Powers & Abilities Haki is the strongest power in the One Piece verse. The strongest characters are the ones with the stronger Haki

#41
I still think awakening is > ACOC but I can see where you're coming from

I completely disagree with the "the one with better haki will always triumph" thing though

I don't think anyone could argue Luffy's haki was better than Katakuri's during WCI but he still won

Some of Luffy's opponents pre TS had haki yet he still embarrassed them

The one with better haki will win most of the time but there are exceptions
Yes I agree, that's why I said that the one with stronger Haki are generally the stronger ones and the ones who win a fight
Generally, therefore most of times, but not every time 100 times on 100

Take a DF less top tier with maxed out Hakis, no matter swordsman or brawler, and put him against whoever there is with Haki restricted. The one with Haki will demolish every hakiless guy.

But of course, different fighting styles get amped differently. e.g. Haki being essential for swordsmanship to cut through everything and become one with the blade. Haki itself isn't a fighting style, it amps whatever fighting style you have. Hence Haki has a higher ceiling.
Yeah exactly. Because everyone has Haki. It's the equal chance for everyone to be the strongest that he can.

Not everyone has a DF, not everyone uses a sword, not everyone has a martial arts style and so on. But everyone has Haki.
Haki is equality. Equal starting chances for everyone, and the strongest ones will come on top.

That's why for example let's take Current Luffy
Remove his DF and he remains a tough strong motherfucker with all kind of Haki at the maxxed level
Remove his Haki and he becomes what??

Or take an Admiral
Remove his DF and he remains a strong guy with great physicals and maxxed levels of Haki to fight at high levels
Remove his Haki and he would become nothing more than a upgraded Ener or Crocodile
 

Peroroncino

🅷🅰🅻🅰 🅼🅰🅳🆁🅸🅳
#43
And before someone quotes me saying kid/law didn’t have a real win, they still did way better than the scabbards, who did have advanced haki, so my point still stands
Their advanced haki wasnt strong enough since it only caused shallow wounds.
Also kaido said haki is needed to conquer the seas so he was talking about conquerors haki
 
#44
And before someone quotes me saying kid/law didn’t have a real win, they still did way better than the scabbards, who did have advanced haki, so my point still stands
Advanced as in Ryuo/flow, but their level was rather low. Not everyone's Ryuo is the same. Take someone who has super hard hardening and coats his entire body with it like Vergo, uses large barriers in addition, like the one Rayleigh used to knock off a huge beast, add internal destruction Haki and high level of Haoshoku. Take whatever hakiless DF- Boy you have. They get murked.
 
#45
And before someone quotes me saying kid/law didn’t have a real win, they still did way better than the scabbards, who did have advanced haki, so my point still stands
Because if the gap is so massive, like the one between Law/Kidd and the Scabbards, not even Haki or a better or a stronger Haki can save the much weaker one.

But generally, most of times, the stronger characters are the one with the stronger Haki. And the ones with the stronger Haki are the stronger ones.
That's why Doflamingo was more hyped about Luffy unlocking Conqueror Haki than Law having the Ope Ope, and talked as if Haki sealed the deal about the former being stronger than the latter.
That's why we have many Top Tiers who doesn't have a DF and some ones not even using a weapon, but we have not Top Tier not having Haki or having a weak level of Haki.
That's why Kaido called Haki the strongest power, the power that "surpasses it all", and called Advanced Conqueror Haki as the power that is landmark of being a Top Tier "only a handful of the very strongest can".

Because Haki is equality. Differently from DFs, weapons and martial art styles, everyone has Haki. Because it depends from the willpower and everyone has it.
Only the ones with the greatest willpower will be the strongest ones.
 
#46
One of the biggest hypocrites made this post, that's funny.

Zoro wasn't using knockout CoC. That was a side effect to him just coating his swords. His CoC is that strong.

Similar to when Luffy obtained awakening. His CoC went through the skull but it didn't knock out alot of the fodder.
How many people did Midd knock out with his conqueror's haki?
 
#47
Weirdly enough, I see members of a certain fandom of flat earthers desperately and delusionally trying to understate Haki, Adv CoC, Kaido's statements and what not.

Why do these special friends of ours act like this? Weirdly enough, they are the same ones that when Luffy unlocked Adv CoC were saying that "Adv CoC is the real deal, that makes Luffy lightyears stronger than Zoro" "Zoro will never have Adv CoC, Zoro won't even have basic Conqueror" "Zoro, at most, will obtain Adv CoC at the end of the series, if even".
Funnily enough, the author had a very different idea and Zoro was not only confirmed as a Conqueror and a King (not every Conqueror is a King!), but also unlocked Adv Coc, the power of the strongests, in the very same arc as the main character did, merely a few chapters after the man character.

And funnily enough, what they called the power of the strongests, what they called the real deal, what they called the power up that separated Luffy from Zoro, suddenly became a third rate average power that didn't even separate Zoro from Simpji.

