Episode Discussion Toyotaro interview reveals that Broly, Bills, Whis, and Grand Priest are stronger than current Goku with iS.


Yes and? He dodged her attack and destroyed her ass. UIO2 was stronger than Kefla in a fight. What the fuck are you trying to argue?


No she didn't have more raw power than him. The whole point of UIO is that Goku wasn't able to use that tremendous strength at it's fullest because he couldn't empty his head when attacking.


No it doesn't. What explains why his SSJ is so strong is that it's a SPECIAL TYPE of Super Saiyan, the same as KALE who ragdolled SSB Goku in the ToP initially in both manga and anime.


You realize that FSF need you too land blows to work? So Gogeta Blue (who took 0 blows vs Broly) can't avoid getting hit by Moro but UI Goku not only can, he can also take hits on purpose and have Moro injure himself in the process.


Massive L Kaido D. Weaker since Super Saiyan C is also used for Kale and listed as such in the wikia.
Kale is literally the female version of your Space Ape Tarzan smh, have more respect for her, she has the same powers that he does.


Congrats. You figured out why they didn't have Goku and Vegeta fuse in the ToP. Can't afford to let Jiren walk all over the best marketing tool in Dragon Ball history.


Jiren and UI shook an infinite world of void. That's far more impressive.


1. No it wasn't said to be that, stop using shity promotional content about "mightiest", especially when it refers more so to the fact that people were obsessed about Broly vs Gogeta since the early 2000s with fucking Budokai games putting it in every intro.


I mean yea you've basically proven that BROLY is an even more asspull character than Kale was and Kale got a lot of flack for going to fodder to folding Blue with her SSJC form. So I guess we can agree that Broly is just bad writing and asspul powers uh?
Sadly what you said here is false, Broly did train his whole life, that's all he did on Vampa, somehow he was still fodder after all this training tho and had to get strong in a real fight.


-Ikari Broly was beaten by SSB, where tf are you getting that they're equal when Freeza killed Paragus because BROLY was losing?
-I mean yea, but as I said even Heavily Supressed Jiren roflstomped SSB in 1 glare so being > Goku/Vegeta in SSB isn't impressive
-Broly SSJ > Gogeta SSJ is 100% headcanon. They looked equal to each other.
-Lol no it doesn't mean Broly is SSG Gogeta level, because SSB Gogeta took a crap on Broly the whole time and didn't get hit once.
-Speculation, current Broly is below Hakaishin Vegeta who's fodder to Beerus.



It's not that "things changed", Toyo back then even said "We don't know if this is true or not" when directly asked who's stronger by fans.
Also yes Beerus gets retconned, water is wet. Current Beerus would nodiff Vegito with a hand behind his back.



Why are you using outdated empty hype statements? You know very well Beerus folds Vegito and you know very well Broly can't be the strongest of opponents when Beerus was an opponent of Goku and he would roflstomp Broly even worse than he roflstomped Universe 7 top 3 mortal Vegeta
1. He dodge her attack and had to use an attack at point blank range because he didn't trust in his ability to have any other way of beating her

2. Bullshit. It was shown that every time broly was powering up via fight was when his power (ikrari) was kicking in . Hell his eyes in base would even flash golden to show you he was tapping into it to increase his power when he fought. That was taken up a further notch when he went Super saiyan. And last time I checked ssj stacks. So there is zero reason to believe that broly wasn't using both ikari and ssj simultaneously. Why? Because his ikari wasn't listed as a separate transformation. It was simply him tapping into his Ape power in base. The moment he went into Super saiyan his eyes whited out the same way a great Ape does. While kales eventually turned normal and became smaller when she controlled her emotions

3. She had more raw power than is ui omen form hence his reasoning for dodging the entire fight

4. And you do realize that that is not the case with Moro since he already has the ability to aborb energies without even having to move or touch you right? And thus has the ability to use spirit fission without physically touching right? Cuz unlike Vegeta he already has the unique ability to take your power without touching you right?

5. You are using wiki? A sight thats info can be wrong since its info is tweaked by fans such as ourselves? Use the actual official dragon ball super site for info. Not wiki
 
Yes and? He dodged her attack and destroyed her ass. UIO2 was stronger than Kefla in a fight. What the fuck are you trying to argue?


No she didn't have more raw power than him. The whole point of UIO is that Goku wasn't able to use that tremendous strength at it's fullest because he couldn't empty his head when attacking.


No it doesn't. What explains why his SSJ is so strong is that it's a SPECIAL TYPE of Super Saiyan, the same as KALE who ragdolled SSB Goku in the ToP initially in both manga and anime.


