Controversial Be smart and quit One Piece OR admit you love it

Detatch your ego from One Piece, you're just a consumer, critique of one piece is not a critique of your existence.
A decade ago I spent hundreds of hours watching this thing, so I have a right to skim it for 5 minutes every couple weeks.

You can't police other people's reaction to the story.
I hope someday you find a forum that does nothing but praise One Piece, so you don't have to feel these negative emotions.
It's not about just One Piece
It's not about just me or my ego
It's much more than just me asking for more positivity or ranting about baseless One Piece fans.

It's about something many people are complaining about all over the internet and many people here are in denial about.

It's about a shift in the consumption of serial narrative material and its effect on people and communities.

It's about pointing a problem in the very fabric of EVERY fanbases and trying to find a solution to maintain their coherency before we destroy them AND/OR their related material/media under the hammer of capitalism and brainless consumption.
 
I think the one thing that has undeniably changed between Pre & Post TS is pacing. That's really the main thing that actually annoys people.

100-150 chapters Pre-TS gave you a whole saga. 100-150 chapters Post-TS it is giving you singular arcs like Dressrosa and Wano. I do not see why for example Dressrosa Arc should be longer than the entire Summit War Saga. Lol.

Pacing is the king of entertainment value. Screw that up and everything else collapses.
I agree.

Oda is a good writer. But as much as they say Shueisha gives him free reign, I'm assuming he's under pressure to finish the series.

He has been overbloating the arcs. It's very apparent that he's trying to wrap up most of the story with Wano, Egghead and Elbaf with the amount of flashbacks and lore dumping we've been getting. It tanked his writing quality as a result.

Pretty ironic that they're rushing him now though, considering it was the editors fault the story kept getting longer to begin with lol. I recall Oda saying One Piece was supposed have been finished but they kept telling him to add stuff, like the Supernova etc.
 
I agree.

Oda is a good writer. But as much as they say Shueisha gives him free reign, I'm assuming he's under pressure to finish the series.

He has been overbloating the arcs. It's very apparent that he's trying to wrap up most of the story with Wano, Egghead and Elbaf with the amount of flashbacks and lore dumping we've been getting. It tanked his writing quality as a result.

Pretty ironic that they're rushing him now though, considering it was the editors fault the story kept getting longer to begin with lol. I recall Oda saying One Piece was supposed have been finished but they kept telling him to add stuff, like the Supernova etc.
The "overbloating" is a relative standpoint. In reality only the amount of content inside the arcs changed. Their pacing never really evolved dramatically.

What makes people "think" Oda has a pacing problem is the fact that he scraped the simplicity of his worldbuilding away. Pretimeskip One Piece is amazing but in term of nuance of characters and thematics, it stays on a regular level. The lengh of Post-timeskip arcs allows for a much better display of these nuances and thematics. BUT it renders pacing lengh (that have always been there) much more visible.

The question is, is this a good choice or a bad one?

For the weekly reading/watching, it is a risky choice. It slighly stretches the reading experience, creating more spaces between fundamental elements such as characterization moments or important storytelling data.

Which is why most people here reading weekly or in partiality think that One Piece is simple when in reality, it's the complete opposite. One Piece is deep there are a LOT of important subtle informations to take in and I know for a fact most people who trash on One Piece don't understand the majority of these subtleness.

But One Piece is more than just a weekly reading experience.

It's also an anime that is meant to be read in bulk
. As such the elements that are spaced too far become much more visible and the characterizations are much more visible.

This is not a coincidence if new reactors (especially women) are able to pick much quicker the nuances of the characters and situation than older readers/anime reactors.

So for the Jump, Oda is using a risky strategy, but as we can see, it's only a risk that prevents people with no patience or willingness to dive deep into the narrative to quit, most people actually love the complexity and its a good thing. In a world where everything is meant to be easy to grasp and understand, we need stories like One Piece that defy our expectations and pushes us to analyze deeper.
 
I agree.

Oda is a good writer. But as much as they say Shueisha gives him free reign, I'm assuming he's under pressure to finish the series.

