Controversial General Political Discussion

[Photon]

I don't recall making such claims. Another fool joins my ignore list.

Lmao, first you said Israel and jew in the same sentence as if criticizing israel would also directly mean criticizing jew. Then you said it is not a big deal and i show you why it is a big deal to make a distinction

And wow, why would i care about your ignore list lmao, people sure as hell would be glad to know it you think?

Sure then, bye another israel's dog, i'm sure you would be a great dog to them

 

[Jew D. Boy]

In case anyone’s curious, I am not a supporter of Israel and have been vilified by others in my community as a result; I find it very contradictory and heinous for a group of people who have faced multiple genocides to so gleefully cheer on the kind of massacres that Bibi and his cronies visit upon Gaza every single fucking day

 

[ShinmenTakezo]

You gotta give it to Trump and the administration, they are keeping everyone on their toes....

- Tariff reduction/pause with China
- Price control of pharma
- Accepts a 747 from Qatar
- Refugees from South Africa
- 600 billion to 1 trillion investment deal with Saudis (plus they played YMCA at the investment forum later )
- Breaks with Bibi
- Removes sanctions from Syria
- Mediates between India and Pakistan
- Probably will go to Istanbul for peace talks

Forgot about inflation for April at 2,3 %

Not an edit...

 

[Midnight Delight]

@Monkey D Theories fun fact
The White Lotus in China is technically Abrahamic or at least half Gnostic

 

[NAMELESS]

Lmao, first you said Israel and jew in the same sentence as if criticizing israel would also directly mean criticizing jew. Then you said it is not a big deal and i show you why it is a big deal to make a distinction

And wow, why would i care about your ignore list lmao, people sure as hell would be glad to know it you think?

Sure then, bye another israel's dog, i'm sure you would be a great dog to them

Listen, retard, you don't even know what my takes are. I don't support or condene Israel. I don't have a dog is this race. You are literally putting words in my mouth and reading shit i never typed. You need to work on your reading comprehension, son. You are assuming i said that shit when i didn't. I'm putting you on the ignore list cause i'm tired of debating c4n like users. Bye, snowflake.

Post automatically merged: May 13, 2025

In case anyone’s curious, I am not a supporter of Israel and have been vilified by others in my community as a result; I find it very contradictory and heinous for a group of people who have faced multiple genocides to so gleefully cheer on the kind of massacres that Bibi and his cronies visit upon Gaza every single fucking day

We are all fucked. If you criticize Israel, you are a Hamas supporter. If you don't, you are genocide supporter. People are fucking dumb and can't think for themselves.

 

[Jew D. Boy]

We are all fucked. If you criticize Israel, you are a Hamas supporter. If you don't, you are genocide supporter. People are fucking dumb and can't think for themselves.

I just don’t see how anyone can see and hear about Israel bombing Palestinian schools and hospitals under the guise of rooting out the same terrorists they helped create and think they have the moral high ground, it drives me up the fucking wall…it’s a nuanced situation, and of course I want Jews to have a place to call their own, but we were nomads for centuries and that sliver of land is meaningful to multiple religions, so to act as though we’re the only ones who can lay claim is just asinine in my opinion.

 

[Monkey D Theories]

@Monkey D Theories fun fact
The White Lotus in China is technically Abrahamic or at least half Gnostic

Are you talking about the guys who are trying to find Maitreya, the successor of the Shakyamuni Buddha? Or is this something different?

Post automatically merged: May 13, 2025

But somehow I met Jews in real life who've eaten beacon in front of me because they "aren't muslim but jewish" and they were the kind of jews who supported an ongoing genocide pretending that people in the videos were either actors or made by AI. After this day I had to rethink everything I knew, I either met the most retarded Jews who didn't know shit about their religion or I was wrong about pork being forbidden ? But every time I checked a source, it said it was forbidden. This event that took place years ago now left a mark on me. And made me question myself. Why are people I meet outside of my social circles retarded ?

Jews are an ethnoreligious group. You can be ethnically ashkenazi/sephardic/etc. but religiously atheistic, a you can be a frum convert with no ethnic ties, or something in between.

The people you were talking about were probably atheistic/secular.

Most religious Jews either outright don’t eat pork, or if they do, they’d still acknowledge it’s a sin(albeit probably not a big one).

