@Logiko how can you possibly justify only giving Kuma 12% for his giant tragic childhood flashback? If he doesn't join, he will be only the 3rd character in the series to get this kind of childhood flashback and not join the crew. 2nd if you count Vivi as a nakama. That on its own is a better predictor of a nakama than 90% of your list combined. And as for a character with a role, a dream, and a multichapter tragic childhood flashback? Literally never happened to a character that didn't join the crew. Your "system" rates characters with none of that higher just because they got a cool double spread you call a "shining nakama action".
General & Others Next Straw Hat Crew Members and the Grand Fleet
- Thread starter Uncle Van
- Start date
- Tags #c4ng2g carrot fans are still losers carrot haters are real losers seethe at the rabbit carrot is doing nothing because she doesn't matter carrot will never join the straw hats carrot's story never even began cry about carrot everyone else in the verse neg diffs the bunny imagine thinking stussy won't join its over furry bros keep the bunny on zou nobody else needs her let it go furry bros momo is breeding yamato no character is less relevant than carrot oden larper fans can't read stussy > carrot & yamato stussy supremacy who will be the next nakama of the week? yamato always had a better chance than carrot yamato story is over
12 % is the max
Plus I gave him also the max in strong character arc.
This is a good flashback but the fact that its starts at childhood is simply to explains his story and why he had to suffer.
Its not.
A flashback usually shows the childhood because its the part where you can easily creates empathy with the readers. But this is not something common to all the strawhats, you can do awesome backstories or character arc without showing the childhood. Its less easy but still possible. So this is not a parameter that should be taken into consideration. Its important, but its a simple consequence of the nature of the tragedy and the character arc.
Before putting a parameter in the system of prediction. You first need to ask yourself whats the role of this parameter in the story ? In this case, its creating empathy. Its also a result of the way the flashbacks are done and an economy of work. Its therefore not a parameter related to the creation of a strawhat, its just a sub parameters of characterization. Something that can be put in the parameters "tragedy" or "Strong character arc".
My system simply rates the shining Nakama action higher than any other parameters because this parameter is related to the post and it is something that only 11 people had until now. So that's even rarer than a dream/desire, a strong backstory or a tragedy. If this parameter wasn't related to the post and extremmely important thematically, I wouldn't give it so much importance.
I only do maths here. No bias, I'm being very cold with this prediction model.
You really need to understand that and stop being so bias about me.
Plus I gave him also the max in strong character arc.
This is a good flashback but the fact that its starts at childhood is simply to explains his story and why he had to suffer.
Its not.
A flashback usually shows the childhood because its the part where you can easily creates empathy with the readers. But this is not something common to all the strawhats, you can do awesome backstories or character arc without showing the childhood. Its less easy but still possible. So this is not a parameter that should be taken into consideration. Its important, but its a simple consequence of the nature of the tragedy and the character arc.
Before putting a parameter in the system of prediction. You first need to ask yourself whats the role of this parameter in the story ? In this case, its creating empathy. Its also a result of the way the flashbacks are done and an economy of work. Its therefore not a parameter related to the creation of a strawhat, its just a sub parameters of characterization. Something that can be put in the parameters "tragedy" or "Strong character arc".
My system simply rates the shining Nakama action higher than any other parameters because this parameter is related to the post and it is something that only 11 people had until now. So that's even rarer than a dream/desire, a strong backstory or a tragedy. If this parameter wasn't related to the post and extremmely important thematically, I wouldn't give it so much importance.
I only do maths here. No bias, I'm being very cold with this prediction model.
You really need to understand that and stop being so bias about me.
Last edited:
Look bro. I think Logiko is completely wrong the majority of the time. In fact, I'd argue that he and I are diametrically opposed on most issues and points, both regarding One Piece and the real world (as evidenced by our debates in the Politics Thread). However, even if Logiko has stated on this forum his medical issues, there is absolutely -no need- to put him on blast.
The high narcissism is not something he has confirmed, and such a claim from somebody who is not qualified to make such a diagnosis is misinformed at best and toxic at worst.
Basically, don't attack him as a person. Just attack his arguments. Fucking hell.
Also, y'all still sleeping on Vivi. She's definitely next Nakama.
The high narcissism is not something he has confirmed, and such a claim from somebody who is not qualified to make such a diagnosis is misinformed at best and toxic at worst.
Basically, don't attack him as a person. Just attack his arguments. Fucking hell.
Also, y'all still sleeping on Vivi. She's definitely next Nakama.
