Powers & Abilities Zoro Taming Enma : Was it COC or COA or both?

[Geo]

As the thread title States, do you think Zoro being able to draw back his haki from Enma should be attributed to a possible COC awakening or was it Armament haki or both?
This was inspired by @Bil02 submission in a previous thread concerning the scene. I found his statement quite possible. And to add to that statement, it seems the SFX for when COC is used is also present when Zoro takes Enma....make of that what you will

Same level of haki as Oden when he tamed the sword.
And we know Oden was using that sword since his childhood as during the brothel incident in the flashback, he already had it.
No way of really knowing if Zoro has the level of armament Oden had at 39 against Kaido.

Post automatically merged: Oct 12, 2020

Also is it even stated you need great haki to tame enma? Yes Enma forces the ryuo of the user on its own and surely needs high Coa control to master it but I don't think that was what Zoro did to tame it.
What Zoro did seemed to me more like bending the sword to his will which is a Conqueror feat imo, even the sfx during that scene are similar to those of confirmed Coc users.
We know Oden was a conqueror and that no one before and after him could tame the sword since its creation, this just tells me there were no other conquerors in Wano during those periods.This could explain why none of the scabbards could tame Enma despite having Ryuo on a level that can wound Kaido;they simply lacked the first requirement needed to tame the sword.

Now during training to master it,you train your ryuo control and stamina such that at the end the requirements for using that sword are Coc + high ryuo control.
Imo if Luffy was a swordsman,he would have tamed Enma the same way.

Discuss

 

[nik87]

CoA, imo. Idk how CoC can suck the haki back in.

 

[Gauntlet]

CoA, imo. Idk how CoC can suck the haki back in.

He enforced his will onto Enma to relinquish his haki, which is a component of CoC. Also the only other person to accomplish this feat was Oden as far as we know, an individual who has CoC. Though for now I'm leaning towards CoA. Impressive either way.

 

[Geo]

CoA, imo. Idk how CoC can suck the haki back in.

Well since it also deals with willpower there is that possibility. Overpowering the wills of others is attributed to COC and since cursed swords seems to have some sort of will in them ..it kinda works.
Also when combine with Tengu's statement..he says that No one in Wano has been able to tame Enma except for Oden. We know that Oden had COC but didn't have the ability to leak haki like Roger and WB did.
So I think the possibility is there

 

[Celestial D. Dragon]

Well I have been saying that taming Enma is more of a Willpower feat than an actual CoA strength feat, so it is possible that CoC is something that played a role Zoro being able to tame the sword like Oden.

CoA never really made sense, because what does having strong CoA have to do with stopping Enma from pulling it out of you? Bending the sword to one's Will make much more sense in the confines of the definition of "taming."

 

[HA001]

I did used to think its coa control, but now im not sure

Thats what zoro does, it looks more like hes imposed his will on it as opposed to any sort of coa control

Theres no chance kid oden had ryou control at that level to do that, wheras kids have had coc before, like doffy or ace.
Honestly unsure.

 

[Geo]

Well I have been saying that taming Enma is more of a Willpower feat than an actual CoA strength feat, so it is possible that CoC is something that played a role Zoro being able to tame the sword like Oden.

CoA never really made sense, because what does having strong CoA have to do with stopping Enma from pulling it out of you? Bending the sword to one's Will make much more sense in the confines of the definition of "taming."

I did used to think its coa control, but now im not sure

Thats what zoro does, it looks more like hes imposed his will on it as opposed to any sort of coa control

Theres no chance kid oden had ryou control at that level to do that, wheras kids have had coc before, like doffy or ace.
Honestly unsure.

The issue with attributing it to CoC alone is the Zoro's statement after taming the sword that if he gets used to it, it would mean he'd gotten stronger.
We know COC cannot be trained so how would he be getting stronger if it is COC attributed

 

[HA001]

The issue with attributing it to CoC alone is the Zoro's statement after taming the sword that if he gets used to it, it would mean he'd gotten stronger.
We know COC cannot be trained so how would he be getting stronger if it is COC attributed

Then it simply means he was talking about having a sword under his control as opposed to not. Even the training a day later hes got full control over it in the bamboo forest, and a day after that he replicates the enma cliff slash on his own accord.

 

[nik87]

It is about CoA, imo, a step towards the black blade.