 

[NAMELESS]

I just don’t see how anyone can see and hear about Israel bombing Palestinian schools and hospitals under the guise of rooting out the same terrorists they helped create and think they have the moral high ground, it drives me up the fucking wall…it’s a nuanced situation, and of course I want Jews to have a place to call their own, but we were nomads for centuries and that sliver of land is meaningful to multiple religions, so to act as though we’re the only ones who can lay claim is just asinine in my opinion.

"It's colateral damage that happens in war" is the argument that the Herrera types throw at this. Imagine if the Brazilian army bombed the favelas to off the drug dealers. Not even Bukele of El Salvador did something so radical. Religious and political bias has blinded some people.

 

[Midnight Delight]

Are you talking about the guys who are trying to find Maitreya, the successor of the Shakyamuni Buddha? Or is this something different?

Yes
Maitreya being turned into some Jesus figure who was gonna salvage mankind was basically them trying to reconcile Mani's religion with Buddhism and Confucius

 

[Monkey D Theories]

Yes
Maitreya being turned into some Jesus figure who was gonna salvage mankind was basically them trying to reconcile Mani's religion with Buddhism and Confucius

I don’t consider it abrahamic unless a figure from abrahamic lore is actually involved

Else this is about as Abrahamic as One Piece because Jesus, Maitreya, and Luffy are all saviors of mankind.

Post automatically merged: May 13, 2025

In case anyone’s curious, I am not a supporter of Israel and have been vilified by others in my community as a result; I find it very contradictory and heinous for a group of people who have faced multiple genocides to so gleefully cheer on the kind of massacres that Bibi and his cronies visit upon Gaza every single fucking day

I really dislike religious Zionism

I get how the land of eretz Israel is important to the Jewish religion, and how Jews naturally have ties to Israel due to having friends/family that live there.

but I hate the idea that support for the state of Israel, which was created less than a century ago, is somehow an integral part of a 1000+ year old religion.

Post automatically merged: May 13, 2025

Anyways sucks people would vilify you over this. People genuinely need to stop getting so offended over a conflict in a land across the sea.

 

[Jew D. Boy]

I really dislike religious Zionism

I get how the land of eretz Israel is important to the Jewish religion, and how Jews naturally have ties to Israel due to having friends/family that live there.

but I hate the idea that support for the state of Israel, which was created less than a century ago, is somehow an integral part of a 1000+ year old religion.

That last bit is what I say to my mother and other naysayers, why should we tie our entire cultural identity to a country that didn’t properly exist until just after WWII? To me, doing that diminishes all other aspects of our belief system and portrays us as a monolith when there are plenty of others who don’t support this shit…

 

[Ravagerblade]

The land of Jerusalem and yet you can't grasp the significance of it etc...
A people with no home them, cast them out to be nomads, people without a country.

Optics don't look good then.
You have to face that nothing in this world is going to be perfect.

 

[Monkey D Theories]

That last bit is what I say to my mother and other naysayers, why should we tie our entire cultural identity to a country that didn’t properly exist until just after WWII? To me, doing that diminishes all other aspects of our belief system and portrays us as a monolith when there are plenty of others who don’t support this shit…

the more extreme versions of Zionism honestly seem like a cult

Like if you tell me you want to go to the Middle East to settle occupied land or fight a war for the purpose of empowering a religious state, it ngl doesn’t sound too different from what people radicalized by ISIS do.

And this isn’t to say Israel = ISIS, because there is some liberal secular aspect to Israeli society. But the version of Israel the religious Zionists want to create tbh sounds like Jewish ISIS.

 

[Reborn]

War of Narratives

In today’s world, information is no longer just about facts—it’s about influence.

Media outlets and various information sources engage in a constant war of narratives, where each side frames events in a way that serves specific interests.

These outlets usually operate with two main motives: maximizing viewership by tailoring content to public sentiment, and advancing state or corporate interests based on the region they belong to.

These narratives are emotionally charged. They are designed not just to inform, but to provoke emotional reactions—anger, fear, pride, or sympathy—often at the cost of objectivity. This emotional manipulation can override logic and cloud judgment.



People respond differently to these narratives.

Some align easily due to confirmation bias—accepting only what fits their pre-existing beliefs.

Others, equipped with critical thinking and fact-checking tools, question and resist such influence.

Yet many fall into echo chambers, surrounded by friends, family, and communities that reinforce the same narrative, sometimes out of a need for social acceptance.


Narratives have power. They can unify people for a cause or polarize societies.

No single source offers the absolute reality. Instead, truth lies buried beneath layers of perspective, agenda, and perception.



During war, every side in a war presents its own version of why the war started—self-defense, liberation, revenge, or protection of values.

