General & Others I hate One piece YouTubers for this shit
- Thread starter ImmaIvanoM
- Start date
Mamma mia, who's that idiot? 
P.S: on the other hand, probably that's what an One Piece Youtber needs to do since most of fandom would like to hear praises of the series they like and follow rather than the truth, otherwise they won't make money. Then I can't blame them for become this idiotic (or pretend)
P.S: on the other hand, probably that's what an One Piece Youtber needs to do since most of fandom would like to hear praises of the series they like and follow rather than the truth, otherwise they won't make money. Then I can't blame them for become this idiotic (or pretend)
As one of the ex-ZKK believers I didn't give two craps about the central plot of Wano as I predicted that it wasn't going to be good even before the relavation of ZKK not happening. Although I had no faith in Wano as a whole being well written as Oda has proven to be a shoddy writer in the Post-TS, I was only getting through it to see my ex-fav Zoro do something special that he's never done before, or even Oda expanding on Zoro's character but Oda somehow missed all the easy ass layups to make Zoro great again.
There is no "objectively" whatsoever when judging if a story is good or bad. A story could be wonderfully constructed and be spectacularly boring or awful nonetheless. You can like it, I could hate it, and vice-versa.
Having said that, the great, insurmountable problems of Wano are, for me:
- it's inconceivable length, a problem that affects all TS, but Wano in particular;
- 90% of Wano are the same ideas that we have already seen in other arcs;
- the fights were, for the lack of a better world, shitty;
- the G5 was maybe the biggest, incoherent plot hole I have ever seen.
Having said that, you could still like Wano; however I, and lots of others, don't.
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And I never said that. Good or bad is relative. it's up to the reader.
What can be objectively demonstrated on the other hand, is if a story is well crafted or not.
Very unlikely.
The lengh of a media is a not a sign of weakness or strenght, its just what it is;
Now, being an already seen idea doesn't means its bad. All the arc of One Piece revolves around the same idea (embark / debark/ explore / conflict) it doesn't make the story bad. So I will need at least 10 examples here where those occurence are bad and why (you said 90% of Wano)
Why ? Again. You say "shitty" without explanation.
For me the fight were great:
- Awesome panels
- Awesomes technics
- Awesome power up
- A lot of creativity and funny moments
- Long enough so that we care, not to long enough to drag the story.
Etc.
So I will need explanations on "why" those fight were "shitty".
Actually no.
From a actual profesionnal storytelling perspective, that's one of the best revelation of the story, as it:
- Extends the worldbuilding
- Create an awesome plot twist
- Puts context on what we already know
- Is a play on the support of the serie
- Is an incredibly creative idea
- Was well setupped and prepared
- Is perfectly illustrating the philosphical theme of the story
- Is perfectly extending the characterization of the main character
- Make us rediscover the story with a new eye.
Etc.
Not a plot hole at all. (and that's from an objective standpoint) I think you are not understanding this revelation at all and listening a bit too much the people of WG here.
And you have the right to.
What can be objectively demonstrated on the other hand, is if a story is well crafted or not.
Very unlikely.
The lengh of a media is a not a sign of weakness or strenght, its just what it is;
Now, being an already seen idea doesn't means its bad. All the arc of One Piece revolves around the same idea (embark / debark/ explore / conflict) it doesn't make the story bad. So I will need at least 10 examples here where those occurence are bad and why (you said 90% of Wano)
Why ? Again. You say "shitty" without explanation.
For me the fight were great:
- Awesome panels
- Awesomes technics
- Awesome power up
- A lot of creativity and funny moments
- Long enough so that we care, not to long enough to drag the story.
Etc.
So I will need explanations on "why" those fight were "shitty".
Actually no.
From a actual profesionnal storytelling perspective, that's one of the best revelation of the story, as it:
- Extends the worldbuilding
- Create an awesome plot twist
- Puts context on what we already know
- Is a play on the support of the serie
- Is an incredibly creative idea
- Was well setupped and prepared
- Is perfectly illustrating the philosphical theme of the story
- Is perfectly extending the characterization of the main character
- Make us rediscover the story with a new eye.
Etc.
Not a plot hole at all. (and that's from an objective standpoint) I think you are not understanding this revelation at all and listening a bit too much the people of WG here.
And you have the right to.
