Speculations How did Kaido win against Oden, brute force or underhanded tactics?
The question remains when he is stronger. It seems unlikely that a full, major fight happened. Some exchange of blows, obviously, but I neither think Oden would have been defeated immediately, nor that he was slowly pummeled into unconsciousness. And Oda is always hesitant to make full drawn-out fights, even implied in a character's flashbacks, so it's likely Kaido took some sort of shortcut, just to keep the focus on the historical storytelling.
The point is: strength is not enough to say what happened, as fights can be messy things even if someone is stronger, and Oden is clearly not like any other of Kaido's challengers (that neat starform scar).
The point is: strength is not enough to say what happened, as fights can be messy things even if someone is stronger, and Oden is clearly not like any other of Kaido's challengers (that neat starform scar).
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How do we know that? If haki would've made a difference,oden would've used that on the barrier instead of begging orochi to get out of the barrier.
Also higurashi kurozumi specifically said violence is no match for the barrier,and orochi added that if violence was the key,the other daimyo would have killed him already and we know even if oden got much stronger than when he left,he still can't defeat all the other daimyo on his own.
So yes,all points to oden not being capable of defeating barrier.If he could,he would've done it already.
Also higurashi kurozumi specifically said violence is no match for the barrier,and orochi added that if violence was the key,the other daimyo would have killed him already and we know even if oden got much stronger than when he left,he still can't defeat all the other daimyo on his own.
So yes,all points to oden not being capable of defeating barrier.If he could,he would've done it already.
Yes but that doesn't change the fact that oden was begging orochi to get out of the barrier before the kurozumi trio started blackmailing him.
When oden was blocked by the barrier and was told it was a devil fruit power,what was stopping him from using haki on his swords and try to cut through it? Higurashi and setsumaru have traveled the world(as illustrated by higurashi taking shiki's and shinobu's appearance previously) and have brought kaido to wano,so if they say oden can't cut through barrier then i beleive them as oden hasn't shown otherwise.
When oden was blocked by the barrier and was told it was a devil fruit power,what was stopping him from using haki on his swords and try to cut through it? Higurashi and setsumaru have traveled the world(as illustrated by higurashi taking shiki's and shinobu's appearance previously) and have brought kaido to wano,so if they say oden can't cut through barrier then i beleive them as oden hasn't shown otherwise.
I agree with @King7, imo if it turns out that Kaidou beat Oden through underhanded means then Kaidou loses a lot of hype imo. Not only that, but it’d also establish that Kaidou is ‘beatable’ which is kinda contrary to the narrative Oda’s been pushing since Kaidou’s introduction up until now.
Rather than Oden dominating Kaidou & the then the later cheating to win. I think it’d be something akin to Kaidou v Luffy at the beginning of the arc, in which Oden lands a flurry of powerful & violent blows on Kaidou but is ultimately unable to hurt the later and then as a result, opts to voluntarily allow Enma suck up all of his Haki which allows him to finally land a fatal blow on Kaidou but then even that won’t be enough to put Kaidou down tho the later would be severely injured and then Kaidou proceeds to wreck Oden. For me, it makes zero sense for Kaidou to be de-hyped at the expense of Oden.
Also I think the bit about Oden being invincible was the narrator talking from the perspective of the people of Wano. To them Oden is indeed invincible but us readers know for certain from the flashback that he isn’t.
Hmmn... Orochi’s scum so Oda could potentially write him to shoot at Oden at a critical point in that battle to make us hate him even more, similar to Flampe intervening in the Katakuri v Luffy fight. Damn it! I just thought of annoying possibility 😭 lolz. Let’s assume Oden allowed Enma to consume all of his Haki to land a devastating blow on Kaidou, it’s sensible to think he’d aim for his Kaidou’s vitals right? Do y’all think the place Kaidou’s scar is at is a vital spot?🤔 I’m not really that knowledgeable about the human anatomy but you’d reckon he’d go for his neck or his heart tho right? I mean there’s the possibility of Kaidou evading the attack resulting in Oden missing his vitals but I think that possibility is unlikely given Kaidou has never been scarred prior to Oden. So maybe Orochi shot at Oden at the critical moment which made him miss Kaidou’s vitals😓. I really hope Oda doesn’t go this route tho.
Rather than Oden dominating Kaidou & the then the later cheating to win. I think it’d be something akin to Kaidou v Luffy at the beginning of the arc, in which Oden lands a flurry of powerful & violent blows on Kaidou but is ultimately unable to hurt the later and then as a result, opts to voluntarily allow Enma suck up all of his Haki which allows him to finally land a fatal blow on Kaidou but then even that won’t be enough to put Kaidou down tho the later would be severely injured and then Kaidou proceeds to wreck Oden. For me, it makes zero sense for Kaidou to be de-hyped at the expense of Oden.
Also I think the bit about Oden being invincible was the narrator talking from the perspective of the people of Wano. To them Oden is indeed invincible but us readers know for certain from the flashback that he isn’t.
