Controversial Alot of leftist belief is inherently racist

[Logiko]

your justifying sexism as a means to end sexism, it's like saying end racism by using more racism

uh ? No.. Sayin men are trash is not meant to end sexism, it's meant to express anger and to sort out who really understand the fight from the ones who don't

And no, this is not sexism. Sexism is a systematic situation just like racism. Sayin men are trash as nothing to do with that.

your saying end the oppression but you cant tell me what that would entail or mean like what you would do as say a president to handle this

We know how to end oppression dude.. i've told you many way to do it. But we can't really end oppression if people like you keep questionning the fight, you do understand right ?

as a man who's not you and not super left leaning
Why would, I wanna claim that im a problem

You know, there is nothing wrong in seeying and understanding your bias. For example I had a period with HUGE sexist bias and I still know that I have some racist bias. Those are bias linked with my education and environment.. but you see, I work EVERYDAY to end those bias. Knowing or acknowledging your weaknesses doesn't make you bad, it makes you a better person. You live, like me, in a sexist society, higly patriarcal, highly liberal and highly racist.. you WILL have sexist, liberal and racist bias. You can't do anything about that, it's done.

What you must do is accept that you live in a environment where all those bias are perpetuated by society, media and educations, only by doing that will you understand that you are part of the problem.

When we say "men are trash" we don't mean that you are a piece of sh*t that must be avoided, we say that you are born in a society where men are priviledge over women and where men are raised with all those bias weither you like it or not.

That why you are a "trash" (potentially problematic for women) until you are not. For example, I don't think I will be a problem for women anymore, but I sure was early in my days.

Another thing you need to understand is that women don't have to tell you that you are a "good guy". Being a good guy is normal, that's just the state you should be in if you weren't raised like me in a patriarcal society, it's just normal. So don't expect them to give you a cookie. But being a good guy right now means, being able to recognize all those bias and working on them.

not even saying, I wont admit to make mistakes or whatever just meaning in a general sense why would guys wanna join a group where they essentially have to demonize themselves

Refusing to admit mistakes is a huge problem.

Do you not see how that might just alienate some men?

Trust me, men who understand their bias and work on them are FAR MORE happy than men who refuse to look at themself and the pressure that society put on them.

I don't have a studdy on that, but in my knowledge, this is quite a based idea.

There is nothing more liberating that overpowering your own bias.

racism is at a all time low and that we have progressed so much where major racial issues are white boys appropriating rap music and wearing braids

yeah.. no. racism is still here and still very present.

who would like one race over another

white supremacist.

I disagree
I think trying to stay neutral and fair is much better then being a ideologue for right or left

Trying to stay neutral ALWAYS benefit the right.

When you are neutral, you are doomed to fall on the right side.

 

[Uncle Van]

I disagree
I think trying to stay neutral and fair is much better then being a ideologue for right or left


but again your free to discard my comments and just say im a fence sitter

Being a centrist isn't well received because the US as a whole is heavily right wing. Even most of the Democrats are right wing, with Joe Biden and Hilary Clinton for example being authoritarian right on the political spectrum. It's Authoritarian right wing policies that's fueling Capitalism and deeply rooted it in American culture.

Most of the issues facing America right now are due to these Captialist right wing polices and is in dire need of some leftist/socialist policies to fix issues like poverty, homelessness, poor education and food/housing costs, and it can be done easily but politicians and corporations don't want that cause it's not profitable and gives less power.

 

[Logiko]

Being a centrist isn't well received because the US as a whole is heavily right wing. Even most of the Democrats are right wing, with Joe Biden and Hilary Clinton for example being authoritarian right on the political spectrum. It's Authoritarian right wing policies that's fueling Capitalism and deeply rooted it in American culture.

Most of the issues facing America tight now are due to these Captialist right wing polices and is in dire need of some leftist/socialist policies to fix issues like poverty, homelessness, poor education and food/housing costs, and it can be done easily but politicians and corporations don't want that and it's not profitable and gives less power.