He has been overbloating the arcs. It's very apparent that he's trying to wrap up most of the story with Wano, Egghead and Elbaf with the amount of flashbacks and lore dumping we've been getting. It tanked his writing quality as a result.

Pretty ironic that they're rushing him now though, considering it was the editors fault the story kept getting longer to begin with lol. I recall Oda saying One Piece was supposed have been finished but they kept telling him to add stuff, like the Supernova etc.
I doubt he is under pressure to finish. One Piece is probably the most consistent long term source of income Shueisha has. Once One Piece finishes, there is nothing to replace it. That is a chunk of revenue lost forever. Lol. They will encourage Oda to take as much time as he likes.

Anyway, the bloating problem is mostly just too many damn characters. Scabbards could have been halved in number, three major antagonists for Wano was too much (either cut Orochi or just roll the best part of Orochi's character i.e. his backstory into Kaido's character) and the Supernovas are fine in number but should be spread across 4 crews instead of 9 crews (e.g. Luffy crew, Law crew, Kidd crew, Bege crew).

Oda has a gift for creation but not for restraint.
 
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I doubt he is under pressure to finish. One Piece is probably the most consistent long term source of income Shueisha has. Once One Piece finishes, there is nothing to replace it. That is a chunk of revenue lost forever. Lol. They will encourage Oda to take as much time as he likes.

Anyway, the bloating problem is mostly just too many damn characters. Scabbards could have been halved in number, three major antagonists for Wano was too much (either cut Orochi or just roll the best part of Orochi's character i.e. his backstory into Kaido's character) and the Supernovas are fine in number but should be spread across 4 crews instead of 9 crews (e.g. Luffy crew, Law crew, Kidd crew, Bege crew).

Oda has a gift for creation but not for restraint.
I think they even appreciate his break weeks because it gives them time to make flash sales lol
 
I doubt he is under pressure to finish. One Piece is probably the most consistent long term source of income Shueisha has. Once One Piece finishes, there is nothing to replace it. That is a chunk of revenue lost forever. Lol. They will encourage Oda to take as much time as he likes.

Anyway, the bloating problem is mostly just too many damn characters. Scabbards could have been halved in number, three major antagonists for Wano was too much (either cut Orochi or just roll the best part of Orochi's character i.e. his backstory into Kaido's character) and the Supernovas are fine in number but should be spread across 4 crews instead of 9 crews (e.g. Luffy crew, Law crew, Kidd crew, Bege crew).

Oda has a gift for creation but not for restraint.
He could always start another series a la Boruto. With how huge and timespanning the OP universe is, it practically begs for more stories.
 
Pretty ironic that they're rushing him now though, considering it was the editors fault the story kept getting longer to begin with lol
Also I don't know where this comes from.

It's pretty logical for an author to expand the story. Oda probably had the very basic of his outline and since he is pretty bad at managing his time, he simply completely underestimated the time it would take him.

At first he probably started with the idea of 5 years but he had a 15+ years story in the hand. So he probably decided to say "fuck it I'm gonna make this my life's work" and decided to go completely wild with it.

The editors probably had no inputs other than "dude, you crazy, this is not a 5+ years story" (but it was probably at the end of East Blue and too late to stop).
 
Also I don't know where this comes from.

It's pretty logical for an author to expand the story. Oda probably had the very basic of his outline and since he is pretty bad at managing his time, he simply completely underestimated the time it would take him.

At first he probably started with the idea of 5 years but he had a 15+ years story in the hand. So he probably decided to say "fuck it I'm gonna make this my life's work" and decided to go completely wild with it.

The editors probably had no inputs other than "dude, you crazy, this is not a 5+ years story" (but it was probably at the end of East Blue and too late to stop).
One piece was only supposed to last for 5 years and was originally supposed to focus on Luffy fighting the 4 Emperors after his battle with Crocodile.

Then he started introducing more warlords. The Supernova weren't supposed to be a big thing, until his editors told him otherwise.

