Versus Battle Tobirama vs Ay
- Thread starter Jiihad
- Start date
There's no contest
Tobirama is faster
has faster reactions (guy managed to dodge Juubito attacks - that feat instantly puts him far beyond the 5 kage of Ays generation)
he also has more chakra density and power - he can destroy his surroundings just by raising it - Ay has to transform its nature before he can accomplish this feat
This means Tobirama is more durable and less exhaustible
Plus he is stronger than the trollkage who made Gaara and Ohnoki look weak, reputed as the strongest Suiton user ever, and Ohnoki in the eyes of many was at least on par with Ay
He has Edo Tensei
He has infinite exploding tags like Konan did
Tobirama also oneshot Izuna when he had the mangekyo Sharingan. When Sasuke had the Mangekyo he put up a fight to Ay and managed to have one of Ays limbs amputated
It's a totally different scale
Somehow we've seen some mad Kisame wank here, but it's irrelevant. I dont understand the logic of the guys trying to say Ay beats Tobirama
Tobirama is faster
has faster reactions (guy managed to dodge Juubito attacks - that feat instantly puts him far beyond the 5 kage of Ays generation)
he also has more chakra density and power - he can destroy his surroundings just by raising it - Ay has to transform its nature before he can accomplish this feat
This means Tobirama is more durable and less exhaustible
Plus he is stronger than the trollkage who made Gaara and Ohnoki look weak, reputed as the strongest Suiton user ever, and Ohnoki in the eyes of many was at least on par with Ay
He has Edo Tensei
He has infinite exploding tags like Konan did
Tobirama also oneshot Izuna when he had the mangekyo Sharingan. When Sasuke had the Mangekyo he put up a fight to Ay and managed to have one of Ays limbs amputated
It's a totally different scale
Somehow we've seen some mad Kisame wank here, but it's irrelevant. I dont understand the logic of the guys trying to say Ay beats Tobirama
It was a 2 vs 2. Tobirama was with the 2nd Raikage, and it's implied it's Kinkaku who handled Tobirama by Shikamru's wordings(Kinkaku is the monster said to have defeated the second hokage)
I'm not saying A could have done any better. I said Tobirama would win regardless but that it'd be closer than people seem to imply
There were 2 encounters. The first one when he was with the 2nd Raikage and he barely survived and the second one against the squad where he died
I'm not saying A could have done any better. I said Tobirama would win regardless but that it'd be closer than people seem to imply
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There were 2 encounters. The first one when he was with the 2nd Raikage and he barely survived and the second one against the squad where he died
Both
Tobirama is literally the third or fourth fastest Shinobi to ever live (excluding Ootsutsuki and Juubi related powers)
He's only slower than Minato, Naruto and Sasuke. That alone makes him too much for Hiruzen to handle
then there's the fact that, while Hiruzen has impressive power with 4 natures, to the same level of Danzo's wind for most (or thereabouts), Tobirama is the strongest Suiton user to ever live, or certainly within living memory. That puts his Suiton > EVEN Hashirama, Gengetsu and Kisame - it's a totally different level of Ninjutsu and Taijutsu
I just can't see Hiruzen winning this. There's no feasible way he could without help.
Tobirama is literally the third or fourth fastest Shinobi to ever live (excluding Ootsutsuki and Juubi related powers)
He's only slower than Minato, Naruto and Sasuke. That alone makes him too much for Hiruzen to handle
then there's the fact that, while Hiruzen has impressive power with 4 natures, to the same level of Danzo's wind for most (or thereabouts), Tobirama is the strongest Suiton user to ever live, or certainly within living memory. That puts his Suiton > EVEN Hashirama, Gengetsu and Kisame - it's a totally different level of Ninjutsu and Taijutsu
I just can't see Hiruzen winning this. There's no feasible way he could without help.
Tobirama's shunshin is near Minato's. Then his Hirashin (ftg) is same as Minato's. His reactions are better than Minato's.
This is ofc with Tobirama not being at full power.
From feats Tobirama hasn't shown anything that would bypass the armor. From portrayal, he should have various ways to do it.
Nah, he lost to Ginkaku & Kinkaku. Since it was Ginkaku who said "after we beat him". But more than likely it was a group attack.
This is ofc with Tobirama not being at full power.
From feats Tobirama hasn't shown anything that would bypass the armor. From portrayal, he should have various ways to do it.
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Nah, he lost to Ginkaku & Kinkaku. Since it was Ginkaku who said "after we beat him". But more than likely it was a group attack.
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Dummy because you disagree with my point? Nice one. We can tell who's shit at powerscaling based on that last statement, and it certainly aint me buddy.
To powerscale Kisame:
Kisame is inferior to Jiraiya dude. Itachi said so himself and it's a solid and reasonable suggestion that Jiraiya would get low diffed (at best) by Gaara + Ohnoki +4000 Jonin and Chunin - which some people somehow seem to think Kisame can beat.
