Powers & Abilities So does everyone agree Enma not a power up now.

[Zenos7]

You agree those are PowerUp ?

they were better swords than what he used before, so yes.

enma was not stated or shown to be better/stronger than shusui.

Why this training hasn't the same built-up as all others training ?
Why the training tool is more hyped than the actual training ?

thats your subjective opinion.

im definitely more hyped for the result,aka zoro being used to enma and having better haki Control

You dont see why the staging is important in a story ? Is it a joke ?
Explain why Enma staging is way better than the training one ?

The results of training hyped ?

^

And Why having two swords from the same blacksmiths help you to manage you CoA better ?
Explain this mechanics

thats not whats happening though. wado isnt helping zoro to manage coa better, it helps him getting used to enma better.

at least thats whats hitetsu is saying.

 

[M944]

Every sword that Zoro gets receives a moment of hype, something about it gets highlighted and Zoro needs to get used to it to bring it under control so it can behave how Zoro demands. Once those introduction hype moments are over, it never gets brought up again.

To resume Enma have the same scheme of built-up than Sandai or Shusui.
Do you agree ?

Not sure what do you mean with Why Enma is so different compared to Shusui and Sandai. It is different compared to Sandai that it is higher grade and it is different compared to Shusui that it is not a Kokuto, which means lower hardness grade despite the same ranking.
Both Shusui and Sandai had their own introduction hype gimmicks, just like Enma. Shusui was a heavy blade and was creating a larger slash by absorbing other slashes. Sandai is incredibly sharp and was cutting more than Zoro intended.

Thanks for the resume but I mean Why it's different why Enma isn't a PowerUp.
Enma have the same scheme of built-up in better than Shusui or Sandai ?
So why Enma is the one we cant call a PowerUp ?

Enma is a better training tool than other swords but that is where Enma's hype ends. Once used to it, you can discard it and you lose nothing. Enma itself is not a power-up, it is a power-down, a liability for everyone who isnt used to it. It drains the user of his Haki way too fast and nobody wants that. When you get used to it, it is just a regular sword, no different to Ame no Habakiri.

Headcannon. Every thing you said is for if you dont believe Enma is a PowerUp itself.
If you think it's a PowerUp itself those are not argument.

Yes, Enma is a training tool and it can be discarded now since Zoro already got used to it and it no longer offers him anything.

Enma can become a Black blade.

Hitetsu said that Zoro is familiar to Enma because of Wado. That means that Wado probably has a gimmick too, one which we dont know of and that could be a reason why Zoro's haki mastery is good

Which gimmick Wado have ?

they were better swords than what he used before, so yes.

enma was not stated or shown to be better/stronger than shusui.

You really need everything to be stated ?
I guess every character has the same powerLevel.

No we have shonen codes that everyone knows. Oda use them and here they dont let any doubt Enma is better than Shusui.

thats your subjective opinion.

im definitely more hyped for the result,aka zoro being used to enma and having better haki Control

Subjective two panels for a training. Against two chapters for introduce a sword. A chapter name for a sword nothing for this training.
But yeah Enma's hype isn't factually better.

thats not whats happening though. wado isnt helping zoro to manage coa better, it helps him getting used to enma better.

at least thats whats hitetsu is saying.

It helps Zoro to manage Enma effects better. What are those effects ? Your CoA is taked by Enma.
The only issue Zoro needs to get use is a CoA issue.

 

[Zenos7]

Oda use them and here they dont let any doubt Enma is better

show it, prove it.

 

[Zenos7]

Subjective two panels for a training. Against two chapters for introduce a sword. A chapter name for a sword nothing for this training.
But yeah Enma's hype isn't factually better.

you seem to not be reading the manga or my statements. stop wasting my time

 

[Zenos7]

it helps Zoro to manage Enma effects better. What are those effects ? Your CoA is taked by Enma.
The only issue Zoro needs to get use is a CoA issue.

thats one way to read something that isnt there into the manga lol.

 

[M944]

show it, prove it.

I did the built-up is clear.

you seem to not be reading the manga or my statements. stop wasting my time

Someone who said built-up doesn't matter in a story.
I agree we should stop you cant answer.

thats one way to read something that isnt there into the manga lol.

What Zoro will be get used to ? Explain

 

[Zenos7]

Someone who said built-up doesn't matter in a story.

dafuq?

ok now i know you are just trolling me lmfao

 

[nik87]

To resume Enma have the same scheme of built-up than Sandai or Shusui.
Do you agree ?

Yes.

Thanks for the resume but I mean Why it's different why Enma isn't a PowerUp.
Enma have the same scheme of built-up in better than Shusui or Sandai ?
So why Enma is the one we cant call a PowerUp ?

Because it does nothing, that's why it isnt a power-up except that it provides some training during the process of getting used to it.

Headcannon. Every thing you said is for if you dont believe Enma is a PowerUp itself.
If you think it's a PowerUp itself those are not argument.

