Anime & Manga Vergo's right ankle is harder than Katakuri's block mochi as per the hardness of Sanji's bones (lol, u think Kuri has Vergo level haki) :):)

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critical mindset

#86
Charlotte Donut was bleeding from a random G2 kick
It wasn't even G2, it was just a regular kick though with armament imbued. Katakuri, being as slow as he is, Luffy could dodge and kicked him right on the chin, which made him spit reams of blood, more than Vergo from an enraged hit with DJ that has around G3 level in just attack power, disregarding the effects the internal fire has on Vergo's body...


Luffy did in fact not manage to land any G2 attack throughout the fight owing to Kata's evasiveness
 

Lion of Olympus

The Prince of Power
#87
It wasn't even G2, it was just a regular kick though with armament imbued. Katakuri, being as slow as he is, Luffy could dodge and kicked him right on the chin, which made him spit reams of blood, more than Vergo from an enraged hit with DJ that has around G3 level in just attack power, disregarding the effects the internal fire has on Vergo's body...


Luffy did in fact not manage to land any G2 attack throughout the fight owing to Kata's evasiveness
Oh yeah, that’s right! That makes mochi boy look even worse :milaugh:
 
C

critical mindset

#89
Not even gonna entertain such a dumb thread.....if you tag me at least make it something worthwhile with actual logic :/
@critical mindset
What exactly is your objection?

We have Katakuri with Block Mochi not being able to replicate Sanji's feat.

Sanji has a high level of base leg bone hardness that Kata does not. Kata does not have Sanji's base strength level or hardness

Oda emphasises specifically the hardness of Sanji's leg bone combined with haki > harder than Kata's block mochi.

Vergo's right ankle was enough to fucking destroy Sanji's leg bone that was augmented with haki.

This is the fucking differnce between Katakuri and Vergo who is the arc villain that needed a multi billion buster attack and had a whole arc dedicated to him
 
#90
It wasn't even G2, it was just a regular kick though with armament imbued. Katakuri, being as slow as he is, Luffy could dodge and kicked him right on the chin, which made him spit reams of blood, more than Vergo from an enraged hit with DJ that has around G3 level in just attack power, disregarding the effects the internal fire has on Vergo's body...


Luffy did in fact not manage to land any G2 attack throughout the fight owing to Kata's evasiveness

this moment does not count
he can't use CoO
luffy counter attack at the same second
:kata:
and that kick and blood did nothing





and kata is slow now ?
what luffy did here
Vergo try to do the same thing on smoker here
but the difference is both can use CoO

and ?



Vergo is fucking slow
his only way is to counter attack and that counter attack got counter attack from smoker and sanji
:goatasure:

talk about speed

luffy snake man was super fast that kata could not use his future sight to dodge or creat spaces in his body !





this is a pure CoO not that shit with luffy and angry kata
 
#92
Diable Jambe already is already in the same ballpark as G3 level of damage output disregarding the effect of internal fire.
Doflamingo used his Spiderweb to block a solid sized Elephant Gun meanwhile he used his coat to block Sanji's spamming attack.
Imagine Doflamingo blocking Luffy's Elephant Gun Gatling by using his hakiless coat.

That's how fucking silly your assertion is.

We just need to compare the damage output from Sanji's DJ to that of Luffy's Grizzly Magnum that was at full power where two enraged DJ hits make this impact on the wall made of solid steel
No, you cannot compare Sanji's environmental damage with G3's when it comes to walls.
Besides, Luffy's Elephant Gun Gatling destroyed huge chunks of noah which was half the size of fishman island. It vastly shits on Sanji's mosquito AP.

Let Sanji surpass Luffy's G2 AP first, then we can talk.

Grizzly Magnum slammed Caesar into the wall where the crack propogation that I have highlighted means it was not an immediate but a stepwise fracturing process of the wall.
Do you actually realise that Luffy's Grizzly Magnum managed to do this with Pica's head:


And do you also realise the amount of mass and density of said steel wall which Luffy's Grizzly Magnum destroyed? Sanji destroyed a tiny part of said steel wall which is shit compared to the door Luffy destroyed.