We saw how Kisame would be able to cope with Ay's speed. He simply wouldn't. We also saw how Kisame would handle FTG. He simply wouldnt.
Tobirama has been hyped up as the strongest Suiton user EVER. That puts Tobirama levels above Ay and Kisame. Heck, Ays dad didn't even get hyped as the strongest Raiton user ever, and he was way stronger than Ay. Tobirama was competent against Juubito. Ay was nigh useless against an inferior Edo Madara.
Tobirama literally has the speed advantage Minato had. That is all people need to know to answer this question. It's a low diff.
To powerscale Kisame:
Kisame is inferior to Jiraiya dude. Itachi said so himself and it's a solid and reasonable suggestion that Jiraiya would get low diffed (at best) by Gaara + Ohnoki +4000 Jonin and Chunin - which some people somehow seem to think Kisame can beat.
We saw how Kisame would be able to cope with Ay's speed. He simply wouldn't. We also saw how Kisame would handle FTG. He simply wouldnt.
Tobirama has been hyped up as the strongest Suiton user EVER. That puts Tobirama levels above Ay and Kisame. Heck, Ays dad didn't even get hyped as the strongest Raiton user ever, and he was way stronger than Ay. Tobirama was competent against Juubito. Ay was nigh useless against an inferior Edo Madara.
Tobirama literally has the speed advantage Minato had. That is all people need to know to answer this question. It's a low diff.
Lolololololol
Kisame always beats Jiraiya and is ahead of him in tiers tho. Kisame's one of the most OP individuals in the manga before they got into big blasts and dimensional shifts.
Also anyone who uses "power-scaling" is a fool. Use feats to determine a VS battle not hype, you belong arguing on twitter and youtube comments not on an actual forum my man.
Kisame always beats Jiraiya and is ahead of him in tiers tho. Kisame's one of the most OP individuals in the manga before they got into big blasts and dimensional shifts.
Also anyone who uses "power-scaling" is a fool. Use feats to determine a VS battle not hype, you belong arguing on twitter and youtube comments not on an actual forum my man.
Kisame by his own admission said he can't handle Jiraiya and that Itachi was only a maybe. This places him below Jiraiya and Itachi.
Powerscaling, feats, hype and portrayal are all equally imporant. Siphoning off all lines of argument except the one that suits your misguided opinion best is a default admission of incorrectness.
Stop being so salty and toxic. Why should I even present an argument with feats to somebody so undeserving, disrespectful, rude and irritating? I don't have time for this shit.
Powerscaling, feats, hype and portrayal are all equally imporant. Siphoning off all lines of argument except the one that suits your misguided opinion best is a default admission of incorrectness.
Stop being so salty and toxic. Why should I even present an argument with feats to somebody so undeserving, disrespectful, rude and irritating? I don't have time for this shit.
Don't fully remember nor care but pretty sure you were being annoyingly rude first, or maybe I just didn't like your posts that much idk.
Anyways, if I can make an argument around feats that clearly shows Kisame can top Jiraiya in a battle are we still going to take what he said while laughing to himself in a moment where they both explicitly stated many times they didn't want to get into a battle??
By your own "hype and portrayal" asinine argument Itachi was portrayed as LEAGUES MANY MANY LEAGUES above Orochimaru, who Jiraiya himself stated he could never equal... so which do we go with??? That is why VS sections exist to take feats and arguments and debate if you want to wank portrayal and hype stick to the discussion section. Don't bother arguing anything this wasn't a Kisame V.S Anyone thread to begin with.
Anyways, if I can make an argument around feats that clearly shows Kisame can top Jiraiya in a battle are we still going to take what he said while laughing to himself in a moment where they both explicitly stated many times they didn't want to get into a battle??
By your own "hype and portrayal" asinine argument Itachi was portrayed as LEAGUES MANY MANY LEAGUES above Orochimaru, who Jiraiya himself stated he could never equal... so which do we go with??? That is why VS sections exist to take feats and arguments and debate if you want to wank portrayal and hype stick to the discussion section. Don't bother arguing anything this wasn't a Kisame V.S Anyone thread to begin with.
*literally the first thing you said to me. small thing and i couldnt care less but if you cant be courteous then don't expect anything from anyone. Respect is mutual and you lost my respect instantly. I'm sure other users feel the same way if this is the temperament you carry around with you
If you're going to paint somebody as the bad guy, make sure you don't make yourself look like a tool in the process next time.
Would you like to retry posting, this time without being a twat, in order to get the response you clearly desperately need for some form of validation?
If you're going to paint somebody as the bad guy, make sure you don't make yourself look like a tool in the process next time.
Would you like to retry posting, this time without being a twat, in order to get the response you clearly desperately need for some form of validation?