The 4 Yonko Saga was supposed to have been here a LONG time ago. He very much did overbloat his story, especially after the timeskip.
 
Anyway, the bloating problem is mostly just too many damn characters. Scabbards could have been halved in number, three major antagonists for Wano was too much (either cut Orochi or just roll the best part of Orochi's character i.e. his backstory into Kaido's character) and the Supernovas are fine in number but should be spread across 4 crews instead of 9 crews (e.g. Luffy crew, Law crew, Kidd crew, Bege crew).
I've been saying this for years now. But Kaido and the Beast Pirates should have been the sole antagonists of the arc. Luffy, Kidd and Law should have jumped Kaido and beat him together. Big Mom should have never been there.

The arc would have been way shorter and frankly, better overall for it lol.
 
One piece was only supposed to last for 5 years and was originally supposed to focus on Luffy fighting the 4 Emperors after his battle with Crocodile.

Then he started introducing more warlords. The Supernova weren't supposed to be a big thing, until his editors told him otherwise.

The 4 Yonko Saga was supposed to have been here a LONG time ago. He very much did overbloat his story, especially after the timeskip.
No. What he did is respect the real potential of his story. Creating One Piece within 5 year would have at best created a MHA shonen. Not the kind of epic odyssey that this story need in the very core.

Also yes I know, Oda SAID that it was supposed to be 5 years, he also said that things like Law or the warlords weren't supposed to exist. So about that:

- We don't have to believe him, Oda has been known to be an unreliable source of information regarding his own process. He will often under estimate his own planning in order to keep a "modest" and "romantic" vision of the story. You will often see him overstate how much he "let his character live", while it is true in certain aspect, it is also an illusion as the guy is a big architect.

- What Oda is talking about is an estimate that Mangaka tend to give to their editors at the beginning of their story in order to plan the releases of the volumes and the planning of releases.

- 5 year was way too short even for the very first draft of the manga (let's not forget that oda had the entire crew planned, most probably Luffy's arc in Marineford since its a major turn over, most probably Wano with Big Mom and Kaido and most probably various villain such as Imu and Black Beard). This estimation, with the way Oda craft even his shortest story, was completely bonker.

- I repeat again, we need to be very careful with Oda's affirmation and interviews, most of the time we don't have the context and we tend to rigidify our understanding of Oda's process when it is really quite organic. Oda simply adapted his story to its necessities.

- The editor give him guidance. They can have ask him to add some flavor around some arcs like Sabaody but Oda (and authors in general) will eventually decide what they put in their story within the limit of what Jump can accept. In this case, its Oda who choose to developp his story that way.

And it's a good thing. The story is not "overblown", it's simply big on purpose.


I've been saying this for years now. But Kaido and the Beast Pirates should have been the sole antagonists of the arc. Luffy, Kidd and Law should have jumped Kaido and beat him together. Big Mom should have never been there.
That would destroy a good chunk of the point of the thematic of the Yonko Saga.

This saga is completely centered around the thematic of parenting and the "taking down" of bad parental figure. Big Mom was an absolute necessity in wano and whole cake was too soon for her. Luffy beating Kaido alone was ALSO a necessitye ven if he had help at the beginning. It's the Saga where Luffy becomes biggers than a simple pirate. He becomes Yonko. Big Mom is here to highlight the gap that Luffy crossed and kaido is here to highlight the step Luffy had to overcome in order to move ahead.

Really. There is nothing uneeded here. Shorter arcs are not necessarily better. Wano needed to be an epic tale. It has some lengh of course (especially around the battle) but overall, its solid as F.
 
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I've been saying this for years now. But Kaido and the Beast Pirates should have been the sole antagonists of the arc. Luffy, Kidd and Law should have jumped Kaido and beat him together. Big Mom should have never been there.

The arc would have been way shorter and frankly, better overall for it lol.
Yeah Big Mom should have never been in Wano, she should have returned in Elbaf which would have been the logical continuation for her story given all the connections she has with the place and the giants; and the way she was handled and written in Wano was so insane and bad. Oda really showed how bad and wacky of a writer he can be with her. She had so much more potential than the shitshow Oda did of her in Wano.

