Controversial General Political Discussion

[Monkey D Theories]

Rabbi suggests to use atomic bomb to end Gaza war.
Says the bombing didnt just end war, Japan wanted to be friends after being bombed.

@BleakAsh @NikaInParis @Logiko

I wonder what people have to say about this since bombings in Japan killed between 129,000 and 226,000 people.
Was it also the next big thing after Holocaust?

After looking at this video

I do want to see exactly where he is going with this. He didn’t literally say israel should nuke Gaza.
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There’s this idea that kinda goes around in Jewish circles that I find pretty dumb. And it’s this idea that we need israel because that’s the only way Jews can be safe.

And like, I just don’t think that’s true.

I think Jews have a pretty good life in America. It’s not perfect. There are a lot of people in America who hate Jews. But that’s not everyone, that’s not even most people.

I’m fortunate to live in a country where the most racist bigoted people can’t just gain power and do whatever the fuck they please without the consent of the rest of us.

I can choose whatever religion I want and by the constitution, the government cannot discriminate against me on that. That doesn’t stop them from trying(they’ve definitely discriminated against Muslims since 9/11).

but it’s good enough. Not all people are nazis, and most countries aren’t as bad as nazi germany.

 

[Mathias]

Israel is Jewish ISIS tbh

ISIS = Wants to create a state with a state imposed Islamic character
Israel = Wants to create a state with a state imposed ethnically and religiously Jewish character

So your position as a wannabe Jew is that Israel is evil ? That's interesting
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Rabbi suggests to use atomic bomb to end Gaza war.
Says the bombing didnt just end war, Japan wanted to be friends after being bombed.

@BleakAsh @NikaInParis @Logiko

I wonder what people have to say about this since bombings in Japan killed between 129,000 and 226,000 people.
Was it also the next big thing after Holocaust?

This is definitely something that can come outta Trump's mouth

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

this idea that we need israel because that’s the only way Jews can be safe.

Direct result of traditional European antisemitism. European antisemitists created a monster

 

[Mathias]

Let's give a state to the Kurds too then !

 

[Logiko]

I say a lot of things about this forum. But at least the majority of you guys are aware of the horrors happening in Palestine and it gives me a little bit of hope.

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

Let's give a state to the Kurds too then !

Bro
Just when I was reminiscing about my old dream of joining peshmerga to fight isis can you read my thoughts ir what?!?

 

[Monkey D Theories]

So your position as a wannabe Jew is that Israel is evil ? That's interesting

I don’t think it’s inherently evil. But there are elements of the country I do not like.

I don’t agree with the idea of imposing an ethnic/religious character over an entire nation.

I think it’s discriminatory. In fact as a convert to Reform Judaism, while I would be eligible for Israeli citizenship under the law of return, I don’t believe I would actually be classified as Jewish in Israel, and I believe there are certain legal ramifications of that.

Still I would obviously have a higher status than a Palestinian.
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https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveb...m-convert-weds-a-jew-the-marriage-is-invalid/

Apparently I cannot marry another jew in israel, because the Israeli rabbinate is run by the Orthodox Jews, who don’t believe that conversion in Reform Judaism is valid.

I seriously doubt get why anybody would want to live in a theocracy

 

[Toby D. Dog]

https://news.yahoo.com/supreme-court-just-dealt-massive-165909572.html

I don't wanna hear any mfs on the right that agree with this say they actually care about free speech and the first amendment.

 

[Uncle Van]

https://news.yahoo.com/supreme-court-just-dealt-massive-165909572.html

I don't wanna hear any mfs on the right that agree with this say they actually care about free speech and the first amendment.

Ah so they just violate the constitution whenever they please. Democracy!

 

[Haoshoku]

Hareetz is pro Zionist? LMAO


Do you realize you just called the biggest left wing Israeli publication pro Zionist?

What is this mans even talking about? They’re pro Israel through and through, they’re in full agreement with their right wing counterparts when it comes to denying Israeli oppression and the bloody premise with which their very state was founded. They just aren’t extreme when it comes to current Israeli foreign policy and call out Bibi and his likes for their own internal politics. You don’t even know the basics.

bruh you instantly assume anybody Israeli is pro Israeli without even looking into them. You did the same with Pappe.