The coherence of these guys...

But anyway, we are inclusive and sympathetic. We don't judge them. We can understand them, it's perfectly normal to be envious of the Grandmaster and the way most of the fans love him and the way the author loves him.
Just this level of salt is too much, maybe...

Anyway, I suggest to COPE.
And then COPE HARDER.







 
#52
Because of people like Luffy, I am not impressed by Haki.
No matter what haki he pulls, his damaji remains trash.
Meanwhile, Zoro never needed aCoC to have supreme dmg.
The problem i have always noticed with overanalyzing unpolished concepts like Haki is how it diminishes everything else said non-devil fruit user has by treating it as a standalone ability rather than an undefined variable boost. I don't even think Oda thought once about how he integrates Haki into the power system consistently, about whether CoA or physical strength contributes more in Garp's punch.

That's why i liked what @Rosella.Fiamingo once said, "Oda keeps Haki opened ended and ambiguous because it's crutch. When the situation deteriorates and Luffy finds himself in with his back against the wall, Oda can always turn to an unforeseen aspect of Haki to give Luffy the power he needs to overcome his opponent".

But the same could be said about all the non-Haki training Zoro's body undergone throughout the story, you can't simply hand Zoro's muscle strength, endurance/pain tolerance, speed, reflex, swordsmanship experience to everyone that shares comparable Haki to him.

Physical strength, durability, endurance, speed, reflex, weapons, special genes/abilities and matchup on top of them all are all factors not related to DFs/Haki that affect both swordsmen and brawlers. Haki is too ambiguous to function as the only measuring stick to determine the level of non-devil fruit users.
 
#53
Weirdly enough, I see members of a certain fandom of flat earthers desperately and delusionally trying to understate Haki, Adv CoC, Kaido's statements and what not.

Why do these special friends of ours act like this? Weirdly enough, they are the same ones that when Luffy unlocked Adv CoC were saying that "Adv CoC is the real deal, that makes Luffy lightyears stronger than Zoro" "Zoro will never have Adv CoC, Zoro won't even have basic Conqueror" "Zoro, at most, will obtain Adv CoC at the end of the series, if even".
Funnily enough, the author had a very different idea and Zoro was not only confirmed as a Conqueror and a King (not every Conqueror is a King!), but also unlocked Adv Coc, the power of the strongests, in the very same arc as the main character did, merely a few chapters after the man character.

And funnily enough, what they called the power of the strongests, what they called the real deal, what they called the power up that separated Luffy from Zoro, suddenly became a third rate average power that didn't even separate Zoro from Simpji.

The coherence of these guys...

But anyway, we are inclusive and sympathetic. We don't judge them. We can understand them, it's perfectly normal to be envious of the Grandmaster and the way most of the fans love him and the way the author loves him.
Just this level of salt is too much, maybe...

Anyway, I suggest to COPE.
And then COPE HARDER.







Jinbei and Scopper have the same position in a crew, you need to fix that.
 
#54
At this point, it is a given that Advanced Conqueror > Devil Fruit Awakening/other special abilities > Haki > Devil Fruits/other abilities. Between characters of similar levels, the ones with stronger Haki are, most of times, the stronger ones. This really seems the way the author sees things in his own series.

Kaido already knew well about DF Awakening, and then witnessed the Awakening of one of the most powerful DFs, possibly even the most powerful one, the Gomu Gomu... ahem the Nika Nika. And yet he still says that Haki surpasses all the powers.

So yeah, the strongest characters in One Piece are the one with the strongest Haki. In a fight between two characters of similar levels, the one with the strongest Haki will be the winner.
This is so coherent, after all. Will, being it inherited will or willpower, is one of the main themes of the One Piece series. Haki is the power of the will.
Willpower makes you tougher, that's Armament Haki. Willpower makes you feel the surroundings, that's Observation Haki. The strongest kind of willpower is the one that makes you dominate over anything and anyone else; and that's Conqueror Haki, the act of the Kings imposing their superiority to the lesser ones.

That's why Haki the strongest power in the world of One Piece. As Kaido said, in a direct comparison with the other abilities: "HAKI SURPASSES IT ALL".



And the strongest kind of Haki is the Advanced Conqueror Haki, which indeed was portrayed as the power of the Top Tiers, through Kaido's words again "Infusing things with Conqueror Haki? ONLY A HANDFUL OF THE VERY STRONGEST CAN!"
Therefore, you could say that, being Adv CoC the strongest version of Haki which is the strongest power, the actual strongest power in the verse is Adv CoC. So basically it's like this: Adv CoC Haki > Haki > anything else.



Doflamingo, being a Conqueror Haki user and having a DF with Awakening, and also perfectly knowing what Ope Ope (one of the strongest DF around) can do, so having massive knowledge, refers to being a Conqueror as a proof of the greater power of the ones who possess that ability compared to the ones who do not, as something that creates a clear distinction between who has it and who doesn't have.