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At this point in time, I'm wondering why you care so much? YouTubers want to grow their channel so they clickbait. Many OP youtubers only started covering the series because it's very popular and could help their channel, and many don't understand Oda as a storyteller and just go by hype. They can get 29 predictions wrong bit as soon as they get 1 right, they act like they all knowing. Others brag about getting obvious predictions right like Luffy getting a power up to beat Kaido lol.
Then we are ok, because I don't give a damn, to be honest, if a story is well constructed or not from an abstract point of view: what I care about is if I find it good or bad.
I am not even arguing with you about this.
On the contrary, it is very normal. For example, I think every one of us has read a "masterpiece"/classic in our lives and has found it not too good or outright bad. It's normal, even if you say otherwise.
Absolutely untrue: excessive length is a tremendous weakness. I, and many others, find Wano painfully long, borderline boring.
You don't? Good for you, but sincerely I don't care and I don't want or have any intention to try to change your idea. You asked why I think that and this is one of the reasons.
It is, for me, when you are using the same ideas over and over. Do you want some examples?
- an enemy that is almost impossible to wound, at least consistently, thanks to his special powers.
I think it's all at least the fourth time as far as big villain goes: Crocodile, Ener, Magellan and Kaido.
- AGAIN the theme with the Royal family in distress and the bad usurper that is sitting on the throne.
- we even had Mocha 2.0 with Tama.
And so on.
But as I said, I didn't like it, but you could. You asked why, and I answered.
Why? I think for the exact same reasons you said, but the opposite.
For example, I find BM fight the worst fight ever in OP (for an important character) : generally underwhelming, boring, mostly of-screened and even incoherent (how is it possible that BM used adv Coc against P1, but didn't use it - or Oda did not draw it - against Law and Kidd? Even in life-threatening situations, like when she was trying to topple down Law before the PW).
So yes, I found the fights shitty, for the lack of a better world. You didn't: good for you.
As I said, I don't care if you do, I am even happy for you, because I am not trying to convince you.
Again, you asked why I didn't like Wano and I responded.
I don't think I do, but it's fine if you like it, obviously.
However, this is not the place for this discussion. I think there are at least fifty threads about why the Nika Nika doesn't make any sense.
For our purposes, you could understand why not liking (at all) the Nika Nika had impacted on my Wano rating.
As you have the right to like it, of course, and I will not judge your personal view of what you like, because there is nothing to judge: it is personal.
As you said "Good or bad is relative. it's up to the reader”
You found the fights good, I didn't;
You found the Nika Nika revelation good, I found it horrible;
And so on.
And it's all good, but you asked why I didn't like Wano and I responded.
I am not even arguing with you about this.
On the contrary, it is very normal. For example, I think every one of us has read a "masterpiece"/classic in our lives and has found it not too good or outright bad. It's normal, even if you say otherwise.
Absolutely untrue: excessive length is a tremendous weakness. I, and many others, find Wano painfully long, borderline boring.
You don't? Good for you, but sincerely I don't care and I don't want or have any intention to try to change your idea. You asked why I think that and this is one of the reasons.
It is, for me, when you are using the same ideas over and over. Do you want some examples?
- an enemy that is almost impossible to wound, at least consistently, thanks to his special powers.
I think it's all at least the fourth time as far as big villain goes: Crocodile, Ener, Magellan and Kaido.
- AGAIN the theme with the Royal family in distress and the bad usurper that is sitting on the throne.
- we even had Mocha 2.0 with Tama.
And so on.
But as I said, I didn't like it, but you could. You asked why, and I answered.
Why? I think for the exact same reasons you said, but the opposite.
For example, I find BM fight the worst fight ever in OP (for an important character) : generally underwhelming, boring, mostly of-screened and even incoherent (how is it possible that BM used adv Coc against P1, but didn't use it - or Oda did not draw it - against Law and Kidd? Even in life-threatening situations, like when she was trying to topple down Law before the PW).
So yes, I found the fights shitty, for the lack of a better world. You didn't: good for you.
As I said, I don't care if you do, I am even happy for you, because I am not trying to convince you.
Again, you asked why I didn't like Wano and I responded.
I don't think I do, but it's fine if you like it, obviously.
However, this is not the place for this discussion. I think there are at least fifty threads about why the Nika Nika doesn't make any sense.
For our purposes, you could understand why not liking (at all) the Nika Nika had impacted on my Wano rating.