Man quite slow on the uptake, that was a play on your dismissive logic when you squealed “hE’s pRo pAlesTinIan!” Hence the reason why I did the same when you brought up the Haaretz’ hit piece. In my case I actually have a valid reason of dismissing them since they have an obvious agenda when it comes to denying the massacres and displacements that made up the first naqba. On the other hand if someone brings an evidenced work or claim then debunk the evidenced work or claim instead of being fallacious while sounding like a grade A clown with all of the labeling.

Is this a reflection? Are you that blindly loyal to your ethnic group?

Get a load of this tomfoolery.
What does my ethnicity have to do this? Lol this mans getting me weak post after post. This is a reflection of yourself, don’t project your anxieties on me. I ain’t even Middle Eastern or even Asian for that matter lol jokes on you.

I literally provided you a Wikipedia page of all the recorded mass killings. If you can’t find them there you probably made the up in your head

Smh I clearly asked for the massacres, displacements and occupations of the Israelies by the Palestinians and man just keeps barking about the relatively minor clashes that took place in the early 30s. You not sounding genuine at all at this point.

No sane man will claim there’s a proportionally equivalent tit for tat between them. In the meantime tho you can go ahead and squeal about these being pro Palestinian too:

Spoiler

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_in_the_Palestinian_territories

6k+ casualties in comparison to Israel’s 300+:
https://www.ochaopt.org/data/casualties

70% of the dead in current Gaza are women and young children due to indiscriminate bombing.
https://www.ohchr.org/en/statements/2024/02/gaza-when-mothers-have-bury-least-7700-children-very-basic-principles-are#:~:text=As of 12 February 2024,67,984 Palestinians have been injured.

Keep denying tho, no amount of numbers or data are going to be enough for those in denial. Most folks rn ain’t got they head in the sand tho, so that is good.

Next to retards who can’t even waste a second to verify what they say ofc I’m enlightened lol

Lmao just keep reading OP every week and when you had enough with that, keep watching Tatum bounce around an orange ball jumping out of your seat whilst thinking you’re actually enlightened 🤡

They also rejected the partition plan, which still wasnt optimal (~40/60% distribution) but infinitely better than what happened ever since

They rejected it for the very fact that it wasn’t good by any means. The land belonged to them anyways. The Israelies themselves didn’t want that either as they pushed that number from 60% to 80% by the end of the decade with the forced displacements of hundreds of thousands.

 

[Zenos7]

The land belonged to them anyways.

To the british*
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The Israelies themselves didn’t want that either as they pushed that number from 60% to 80% by the end of the decade with the forced displacements of hundreds of thousands.

Pretty sure they accepted the initial partition plan

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

I think it’s discriminatory. In fact as a convert to Reform Judaism, while I would be eligible for Israeli citizenship under the law of return, I don’t believe I would actually be classified as Jewish in Israel, and I believe there are certain legal ramifications of that.

Non rabbinic Jews such as Ethiopians are not even considered real Jews by those ultra othodox fellas:saden:
The state of Israel is racist through and through

 

[Herrera95]

Were you a slave once.. Of anything other than zionist duchebags

The fuck

 

[Roo]

What is this mans even talking about? They’re pro Israel through and through, they’re in full agreement with their right wing counterparts when it comes to denying Israeli oppression and the bloody premise with which their very state was founded. They just aren’t extreme when it comes to current Israeli foreign policy and call out Bibi and his likes for their own internal politics. You don’t even know the basics.

Man quite slow on the uptake, that was a play on your dismissive logic when you squealed “hE’s pRo pAlesTinIan!” Hence the reason why I did the same when you brought up the Haaretz’ hit piece. In my case I actually have a valid reason of dismissing them since they have an obvious agenda when it comes to denying the massacres and displacements that made up the first naqba. On the other hand if someone brings an evidenced work or claim then debunk the evidenced work or claim instead of being fallacious while sounding like a grade A clown with all of the labeling.