 

[Celestial D. Dragon]

The issue with attributing it to CoC alone is the Zoro's statement after taming the sword that if he gets used to it, it would mean he'd gotten stronger.
We know COC cannot be trained so how would he be getting stronger if it is COC attributed

It'd be nice if Oda actually explained to us how CoA gets stronger in the first place. I mean, we know that it and CoO are actually able to be trained, but we have no clue how they can be trained.

I mean it could make sense if taming enma is a matter of willpower, and since it's a constant battle of "wills" so to speak, then taming the sword is actually increasing Zoro's level of willpower, which in turn makes all forms of haki stronger. It's somewhat convoluted, but since Haki = Willpower, it makes some sense.

 

[Zowo]

The issue with attributing it to CoC alone is the Zoro's statement after taming the sword that if he gets used to it, it would mean he'd gotten stronger.
We know COC cannot be trained so how would he be getting stronger if it is COC attributed

nope enma was tamed and wouldn t take zoro s haki anymore
"getting used to it" could mean getting used to the new weight since shusui is heavier and enma lighter
zoro said the same thing when he got shusui that it s heavier than yubashir and he needs to get used to it
coc might be a factor

 

[KiriNigiri]

It could've been both. Hitetsu claimed an ordinary swordsman would've been a husk, however, Zoro was still mostly fine and later forced the sword to give his haki back. The former implies Zoro had that much CoA that Enma couldn't take anymore, while the latter demonstrates a conqueror-like nature.

 

[LANJI CUCKSMOKE]

if its not coa which I think it is we'll know pretty soon
coc makes more sense thinking about it tho
with so many capable ryou users in wano
one should be able to tame it
coc users are rare
and so is taming enma.
I assume oden had coc as well here.

 

[thedarkdragon11]

CoA + Sword Logic in the series...

 

[The White Crane]

It was tamed by Zoro's Chad energy.

 

[Chrono]

Zoro's CoC can make swords faint

 

[Bil02]

Oden tamed Enma as a kid right ? We saw him having Enma at his waist during the sukiyaki flashback at the beggining of Oden flashback.
These last chapters,Kaido has been saying the scabbards have the same ryuo as Oden which is reinforced by the latest chapter showing the scabbards using Togen Totsuka even though they weren't paying attention to Oden's teachings.
Now the question is :If the scabbards have the same level of ryuo as Oden at 39,how come they could never tame Enma when Oden could do it as a kid ?

Finally, during the Zoro taming Enma scene,the sword forces Zoro's ryuo out on its own,Zoro says "give it back" while the panel Zooms at Zoro's eye,if Zoro had suck it in with Coa control,why does Zoro need to tell the sword to give it back ? And why does the panel Zoom to Zoro's eye with the sfx identical to luffy's Coc usage in Udon ? For now,i'm 80% sure it was Coc zoro used to tame the sword.


For reference : check out Luffy using Coc on the guards in Udon during Queen's sumo Inferno challenge and Zoro taming Enma while comparing the respective sfx.

 

[Patryipe]

Whatever it was it was greatness

 

[Bil02]

The issue with attributing it to CoC alone is the Zoro's statement after taming the sword that if he gets used to it, it would mean he'd gotten stronger.
We know COC cannot be trained so how would he be getting stronger if it is COC attributed

Well that's why i think the process happens in 2 steps

Step 1: Taming Enma
Here both Zoro and Oden impose their will on the Sword forcing it to give back the ryuo After trying to cut a tree or a rock,something quite simple for any amateur swordsman.

Step 2: Mastering Enma

Zoro tries to cut more swiftly as he demostrates on the bamboo while talking to Momo (towards end of chap 955). Naturally as you try to cut harder substances and use high end moves,your control over the sword lessens hence why you need to have high level Ryuo control to stop the sword from sucking your Coa without it being an handicap mid battle confiriming what Zoro said about being much stronger after getting used to it.
The scabbards are said to have Ryuo on Oden level evidenced by their Togen Totsuka doing the same type of damage on Kaido this latest chapter.

Conclusion : It is a combination of both Coc+ high Coa control to be able to use the sword efficiently with no drawbacks.

Coc : Taming
Coa : Mastering

 

[WoronoaWoro]

I think it was CoC. All the scabbard have Ryou ( Advanced CoA) but couldnt tame Enma. It must mean that it is CoC then.