As you have the right to like it, of course, and I will not judge your personal view of what you like, because there is nothing to judge: it is personal.
As you said "Good or bad is relative. it's up to the reader”
You found the fights good, I didn't;
You found the Nika Nika revelation good, I found it horrible;
And so on.
And it's all good, but you asked why I didn't like Wano and I responded.
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And it's fine, but like I said before it is completely irrelevant in this case, at least for me. I was referring to the fact that I didn't like how the story played out.
A house could be engineeringly perfect, but I could find it visually horrible or impractical, and so I wouldn't want to live there. I wouldn't even enter the engineering part, because I don't have the competence or even the interest.
I hope this will clarify what I am talking about.
A house could be engineeringly perfect, but I could find it visually horrible or impractical, and so I wouldn't want to live there. I wouldn't even enter the engineering part, because I don't have the competence or even the interest.
I hope this will clarify what I am talking about.
Though I disagree that you can't judge objectively, I agree that people are still bound by their personal preferences and interpretations. For example, some view Sword Art Online as a survival thriller. Others like myself view it as a Romance/Harem that takes place in a video game. We're bound the judge the series differently based on these perceived premise.
On a side note, the guy you're replying too was adamant that his story telling knowledge and understanding of Oda proved that Carrot was gonna join the SHs, and caused lots of mayham trying to prove it. Obviously she didn't join so that alone proves your point.
On a side note, the guy you're replying too was adamant that his story telling knowledge and understanding of Oda proved that Carrot was gonna join the SHs, and caused lots of mayham trying to prove it. Obviously she didn't join so that alone proves your point.
In general you will find very few classic without great appreciation.
Not at all.
For example, the lengh of One Piece is one of its strenght. Its one of the reasons people are so attached to the story. The longer the story, the more likely you are to get attach to the characters.
The lenght of a media can be a weakness in certain cases where this lengh is not legitimated by the storytelling, but in absolute the lengh of a media is neither a weakness or a strenght. It's just a choice from the writer of the story.
Most probably because you were following Wano week to week without really managing your expectation. I talked about that here:
.
You will observe that in general, people who will read or binge watch the story of Wano, will find it perfectly fine in term of lenght.
It's okay, we all have different taste. What is important to understand is the objective qualities of a story. And here, the lengh of Wano is a strenght.
I want at least 10 as you said that the majority of Wano was repeatitive BAD ideas.
This is precisely the best way to build conflict in a shonen manga and in stories in general : Make the ennemy unbeatable, far stronger than the character.
This is not a bad idea, this is just a commong trope that Oda is using quite well here as Kaido is not only strong but he is thematically and physically the embodiement of strenght and power.
That is a theme. You are failing to say why it is bad. May I remind you that this theme doesn't come out of nowhere, this is the classic battle against oppression that is a core idea in One Piece. So, why is this bad ? I think Oda did an amazing job in fact depicting the return of the Kozuki.
Not really, the thematic around Mocha was the self sacrifice and drug addiction.
With Tama is the concept of hunger and poverty.
They have very little in common objectively beside the fact that they are two little girls. You hate children ?
Not really, you have given me nothing here. You said " Oda used that idea" without saying why this was a bad utilisation of that idea.
Again, repetition in media is like the lenght of the media, its just the tool. repetition in itself is not bad. In fact it's more often a strenght that the opposite as it helps the echoing of the theme during the story.
- Awesome panel > Because the art direction of said panels are objectively masterfull.
- Awesome technics > Because there is a diversity of amazing techniques among all the fighters: (To quote a few:)
The rail gun of Kid (which btw is not a laser beam)
The Mazer Cannon of Big Mom
Or the Giantum fishmen Karate palm from Robin:
- Awesome power up:
The fiery powerup of Sanji:
The AMAZING power up of Robin:
Or the creative powerup concerning Luffy and the conqueror haki:
- A lot of funny and creative moments > Because the heart of One Piece is adventure AND comedy
Etc..
Those panels are why.
One could argue that she really didn't as noone is surprised that she didn't touch him. But even then...
.. you need to understand that Big Mom's power are related to her emotion rather than critical thinking. And characters in One Piece, just like humans in real life, can make poor descision making.
Big Mom is a very flawed character, even in term of combat ability. Notice that during the entire fight against Kid and Law, Big Mom is underestimating the boyz. Even when they have the advantage.