Btw, Luffy didn't only destroy the wall, he sent Caesar's ass - whose body was massively boosted by the lethal gas - flying through the ENTIRE facility:


The sheer force was so impactful, chunks of said steel wall, which you highlighted were cracked "very slowly" at first, were flying away in result as well:


Caesar flew so fast, he damaged a tank when he crashed into it.
It is sooo ludicrously wrong to say Sanji's mosquito AP is as strong as Luffy's strongest G3 attack. You are wrong to such an extent, it is just amusing to highlight the flaws in your argument.

as seen here Caesar flew though an air chute, the wall was not even that thick
Define how the wall "was not even that thick".
The wall was thick enough to dwarf the width of Luffy's G3 finger which demonstrate that the steel wall had solid mass and density. Once again a pure conjecture.

What's that panel supposed to tell me about the Viz translation saying that it's steel and not iron? Steel IS harder than iron which makes this feat even better.

Sanji with the impact of his DJ kicks never pushed Vergo into the wall like Luffy did Caesar, but it was just the momentum imparted onto Vergo that broke through the wall.
Do you realise what you are talking about, humpty dumpty? Luffy's Grizzly Magnum sent Caesar's ass, who received a good PU with the lethal gas, through a massive steel wall and THEN through the facility in which the sole momentum imparted onto Caesar destroyed the tank of the ship outside the facility.
Meanwhile, DJ Sanji's attack force only caused a tiny hole in the steel wall in which Vergo crashed onto.

In addition, you are comparing feats of two different environmental circumstances which are totally different. You have to bring a feat of DJ Sanji crashing someone onto the steel wall and causing the same destruction just with the momentum said character flew into the steel wall and you would have a point.
Since those two circumstantial feats in terms of environmental damage on steel are not quite comparable, Sanji's AP is still dogshit compared to G3, let alone Snake Man, let alone Bound Man.

By the way, Luffy's Thor Elephant Gun reshaped Don Chinjao's head in its original shape although the latter USED and CLASHED against Luffy's Thor Elephant Gun.

If you want, you can think that DJ Sanji slightly cracking Luffy's head is impressive meanwhile Luffy's G3 fucking reshaped the head of a veteran like Don Chinjao who attacked as well and built full momentum lol.

Hell Memories which would be a more powered up version of DJ was able of making Wadatsumi's head cave into his body
Wadatsumi inflated air into his body; Jinbe punched lots of air outta Wadatsumi's body before Sanji even hit him.

I have to say, Hell's Memories looked impressive and that was the only impressive AP feat of Sanji but THAT feat is highly irrelevant since Sanji never used that move ever again against his opponents.

Nice try but you have to try harder.

with the way the fat overlaps, and wadatsumi is still an overinflated ball that is armoured with air pressure, which means it is immune to blunt damage, but Sanji nevertheless makes his whole body cave in like this which speaks volumes of his AP in this mode.
What? This makes Wadatsumi highly resistant to blunt force but he ain't immune lmao.
Luffy is a literal rubber human and even he AIN'T completely immune to blunt force.

Wadatsumi's durability was just huge shit despite being an overinflated ball in which Sanji kicked with all his might into his body. The way how Wadatsumi's head was bounced into his body is self-explanary.
Cracker was literally sucked into Tank Man's body whilst Cracker didn't deal jackshit to Tank Man's body - and Wadatsumi's overinflated body was much more than Tank Man. Yet again, this proves nothing at all.

The fact that Wadatsumi is knocked out and spitting out blood again is confirmation that Sanji damages internally
No shit.
Wadatsumi's entire body took fire and Sanji's literally kicked Wadatsumi's head a bit into the body. I guess Katakuri internally damaged Luffy as well when he hit Luffy's hit in which he was spitting out blood lol.