Get a load of this tomfoolery.
What does my ethnicity have to do this? Lol this mans getting me weak post after post. This is a reflection of yourself, don’t project your anxieties on me. I ain’t even Middle Eastern or even Asian for that matter lol jokes on you.

Smh I clearly asked for the massacres, displacements and occupations of the Israelies by the Palestinians and man just keeps barking about the relatively minor clashes that took place in the early 30s. You not sounding genuine at all at this point.

No sane man will claim there’s a proportionally equivalent tit for tat between them. In the meantime tho you can go ahead and squeal about these being pro Palestinian too:

Spoiler

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_in_the_Palestinian_territories

6k+ casualties in comparison to Israel’s 300+:
https://www.ochaopt.org/data/casualties

70% of the dead in current Gaza are women and young children due to indiscriminate bombing.
https://www.ohchr.org/en/statements/2024/02/gaza-when-mothers-have-bury-least-7700-children-very-basic-principles-are#:~:text=As of 12 February 2024,67,984 Palestinians have been injured.

Keep denying tho, no amount of numbers or data are going to be enough for those in denial. Most folks rn ain’t got they head in the sand tho, so that is good.


Lmao just keep reading OP every week and when you had enough with that, keep watching Tatum bounce around an orange ball jumping out of your seat whilst thinking you’re actually enlightened 🤡


They rejected it for the very fact that it wasn’t good by any means. The land belonged to them anyways. The Israelies themselves didn’t want that either as they pushed that number from 60% to 80% by the end of the decade with the forced displacements of hundreds of thousands.

1. Literally posted videos of hareetz columnist calling for an end to the war and articles detailing hareetz pro Palestinian ties. Again, if you can’t even bother to make a simple google search you’re just projecting blind allegiance to everybody else

2.This retard keeps thinking the list is only in the 30s lmao. Literally keep scrolling down, it is up to the 1948 war. Also stop moving the goal post, we were literally talking the entirety of the conflict aka early 1900s. You can’t just say “hurr durr it happened in the 30s so it doesn’t matter” dumbass

3. I never said you’re ME retard. Again, I am calling you out for assuming just because someone is Israeli they’re instantly Zionist. You’re projecting your own blind loyalty to your ethnic group into other people. Whatever country you’re from you’re probably that big of a dick rider. I can’t relate to that, in the US we are embolden to criticize our country,
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To the british*
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Pretty sure they accepted the initial partition plan

And to the ottomans before

 

[BleakAsh]

@Roo idk what your point was, but the wiki about the "massacres" is quite disputed incomplete

Thw definition of massacre, context of incidents, accurate citations, reliability of the source or the extractions from it etc
Anything pivotal enough, that should be making it a reliable source for what it claims to be, is disputed heavily.

Refer to the discussions about it:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:List_of_killings_and_massacres_in_Mandatory_Palestine##

Edit: martin gilbert author of the Routledge's atlas , and the primary source for alot of the info in the wiki is , is a zionist too according to wiki

 

[Zenos7]

Non rabbinic Jews such as Ethiopians are not even considered real Jews by those ultra othodox fellas:saden:
The state of Israel is racist through and through

Forced sterilisation of ethiopians were also a thing in israel iirc

 

[BleakAsh]

Non rabbinic Jews such as Ethiopians are not even considered real Jews by those ultra othodox fellas:saden:
The state of Israel is racist through and through

Most Israeli's are not religious Jews but they do practice some of its religion tradition.

There are clear verses in their Tanakh and Talmudic commentary about race supremacy.

No matter how good of jew you are, if you're not jew by descent.. You're an inferior jew to the rest.
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I swear the middle-east is screwed for another century

They plan on making the greater Israel.. So you are correct they are gonna go to war with the bordering countries like Egypt, KSA, Jordan.

Arab.. May god guide them, are being wusses

 

[Monkey D Theories]

No matter how good of jew you are, if you're not jew by descent.. You're an inferior jew to the rest.

not everyone believes this

My congregation has a ton of converts and I don’t think I’ve ever felt discriminated against. In fact a lot of the converts happen to be the most active members of the community.

That being said, I’m part of the reform sect, which is more liberal.