+1000

 

[Toby D. Dog]

So what's the point of this thread? That everything's too damn woke? Racism doesn't exist anymore? it ended in the 60s? Socialism=bad? Hotel? Trivago?

 

[Logiko]

So what's the point of this thread? That everything's too damn woke? Racism doesn't exist anymore? it ended in the 60s? Socialism=bad? Hotel? Trivago?

 

[Elder Lee Hung]

Most of the issues facing America right now are due to these Captialist right wing polices and is in dire need of some leftist/socialist policies to fix issues like poverty, homelessness, poor education and food/housing costs, and it can be done easily but politicians and corporations don't want that cause it's not profitable and gives less power.

The issues are exacerbated by the fact that America’s enemies and the Democratic Party are funding these extreme right wing groups because they know that these ideas cause extreme instability and are harmful to the country.

It’s very hard to defeat ideological movements funded by foreign governments. Not that I’m complaining, all of the chaos the U.S. sows around the world, we had it coming when that same chaos is set loose against us.

 

[Roo]

Being a centrist isn't well received because the US as a whole is heavily right wing. Even most of the Democrats are right wing, with Joe Biden and Hilary Clinton for example being authoritarian right on the political spectrum. It's Authoritarian right wing policies that's fueling Capitalism and deeply rooted it in American culture.

Most of the issues facing America right now are due to these Captialist right wing polices and is in dire need of some leftist/socialist policies to fix issues like poverty, homelessness, poor education and food/housing costs, and it can be done easily but politicians and corporations don't want that cause it's not profitable and gives less power.

Joe Biden is not right wing by any means, it’s a dumb myth spread by that highly innaccurate political compass meme that claims Bernie is center left, when literal European politicians have called Bernie far left

If you stake out his policies you’d see he leans left, center left at minimum

 

[Uncle Van]

The issues are exacerbated by the fact that America’s enemies and the Democratic Party are funding these extreme right wing groups because they know that these ideas cause extreme instability and are harmful to the country.

It’s very hard to defeat ideological movements funded by foreign governments. Not that I’m complaining, all of the chaos the U.S. sows around the world, we had it coming when that same chaos is set loose against us.

Well of course. Create an enemy to divert everyone's attention while you continue to push the status quo. Speak out against it and you either a communist or facist. Only a 70+ year success rate.

 

[Toby D. Dog]

Joe Biden is not right wing by any means, it’s a dumb myth spread by that highly innaccurate political compass meme that claims Bernie is center left, when literal European politicians have called Bernie far left

If you stake out his policies you’d see he leans left, center left at minimum

When it comes to welfare Bernie is pretty center left. It's when Bernie talks about nationalizing certain industries when you can start saying he's left on the international spectrum. It's still based tho.

Joe Biden is right wing tho. If you're not for free healthcare you're a rightwinger.

 

[Roo]

When it comes to welfare Bernie is pretty center left. It's when Bernie talks about nationalizing certain industries when you can start saying he's left on the international spectrum. It's still based tho.

Bernie is pretty far left, the man was idolizing the Soviet Union back in the 70s lol

edit: to be fair tho his campaigns were mostly on the social democrat side

 

[Toby D. Dog]

Bernie is pretty far left, the man was idolizing the Soviet Union back in the 70s lol

The soviet union was repressive. Bernie is the most libertarian left guy to ever exists. There's no one more pro freedom than him. But I reiterate, if you're not for free healthcare you're a right winger.

Don't get it twisted, Bernie is not a communist. He doesn't believe in a post capitalist system.

 

[Bob74h]

uh ? No.. Sayin men are trash is not meant to end sexism,

You said it was though
in the context of global oppression against women, Implies that the act was justified in it's function to combat or end sexism


What did you mean by that comment, If not what was said.

And no, this is not sexism. Sexism is a systematic situation just like racism. Sayin men are trash as nothing to do with that.