You realize that FSF need you too land blows to work? So Gogeta Blue (who took 0 blows vs Broly) can't avoid getting hit by Moro but UI Goku not only can, he can also take hits on purpose and have Moro injure himself in the process.


Massive L Kaido D. Weaker since Super Saiyan C is also used for Kale and listed as such in the wikia.
Kale is literally the female version of your Space Ape Tarzan smh, have more respect for her, she has the same powers that he does.


Congrats. You figured out why they didn't have Goku and Vegeta fuse in the ToP. Can't afford to let Jiren walk all over the best marketing tool in Dragon Ball history.


Jiren and UI shook an infinite world of void. That's far more impressive.


1. No it wasn't said to be that, stop using shity promotional content about "mightiest", especially when it refers more so to the fact that people were obsessed about Broly vs Gogeta since the early 2000s with fucking Budokai games putting it in every intro.
Are you putting kale on the same level as Broly? HAHAHAHAHA...
That's how desperate you are.


I mean yea you've basically proven that BROLY is an even more asspull character than Kale was and Kale got a lot of flack for going to fodder to folding Blue with her SSJC form. So I guess we can agree that Broly is just bad writing and asspul powers uh?
Sadly what you said here is false, Broly did train his whole life, that's all he did on Vampa, somehow he was still fodder after all this training tho and had to get strong in a real fight.


-Ikari Broly was beaten by SSB, where tf are you getting that they're equal when Freeza killed Paragus because BROLY was losing?
-I mean yea, but as I said even Heavily Supressed Jiren roflstomped SSB in 1 glare so being > Goku/Vegeta in SSB isn't impressive
-Broly SSJ > Gogeta SSJ is 100% headcanon. They looked equal to each other.
-Lol no it doesn't mean Broly is SSG Gogeta level, because SSB Gogeta took a crap on Broly the whole time and didn't get hit once.
-Speculation, current Broly is below Hakaishin Vegeta who's fodder to Beerus.



It's not that "things changed", Toyo back then even said "We don't know if this is true or not" when directly asked who's stronger by fans.
Also yes Beerus gets retconned, water is wet. Current Beerus would nodiff Vegito with a hand behind his back.



Why are you using outdated empty hype statements? You know very well Beerus folds Vegito and you know very well Broly can't be the strongest of opponents when Beerus was an opponent of Goku and he would roflstomp Broly even worse than he roflstomped Universe 7 top 3 mortal Vegeta
Broly > Jiren, it's no use answering everyone like crazy based on their interpretations.
Broly is the most powerful enemy that goku has faced and that statement comes after the power tournament.
At the end of the DAY > Broly > JIREN.
GOGETA (BLUE FILM) > JIREN.
Bills: They surpassed me.

Goku after having witnessed all 12 gods of destruction fight each other (if they were restricted they would be deleted according to DAISHINKAN): You can be even stronger than lord Bills, and lord bills is a god.

And as I said again, the level of power demonstrated in the film was the greatest ever seen in the work, that's stated.

And that statement comes after the power tournament.

With the god of destruction bills mentioning that they "overtook me".

And by the way, BASE BROLY + OZARU never lost to GOKU BLUE.

BASE BROLY +OZARU, was fighting toe-to-toe with BLUE 100% after the power tournament.
When FREEZA killed Broly's father, he was still fighting GOKU BLUE, Broly fighting in BASE + OZARU laughs.


He only needed to go to super saiyan 1, for GOKU and VEGETA to fight together in their blue form and not even scratch the man.


Goku and vegeta blue can't even move Broly from the place attacking TOGETHER.


By the way, I don't care which you think is more awesome, shaking the world out of the void or creating dimensions, it's already been declared that the highest level of force (destructive power) of the series was the fight between Broly and Gogeta, so go to I sing and cry.

See what Broly does with his greatest offensive power combined, HAHAHA is nothing to Broly, nor does it scratch him.

It looks like I'll have to publish the entire movie on my YT channel, and teach him how to scale power.
All this after the tournament, which goku and vegeta trained every day relentlessly.

Goku and Vegeta Movie> Goku and Vegeta Tournament.

 
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Some people are just stubborn
They can’t see the reality that broly is the goat
The guy jumped from below base vegeta level into beerus level in a couple of hours
Can you imagine if broly was trained for just 1 day by beerus and whis ????

zeno who?
:luuh:
 
Some people are just stubborn
They can’t see the reality that broly is the goat
The guy jumped from below base vegeta level into beerus level in a couple of hours
Can you imagine if broly was trained for just 1 day by beerus and whis ????

zeno who?
:luuh:
Broly is the goat, he is a prodigy.

He never needed to train his whole life like GOKU and JIREN to overcome them, he did it in his first real fight.