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Hmmn... Orochi’s scum so Oda could potentially write him to shoot at Oden at a critical point in that battle to make us hate him even more, similar to Flampe intervening in the Katakuri v Luffy fight. Damn it! I just thought of annoying possibility 😭 lolz. Let’s assume Oden allowed Enma to consume all of his Haki to land a devastating blow on Kaidou, it’s sensible to think he’d aim for his Kaidou’s vitals right? Do y’all think the place Kaidou’s scar is at is a vital spot?🤔 I’m not really that knowledgeable about the human anatomy but you’d reckon he’d go for his neck or his heart tho right? I mean there’s the possibility of Kaidou evading the attack resulting in Oden missing his vitals but I think that possibility is unlikely given Kaidou has never been scarred prior to Oden. So maybe Orochi shot at Oden at the critical moment which made him miss Kaidou’s vitals😓. I really hope Oda doesn’t go this route tho.
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Would be really a big twist with Oden coming out as the winner against the main villian of a new arc. We never had something like this, a villian who get defeated already by a hero in the past. That is like Doffy getting defeated by Kyros or Enel get defeated by Viper or someone else in the past. Would being a big impact for Kaido character, getting defeated by Oden would not only hype Oden but overall the wano samurais.
But be honest I don't would then know how to feel about Kaido lose. Oda would make a different route who we don't see much overall in Shonen mangas, something like this I could see this in HxH. It would be kinda interesting though about Kaido character.
But be honest I don't would then know how to feel about Kaido lose. Oda would make a different route who we don't see much overall in Shonen mangas, something like this I could see this in HxH. It would be kinda interesting though about Kaido character.
What hype? Kaido is an unbeatable monster to the people of Wano like how Mingo was unbeatable for the people of Dressrosa. Kaido being the strongest has always been given an air of doubt and he was below WB. Honestly his clash with BM should have " dehyped" him.
Kaido has already one shot Luffy and he's gonna be beaten with the plotty bullshit by the same guy like everyone else.
Kaido has already one shot Luffy and he's gonna be beaten with the plotty bullshit by the same guy like everyone else.
J
No retainer mentions Kaido losing It is already tossed aside that kaido cheated or orochi took part.
Do you really believe Ashura will be stupid to keep such info.
Why would a clash with BM dehype him?When BM and Kaido are the strongest emperors since pre ts, backed up by the fact both were hidden among original Yonko
Oda saved the best last.
Also BM and Kaido have always been counterpart
Y'all just thought BM was something Oda never said! She isnt weakest top tier neither Low top tier!
Which WB ?
The one that was shook from Young Oden presence and matched in strength?... or the sick WB ? he himself knew was out of prime by far. Kaid was WSC already before Ace was a rookie, coz when Ace had his own crew, kaido was WSC! Ace Novel is canon. No single info there has been proven false yet.
Oden and co are going to battle Kaido not Orochi
Also Sacrificing oneself doesnt mean the person won! Or had upper hand!
Oden already though of Momo using his other sword the moment Momo was born, he already viewed Momo as someone who will cut the heavens and hell in halves.
Well difference between the Kyros Wiper example and this one is that Oden is dead.
Also the fact that Oden gave Kaido those massive scars is very telling. Not even Moria who is said to have fought Kaido equally was able to scar Kaido.
No retainer mentioned Oden losing too........moot point
Also the fact that Oden gave Kaido those massive scars is very telling. Not even Moria who is said to have fought Kaido equally was able to scar Kaido.
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No retainer mentioned Oden losing too........moot point
J
Kaido losing is out of the window
The only end results are:
he scarred Kaido,
he is excuted,
kaido still standing and burns down the castle
Following thay logic "not even moriah gave Kaido scars while Oden did"
:
WB did lose to Kaido whenever they fought equally or not
since he failed giving Kaido scars
The only end results are:
he scarred Kaido,
he is excuted,
kaido still standing and burns down the castle
Following thay logic "not even moriah gave Kaido scars while Oden did"
:
WB did lose to Kaido whenever they fought equally or not
since he failed giving Kaido scars
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We would have the answer most probably by tomorrow, but up to now, I don't see Kaido doing dirty tactics especially in a fight, something that he seems to love and seek enjoyment in the most. I think the fight between Kaido vs Oden and scabbards will show how monstrous Kaido was, while also giving Oden a truly legendary feat of being the only one to ever left a scar on Kaido. So my prediction is Kaido will gain the upperhand, the scabbards were helpless, Oden scarred Kaido, Kaido found enjoyment and get to his full rampage power, and Oden get defeated by Kaido while making sure his retainer flee so they could go the castle.
Luffy is here to make the difference. This time, not only Luffy has the scabbards on his side, but he most likely will get aid from other supernovas and probably SH grandfleet/marines that could also come into play. Luffy will do what Oden did not manage to do : actually seeking help from others and finally defeating Kaido.
Luffy is here to make the difference. This time, not only Luffy has the scabbards on his side, but he most likely will get aid from other supernovas and probably SH grandfleet/marines that could also come into play. Luffy will do what Oden did not manage to do : actually seeking help from others and finally defeating Kaido.