So it's only racist or sexist if it's inherently done by the government?
so if im to call some black person racial slurs, it's not racist due to it not being systematically?

In your attempt to like disavow white racism or male sexism, You created a internal logic which wouldt account individual people who themselves are racist


and even then, You seem to be unsure of what your stance on misandry would be like before you seemed to frame it as a necessary evil for the freedom of women and now it's just not sexist whatsoever

We know how to end oppression dude.. i've told you many way to do it. But we can't really end oppression if people like you keep questionning the fight, you do understand right ?

You didt answer on what was the tangible goal to be had
people like me questioning the fight, Please im being very light compared to alot of the more people on the right

which would of called you stupid or some other insult


This is discourse, discussion or whatever you wanna call it. im not exactly stopping the fight or doing much of anything to advance it by asking about the details there of now would i be?
I think such details as what is the goal of this fight, is important anyway

You know, there is nothing wrong in seeying and understanding your bias

Trying to stay neutral ALWAYS benefit the right.

You are telling me that it's bad to stay neutral and that im to evaluate my potential biases
How can be one side left or right, Then also take the stance of trying to fix the biases that may blind your thought processes


I agree with the idea, Trying to elevate biases so you can make more critical judgments

And going back to the initial point
you said it was about men realizing they were the problem

and my response to that was that alot of guys who arent as far left as you wont wanna demonize themselves so your reponse here is a total non sequitur

What you must do is accept that you live in a environment where all those bias are perpetuated by society, media and educations, only by doing that will you understand that you are part of the problem.

Think that's basic sociology to a degree
The social environment dictating behavioral functions part at least

This kinda goes into the nature vs nurture idea of things but nonetheless agree the point in theory


maybe not in it's entirety due to the whole, you are at fault thing
It cant be a societal problem with numerous layers of environmental manipulation to encourage certain ways of thinking and have the conclusion be the most black & white, men are the problem answer

women can face issues due to economic pressures ie not having enough due to being born in a more wealthy household and that would exist entirely separate to men as a collective, that's just one hypothetical ofc cant say it represents everything but it's the general point not every issue had by a woman has to relate to men with the male gender always as the badguy

for one who speaks of checking out your own internal biases, You are very quick to see men as the badguy and not saying men cant do bad things or whatever merely pointing out how the quick men bad response kinda speaks to something afterall if the same type of argument was had by me and ive immediately said women bad, you would justifiably call me out

That why you are a "trash" (potentially problematic for women) until you are not. For example, I don't think I will be a problem for women anymore, but I sure was early in my days.

Another thing you need to understand is that women don't have to tell you that you are a "good guy". Being a good guy is normal, that's just the state you should be in if you weren't raised like me in a patriarcal society, it's just normal. So don't expect them to give you a cookie. But being a good guy right now means, being able to recognize all those bias and working on them.

This is where we fundamentally differ
I dont honestly care to work hard on being not a nuisance to women nor does the reverse really apply im not going to work hard on being a complete doosh to them

I just treat women like any other person say hello or whatever yknow
maybe sometimes interaction might differ with that of a dude due to the simple fact, im attracted to women and not manly men


I think we disagree on what being a good guy would be, To you it's being able to recognize biases and working on them
To me, I think it's just being polite and civil to others not being mean or rude

Sometimes you can have a bad day or whatever maybe your dog died or whatever but overall you should try to stay civil and nice no purpose or function in mindlessly pissing off every single person in the vicinity

white supremacist.

I said racists but they would fit that bill too
I would have a broad definition including black supremists or any group which would prefer 1 racial group over another

Refusing to admit mistakes is a huge problem.

Didt say, I refuse to admit mistakes
I even said not saying and then said in a general sense why are you responding to me in a way that's implying the exact opposite of what was stated by me

are you confused about what was said in said statement?

 

[Roo]

The soviet union was repressive. Bernie is the most libertarian left guy to ever exists.