I dont think Enma itself is a power-up, I said it is a power-down for those who arent used to it. Those who are, it offers nothing.
The process of getting used to it - training, can be considered as power-up but we have yet to see if it does anything.

Enma can become a Black blade.

Every sword can become black blade.

Which gimmick Wado have ?

I already said that we dont know that.

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

It's a power up.

 

[M944]

Because it does nothing, that's why it isnt a power-up except that it provides some training during the process of getting used to it.

It's just your opinion.

I already said that we dont know that.

So you cant explain why wado has an affect on the training to manage your CoA.

 

[nik87]

So you cant explain why wado has an affect on the training to manage your CoA.

No, I cant because it isnt stated in manga. You read something that I didnt?

It's just your opinion.

Why do you call facts an opinion?

 

[M944]

No, I cant because it isnt stated in manga. You read something that I didnt?

Nope. I just ask why have you find this gimmick story.

Why do you call facts an opinion?

Unless you can prove it downed zoro's power it's an opinion. And not even the opinion of most of the readers.

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

Luffy gets a new form of Haki able to injure Kaido.
Sanji gets the raid suit, a boost to all his stats.

Zoro gets the sword that is hyped for cutting Kaido. But nah, it's actually a nerf.

 

[nik87]

I just ask why have you find this gimmick story.

It is just my guess.

Unless you can prove it downed zoro's power it's an opinion.

Why do you think nobody wanted Enma? Because it drains all your haki in few swings and you are fucked.
That is what it does to those who cannot control it, that is what it did to Zoro when he first touched it.
Once used to it, it does absolutely nothing, you can see Oden's example.
Unless you consider a liability a power-up, I dont know what is the issue here...

 

[Zenos7]

Luffy gets a new form of Haki able to injure Kaido.
Sanji gets the raid suit, a boost to all his stats.

Zoro gets the sword that is hyped for cutting Kaido. But nah, it's actually a nerf.

initially, without zoro getting accustomed to it.

This is a very lazy misrepresentation of what people are arguing here. . . .

 

[M944]

It is just my guess.

Why do you think nobody wanted Enma? Because it drains all your haki in few swings and you are fucked.
That is what it does to those who cannot control it, that is what it did to Zoro when he first touched it.
Once used to it, it does absolutely nothing, you can see Oden's example.
Unless you consider a liability a power-up, I dont know what is the issue here...

I can resume what you said with one sentence.
If you cant control Enma it's not a PowerUp, if you can it's a PowerUp.

Zoro can so it's a PowerUp.

 

[nik87]

I can resume what you said with one sentence.
If you cant control Enma it's not a PowerUp, if you can it's a PowerUp.
Zoro can so it's a PowerUp.

If you read what I posted, that is not what I said.
Zoro can replace Enma with any sword and he wont lose anything.
The only thing you can call a power-up is the process(training) of getting used to it.
Enma does nothing different compared to Ame, you can see on Kaido.
You seem desperate to call it a power-up... Why?

 

[Finalbeta]

I can resume what you said with one sentence.
If you cant control Enma it's not a PowerUp, if you can it's a PowerUp.

Zoro can so it's a PowerUp.

Then even Luffy's Rayleigh is a power up. What changes is that the sword is a training tool and Rayleigh also acted as training tool for Luffy.

 

[M944]

If you read what I posted, that is not what I said.
Zoro can replace Enma with any sword and he wont lose

How do you know that ? Have you any panel ?

The only thing you can call a power-up is the process(training) of getting used to it.
Enma does nothing different compared to Ame, you can see on Kaido.

This process doesn't seems to be a PowerUp in himself.
It's just the way to use the PowerUp at 100%.
Unless you can call a 2 panels training a PowerUp.
And a 3 chapters of built-up an hype for a training tool.
Which doesn't seems logical for a story.

You seem desperate to call it a power-up... Why?

I'm ain't desperate I just want answers but none of you give them but still refuse to call Enma a PowerUp.

Then even Luffy's Rayleigh is a power up. What changes is that the sword is a training tool and Rayleigh also acted as training tool for Luffy.

Do you think you are relevant ?
How comparing Rayleigh to Enma make sense for you ?

 

[nik87]

How do you know that ? Have you any panel ?

This process doesn't seems to be a PowerUp in himself.
It's just the way to use the PowerUp at 100%.
Unless you can call a 2 panels training a PowerUp.
And a 3 chapters of built-up an hype for a training tool.
Which doesn't seems logical for a story.
I'm ain't desperate I just want answers but none of you give them but still refuse to call Enma a PowerUp.


Do you think you are relevant ?
How comparing Rayleigh to Enma make sense for you ?

I gave you all the answers tho.
You literally have a panel of Zoro saying that process of getting used to it might make him stronger. Do you disagree with that panel or what is the source of your confusion?