Future Events Will Shiryu sneak attack Ben?

[ShadowStyle369]

Wrong. Sanji didn't need the noise.

He went invisible and immediately gained height to use collier coup.

Collier coup is an attack that needs height. It's usually part of his finishing blows. A final barrage if you will.

There was 0 pause or hesitation. As shown in the chapter

We can see that queen notices osome and decided to use soru to attack osome before sanji reaches the ceiling. As shown here

Spoiler: Queen attacking osome using soru

So queens already Using soru. He's blitzing osome.

Spoiler: Sanji talking to himself while queens using soru

While queens running towards osome mid blitz attack.... sanji has a whole conversation with himself and then finally attacks queen.

The truth of the matter is that sanji never once hesitated. He gained height to use collier coup as soon as queen went invisible.

He combined all his powers while moving so fast that queens shave attack appeared in slow motion to him.

People have a hard time following panels. So I get it. Oda doesn't help either. He can be pretty jumbled in his paneling


There's a misconception that coo doesn't include sound. Coo was described as having sound as part of it. All the senses. Including sound. Rayleigh said sound specifically.

This is no way downplays sanji. It's still coo.

Also are we all forgetting absalom? Sanji handled invisibility pre ts. Multiple times. Let's not act like this is new to him

Uhh I’m not trying to downplay sanji I’m simply saying I wonder if fs is necessary to beat invisible people I went back and checked absalom what lead to his defeat was sanji got stabbed in the back and absalom stepped in the blood sanji was able to grab him remove the knife and then defeat him. Against queen the sound was emphasized manga and anime sanji no doubt heard the creaking noise as well which would help him locate queen. Garp there was no sound emphasis but he just started moving to protect koby as if he saw the future.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Uhh I’m not trying to downplay sanji I’m simply saying I wonder if fs is necessary to beat invisible people I went back and checked absalom what lead to his defeat was sanji got stabbed in the back and absalom stepped in the blood sanji was able to grab him remove the knife and then defeat him. Against queen the sound was emphasized manga and anime sanji no doubt heard the creaking noise as well which would help him locate queen. Garp there was no sound emphasis but he just started moving to protect koby as if he saw the future.

There was a sound emphasis. Oda had a sound effect of a sword unsheathing on shiryus panel.

The sound effects mean nothing to it because it really makes no sense how characters like Coby and osome didnt hear them when they’re being targeted. Or how when queen was talking to Sanji that sound didn’t give his location away but a few footsteps did

 

[ShadowStyle369]

There was a sound emphasis. Oda had a sound effect of a sword unsheathing on shiryus panel.

The sound effects mean nothing to it because it really makes no sense how characters like Coby and osome didnt hear them when they’re being targeted. Or how when queen was talking to Sanji that sound didn’t give his location away but a few footsteps did

Uhh where exactly is a sound with shiryu I dont see that anywhere in the chapter? Also as dumb as it sounds it makes sense vs absalom there was talking and yet sanji couldn’t find him it was only when he stepped in his blood that sanji grabbed him… would it not be no difference for queen he heard his footsteps going towards osome and he catches him there.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Uhh where exactly is a sound with shiryu I dont see that anywhere in the chapter? Also as dumb as it sounds it makes sense vs absalom there was talking and yet sanji couldn’t find him it was only when he stepped in his blood that sanji grabbed him… would it not be no difference for queen he heard his footsteps going towards osome and he catches him there.

It’s on the same page as Garp getting stabbed. Row above it far left panel “Shwing!”

And it’s not dumb because noise doesn’t give away location and never has. Sanji and Garp used haki to find their location and bypass the invisibility.

 

[ShadowStyle369]

It’s on the same page as Garp getting stabbed. Row above it far left panel “Shwing!”

And it’s not dumb because noise doesn’t give away location and never has. Sanji and Garp used haki to find their location and bypass the invisibility.

So absalom footstep didn’t give away his location be sanji ?

It’s on the same page as Garp getting stabbed. Row above it far left panel “Shwing!”

And it’s not dumb because noise doesn’t give away location and never has. Sanji and Garp used haki to find their location and bypass the invisibility.

I hear ya but oda isn’t just including the sounds for nothing against absalom there is a splak (step in blood) leading to sanji being able to locate and grab him… all the way up to his final attack on queen is the emphasis on creek even in the anime they back up this logic… garp on the other hand is already moving to protect koby now I don’t know exactly which panel has the sword sheath removal but I’m just simply employing that maybe garp saw the future is all .

 

[BlackLegFring]

I agree. It's just that prime Shiryu is being scaled by the narrative of "defeating Ben" and being Zoro's opponent, hence asking whether it makes sense to scale him like this without taking into account that he sneaks into people.

Abilities should always be taken into account. Even if Shiryu has weaker attack power than his opponent but can win with his sneaking around, then I’d say it’s fair to scale him to them.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

So absalom footstep didn’t give away his location be sanji ?