You’re saying this as if there isn’t public record of him idolizing the USSR and taking trips over there

if you're not for free healthcare you're a right winger.

This is such a childish way of looking at the political spectrum lol

Don't get it twisted, Bernie is not a communist. He doesn't believe in a post capitalist system.

Ideologically he’s a socialist, but in practice he’s more of a socdem

 

[Logiko]

Joe Biden is not right wing by any means, it’s a dumb myth spread by that highly innaccurate political compass meme that claims Bernie is center left, when literal European politicians have called Bernie far left

If you stake out his policies you’d see he leans left, center left at minimum

Biden is center right. Meaning ha is in the """right"""" side, there is no such thing as center. I wouldn't call Bernie center left but he is what a based left should be.

There is no "myth" saying that Biden is center right. He IS, the reason you don't understand that is because the overton windows shifted right a while ago, in most occidental societies. For example, Macron (president of France) comes from what we call the "socialist party" which should be a left party but is in fact applying (like his mentor Hollande) hard liberal laws which is a complete right thing to do.

Macron is therefore Right and Biden is up there with him. Pure liberalist party. Liberalism is not a leftist concept, it comes from the RIGHT side of the political spectrum.

Far right winger are only tricking you into thinking that biden is progressive but he is only by interest. That's why today you guys in America don't have "decent" republican party anymore, the overton Window shifted right just as far right member started to poor in the party.. and now... well.. you have the orange pumpkin and his old friends when you should have instead Biden and we should have Bernie (well Melenchon in my case).

What is happening in France is happening pretty much everywhere.. Far right is gaining voices and we have to fight against that type of dissinformation.

 

[Toby D. Dog]

You’re saying this as if there isn’t public record of him idolizing the USSR and taking trips over there



This is such a childish way of looking at the political spectrum lol


Ideologically he’s a socialist, but in practice he’s more of a socdem

You can call it whatever you want. Healthcare is a human right. I know people who have died cause they couldn't afford it. And I'm interested in those records of him idolizing the soviet union. All I know is he went there for his honeymoon.

 

[Roo]

Biden is center right. Meaning is he right, there is no such thing as center. I wouldn't call Bernie center left but he is what a based left should be.

Except you’re wrong, and saying shit like that this just shows how naive and young you are lol

Can you even name 10 Biden policies? How can you talk about American Politics with that confidence is beyond me

 

[LANJI CUCKSMOKE]

That I don't doubt since there's a tendency to perhaps overcorrect past mistakes.
identity politics could go overboard etc

that being said David duke
nick fuentes,
Kanye west
strong anti migrants sentiments based on conspiracy theories of "planned replacement"
could go on

a more concerning amount of these voices are right wing.
lesser of two evils is clear to me.

 

[Toby D. Dog]

Except you’re wrong, and saying shit like that this just shows how naive and young you are lol

Can you even name 10 Biden policies? How can you talk about American Politics with that confidence is beyond me

He's not for Medicare for all
He crafted the crime bill in the 90s which caused a mass incarceration crisis
He was supposed to be for the public option but he backtracked
He sells himself as pro union but he blocked the railway worker's strike
He was against raves
One of the good things he supported was the partial student loan debt reduction (he should've cancelled it all)
Other good thing he did was pull out of Afghanistan

Just to name a few off the top of my head. I grew up in Latin America and the US. Left wing movements in latin america would consider people like biden right wing.

 

[Roo]

You can call it whatever you want. Healthcare is a human right. I know people who have died cause they couldn't afford it.

Why are you appealing to emotion? Idgaf about how many people died over it, that doesn’t change the fact that being solely pro free healthcare makes you a leftist. You’re talking to adults here.

And I'm interested in those records of him idolizing the soviet union. All I know is he went there for his honeymoon.

You can literally google search it alongside his praise of the Castro regime

 

[Bob74h]

And I'm interested in those records of him idolizing the soviet union