So the problem here is not that Oda is not making Big Mom use conqueror haki in her fight, it's that you guys are completely missunderstanding or ignoring Big Mom's characterization.
And its ok to feel that way. That's your point of view.
And they are all wrong lol
Not really no, as the "plot hole" criticism is completely baseless.
Me neither, I will only judge when you make an affirmation about a fight or a storytelling point. Your tastes are yours.
Technically, my point was this one: Everything point toward the fact of Carrot joining the crew. While my conclusion was wrong (that everything was pointing toward Carrot becoming a strawhat) my reasonning was perfectly correct in the sence that everything was indeed pointing toward Carrot becoming someone important. (And I still think that Carrot was meant to be a strawhat at one point).
The storytelling don't lie.
And I was right and wrong. carrot did not became a strawhat, but her story was heading toward something that put her on the throne.. Which is BTW.. still something strange narratively to this day.
In short what I was trying to prove in that thread was not really my conclusion, it was my reasonning. And you can see that multiple time when I dissect the storylines bit by bit to show you were there is something important to consider.
For example: The way Oda linked Carrot to the post of Lookout through storytelling (in differents ways) is not common and this should be something that make us raise our eyebrows (even to this day).
Conclusions can be wrong, but storytelling never lie.
Not at all.
For example, the lengh of One Piece is one of its strenght. Its one of the reasons people are so attached to the story. The longer the story, the more likely you are to get attach to the characters.
The lenght of a media can be a weakness in certain cases where this lengh is not legitimated by the storytelling, but in absolute the lengh of a media is neither a weakness or a strenght. It's just a choice from the writer of the story.
Most probably because you were following Wano week to week without really managing your expectation. I talked about that here:
.
You will observe that in general, people who will read or binge watch the story of Wano, will find it perfectly fine in term of lenght.
It's okay, we all have different taste. What is important to understand is the objective qualities of a story. And here, the lengh of Wano is a strenght.
I want at least 10 as you said that the majority of Wano was repeatitive BAD ideas.
This is precisely the best way to build conflict in a shonen manga and in stories in general : Make the ennemy unbeatable, far stronger than the character.
This is not a bad idea, this is just a commong trope that Oda is using quite well here as Kaido is not only strong but he is thematically and physically the embodiement of strenght and power.
That is a theme. You are failing to say why it is bad. May I remind you that this theme doesn't come out of nowhere, this is the classic battle against oppression that is a core idea in One Piece. So, why is this bad ? I think Oda did an amazing job in fact depicting the return of the Kozuki.
Not really, the thematic around Mocha was the self sacrifice and drug addiction.
With Tama is the concept of hunger and poverty.
They have very little in common objectively beside the fact that they are two little girls. You hate children ?
Not really, you have given me nothing here. You said " Oda used that idea" without saying why this was a bad utilisation of that idea.
Again, repetition in media is like the lenght of the media, its just the tool. repetition in itself is not bad. In fact it's more often a strenght that the opposite as it helps the echoing of the theme during the story.
- Awesome panel > Because the art direction of said panels are objectively masterfull.
- Awesome technics > Because there is a diversity of amazing techniques among all the fighters: (To quote a few:)
The rail gun of Kid (which btw is not a laser beam)
The Mazer Cannon of Big Mom
Or the Giantum fishmen Karate palm from Robin:
- Awesome power up:
The fiery powerup of Sanji:
The AMAZING power up of Robin:
Or the creative powerup concerning Luffy and the conqueror haki:
- A lot of funny and creative moments > Because the heart of One Piece is adventure AND comedy
Etc..
Those panels are why.
One could argue that she really didn't as noone is surprised that she didn't touch him. But even then...
.. you need to understand that Big Mom's power are related to her emotion rather than critical thinking. And characters in One Piece, just like humans in real life, can make poor descision making.
Big Mom is a very flawed character, even in term of combat ability. Notice that during the entire fight against Kid and Law, Big Mom is underestimating the boyz. Even when they have the advantage.
So the problem here is not that Oda is not making Big Mom use conqueror haki in her fight, it's that you guys are completely missunderstanding or ignoring Big Mom's characterization.
And its ok to feel that way. That's your point of view.
And they are all wrong lol
Not really no, as the "plot hole" criticism is completely baseless.
Me neither, I will only judge when you make an affirmation about a fight or a storytelling point. Your tastes are yours.