In orthodox and ultra Orthodox Judaism I do believe there is a bit of a bias. Especially because they believe that the cohens will be priests when the temple is rebuilt and hence they need to have a pure bloodline or something.
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There are clear verses in their Tanakh and Talmudic commentary about race supremacy.

The thing about that tho is that those commentaries are made by various different rabbis and not all of them are going to agree with each other.

I do believe by Jewish law, you’re not allowed to discriminate against a convert or even against non Jews.

That being said not everyone follows it, least for all the state of Israel which cares more about their self preservation than following the Jewish religion.
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Non rabbinic Jews such as Ethiopians are not even considered real Jews by those ultra othodox fellas:saden:
The state of Israel is racist through and through

Im fine with the fact that the ultra orthodox have their own standards for who is a Jew and that they don’t consider me one.

If I wanted to be ultra orthodox I could have pursued ultra orthodox conversion. But I didn’t want that.

Im a reform convert descended from pagan Indians and I’m tbh fine with that. I’d even say I’m proud of my ancestry. Hindu literature is pretty dope.

What I think is fucked up is how the opinions of these people somehow has legal ramifications in Israel.

Why the fuck should some rabbi get to define who is and isn’t a Jew? Who is this person that they have authority over the Jewish religion? Are they G-d? Are they the messiah?

If I’m Jewish by Reform Judaism and I want to marry someone who also follows Reform Judaism? Why isn’t that allowed in israel?

Why does religion even matter regarding marriage laws? Why can’t Muslims marry Jews? Or Christians marry Jews?

The answer is that the Israeli government wants to protect their Jewish majority. And if there was inter religious marriage, you would have kids born to Jews who might not identify as Jewish. Especially if the mother wasn’t Jewish,

 

[Bisoromi Bear]

In fact a lot of the converts happen to be the most active members of the community.

This happens a lot, in many religions

I do believe by Jewish law, you’re not allowed to discriminate against a convert or even against non Jews.

That being said not everyone follows it, least for all the state of Israel which cares more about their self preservation than following the Jewish religion.

Religious authorities usually don't care about the contents of the religion ,they use it more as a tool to stay in power.
If they cared about their actual religion, like you said, they'd welcome converts with open arms. The Catholic church is similar in this regard as they notoriously discriminate against or outright turn down prospective converts from non European countries. This happened to my own dad btw who is an immigrant from a majority Muslim country, they forced him to memorize the entire contents of the Bible if he wants to convert to Catholicism which of course is an impossible task thus acting as a deterrent. In the end he didn't get baptised.

 

[Monkey D Theories]

. The Catholic church is similar in this regard as they notoriously discriminate against or outright turn down prospective converts from non European countries. This happened to my own dad btw who is an immigrant from a majority Muslim country, they forced him to memorize the entire contents of the Bible if he wants to convert to Catholicism which of course is an impossible task thus acting as a deterrent. In the end he didn't get baptised.

Really? I thought Catholics want to convert as many people as possible

Jews aren’t that way anymore because for centuries, Jewish conversion was punishable by death in Christian and maybe Muslim countries. And that had the effect of making Jews a very insular community.
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If they cared about their actual religion, like you said, they'd welcome converts with open arms.

The orthodox believe in a very rigid form of Judaism

The issue with this is that the Judaism they subscribe to wasn’t created with the intentions of ruling a country. It was a religion that came about through centuries of discrimination and living as a minority in other countries.

The Hasmoneans actively converted non Jews and integrated them into Judaea.

But Israel cannot and will not do this to the Palestinians. Since the orthodox follow a Judaism that is so tied to ethnic identity, it’s not flexible enough to be something that can unite a country, hence the only way they can have a Jewish country is by apartheid.
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Due to the nature of Judaism being that of a minority ethnoreligion, it’s just not functional as being a religion of an entire state.

At least not until someone comes along and changes judaism into being a world religion. Such a person could only be the messiah.

Hence I tbh agree with the ultra orthodox idea that Jews shouldn’t create a state of their own until the messiah comes.
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That being said israel has already been created and has existed for 70+ years and “destroying it” would lead to more massacres and violence on both sides.

So the only thing that can be done is for israel to exist but to abolish it’s harmful and discriminatory practices.