’t feel like going back to find the panel but go back and reread Juukou. Now obviously not any fighter can clash equally with Moubu yes, but there are surely plenty of other martial, backstory-possessing generals who can undoubtedly clash with Moubu.

Is it such a shock to you Mou Bu isn't swinging his glaive at full strength every time he swings it? Mou Bu isn't some mindless brute. He uses strength he thinks appropriate to deal with fodders. Man'U's elites were of stronger mettle than what he initially anticipated, so he adjusted and went to work anyway. You're making a big deal of Mou Bu having to turn up the thermostat dial.

Then it’s a good thing I didn’t make that comparison and only an absolute fucking moron would even imply this was the comparison I was trying to make, lol.

If the shoe fits.

Man’U and Rozo are both similar in that they are lords of relatively unimportant territories of their respective states.

Simply saying they are similar doesn't make them so.

Ryouyou was not a strategic stronghold of significant importance beyond Ou Sen's plans during the Western Zhao Invasion. It does not come close to Juukou's worth. They're not even in the same conversation.

And yes, before your dumbass assumes Juukou is a top 3 most important Chu territory just because Juukou has had one very minor story arc and we haven’t reached inner Chu yet,

Eventually you'll start to notice that you're the only person here making presumptuous claims of rankings.

Reasonably intelligent people will take the story as it comes and make reasonable deductions based on ample information and context.

You are neither reasonable nor intelligent. You are a hyperactive child.

Juukou is going to be a pretty minor Chu territory in the grand scheme of things. If you think Juukou is important, wait until you see how deathly seriously Karin will defend the territories surrounding the Chu capital, the capital itself, the southern territories bordering the Baiyue tribes, actual officially designated strongholds of the main Chu military, etc…

lol