These narratives justify actions of a state and rally public support.

Media often glorifies its own soldiers and demonizes the enemy - humanize one, dehumanize others. This makes it easier to gain support and justify violence.

Governments censor or shape media to maintain public morale and international image. They shape the flow of information.

Then, fake news, propaganda, selective footage, and emotionally charged images are used to control public opinion.


And, same thing happens in the global arena.

People who challenge the dominant narrative are often labeled unpatriotic, traitors, or enemy sympathizers and becomes object of ridicule within their own community.

This reduces space for peace voices or critical thinking during war.

Worst part is, narratives outlast actual wars. They shape history books, national memory, and future generations identities—often keeping old hatreds alive.


And, common men like us? We are the targets or shall I say "victim" of such narrative influence and then "agents" of propagation of such narratives.

 

[notAfanboy]

Worst part is, narratives outlast actual wars. They shape history books, national memory, and future generations identities—often keeping old hatreds alive.

And I agree. And more concerning is that BJP has mastered this tactic.

You may want to read this book by an Indian author Swati Chaturvedi in 2016:

I Am a Troll: Inside the Secret World of the BJP's Digital Army

Summary:

I Am a Troll: Inside the Secret World of the BJP's Digital Army by Swati Chaturvedi exposes the BJP's organized use of social media to manipulate public discourse. The book reveals how the party's IT cell orchestrates coordinated trolling campaigns, targeting critics with abuse and misinformation. Sadhavi Khosla, a former volunteer, provides insider testimony on directives to attack dissenters and trend specific hashtags. Chaturvedi highlights that Prime Minister Modi follows several abusive accounts, suggesting tacit endorsement. The book underscores the impact on democratic dialogue, where dissent is suppressed through digital intimidation. For her courageous reporting, Chaturvedi received the RSF Press Freedom Award in 2018.

In addition, check out European Disinfo Lab's report on Indian disinfo campaign:

Indian Chronicles: deep dive into a 15-year operation targeting the EU and UN to serve Indian interests


Summary:

The operation’s mission is to discredit nations in conflict with India in Asia, in particular Pakistan but also China to a lesser extent. Its long-term objective is:

• In India, to reinforce pro-Indian and anti-Pakistan (and anti-Chinese) feelings.
• Internationally, to consolidate the power and improve the perception of India, to damage the reputation of other countries and ultimately benefit from more support from international institutions such as the EU and the UN.

Also, do some research on:

How indian moderators influence content on Twitter/X

Summary:
Indian moderators hired by social media platforms like X (formerly Twitter) play a significant role in content moderation, impacting what users see and what is removed from the platform.
The problem is, X is outsourcing moderation from Indian cells (because they are cheap). And it has consequences; killing emerging trends that go against Indian narrative, modifying Grok responses, fooling fact checks, and so on.

More on this here:

https://www.techpolicy.press/how-pl...-escalating-harm-in-the-indiapakistan-crisis/


While it is a global problem, India is the epicenter of this issue.

Ready to debate further if you are willing to do so. 👍🏻

 

[Brush D. Teeth]

It's funny when you see a bunch of Indian accounts praise Giorgia Meloni under her tweets in perfect Italian.

 

[Reborn]

And I agree. And more concerning is that BJP has mastered this tactic.

You may want to read this book by an Indian author Swati Chaturvedi in 2016:

I Am a Troll: Inside the Secret World of the BJP's Digital Army

Summary:

I Am a Troll: Inside the Secret World of the BJP's Digital Army by Swati Chaturvedi exposes the BJP's organized use of social media to manipulate public discourse. The book reveals how the party's IT cell orchestrates coordinated trolling campaigns, targeting critics with abuse and misinformation. Sadhavi Khosla, a former volunteer, provides insider testimony on directives to attack dissenters and trend specific hashtags. Chaturvedi highlights that Prime Minister Modi follows several abusive accounts, suggesting tacit endorsement. The book underscores the impact on democratic dialogue, where dissent is suppressed through digital intimidation. For her courageous reporting, Chaturvedi received the RSF Press Freedom Award in 2018.

In addition, check out European Disinfo Lab's report on Indian disinfo campaign:

Indian Chronicles: deep dive into a 15-year operation targeting the EU and UN to serve Indian interests


Summary:

The operation’s mission is to discredit nations in conflict with India in Asia, in particular Pakistan but also China to a lesser extent. Its long-term objective is:

• In India, to reinforce pro-Indian and anti-Pakistan (and anti-Chinese) feelings.
• Internationally, to consolidate the power and improve the perception of India, to damage the reputation of other countries and ultimately benefit from more support from international institutions such as the EU and the UN.