10% of the training that GOKU and JIREN had in their entire lives applied to Broly MAKES Broly stronger than an Angel.:milaugh::milaugh::milaugh::milaugh:
 
1. He dodge her attack and had to use an attack at point blank range because he didn't trust in his ability to have any other way of beating her
Did you skip the part where they explain that UIO Goku's AP is nerfed because he cannot attack while thinking instinctively ? It's got nothing to do with PL. His PL is higher, he just cannot use that PL properly until UIO3.

2. Bullshit. It was shown that every time broly was powering up via fight was when his power (ikrari) was kicking in . Hell his eyes in base would even flash golden to show you he was tapping into it to increase his power when he fought. That was taken up a further notch when he went Super saiyan. And last time I checked ssj stacks. So there is zero reason to believe that broly wasn't using both ikari and ssj simultaneously. Why? Because his ikari wasn't listed as a separate transformation. It was simply him tapping into his Ape power in base. The moment he went into Super saiyan his eyes whited out the same way a great Ape does. While kales eventually turned normal and became smaller when she controlled her emotions
His form isn't called SSJ Ikari.
It's just SSJ type C, same form as Kale, you can call it unofficial Legendary Super Saiyan too.
And even then why does it matter?
Base Kefla was just as strong as Ikari Broly, she used Super Saiyan Type C and still got beaten by UIO2, not UIO3, not complete UI, just the 2nd trigger of the form.

Kale's eyes were the same as Broly in her initial form, she just mastered her power to keep her sanity while Broly did not.


3. She had more raw power than is ui omen form hence his reasoning for dodging the entire fight
She had more power output because UIO2 Goku could not attack without thinking as Whis explained it.
Goku's actual PL wasn't lower than Kefla's.

4. And you do realize that that is not the case with Moro since he already has the ability to aborb energies without even having to move or touch you right? And thus has the ability to use spirit fission without physically touching right? Cuz unlike Vegeta he already has the unique ability to take your power without touching you right?
Moro's range attacks are tied to his magic, not to FSF which isn't magic.
Moro needs to hit you to make FSF works so Piccolo/Goku don't think that Gogeta can go a whole fight with Moro 73 without getting hit (something he did vs Broly once he turned SSB)
Moro 73 > Broly
And UI Goku did what Piccolo/Goku thought would be impossible for Gogeta to achieve.

5. You are using wiki? A sight thats info can be wrong since its info is tweaked by fans such as ourselves? Use the actual official dragon ball super site for info. Not wiki
Because it's painfully obvious that Kale and Broly have the same transformation.
They're both cash cows remade versions of Z Broly, Kale is U6 Broly.

Broly > Jiren, it's no use answering everyone like crazy based on their interpretations.
Broly is the most powerful enemy that goku has faced and that statement comes after the power tournament.
At the end of the DAY > Broly > JIREN.
GOGETA (BLUE FILM) > JIREN.
Bills: They surpassed me.
Jiren/Beerus > Granola > Angel Moro > Moro 73 > Broly

Beerus never said that why are you lying?
Or are you using trash promotional material again?
Cause Beerus said "He might be stronger than me" when talking about UIO3 Omen in the Scan preview for DBS 129.

UIO3 !!!! Not UI


Goku after having witnessed all 12 gods of destruction fight each other (if they were restricted they would be deleted according to DAISHINKAN): You can be even stronger than lord Bills, and lord bills is a god.
Funny how you don't take Goku's opinion to heart when he says Moro is tougher than Broly, or when he tells Whis he doesn't know of anyone stronger than Vegeta or himself and Whis agrees.

And as I said again, the level of power demonstrated in the film was the greatest ever seen in the work, that's stated.
The power demonstrated in the film was nothing special, Gogeta was impressive but Broly wasn't. He had worse feats than TV Special Jiren.

With the god of destruction bills mentioning that they "overtook me".
Again Beerus never said this.

And by the way, BASE BROLY + OZARU never lost to GOKU BLUE.
Yea Freeza killed Paragus for fun uh?
He was unable to overwhelm Blue Goku and that's plain obvious. So Freeza had to kill Paragus to give him a buff.

Goku and vegeta blue can't even move Broly from the place attacking TOGETHER.
I mean sure but SSBKK20,SSBE Vegeta and Android 17 couldn't do it either against Jiren, 3V1, and they were using their strongest moves so once again ... not impressive.

They can’t see the reality that broly is the goat
How is he the goat when he's weaker than Granola,Goku and Vegeta in U7 alone?
And that Beerus already stomped Vegeta to the ground nodiff?
 