Kaido's statement then creates an even further distinction between who has it, and who has it in the Advanced version. Because yes, even among the already very few ones who have Conqueror Haki, only the present strongests or the ones with the greatest future potential are able to use Advanced Conqueror Haki. Confirming that (Adv CoC) as the strongest version of the strongest power (Haki), and making it an established landmark in the power levels of the series, with hype and portrayal above 9000.



Hundreds and hundreds of chapters ago, the idea that the one with the stronger Haki is the one that most of times is the stronger one overall and the winner of a fight, is textually suggested in the manga.
A character textually states that defeating his DF means nothing because he will still win thanks to his high level of Haki; and the answer is that's true, it will depend on who truly has the better Haki for real; the winner will be the one with the strongest Haki.
Now that may not be true for 100 comparisons out of 100; but for the most part, yes. Especially characters with Advanced Conqueror, they are among the strongests for the mere virtue of unlocking and wielding that power. There's a reason for why people like Doflamingo, Chinjao, Kidd or Katakuri are Conquerors and very strong guys, but still could not manage to obtain the usage of Advanced Conqueror Haki.



After all, all of this should not come as a surprise. Not only it is perfectly coherent with will being one of the main themes of the series, and Haki being a reflection of the character's willpower.
Also, please notice that every past, present and future Top Tiers have all different fighting styles: some are DF users, some are swordsmen, some are brawlers and so on. But all of them have exceptionally strong Haki. All of them.
There are so many Top Tiers who do not have a Devil Fruit: Roger, Rayleigh, Mihawk, Shanks, in the future there will be Zoro who is already rising at the highest levels; Oden too can be seen as at that level. Garp as well
.. and he didn't even use swords or other weapons, only his bare hands and Haki! While, on the other side, there is no Top Tier that doesn't have exceptionally strong Haki, and this says all. Even the Admirals use their DFs a lot, but still they are Haki masters, just see how easily they blocked Whitebeard's Gura Gura with their Advanced CoA.



So, yeah, Haki is the strongest power in One Piece: as Kaido said "Abilities are not enough to conquer the world... Roger didn't have that... because only Haki trascends it all!"
And the strongest version of the strongest power is what Kaido called the power of the Top Tiers, the power that "only a handful of the very strongest can", aka the Advanced Conqueror Haki.

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Haki has been confirmed to be the strongest power (to date) in the story. Another W for Zoro
 
#56
Or take an Admiral
Remove his DF and he remains a strong guy with great physicals and maxxed levels of Haki to fight at high levels
Remove his Haki and he would become nothing more than a upgraded Ener or Crocodile
Remove their DF and their AP and defense drop drastically, let alone their utility. How much longer would Aokiji be stalled fighting Jozu if he didn't just freeze him? What would Kizarus Sabaody performance look like if he had to run everywhere instead of blipping around at lightspeed? Akainu punching Ace wouldn't have been anywhere near a killing blow without his DF.


Remove Luffy's DF, and hed be a crumbled up bag of bones like Zoro right now. He'd be chugging Mink Medicine after every fight
 

nik87

Kitetsu Wanker
#59
The problem i have always noticed with overanalyzing unpolished concepts like Haki is how it diminishes everything else said non-devil fruit user has by treating it as a standalone ability rather than an undefined variable boost. I don't even think Oda thought once about how he integrates Haki into the power system consistently, about whether CoA or physical strength contributes more in Garp's punch.

That's why i liked what @Rosella.Fiamingo once said, "Oda keeps Haki opened ended and ambiguous because it's crutch. When the situation deteriorates and Luffy finds himself in with his back against the wall, Oda can always turn to an unforeseen aspect of Haki to give Luffy the power he needs to overcome his opponent".

But the same could be said about all the non-Haki training Zoro's body undergone throughout the story, you can't simply hand Zoro's muscle strength, endurance/pain tolerance, speed, reflex, swordsmanship experience to everyone that shares comparable Haki to him.

Physical strength, durability, endurance, speed, reflex, weapons, special genes/abilities and matchup on top of them all are all factors not related to DFs/Haki that affect both swordsmen and brawlers. Haki is too ambiguous to function as the only measuring stick to determine the level of non-devil fruit users.
Yeah, I think it is overrated and mainly serves as a bridge to remove the gap between overpowered abilities and someone like Luffy. It feels like the whole Haki system is specifically tailored for Luffy due to his shortcomings. He literally became able to block after 1010 chapters. I dont think the Admirals and Blackbeard care that much or rely that much on Haki. It is Luffy who is trying to compete with them thanks to haki, not the other way around.
 
#60
Damn, this mf spittin :finally:

Haki had to be superior, when Shanks made the lord of the coast, a sea king that already ate one... piece decide the journey end there.
I would still want kaido devil fruit though. Better than Gomu Gomu no Mi imo. Zoro has first dibs; always wanted him to get a df sword. Something else he has to master, just to take down Hawkeye.
 
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