I hear ya but oda isn’t just including the sounds for nothing against absalom there is a splak (step in blood) leading to sanji being able to locate and grab him… all the way up to his final attack on queen is the emphasis on creek even in the anime they back up this logic… garp on the other hand is already moving to protect koby now I don’t know exactly which panel has the sword sheath removal but I’m just simply employing that maybe garp saw the future is all .

There’s no emphasis on that footstep tho, there was more emphasis on the speech which didn’t give queens location away. Just its existence. It’s the exact same as Garp.

And Its really just you agree both used haki or neither did because the occasions aren’t any different. And judging by Coby and Osome not hearing or noticing the attacks it’s clear that it’s because of haki that overcomes invisibility.

 

[ShadowStyle369]

There’s no emphasis on that footstep tho, there was more emphasis on the speech which didn’t give queens location away. Just its existence. It’s the exact same as Garp.

And Its really just you agree both used haki or neither did because the occasions aren’t any different. And judging by Coby and Osome not hearing or noticing the attacks it’s clear that it’s because of haki that overcomes invisibility.

Speech has never given away invisible people though? Sanji and absalom talked and nothing came from it only at the moment that absalom stepped in the blood was his presence given away… same for queen but possibly different from garp as he was already moving I’m not disagreeing that haki is ultimately what is used in defeating a invisible person more so that if u don’t have fs u have to rely on the person giving away there location like absalom did or queen did… I could be wrong though

 

[MonsterKaido]

He will behead lenn leckman

 

[ShadowStyle369]

There’s no emphasis on that footstep tho, there was more emphasis on the speech which didn’t give queens location away. Just its existence. It’s the exact same as Garp.

And Its really just you agree both used haki or neither did because the occasions aren’t any different. And judging by Coby and Osome not hearing or noticing the attacks it’s clear that it’s because of haki that overcomes invisibility.

Just to add I just checked viz and saw the sound…. Garp was already moving before shiryu unsheathed his blade does that not back up the notion that garp used fs and saw that koby was gonna get stabbed ? While sanji who doesn’t have fs yet needed to rely on the sound ?

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Speech has never given away invisible people though? Sanji and absalom talked and nothing came from it only at the moment that absalom stepped in the blood was his presence given away… same for queen but possibly different from garp as he was already moving I’m not disagreeing that haki is ultimately what is used in defeating a invisible person more so that if u don’t have fs u have to rely on the person giving away there location like absalom did or queen did… I could be wrong though

Yes and oda went out of his way to show Sanji acknowledge absaloms step in thriller bark. However in Wano oda went out of his way to show Sanji understood Queens internal dialogue And queens intentions. That’s a pretty drastic difference because the intentions part is a main essence of haki.

Oda even did this same thing with Garp where when Garp caught shiryu he understood shiryus intentions.

Future sight is just one advanced use of CoO however, those without future sight can have greater detection ability (enel being able to perfectly sense everyone on an island Fujitora being blind but being able to detect all pirates on dressrosa and Sanji having better ability to detect people than Luffy).

Future sight isn’t needed just good CoO. Not everyone with FS will be able to sense invisible people and vice versa.

 

[Malio]

Breaking News: A murderous killer uses underhanded tactics to hurt/kill people. Some Worstgen members are surprised

 

[Soyz]

Uhh I’m not trying to downplay sanji I’m simply saying I wonder if fs is necessary to beat invisible people I went back and checked absalom what lead to his defeat was sanji got stabbed in the back and absalom stepped in the blood sanji was able to grab him remove the knife and then defeat him. Against queen the sound was emphasized manga and anime sanji no doubt heard the creaking noise as well which would help him locate queen. Garp there was no sound emphasis but he just started moving to protect koby as if he saw the future.

Sanjj hit an attack called neck shot, he wouldn't been able to know where queens neck is based on noise, he was able to detect him.

 

[Just a member]

His sneak attacks are already old at this point, imo he will have a fight in panel with Zoro (most likely) where he displays again the perks of his devil fruit and then loses. But now it is already something predictable.

 

[comrade]

Abilities should always be taken into account. Even if Shiryu has weaker attack power than his opponent but can win with his sneaking around, then I’d say it’s fair to scale him to them.

That's only true if it happens in a 1 on 1. If Ben in a battle with Shiryu cannot react to Shiryu's invisible moves, then it's something you can use to scale Shiryu. But if Shiryu and Ben aren't even engaging in battle but Ben is being backstabbed by Shiryu while being occupied with someone or something else, you can't really scale Shiryu's power level vs. Ben based on that.

 

[LANJI CUCKSMOKE]

most likely
thats how he fights

 

[Ven437]

Shiryu a bigger sneak diff than CP0, he would be the greatest sneak attack that they ever seen.

 

[TheKnightOfTheSea]

He'll definitely try to at least.

Idk what expect of a cutthroat fighter like Shiryu with an invisibility fruit