Did you skip the part where they explain that UIO Goku's AP is nerfed because he cannot attack while thinking instinctively ? It's got nothing to do with PL. His PL is higher, he just cannot use that PL properly until UIO3.


His form isn't called SSJ Ikari.
It's just SSJ type C, same form as Kale, you can call it unofficial Legendary Super Saiyan too.
And even then why does it matter?
Base Kefla was just as strong as Ikari Broly, she used Super Saiyan Type C and still got beaten by UIO2, not UIO3, not complete UI, just the 2nd trigger of the form.

Kale's eyes were the same as Broly in her initial form, she just mastered her power to keep her sanity while Broly did not.



She had more power output because UIO2 Goku could not attack without thinking as Whis explained it.
Goku's actual PL wasn't lower than Kefla's.


Moro's range attacks are tied to his magic, not to FSF which isn't magic.
Moro needs to hit you to make FSF works so Piccolo/Goku don't think that Gogeta can go a whole fight with Moro 73 without getting hit (something he did vs Broly once he turned SSB)
Moro 73 > Broly
And UI Goku did what Piccolo/Goku thought would be impossible for Gogeta to achieve.


Because it's painfully obvious that Kale and Broly have the same transformation.
They're both cash cows remade versions of Z Broly, Kale is U6 Broly.


Jiren/Beerus > Granola > Angel Moro > Moro 73 > Broly

Beerus never said that why are you lying?
Or are you using trash promotional material again?
Cause Beerus said "He might be stronger than me" when talking about UIO3 Omen in the Scan preview for DBS 129.

UIO3 !!!! Not UI



Funny how you don't take Goku's opinion to heart when he says Moro is tougher than Broly, or when he tells Whis he doesn't know of anyone stronger than Vegeta or himself and Whis agrees.


The power demonstrated in the film was nothing special, Gogeta was impressive but Broly wasn't. He had worse feats than TV Special Jiren.


Again Beerus never said this.


Yea Freeza killed Paragus for fun uh?
He was unable to overwhelm Blue Goku and that's plain obvious. So Freeza had to kill Paragus to give him a buff.


I mean sure but SSBKK20,SSBE Vegeta and Android 17 couldn't do it either against Jiren, 3V1, and they were using their strongest moves so once again ... not impressive.


How is he the goat when he's weaker than Granola,Goku and Vegeta in U7 alone?
And that Beerus already stomped Vegeta to the ground nodiff?
Cap base kefla is not as strong as base ikari broly since both Goku and vegetas ssjblue form has increased since then

Can't attack without thinking. Ummm goku learns to do this with ui omen and yet from a power standpoint it is still weaker than mui. So no ui omen goku just didn't have the AP period

Bullshit. Jiren is weaker than than Moro since it took a stronger mui goku put him down in conparison to jiren. Unless you believe a meerus trained goku in the time chamber is using the same level of ui against jiren. Exactly bullshit
 
Did you skip the part where they explain that UIO Goku's AP is nerfed because he cannot attack while thinking instinctively ? It's got nothing to do with PL. His PL is higher, he just cannot use that PL properly until UIO3.


His form isn't called SSJ Ikari.
It's just SSJ type C, same form as Kale, you can call it unofficial Legendary Super Saiyan too.
And even then why does it matter?
Base Kefla was just as strong as Ikari Broly, she used Super Saiyan Type C and still got beaten by UIO2, not UIO3, not complete UI, just the 2nd trigger of the form.

Kale's eyes were the same as Broly in her initial form, she just mastered her power to keep her sanity while Broly did not.



She had more power output because UIO2 Goku could not attack without thinking as Whis explained it.
Goku's actual PL wasn't lower than Kefla's.


Moro's range attacks are tied to his magic, not to FSF which isn't magic.
Moro needs to hit you to make FSF works so Piccolo/Goku don't think that Gogeta can go a whole fight with Moro 73 without getting hit (something he did vs Broly once he turned SSB)
Moro 73 > Broly
And UI Goku did what Piccolo/Goku thought would be impossible for Gogeta to achieve.


Because it's painfully obvious that Kale and Broly have the same transformation.
They're both cash cows remade versions of Z Broly, Kale is U6 Broly.


Jiren/Beerus > Granola > Angel Moro > Moro 73 > Broly

Beerus never said that why are you lying?
Or are you using trash promotional material again?
Cause Beerus said "He might be stronger than me" when talking about UIO3 Omen in the Scan preview for DBS 129.

UIO3 !!!! Not UI



Funny how you don't take Goku's opinion to heart when he says Moro is tougher than Broly, or when he tells Whis he doesn't know of anyone stronger than Vegeta or himself and Whis agrees.


The power demonstrated in the film was nothing special, Gogeta was impressive but Broly wasn't. He had worse feats than TV Special Jiren.