Technically, my point was this one: Everything point toward the fact of Carrot joining the crew. While my conclusion was wrong (that everything was pointing toward Carrot becoming a strawhat) my reasonning was perfectly correct in the sence that everything was indeed pointing toward Carrot becoming someone important. (And I still think that Carrot was meant to be a strawhat at one point).
The storytelling don't lie.
And I was right and wrong. carrot did not became a strawhat, but her story was heading toward something that put her on the throne.. Which is BTW.. still something strange narratively to this day.
In short what I was trying to prove in that thread was not really my conclusion, it was my reasonning. And you can see that multiple time when I dissect the storylines bit by bit to show you were there is something important to consider.
For example: The way Oda linked Carrot to the post of Lookout through storytelling (in differents ways) is not common and this should be something that make us raise our eyebrows (even to this day).
Conclusions can be wrong, but storytelling never lie.
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In general you will find very few classic without great appreciation.
Not at all.
For example, the lengh of One Piece is one of its strenght. Its one of the reasons people are so attached to the story. The longer the story, the more likely you are to get attach to the characters.
The lenght of a media can be a weakness in certain cases where this lengh is not legitimated by the storytelling, but in absolute the lengh of a media is neither a weakness or a strenght. It's just a choice from the writer of the story.
Most probably because you were following Wano week to week without really managing your expectation. I talked about that here:
.
You will observe that in general, people who will read or binge watch the story of Wano, will find it perfectly fine in term of lenght.
It's okay, we all have different taste. What is important to understand is the objective qualities of a story. And here, the lengh of Wano is a strenght.
I want at least 10 as you said that the majority of Wano was repeatitive BAD ideas.
This is precisely the best way to build conflict in a shonen manga and in stories in general : Make the ennemy unbeatable, far stronger than the character.
This is not a bad idea, this is just a commong trope that Oda is using quite well here as Kaido is not only strong but he is thematically and physically the embodiement of strenght and power.
That is a theme. You are failing to say why it is bad. May I remind you that this theme doesn't come out of nowhere, this is the classic battle against oppression that is a core idea in One Piece. So, why is this bad ? I think Oda did an amazing job in fact depicting the return of the Kozuki.
Not really, the thematic around Mocha was the self sacrifice and drug addiction.
With Tama is the concept of hunger and poverty.
They have very little in common objectively beside the fact that they are two little girls. You hate children ?
Not really, you have given me nothing here. You said " Oda used that idea" without saying why this was a bad utilisation of that idea.
Again, repetition in media is like the lenght of the media, its just the tool. repetition in itself is not bad. In fact it's more often a strenght that the opposite as it helps the echoing of the theme during the story.
- Awesome panel > Because the art direction of said panels are objectively masterfull.
- Awesome technics > Because there is a diversity of amazing techniques among all the fighters: (To quote a few:)
The rail gun of Kid (which btw is not a laser beam)
The Mazer Cannon of Big Mom
Or the Giantum fishmen Karate palm from Robin:
- Awesome power up:
The fiery powerup of Sanji:
The AMAZING power up of Robin:
Or the creative powerup concerning Luffy and the conqueror haki:
- A lot of funny and creative moments > Because the heart of One Piece is adventure AND comedy
Etc..
Those panels are why.
One could argue that she really didn't as noone is surprised that she didn't touch him. But even then...
.. you need to understand that Big Mom's power are related to her emotion rather than critical thinking. And characters in One Piece, just like humans in real life, can make poor descision making.
Big Mom is a very flawed character, even in term of combat ability. Notice that during the entire fight against Kid and Law, Big Mom is underestimating the boyz. Even when they have the advantage.
So the problem here is not that Oda is not making Big Mom use conqueror haki in her fight, it's that you guys are completely missunderstanding or ignoring Big Mom's characterization.
And its ok to feel that way. That's your point of view.
And they are all wrong lol
Not really no, as the "plot hole" criticism is completely baseless.
Me neither, I will only judge when you make an affirmation about a fight or a storytelling point. Your tastes are yours.
Technically, my point was this one: Everything point toward the fact of Carrot joining the crew. While my conclusion was wrong (that everything was pointing toward Carrot becoming a strawhat) my reasonning was perfectly correct in the sence that everything was indeed pointing toward Carrot becoming someone important. (And I still think that Carrot was meant to be a strawhat at one point).