Also, do some research on:

How indian moderators influence content on Twitter/X

Summary:
Indian moderators hired by social media platforms like X (formerly Twitter) play a significant role in content moderation, impacting what users see and what is removed from the platform.
The problem is, X is outsourcing moderation from Indian cells (because they are cheap). And it has consequences; killing emerging trends that go against Indian narrative, modifying Grok responses, fooling fact checks, and so on.

More on this here:

https://www.techpolicy.press/how-pl...-escalating-harm-in-the-indiapakistan-crisis/


While it is a global problem, India is the epicenter of this issue.

Ready to debate further if you are willing to do so. 👍🏻

Epicenter? That's a reach

How many years since India or Pakistan or similarly situated countries got independence?

War of narratives precede that.


West has global media dominance.

West has global tech companies

West is governing the social media platforms


West has academia institutions with global presence - and, now a hub for global issues.

West poke their noses in other people businesses.

And, they are doing so for a long time.


China has state controlled media, social platforms, web and economy outreach through its BRI.

And, you say India is at the epicenter?

India just like your country or any other emerging countries are rising players in the war of narratives. We are simply rising faster.



But this isn't the point I wanted to make.

Just like you quoted some sources, I can do the same.

we all can do it in Israel vs Palestine, Russia va Ukraine and so on.

It's tit for tat.

Our ancestors did it, we are doing it and our future generations would do the same - because issues and wars aren't going anywhere

Because what we are doing is playing the role of "agent" of the narratives.

It's funny when you see a bunch of Indian accounts praise Giorgia Meloni under her tweets in perfect Italian.

Glad some of my people were able to make you laugh

 

[notAfanboy]

Our ancestors did it, we are doing it and our future generations would do the same - because issues and wars aren't going anywhere

Because what we are doing is playing the role of "agent" of the narratives.

True, I agree.

I called India the epicenter because most of the social media moderation centers are now in India, especially Hyderabad. And also because of its 1.5 billion population. China is comparable, but Chinese are not as active on social media platforms as Indians.
We already know West's tactics, but the social media took the narrative wars to next level. According to me, India is winning in this regard. Just my opinion.

By the way, Pakistan's Imran Khan was doing the same as BJP; manipulating youth through twitter trends and social media. However, security forces closed their social media wing, arrested social media team, and banned twitter for some time.

Sadly, the scale of these operations is so big that no matter what you do, common people are sure to be influenced by it.


And... this is the reason USA is trying to get rid of TikTok.

You are right, winners write history and their narrative is also accepted. But we are experiencing it in real time, and those who are aware of this war front, can tell the difference. I would argue that even those who know the difference will still be obliged to follow the forced narrative because of their affiliations, history, and loyalty to respective parties.

And this is where terms like traitor, terrorist sympathizer, and apologist are used.

We are cooked either way.

 

[Reborn]

True, I agree.

I called India the epicenter because most of the social media moderation centers are now in India, especially Hyderabad. And also because of its 1.5 billion population. China is comparable, but Chinese are not as active on social media platforms as Indians.
We already know West's tactics, but the social media took the narrative wars to next level. According to me, India is winning in this regard. Just my opinion.

By the way, Pakistan's Imran Khan was doing the same as BJP; manipulating youth through twitter trends and social media. However, security forces closed their social media wing, arrested social media team, and banned twitter for some time.

Sadly, the scale of these operations is so big that no matter what you do, common people are sure to be influenced by it.


And... this is the reason USA is trying to get rid of TikTok.

You are right, winners write history and their narrative is also accepted. But we are experiencing it in real time, and those who are aware of this war front, can tell the difference. I would argue that even those who know the difference will still be obliged to follow the forced narrative because of their affiliations, history, and loyalty to respective parties.

And this is where terms like traitor, terrorist sympathizer, and apologist are used.

We are cooked either way.

I can assure you one thing - Indians do praise few things about Pakistan - food, similarity in culture and so on.


When BLA - (if I am not wrong Balochistan comprises nearly 40% of Pakistan total area), recently proclaimed Independence from Pakistan and seeked India's help against your own government - we refused saying it's Pakistan internal affairs.


The narratives in Pakistan is not our concern tbh. You can do whatever you like.

Bigger concerns are how a terrorist who beheaded US journalist Daniel pearl was roaming free in Pakistan?