Again Beerus never said this.


Yea Freeza killed Paragus for fun uh?
He was unable to overwhelm Blue Goku and that's plain obvious. So Freeza had to kill Paragus to give him a buff.


I mean sure but SSBKK20,SSBE Vegeta and Android 17 couldn't do it either against Jiren, 3V1, and they were using their strongest moves so once again ... not impressive.


How is he the goat when he's weaker than Granola,Goku and Vegeta in U7 alone?
And that Beerus already stomped Vegeta to the ground nodiff?
Pumpkins...
I won't argue with you anymore, I won't change your animal mind.
I've said too many facts here.
You are not able to debate DBS with me.
 
Cap base kefla is not as strong as base ikari broly since both Goku and vegetas ssjblue form has increased since then
I said around as strong.
You overestimate the time that passed inbetween ToP and the Movie.
Post Movie Goku still tells Merus that they are a lot of stronger people than himself and Vegeta in the universes.

Can't attack without thinking. Ummm goku learns to do this with ui omen and yet from a power standpoint it is still weaker than mui. So no ui omen goku just didn't have the AP period
UIO2 didn't have good AP except when going for a Kamehameha at blank point yes. That was the strategy he used against both Kefla and Jiren. Didn't work on the latter though.
UIO3 does have good AP towards the end though, during the Whis speech.

Bullshit. Jiren is weaker than than Moro since it took a stronger mui goku put him down in conparison to jiren. Unless you believe a meerus trained goku in the time chamber is using the same level of ui against jiren. Exactly bullshit
Moro got literally roflstomped and put near death by UI
Jiren ate everything and was unfazed in the manga and fought equally with UI in the anime
You can claim Angel Moro > Manga Jiren if you want, but Angel Moro is on a 30 seconds timer before he goes boom and once again, UI lvl AP hasn't been shown to be able to defeat Manga Jiren.

Pumpkins...
I won't argue with you anymore, I won't change your animal mind.
I've said too many facts here.
You are not able to debate DBS with me.
More like you got destroyed by FACTS and you're running away :suresure:

Where's Space Tarzan in all this ? :kobeha:
 
I said around as strong.
You overestimate the time that passed inbetween ToP and the Movie.
Post Movie Goku still tells Merus that they are a lot of stronger people than himself and Vegeta in the universes.


UIO2 didn't have good AP except when going for a Kamehameha at blank point yes. That was the strategy he used against both Kefla and Jiren. Didn't work on the latter though.
UIO3 does have good AP towards the end though, during the Whis speech.


Moro got literally roflstomped and put near death by UI
Jiren ate everything and was unfazed in the manga and fought equally with UI in the anime
You can claim Angel Moro > Manga Jiren if you want, but Angel Moro is on a 30 seconds timer before he goes boom and once again, UI lvl AP hasn't been shown to be able to defeat Manga Jiren.


More like you got destroyed by FACTS and you're running away :suresure:

Where's Space Tarzan in all this ? :kobeha:
I already answered that, the context has changed.
You really like to ignore things right?

Still, Broly is relevant enough to be mentioned while JIREN is not.


I've been debating DBS with JIREN and Bills fanboys who are 100x worse than you, but they say things with meaning. You don't even know how to speak. It's pointing KALE on the same pedestal as Broly, how crazy you are.

The first step in a good discussion is to be honest with yourself, without hurting your fanboyism.
But be honest it hurts you.


Broly > Jiren.


You can't change that, you can put MORO, granolah, above Broly, but your beloved character JIREN will never be superior to the race's legend who in his first fight without knowing how to fight, did something that JIREN, training his whole life, could not.
 
Still, Broly is relevant enough to be mentioned while JIREN is not.
Broly was never mentionned by Toyotaro why are you lying again?
No one cares about that an useless editor who said his power lvl is 100 to Toyo's 10 000 and to Toriyama's 100 000 thinks.
You think this editor matters? The real editor is TORIYAMA, he's the one who tells Toyo what he can or cannot do.

Toyo ignored Uchida's Broly bullcrap and said Granola,Goku and Vegeta are top 3 in U7.

Toyo wrote Whis telling Goku he doesnt know of anyone stronger than him and Vegeta in U7 (Same Whis that fought and clowned Broly)


I've been debating DBS with JIREN and Bills fanboys who are 100x worse than you, but they say things with meaning. You don't even know how to speak. It's pointing KALE on the same pedestal as Broly, how crazy you are.
The fact that you actually think you're sane and objective is the funniest thing about you lmao.