The storytelling don't lie.
And I was right and wrong. carrot did not became a strawhat, but her story was heading toward something that put her on the throne.. Which is BTW.. still something strange narratively to this day.
In short what I was trying to prove in that thread was not really my conclusion, it was my reasonning. And you can see that multiple time when I dissect the storylines bit by bit to show you were there is something important to consider.
For example: The way Oda linked Carrot to the post of Lookout through storytelling (in differents ways) is not common and this should be something that make us raise our eyebrows (even to this day).
Conclusions can be wrong, but storytelling never lie.
Not at all.
For example, the lengh of One Piece is one of its strenght. Its one of the reasons people are so attached to the story. The longer the story, the more likely you are to get attach to the characters.
The lenght of a media can be a weakness in certain cases where this lengh is not legitimated by the storytelling, but in absolute the lengh of a media is neither a weakness or a strenght. It's just a choice from the writer of the story.
Most probably because you were following Wano week to week without really managing your expectation. I talked about that here:
.
You will observe that in general, people who will read or binge watch the story of Wano, will find it perfectly fine in term of lenght.
It's okay, we all have different taste. What is important to understand is the objective qualities of a story. And here, the lengh of Wano is a strenght.
I want at least 10 as you said that the majority of Wano was repeatitive BAD ideas.
This is precisely the best way to build conflict in a shonen manga and in stories in general : Make the ennemy unbeatable, far stronger than the character.
This is not a bad idea, this is just a commong trope that Oda is using quite well here as Kaido is not only strong but he is thematically and physically the embodiement of strenght and power.
That is a theme. You are failing to say why it is bad. May I remind you that this theme doesn't come out of nowhere, this is the classic battle against oppression that is a core idea in One Piece. So, why is this bad ? I think Oda did an amazing job in fact depicting the return of the Kozuki.
Not really, the thematic around Mocha was the self sacrifice and drug addiction.
With Tama is the concept of hunger and poverty.
They have very little in common objectively beside the fact that they are two little girls. You hate children ?
Not really, you have given me nothing here. You said " Oda used that idea" without saying why this was a bad utilisation of that idea.
Again, repetition in media is like the lenght of the media, its just the tool. repetition in itself is not bad. In fact it's more often a strenght that the opposite as it helps the echoing of the theme during the story.
- Awesome panel > Because the art direction of said panels are objectively masterfull.
- Awesome technics > Because there is a diversity of amazing techniques among all the fighters: (To quote a few:)
The rail gun of Kid (which btw is not a laser beam)
The Mazer Cannon of Big Mom
Or the Giantum fishmen Karate palm from Robin:
- Awesome power up:
The fiery powerup of Sanji:
The AMAZING power up of Robin:
Or the creative powerup concerning Luffy and the conqueror haki:
- A lot of funny and creative moments > Because the heart of One Piece is adventure AND comedy
Etc..
Those panels are why.
One could argue that she really didn't as noone is surprised that she didn't touch him. But even then...
.. you need to understand that Big Mom's power are related to her emotion rather than critical thinking. And characters in One Piece, just like humans in real life, can make poor descision making.
Big Mom is a very flawed character, even in term of combat ability. Notice that during the entire fight against Kid and Law, Big Mom is underestimating the boyz. Even when they have the advantage.
So the problem here is not that Oda is not making Big Mom use conqueror haki in her fight, it's that you guys are completely missunderstanding or ignoring Big Mom's characterization.
And its ok to feel that way. That's your point of view.
And they are all wrong lol
Not really no, as the "plot hole" criticism is completely baseless.
Me neither, I will only judge when you make an affirmation about a fight or a storytelling point. Your tastes are yours.
Technically, my point was this one: Everything point toward the fact of Carrot joining the crew. While my conclusion was wrong (that everything was pointing toward Carrot becoming a strawhat) my reasonning was perfectly correct in the sence that everything was indeed pointing toward Carrot becoming someone important. (And I still think that Carrot was meant to be a strawhat at one point).
The storytelling don't lie.
And I was right and wrong. carrot did not became a strawhat, but her story was heading toward something that put her on the throne.. Which is BTW.. still something strange narratively to this day.
In short what I was trying to prove in that thread was not really my conclusion, it was my reasonning. And you can see that multiple time when I dissect the storylines bit by bit to show you were there is something important to consider.