So your follow up with Doffy is stupid.
Stop spewing nonsense.

He uses haki to block Luffy and looks casual while doing it, while he looks anxious when confronted with Sanji, puts up no haki block and just blocks with raw power, seemingly not effected by the internal fire either?
False.
He looked casual at first but his facial expressions suddenly changed when he saw Bound Man's tensile force:


And his ass was sent flying which clearly shows how Doflamingo was fucked up.

Doflamingo did not look anxious when confronting Sanji, he was laughing consistently and mocked Sanji for his weak AP meanwhile he used HARDENING on Luffy's non-hardening Jet Gatling which is an inferior version to Hawk Gatling.
Besides, where was Doflamingo looking casual when Luffy hit him with Red Hawk:


Even that was superficial at best, although Doflamingo was hit off guard and the fire completely went through his body looking at the fire blast behind Doffy's back.

Yes, Doflamingo was NOT affected by Sanji's DJ. No Haki, just a superficial block, considering that Doflamingo easily stopped DJ Sanji's kick momentum with his own hakiless leg.

That's your implication and it is stupid when we see how much damage output DJ packs, on the level or bordering on G3 attack power, so he did not block it in a manner he did against Luffy, considering the fact he called Sanji powerful but never did to Luffy, an additional information that again suggests he used barrier haki to block, which we now know is a thing and common in the NW.
That's not my implication; that's what happened in the manga you disingenuous troll.
Looking how hard you try to argue against facts, it's just pure entertainment lol.

Exactly, we can see how much damage output DJ packs = mosquito AP. Hence nothing.
True, he didn't block it in a manner he did against Luffy, he neither used Haki nor was he more serious = mosquito AP once again.
He was mocking Sanji meanwhile Luffy actually hurt Doflamingo superficially = Sanji's AP is weak.

No, he did not use barrier Haki. Doflamingo doesn't have barrier Haki and if so, post the panel which says he has it.
Yet again, this is not that common in the NW, it may be common in Wano but only a few have barrier Haki. Doflamingo is not part of them. If so, Luffy would have brought Doflamingo's Haki as a reference when he learned about barrier Haki just like he did when he saw Katakuri's awakening.

Burden of proof is on you to prove that Doflamingo has barrier Haki. And please no "Look how Sanji's fire was blocked!" blabla. We went through that fiasco a lot.

No need to bullshit your way
Considering that Vergo's no 1 fangirl comes up with his "Doffy has barrier Haki" blabla, I will gladly keep "bullshitting" my way.

as Sanji demonstrates both internal fire and G3 level damage output with DJ
No.

so it is the most natural to assume DD used barrier haki here, as we even see the fire dispersed in a manner that suggests he uses it.
No, it your absolute critical mindset (haha) to assume DD used barrier Haki here when he doesn't even have barrier Haki.
The fire of Luffy's Red hawk was dispersed when Katakuri clashed against it. Katakuri has barrier Haki? lol

To see what a difference the block mochi makes in taking and absorbing those hits we need only to look at this instance of a direct hit from just a regular kick by Luffy who was far from being even in a good shape at this point
Again with this nonsense?
Did we not go through this crap a few weeks ago?

I'll just copy & paste my old stuff again:

No, that panel simply highlighted the fact that Luffy was finally able to land a hit and injuring Katakuri in process.

That's why you see this
"He didn't dodge?!! My kick landed!!!"

And furthermore

That's why Luffy said "I'm starting to understand... your powers!" and not "Wow! My kick injured him that much".
Once again, the author's intention was to highlight the fact that Luffy managed to land a hit and not how much he damaged him.

The VC even calls out Oven as more durable for his body, even tying it to inherited durabiltiy from BM, and @PuckTheGreat is the one that translated those parts from the VC.
Idgaf about what the VC said about Oven's durability.

Dude's collarbone was broken by Sanji's base kick meanwhile Katakuri managed to endure 3 Bound Man hits without falling on the ground.