Beerus is a moving goalpost, he roflstomped a Vegeta who's stronger than Jiren

I could find you 384747474 sources that make every single villain from RoF Freeza onwards "stronger" than Beerus, no one cares about these trash sources because they're fake hype and retconned, just like your Goku line on Broly "probably" being stronger than Beerus that you keep clinging on to.

I did not put Kale on the same pedestal as Broly, I said she had the same transformation and that her asspull powers were no worse than Broly's.

The first step in a good discussion is to be honest with yourself, without hurting your fanboyism.
Lmaoooo the irony. You're a batshit crazy Broly fanboy. If Toyo came out and said Granola,Goku and Vegeta are the top 3 mortals in ALL THE UNIVERSES then I wouldn't say Jiren is stronger than them.
Unlike you who directly contradicts the author.

You can't change that, you can put MORO, granolah, above Broly, but your beloved character JIREN will never be superior to the race's legend who in his first fight without knowing how to fight, did something that JIREN, training his whole life, could not.
Like what?

-Fail to oneshot or k.o Freeza?

-Fail to put down SSB Goku and SSB Vegeta?

-Fail to land a single blow on SSB Gogeta?

-Get bailed out by the Dragon Balls?

Tf did Broly do in his movie that was so impressive? Literally nothing lol.

Also you're lying again, Paragus trained Broly his whole life and we see it in the movie
 
are you acting dumb on purpose???
Gronalo goku vegeta being 1 2 3 is because they are the current arc main characters and need to be hyped

Broly vs goku and vegeta showed us the clear huge gap between them and broly
Broly without the zenkai >>>>>>>>>>>>>>goku and vegeta

So broly after the zenkai is weaker than them?

Again goku put broly on beerus level
Beerus >>>>> goku and vegeta is a fact

so broly is >>>>>> goku and vegeta is a fact


Regarding Granola
The wish doesn’t make him the strongest forever , he’s the strongest at the time of the wish

broly is someone who grow and evolve insanely quickly during his fight. Thats a fact

even if granola is stronger now
Just give broly 5 minutes with him
He will evolve and destroy granola

So stop being a stubborn fool
It’s starting to become cringe
:mihugh:
 
Gronalo goku vegeta being 1 2 3 is because they are the current arc main characters and need to be hyped
>Literally a major plot point that Granola is the strongest in the universe
>Predicted by the oracle
>Saga centered around it
>Whis thinks Goku/Vegeta > Broly


The wish doesn’t make him the strongest forever , he’s the strongest at the time of the wish
So you agree that Granola>Broly as of right now? Alright I'll take it. No need to argue any further. I'll let you with your deluded "5 minutes to get stronger" stuff.
 
I said around as strong.
You overestimate the time that passed inbetween ToP and the Movie.
Post Movie Goku still tells Merus that they are a lot of stronger people than himself and Vegeta in the universes.


UIO2 didn't have good AP except when going for a Kamehameha at blank point yes. That was the strategy he used against both Kefla and Jiren. Didn't work on the latter though.
UIO3 does have good AP towards the end though, during the Whis speech.


Moro got literally roflstomped and put near death by UI
Jiren ate everything and was unfazed in the manga and fought equally with UI in the anime
You can claim Angel Moro > Manga Jiren if you want, but Angel Moro is on a 30 seconds timer before he goes boom and once again, UI lvl AP hasn't been shown to be able to defeat Manga Jiren.


More like you got destroyed by FACTS and you're running away :suresure:

Where's Space Tarzan in all this ? :kobeha:

Didnt over estimate it. It was clearly stated. They got even stronger than that in the Moro arc as well so from mui goku is way stronger than mui gplu from the t.o.p. So Moro is clearly above jiren.

Ahhh so you agree the ui omen didn't have extreme ap when against kelfa. Good boy. Infact him using a kamehameha point blank proves that. He needed it to be close enough to do damage.
 
Broly was never mentionned by Toyotaro why are you lying again?
No one cares about that an useless editor who said his power lvl is 100 to Toyo's 10 000 and to Toriyama's 100 000 thinks.
You think this editor matters? The real editor is TORIYAMA, he's the one who tells Toyo what he can or cannot do.

Toyo ignored Uchida's Broly bullcrap and said Granola,Goku and Vegeta are top 3 in U7.

Toyo wrote Whis telling Goku he doesnt know of anyone stronger than him and Vegeta in U7 (Same Whis that fought and clowned Broly)



The fact that you actually think you're sane and objective is the funniest thing about you lmao.

Beerus is a moving goalpost, he roflstomped a Vegeta who's stronger than Jiren

I could find you 384747474 sources that make every single villain from RoF Freeza onwards "stronger" than Beerus, no one cares about these trash sources because they're fake hype and retconned, just like your Goku line on Broly "probably" being stronger than Beerus that you keep clinging on to.