Last edited:
While I think we’ll get more members of the crew I don’t think luffy will get more commanders
Post wano oda went out of his way to label the main crew as luffy’s senior officers. I don’t think it makes much sense to 10+ an arc later
Plus them all hearing luffy’s post pirate king dream together too makes me feel there won’t be more senior officers either
I do think kuma in some some shape or form but not in an expected way. I still think his role would be ship guard tho
Like I saw a theory that the sunny itself will get his fruit. Idk if that would really work but it could be cool imo. The fruit and memories going to something related to the sunny in general could be cool. Him having ties to nika the sun god and being tied to the thousand sunny would be cool
Thinking about it he and Jinbe could be a cool duo lol
Post wano oda went out of his way to label the main crew as luffy’s senior officers. I don’t think it makes much sense to 10+ an arc later
Plus them all hearing luffy’s post pirate king dream together too makes me feel there won’t be more senior officers either
I do think kuma in some some shape or form but not in an expected way. I still think his role would be ship guard tho
Like I saw a theory that the sunny itself will get his fruit. Idk if that would really work but it could be cool imo. The fruit and memories going to something related to the sunny in general could be cool. Him having ties to nika the sun god and being tied to the thousand sunny would be cool
Thinking about it he and Jinbe could be a cool duo lol
You can try and explain why it goes back to his childhood all you want, but the fact is that the list of multichapter childhood flashbacks is various strawhats, Vivi, Law, and Kuma. It doesn't "usually" go back to childhood for non strawhats. Especially not while establishing their dream. That category is just strawhats and Kuma. Yet Carrot gets almost double Kuma's score. My point is that it seems like you criteria was reverse enginered to give Carrot a high score, because there's no other way that's possible.
No its just "SOME" strawhats and Kuma.
Yes for good reason, she has interacted with Luffy far more, and she has a post no matter what. So of course she is ahead.
And still Carrot is second.
Let's look at the differences:
Carrot gets : 72%
And
Kuma gets: 41%
I tried and I can't erease any of those Pillar as they are foundamental to the creation and the characterization of a strawhat.
What Kuma lack is:
- A thematic incarnation (I believe we will have a confirmation of that next chapter) +2%
- A desire and a need. Kuma is blank right now. +10%
- To be rescued, I believe we will have that in the future +11%
- To be invited by Luffy +7
- A post +14%
- A action related to this post +15%
In short, I think Kuma can will at least go to 64%, but no more as I don't think he will have a post, be invited by Luffy or have an nice action related to the post.
As for Carrot, she lacks:
- A strong character arc +5
- A desire +5
- To be rescued by the gang +11
- To be invited by Luffy +7
This means that if Carrot goes back to the story and if Oda starts a character arc for her, it would mean that I'm right, and Carrot could EASILY go to 100% in less than a single arc.
Yes for good reason, she has interacted with Luffy far more, and she has a post no matter what. So of course she is ahead.
And still Carrot is second.
Let's look at the differences:
- The Antagonistic introduction. 3% Both checks that. 3 % for both
- The Multi layered characterization. 5% Same 5% for both
- The Symbolic reach. 8% Carrot checks all the boxes but Kuma lacks the thematic incarnation (FOR NOW, at least in my interpretation, you can give me yours if you want) so he gets only 3/4 (6%) and Carrot 4/4 (8%)
- A Strong character arc. 9% Kuma (9%) checks, but not Carrot who had only a small character arc half the point (4%)
- Hint of the 2 driving forces. 10% Here we need a desire and a need. There is a clear need for Carrot but not desire, and (at least for now) no desire and no need for Kuma. So Carrot gets 5% and Kuma 0%
- The Rescue. 11% None get the point here
- A Tragedy. 12% Both gets 12% here
- The Double Nakama link. 13% Carrot loves Luffy enough to follow him but its not reciproque and there is no sign of Kuma following Luffy or Luffy wanting to recruit Kuma. So I gave 6 for Carrot here and 6 for Kuma (Nika follow)
- The Post. 14% Only Carrot gets the points here as no post as been foreshadowed for Kuma
- The Shining Nakama Action. 15% Only Carrot gets the points here as no actions related to a post were put in motion for Kuma
Carrot gets : 72%
And
Kuma gets: 41%
I tried and I can't erease any of those Pillar as they are foundamental to the creation and the characterization of a strawhat.
What Kuma lack is:
- A thematic incarnation (I believe we will have a confirmation of that next chapter) +2%
- A desire and a need. Kuma is blank right now. +10%
- To be rescued, I believe we will have that in the future +11%
- To be invited by Luffy +7
- A post +14%
- A action related to this post +15%
In short, I think Kuma can will at least go to 64%, but no more as I don't think he will have a post, be invited by Luffy or have an nice action related to the post.
As for Carrot, she lacks:
- A strong character arc +5
- A desire +5
- To be rescued by the gang +11
- To be invited by Luffy +7
This means that if Carrot goes back to the story and if Oda starts a character arc for her, it would mean that I'm right, and Carrot could EASILY go to 100% in less than a single arc.
I didn't say all strawhats have it, but literally no non-strawhats have it. The list is Luffy, Sanji, Nami, Chopper, Robin, Franky, and Kuma. Add Ussop and Zoro if you want to ignore the multiple chapter aspect. I don't care what your weird headcannon neologisms say, that's way more important than a "shining nakama" moment or a slightly more obvious but no more valid role.