For example: The way Oda linked Carrot to the post of Lookout through storytelling (in differents ways) is not common and this should be something that make us raise our eyebrows (even to this day).
Conclusions can be wrong, but storytelling never lie.
Is it perfect execution of the story? No. What does that even look like? Some fans think they know for a story they haven’t come up with, but still feverishly follow. Sometimes I think this forum is full of spoiled fans who head cannon too much. Question, if it always went their way then what? Then they would be complaining that it’s predictable.
OP simultaneously is a trope shonen manga AND has its uniqueness. That’s why people talk about it.
Completely, Like I mentionned earlier, Wano has a lot of little weaknesses here and there (just like arc like Water Seven and Marineford had at the time)... but really the core of the story is just amazing. Wano is not a 10 obviously, its not an 9 either because I think that there are better arcs but its definitely a 8/8.5
Good then that I was not talking in general, but I was talking about Wano.
https://worstgen.alwaysdata.net/for...week-to-week-or-binge-read.37473/post-3904526
To some extent, yes, but I find Wano too long and boring nevertheless.
Yes, and I said what ideas I found bad.
End of story for me, because, like I said, I don't need to justify or explain myself about what I don't like.
In one word: no. At least, not for me.
And you hate thinking before writing?
Lol
I don't know if this is more insulting or retarded
Because I don't have to give you anything lol.
You asked why I don't like Wano, I reponded "I didn't like this". I don't have to explain or worst Justify my tastes lol.
And again, in this case I didn't like it; you do: good for you.
Good for you, again, but I didn't.
Mirror climbing champion here.
But again: if you like it, who am I to say that you shouldn't?
They are painfully right unfortunately, but as I said there are fifty threads about that.
But I'll repeat myself: for our purposes, you could understand why not liking (at all) the Nika Nika had impacted on my Wano rating.
Lol.
Then we are ok.
Yes, I agree and because of that I was talking about how good or bad a story could be perceived. His reasoning was that if a story is well constructed, than it is automatically good, which isn't.
https://worstgen.alwaysdata.net/for...week-to-week-or-binge-read.37473/post-3904526
To some extent, yes, but I find Wano too long and boring nevertheless.
Yes, and I said what ideas I found bad.
End of story for me, because, like I said, I don't need to justify or explain myself about what I don't like.
In one word: no. At least, not for me.
And you hate thinking before writing?
Lol
I don't know if this is more insulting or retarded
Because I don't have to give you anything lol.
You asked why I don't like Wano, I reponded "I didn't like this". I don't have to explain or worst Justify my tastes lol.
And again, in this case I didn't like it; you do: good for you.
Good for you, again, but I didn't.
Mirror climbing champion here.
But again: if you like it, who am I to say that you shouldn't?
They are painfully right unfortunately, but as I said there are fifty threads about that.
But I'll repeat myself: for our purposes, you could understand why not liking (at all) the Nika Nika had impacted on my Wano rating.
Lol.
Then we are ok.
Post automatically merged:
Yes, I agree and because of that I was talking about how good or bad a story could be perceived. His reasoning was that if a story is well constructed, than it is automatically good, which isn't.
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Even a basic understanding of Oda's story telling and habits would let one know that Carrot wasn't going to be a SH. Your arguments depended on Oda doing something he's never done before and just called it story telling.
Ever character meant to be a SH has massive thematic importance and presence in their arc. Carrot never got that.
Every SH had ties to a villain that Luffy had to defeat for them. Carrot never got that.
Every SH was directly involved in the central conflicts and battles and Carrot didn't get that. She was completely separated from the main battles in Wano and off screened. Even before that, Carrot was even removed from the main plotlines during the build up phase.
Your argument was that Oda was setting Carrot up for something bigger, something Oda has never done before. He has never dismissed his main characters like that when they are supposed to join the SHs.
Ever character meant to be a SH has massive thematic importance and presence in their arc. Carrot never got that.
Every SH had ties to a villain that Luffy had to defeat for them. Carrot never got that.
Every SH was directly involved in the central conflicts and battles and Carrot didn't get that. She was completely separated from the main battles in Wano and off screened. Even before that, Carrot was even removed from the main plotlines during the build up phase.
Your argument was that Oda was setting Carrot up for something bigger, something Oda has never done before. He has never dismissed his main characters like that when they are supposed to join the SHs.