I did not put Kale on the same pedestal as Broly, I said she had the same transformation and that her asspull powers were no worse than Broly's.


Lmaoooo the irony. You're a batshit crazy Broly fanboy. If Toyo came out and said Granola,Goku and Vegeta are the top 3 mortals in ALL THE UNIVERSES then I wouldn't say Jiren is stronger than them.
Unlike you who directly contradicts the author.


Like what?

-Fail to oneshot or k.o Freeza?

-Fail to put down SSB Goku and SSB Vegeta?

-Fail to land a single blow on SSB Gogeta?

-Get bailed out by the Dragon Balls?

Tf did Broly do in his movie that was so impressive? Literally nothing lol.

Also you're lying again, Paragus trained Broly his whole life and we see it in the movie
The most powerful enemy GOKU has ever faced. I don't even need to show talent to say that Broly is superior to JIREN.

The film set a few months after the power tournament, Frieza was going to land without an army and with Broly based, facing GOKU and VEGETA, he got stronger. But the fact is that GOKU and VEGETA fighting together and much stronger than in the power tournament, fled from Broly, to make the merger, they reached a conclusion that even fighting together would not win Broly, and never individually.

The current Broly after ZENKAI is at least at the level of the movie's Gogeta Blue, both Moro and the current GOKU and VEGETA can't get LOW DIFF in the movie's GOGETA BLUE.

GOGETA BLUE from the movie is making DIFF download in JIREN. Reviewing the video, who mentions Broly is Victory Uchida, he talks to Toyotaro so he got confused.

But anyway, the information is relevant because Victory Uchida is the editor and has direct contact with Toriyama's information, as well as helping Toyotaro.

So to rectify: Toyotaro mentions Whis and Daishinkan, Victory Uchida says "Beerus" and Toyotaro repeats Beerus as if he agrees, and soon Victory runs over talking Broly too and they already change the topic.

While JIREN is passed.

Broly is the most powerful enemy GOKU has ever faced this statement is after the power tournament, and after GOKU has faced his weak enemy JIREN.

BROLY > REST Sayajin, including KALE.



About Broly training his whole life with his father, liar. Broly's father has 4200 power. Where the hell is this guy a worthy opponent for broly to evolve?
Freeza: They've experienced several battles so far (over Vegeta and Goku).
Freeza: But much more important than that, your son Broly never fought anyone else, right?
Broly's Dad: just simulated combat with me.
Freeza: Fighting someone with your fighting power is negligible.
Freeza: But don't worry he's getting used to this situation.


Goku: Fought Frieza in namekusei, was trained by lord KAIOH, saga cell, trained in the time room, fought cell, trained in the other world with lord KAIOH, fought Majin boo, was taught and trained by an angel he and vegeta, and you come to tell me that simulated combat with the father who has 4200 power is really a suitable training for someone who has never seriously fought in his life ?HAHAHAHAHAHA.... PARAGUSU IS A GENIO in combat like the WHIS right? You fucking trash.
 
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The most powerful enemy GOKU has ever faced. I don't even need to show talent to say that Broly is superior to JIREN.
Again you need to stop with this BS promotional nonsense.
The same thing is said about MORO and now you're ignoring it because Uchida the Broly fanboy brought him up and got ignored by Toyo.
This is not from Toriyama or Toyo.

The film set a few months after the power tournament, Frieza was going to land without an army and with Broly based, facing GOKU and VEGETA, he got stronger. But the fact is that GOKU and VEGETA fighting together and much stronger than in the power tournament, fled from Broly, to make the merger, they reached a conclusion that even fighting together would not win Broly, and never individually.
We have literally no timespan for when the film is set lol nice try.
Definitely doesn't feel like a few months when post movie Goku tells Merus about the other universes having much stronger people than him and Vegeta. (Notice how he talks about other universes and NOT U7).

The current Broly after ZENKAI is at least at the level of the movie's Gogeta Blue, both Moro and the current GOKU and VEGETA can't get LOW DIFF in the movie's GOGETA BLUE.
Current Broly is weaker than Granola,Goku and Vegeta as per Toyotaro's words. Why do you keep contradicting the author? Please tell me.

Uh? UI Goku > Gogeta from the movie.

In fact UI Goku from Moro Arc > Gogeta from Moro Arc according to Goku and Piccolo.