Before you come up with irrelevant blabla, let me repeat myself again:

And how exactly it is a fact that Oven inherited Big Mom's toughness? She can effortlessly block a Kong Gun, could Oven do the same?

Listen, only because it is stated in the databook, doesn't mean it's 100% true in the manga as well. They can make mistakes as well and as far as Oven showed feats, his feats are a bunch of dogshit compared to even Katakuri.
It is more likely that Katakuri inherited Big Mom's body than Oven. He is the strongest child and he will lead the Big Mom pirates later.

After taking three combo hits from Bound Man

... He was still standing onto the ground, regaining is composure whilst that garbage tier Oven took a single hit from base Sanji and ended up like that

Meanwhile, a heavily exhausted and worn out Luffy - after fighting a third commander for 11h - managed to tank that many hits

He is fully tanking ALL attacks with no defense whatsoever.

When it was Luffy's turn, that's how much his casual gum gum pistol damaged Sanji



Katakuri was enduring attacks which sent a tanky character like Doflamingo flying a few kilometers into the city, several times! And he has less toughness than that Oven trash tier? Fuck outta here lol.

All of that stuff disproves your assertions and it also explains this point:

Katakuri without block mochi just his regular base durability would not fare as well and be able to handle the travails of Oven in WCI, as Katakuri is someone that relies on evasiveness and hardened mochi, while Oven just goes about being naturally durable.
Yes, he would have.

Even if Oven genetically inherited Big Mom's durability, Katakuri seemingly surpassed his brother by sheer training and self-discipline as he was taking Rhino Schneider WITHOUT his guard and was still on the ground:


Katakuri's resisting such an overwhelming force and managed to mantain his balance which is a demonstration of his tankiness. And we are talking about a force which is magnitudes above everything what Sanji can offer.

It is clear as day that Katakuri outclasses most of his siblings in durability, strength speed and other physical skills. Meanwhile, only Cracker can match or even surpass his feats - and that's due to his biscuit soldiers, hence not even Cracker himself.
Smoothie is featless but everyone else look like shit in front of Katakuri - and that's how the manga thoroughly portrayed him after all. They didn't hype him up for nothing.

So this highlights the difference between Katakuri, Oven and Vergo
True, Katakuri >>>>>>> Vergo > Oven.
Unlike you, I have at least the dignity to not completely shit on Vergo by saying he loses to weaker characters. Because that's what you are doing by comparing Vergo with an opponent vastly stronger than him.
 
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Light D Lamperouge

𝖂𝖍𝖆𝖙 𝕮𝖔𝖚𝖑𝖉 𝕳𝖆𝖛𝖊 𝕭𝖊𝖊𝖓
#93
Doflamingo used his Spiderweb to block a solid sized Elephant Gun meanwhile he used his coat to block Sanji's spamming attack.
Imagine Doflamingo blocking Luffy's Elephant Gun Gatling by using his hakiless coat.

That's how fucking silly your assertion is.



No, you cannot compare Sanji's environmental damage with G3's when it comes to walls.
Besides, Luffy's Elephant Gun Gatling destroyed huge chunks of noah which was half the size of fishman island. It vastly shits on Sanji's mosquito AP.

Let Sanji surpass Luffy's G2 AP first, then we can talk.



Do you actually realise that Luffy's Grizzly Magnum managed to do this with Pica's head:


And do you also realise the amount of mass and density of said steel wall which Luffy's Grizzly Magnum destroyed? Sanji destroyed a tiny part of said steel wall which is shit compared to the door Luffy destroyed.

Btw, Luffy didn't only destroy the wall, he sent Caesar's ass - whose body was massively boosted by the lethal gas - flying through the ENTIRE facility:


The sheer force was so impactful, chunks of said steel wall, which you highlighted were cracked "very slowly" at first, were flying away in result as well:


Caesar flew so fast, he damaged a tank when he crashed into it.
It is sooo ludicrously wrong to say Sanji's mosquito AP is as strong as Luffy's strongest G3 attack. You are wrong to such an extent, it is just amusing to highlight the flaws in your argument.