How terror organization who openly took responsibility of hijack of our plane and attack on the parliament was operating openly in the Pakistan?

How Osama was found in the Pakistan?

Why US sneaked into Pakistan to kill Osama without notifying Pakistan own government?

Are you telling me Pakistan authorities are unaware of these organizations - who are versed in combats? How can a state be unaware of these individuals who are working openly?

I saw videos of these individuals giving speeches from your own backyard.


I myself saw video of army giving state funerals to these terrorists.

I, myself saw Pakistani Defense Minister openly admitting on live tv - that Pakistan funded and supported terror organizations for 3 decades and used them as proxies.

Then, how come your state not cracking down on them?

And, these are US wanted terrorists - UN wanted terrorists I am talking about.


With Pakistan, it's never about narrative war- you can have that - but your own authorities not cracking down on these individuals, who on air took responsibilities of terror attacks on India is the massive concern.

And, this is the biggest bone of contention from India's side.

If these terrorists operate openly and your state is aware yet doesn't do anything despite fully knowing, that their cells openly took responsibility of terror attacks, then what should we infer from this?

 

[notAfanboy]

I can assure you one thing - Indians do praise few things about Pakistan - food, similarity in culture and so on.


When BLA - (if I am not wrong Balochistan comprises nearly 40% of Pakistan total area), recently proclaimed Independence from Pakistan and seeked India's help against your own government - we refused saying it's Pakistan internal affairs.


The narratives in Pakistan is not our concern tbh. You can do whatever you like.

Bigger concerns are how a terrorists who beheaded Daniel pearl was roaming free in Pakistan?

How terror organization who openly took responsibility of hijack of our plane and attack on the parliament was operation openly in the Pakistan?

How Osama was found in the Pakistan?

Why US sneaked into Pakistan to kill Osama without notifying Pakistan own government?

Are you telling me Pakistan authorities are unaware of these organizations - who are versed in combats? How can a state be unaware of these individuals working openly? I, myself saw videos of these individuals giving speeches.


I, myself saw video of army giving state funerals to these terrorists.

I, myself saw Pakistani Defense Minister openly admitting on live tv - that Pakistan funded and supported terror organizations for 3 decades.


With Pakistan, it's never about narrative war- you can have that - but your own authorities not cracking down on these individuals who on air took responsibilities of terror attacks on India.

Are we starting this again?
Dont you ever get tired of these shitty arguments?

Who supported BLA in the first place? What Kalbushan Yadav was doing in Balochistan and why is he still in Pakistan's custody?
Why India helped BLA in Jaffar Express attack?
Why BLA injured terrorist is under medical treatment in India?
Why India admitted to their plan of separating Bangladesh from Pakistan?
Why Indian government officials are siding with and helping Talibans, who are doing terrorism in Pakistan?
Why your government officials say we will use Talibans to do terrorist activity in Pakistan?
Why the butcher of Gujrat was stopped from entering USA?
Why RSS men, who admitted that they burned Muslims alive, were freed without any charge under BJP government?
Why dont you ask BJP how RSS was inspired by Nazi SS?
Why a terrorist like Modi your Prime Minister?
Why India is building dams on Pakistani side of rivers?
Why Punjabis are raising their voice for Khalistan?
Why India killed Punjabi activists in Canada?
What's India north south divide? Why Hindu belt is hated in India? Care to explain?

Centre forcibly deports 43 Rohingya refugees by abandoning them in international waters: Plea in Supreme Court
Source; Indian Express

The questions you asked have already been answered, Google is your friend. Most of our mistakes stem from being proxy of USA in Afghanistan against Russia. But we have made progress, not in FATF grey list anymore. It happened after USA withdrawal from Afghanistan, and without that it would not have been possible.
And it is the same USA that your current government is bending knees to. You cant oppose super powers.
China just declared Arunachal Pardesh as Zangnan. Why dont you go and fight China? Or you just want to bully weaker opponents? What are you going to do about your defeat against China?
Why turn silent when it comes to China?
The same happened with us when USA came to Afghanistan. We had to pay the price, and we are still paying the price to date. And this is the reason USA still supports Pakistan despite India's geopolitical advantage.


I thought you would be a bit more sensible after our earlier discussion. But you are back to your BJP Hinduvta narrative.

These things cannot be discussed in vaccume, especially because everything is related to each other. And I dont think a BJP andhbakt like you has any intellectual capacity to understand these complex issues.


I dont like toxicity, but if this is what you want, be my guest as I take sips from the fantastic tea. Want some?