GOGETA BLUE from the movie is making DIFF download in JIREN. Reviewing the video, who mentions Broly is Victory Uchida, he talks to Toyotaro so he got confused.
Uchida mentions Beerus and Daishinkan which Toyo agrees with, then he says Broly and Toyo says NOTHING, then Toyo proceeds to say GRANOLA,GOKU and VEGETA are number 1,2 and 3 in the universe.
Toyo doesn't rate Broly that high, only Uchida the editor does, so the guy who describes himself as a 100 to Toyo's 10 000 and Toriyama's 100 000

But anyway, the information is relevant because Victory Uchida is the editor and has direct contact with Toriyama's information, as well as helping Toyotaro.
It's irrelevant because it is contradicted 30 seconds later by Toyo who says only Granola and possibly Vegeta are stronger than Goku amongst U7 mortals.

About Broly training his whole life with his father, liar. Broly's father has 4200 power. Where the hell is this guy a worthy opponent for broly to evolve?
Then you should have said he was badly trained maybe? That's still training.
 
Again you need to stop with this BS promotional nonsense.
The same thing is said about MORO and now you're ignoring it because Uchida the Broly fanboy brought him up and got ignored by Toyo.
This is not from Toriyama or Toyo.


We have literally no timespan for when the film is set lol nice try.
Definitely doesn't feel like a few months when post movie Goku tells Merus about the other universes having much stronger people than him and Vegeta. (Notice how he talks about other universes and NOT U7).


Current Broly is weaker than Granola,Goku and Vegeta as per Toyotaro's words. Why do you keep contradicting the author? Please tell me.

Uh? UI Goku > Gogeta from the movie.

In fact UI Goku from Moro Arc > Gogeta from Moro Arc according to Goku and Piccolo.



Uchida mentions Beerus and Daishinkan which Toyo agrees with, then he says Broly and Toyo says NOTHING, then Toyo proceeds to say GRANOLA,GOKU and VEGETA are number 1,2 and 3 in the universe.
Toyo doesn't rate Broly that high, only Uchida the editor does, so the guy who describes himself as a 100 to Toyo's 10 000 and Toriyama's 100 000


It's irrelevant because it is contradicted 30 seconds later by Toyo who says only Granola and possibly Vegeta are stronger than Goku amongst U7 mortals.


Then you should have said he was badly trained maybe? That's still training.
:laughmoji::laughmoji::laughmoji::laughmoji::laughmoji:
 
SSBKK20 + SSBE Vegeta + 17 vs Jiren

Result = Jiren wrecks all 3 of them at once and their combined ultimate attack, ALL DEFEATED and their asses on the ground.

Bwoly vs SSB Goku and Vegeta (no SSBE,no KK)

Result = Broly fails to land any significant blow on either of them, fails to k.o them, fails to injure them, fails to catch them.

Jiren vs Golden Freeza

Result = Jiren oneshots him in one punch, Freeza goes to sleep and loses Golden.

Broly vs Golden Freeza

Result = Broly beats him up for 1 hour and can't kill him, k.o him, or badly injure him.



Honestly how can you even compare this fodder Broly to Jiren at this point? There are 394498483847474 Galaxies separing their feats
 
SSBKK20 + SSBE Vegeta + 17 vs Jiren

Result = Jiren wrecks all 3 of them at once and their combined ultimate attack, ALL DEFEATED and their asses on the ground.

Bwoly vs SSB Goku and Vegeta (no SSBE,no KK)

Result = Broly fails to land any significant blow on either of them, fails to k.o them, fails to injure them, fails to catch them.

Jiren vs Golden Freeza

Result = Jiren oneshots him in one punch, Freeza goes to sleep and loses Golden.

Broly vs Golden Freeza

Result = Broly beats him up for 1 hour and can't kill him, k.o him, or badly injure him.



Honestly how can you even compare this fodder Broly to Jiren at this point? There are 394498483847474 Galaxies separing their feats
Result = Broly fails to land any significant blow on either of them, fails to k.o them, fails to injure them, fails to catch them.
Is that why they ran away from Broly? Plus the broly got them, yes, he got goku by the leg. And the statement can be found in Broly's NOVEL.


According to Freeza himself there was no warrior in the universe capable of defeating Broly, that includes JIREN.
 
Is that why they ran away from Broly? Plus the broly got them, yes, he got goku by the leg.
What a trash ass feat "they ran from him urrr"

He couldn't injure them, nor catch them, nor do anything remotely impressive.

Can't run in ToP, you have to fight, no coping out or Goku and Vegeta wouldve jumped from the stage willingly otherwise for a break from Jiren's overwhelming power.

Fact is that Jiren defeated

-SSBKK20 Goku (multiple times)
-SSBE Vegeta (multiple times)
-17
-Freeza
-A combination of all these characters at once
-Hit
-UI Omen Goku (twice)
-UI Goku (once before friendship power-up)


And Broly defeated
-Nobody lol, absolutely NOBODY
 
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