Define how the wall "was not even that thick".
The wall was thick enough to dwarf the width of Luffy's G3 finger which demonstrate that the steel wall had solid mass and density. Once again a pure conjecture.

What's that panel supposed to tell me about the Viz translation saying that it's steel and not iron? Steel IS harder than iron which makes this feat even better.



Do you realise what you are talking about? Luffy's Grizzly Magnum sent Caesar's ass, who received a good PU with the lethal gas, through a massive steel wall and THEN through the facility in which the sole momentum imparted onto Caesar destroyed the tank of the ship outside the facility.
Meanwhile, DJ Sanji's attack force only caused a tiny hole in the steel wall in which Vergo crashed onto.

In addition, you are comparing feats of two different environmental circumstances which are totally different. You have to bring a feat of DJ Sanji crashing someone onto the steel wall and causing the same destruction just with the momentum said character flew into the steel wall and you would have a point.
Since those two circumstantial feats in terms of environmental damage on steel are not quite comparable, Sanji's AP is still dogshit compared to G3, let alone Snake Man, let alone Bound Man.

By the way, Luffy's Thor Elephant Gun reshaped Don Chinjao's head in its original shape although the latter USED and CLASHED against Luffy's Thor Elephant Gun.

If you want, you can think that DJ Sanji slightly cracking Luffy's head is impressive meanwhile Luffy's G3 fucking reshaped the head of a veteran like Don Chinjao who attacked as well and built full momentum lol.



Wadatsumi inflated air into his body; Jinbe punched lots of air outta Wadatsumi's body before Sanji even hit him.

I have to say, Hell's Memories looked impressive and that was the only impressive AP feat of Sanji but THAT feat is highly irrelevant since Sanji never used that move ever again against his opponents.

Nice try but you have to try harder.



What? This makes Wadatsumi highly resistant to blunt force but he ain't immune lmao.
Luffy is a literal rubber human and even he AIN'T completely immune to blunt force.

Wadatsumi's durability was just huge shit despite being an overinflated ball in which Sanji kicked with all his might into his body. The way how Wadatsumi's head was bounced into his body is self-explanary.
Cracker was literally sucked into Tank Man's body whilst Cracker didn't deal jackshit to Tank Man's body - and Wadatsumi's overinflated body was much more than Tank Man. Yet again, this proves nothing at all.



No shit.
Wadatsumi's entire body took fire and Sanji's literally kicked Wadatsumi's head a bit into the body. I guess Katakuri internally damaged Luffy as well when he hit Luffy's hit in which he was spitting out blood lol.



Stop spewing nonsense.



False.
He looked casual at first but his facial expressions suddenly changed when he saw Bound Man's tensile force:


And his ass was sent flying which clearly shows how Doflamingo was fucked up.

Doflamingo did not look anxious when confronting Sanji, he was laughing consistently and mocked Sanji for his weak AP meanwhile he used HARDENING on Luffy's non-hardening Jet Gatling which is an inferior version to Hawk Gatling.
Besides, where was Doflamingo looking casual when Luffy hit him with Red Hawk:


Even that was superficial at best, although Doflamingo was hit off guard and the fire completely went through his body looking at the fire blast behind Doffy's back.

Yes, Doflamingo was NOT affected by Sanji's DJ. No Haki, just a superficial block, considering that Doflamingo easily stopped DJ Sanji's kick momentum with his own hakiless leg.



That's not my implication; that's what happened in the manga you disingenuous troll.
Looking how hard you try to argue against facts, it's just pure entertainment lol.

Exactly, we can see how much damage output DJ packs = mosquito AP. Hence nothing.
True, he didn't block it in a manner he did against Luffy, he neither used Haki nor was he more serious = mosquito AP once again.
He was mocking Sanji meanwhile Luffy actually hurt Doflamingo superficially = Sanji's AP is weak.