As for Kaido and the Beast Pirates another reason for why they and Wano fell short was that they were neglected as characters with their backstory, motivations, powers and crew dynamics having been given so little while too much focus was given to Shitoden and his Scabbards (which as you said shouldn't have been so many) and to Tama and Yamatrash (a character who shouldn't have been written).
 
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Reborn

Throughout Heaven & Earth,I alone am d Honored One
This is totally wrong point. But yes, if ClownDa will ruin Elbaf(the pacing was ruined already) I will drop this shit.

Because One Piece became just a SHIT.
Your benchmark of Elbaph being shit is how Oda portrays IMU.

You aren't liking Loki standing his ground against IMU right?

Well it's not Oda's fault that you bet on the wrong guy. :myman:

Marshal D. Teach is the way
 
This is totally wrong point. But yes, if ClownDa will ruin Elbaf(the pacing was ruined already) I will drop this shit.

Because One Piece became just a SHIT.
nop


Yeah Big Mom should have never been in Wano
Yes she should. In fact it wouldn't surprise me if Big Mom was supposed to appear on Wano and not Whole Cake. She is thematically relevant in Wano.




Oda really showed how bad and wacky of a writer he can be with her
He was not bad with her. Again, baseless criticisim based on "i didn't like her treatment" when said treatment was actually perfectly logical based on her characterization (and frankly quite funny and scary at the same time). This critic (this "potential" that you mentionned) is - as I mentionned many time, based the idea that all big and strong characters should be handled with respect and reverance, this is wrong from the get go.


As for Kaido and the Beast Pirates another reason for why they and Wano fell short was that they were neglected as characters with their backstory, motivations, powers and crew dynamics
No. There is enough backstory within the good side, bad guy doesn't always need a flashedout backstory.


too much focus was given to Shitoden
Let me guess, you didn't like the fact that Oden was dancing like a fool and you didn't like Yamato

:pepecorn:


Yamatrash (a character who shouldn't have been written).
I see.
 
This is totally wrong point. But yes, if ClownDa will ruin Elbaf(the pacing was ruined already) I will drop this shit.

Because One Piece became just a SHIT.
If you have more Japan media entertainment exposure, there is no chance you will think Imu is the final villain. When Teach shows the world he has the darkness power, that's basically a lock-on final villain spot. Only the people who read Naruto will think Imu is the final villain because of the Kaguya's controversy.

If you are real Imu's fan, then you have to see it through. Imu's plot won't just end in Elbaph or getting diff by Teach or Luffy. He still has Vivi's plot to be resolved. When Luffy changed the world, he will absolutely be there to witness everything.
 
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Yeah Big Mom should have never been in Wano, she should have returned in Elbaf which would have been the logical continuation for her story given all the connections she has with the place and the giants; and the way she was handled and written in Wano was so insane and bad. Oda really showed how bad and wacky of a writer he can be with her. She had so much more potential than the shitshow Oda did of her in Wano.

As for Kaido and the Beast Pirates another reason for why they and Wano fell short was that they were neglected as characters with their backstory, motivations, powers and crew dynamics having been given so little while too much focus was given to Shitoden and his Scabbards (which as you said shouldn't have been so many) and to Tama and Yamatrash (a character who shouldn't have been written).
Yeah. Yamato, Tama and Oden didnt really have much of a game changing effect on the arc as a whole tbh. Oden became lowkey irrelevant once the scabbards were defeated and the Kanjuro betrayal was poorly done. Orcohi shouldnt exist. All of those characters wasted, could have been spent making the Beast Pirates actually interesting.

Even on our protagonist end, I would have been more satisfied if Zoro got to keep Shisui. He literally earned that blade and got it taken back just for fun. And in return? He gets a sword that asspulls Conquerors Haki out of him. Oda put more effort into building up Sanji's powerup than Zoro's and it's hard to ignore.

Zoro has been neglected as a character post timeskip. Well, him, Ussop and Chopper specifically.
 
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