No, he did not use barrier Haki. Doflamingo doesn't have barrier Haki and if so, post the panel which says he has it.
Yet again, this is not that common in the NW, it may be common in Wano but only a few have barrier Haki. Doflamingo is not part of them. If so, Luffy would have brought Doflamingo's Haki as a reference when he learned about barrier Haki just like he did when he saw Katakuri's awakening.

Burden of proof is on you to prove that Doflamingo has barrier Haki. And please no "Look how Sanji's fire was blocked!" blabla. We went through that fiasco a lot.



Considering that Vergo's no 1 fangirl comes up with his "Doffy has barrier Haki" blabla, I will gladly keep "bullshitting" my way.



No.



No, it your absolute critical mindset (haha) to assume DD used barrier Haki here when he doesn't even have barrier Haki.
The fire of Luffy's Red hawk was dispersed when Katakuri clashed against it. Katakuri has barrier Haki? lol



Again with this nonsense?
Did we not go through this crap a few weeks ago?

I'll just copy & paste my old stuff again:

No, that panel simply highlighted the fact that Luffy was finally able to land a hit and injuring Katakuri in process.

That's why you see this
"He didn't dodge?!! My kick landed!!!"

And furthermore

That's why Luffy said "I'm starting to understand... your powers!" and not "Wow! My kick injured him that much".
Once again, the author's intention was to highlight the fact that Luffy managed to land a hit and not how much he damaged him.



Idgaf about what the VC said about Oven's durability.

Dude's collarbone was broken by Sanji's base kick meanwhile Katakuri managed to endure 3 Bound Man hits without falling on the ground.

Before you come up with irrelevant blabla, let me repeat myself again:

And how exactly it is a fact that Oven inherited Big Mom's toughness? She can effortlessly block a Kong Gun, could Oven do the same?

Listen, only because it is stated in the databook, doesn't mean it's 100% true in the manga as well. They can make mistakes as well and as far as Oven showed feats, his feats are a bunch of dogshit compared to even Katakuri.
It is more likely that Katakuri inherited Big Mom's body than Oven. He is the strongest child and he will lead the Big Mom pirates later.

After taking three combo hits from Bound Man

... He was still standing onto the ground, regaining is composure whilst that garbage tier Oven took a single hit from base Sanji and ended up like that

Meanwhile, a heavily exhausted and worn out Luffy - after fighting a third commander for 11h - managed to tank that many hits

He is fully tanking ALL attacks with no defense whatsoever.

When it was Luffy's turn, that's how much his casual gum gum pistol damaged Sanji



Katakuri was enduring attacks which sent a tanky character like Doflamingo flying a few kilometers into the city, several times! And he has less toughness than that Oven trash tier? Fuck outta here lol.

All of that stuff disproves your assertions and it also explains this point:



Yes, he would have.

Even if Oven genetically inherited Big Mom's durability, Katakuri seemingly surpassed his brother by sheer training and self-discipline as he was taking Rhino Schneider WITHOUT his guard and was still on the ground:


Katakuri's resisting such an overwhelming force and managed to mantain his balance which is a demonstration of his tankiness. And we are talking about a force which is magnitudes above everything what Sanji can offer.

It is clear as day that Katakuri outclasses most of his siblings in durability, strength speed and other physical skills. Meanwhile, only Cracker can match or even surpass his feats - and that's due to his biscuit soldiers, hence not even Cracker himself.
Smoothie is featless but everyone else look like shit in front of Katakuri - and that's how the manga thoroughly portrayed him after all. They didn't hype him up for nothing.



True, Katakuri >>>>>>> Vergo > Oven.
Unlike you, I have at least the dignity to not completely shit on Vergo by saying he loses to weaker characters. Because that's what you are doing by comparing Vergo with an opponent vastly stronger than him.
Vergo>Dogtooth lol.







I hope you know I am joking Sentinel by giving you a one liner in response to that essay lmfao.
 
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