Rules Kingdom General Discussion
- Thread starter Patryipe
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Step 1 : Shouheikun decides to use a certain tactic.
Step 2 : The manga explains about how that tactic is considered either impractical for actual use or normally used in other contexts.
Step 3 : Shouheikun (or the guy who had been taught by Shouheikun beforehand on on how to use it) does it successfully anyway.
Step 4 : Repeat.
Lol. @Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @TheKnightOfTheSea
Step 2 : The manga explains about how that tactic is considered either impractical for actual use or normally used in other contexts.
Step 3 : Shouheikun (or the guy who had been taught by Shouheikun beforehand on on how to use it) does it successfully anyway.
Step 4 : Repeat.
Lol. @Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @TheKnightOfTheSea
This is Shouheikun in a nutshell. Lmfao
Character A: “What? He’s using that tactic? Is that even possible?”
Shouheikun: “Yeah I already killed the enemy General about 2 minutes ago”
Character A: *wide-mouth shock*
Lol
This is why I think Shouheikun has the best army vs army tactics in Kingdom. He knows super-effective tactics for any situation and can pull them off even when they are high-risk high-reward.
Even if his tactics are more conventional and textbook than people like Ousen, Riboku, and Kanki, there are pretty much no generals in Kingdom who have shown more effective tactics than Shouheikun. Some of Riboku and Ousen’s best tactics have been overcome, and Kanki’s tactics are very situation dependent, but Shouheikun? His tactics are so good that he can instruct other characters on how to perform seemingly impossible tactics, and they work anyway. Lol
Character A: “What? He’s using that tactic? Is that even possible?”
Shouheikun: “Yeah I already killed the enemy General about 2 minutes ago”
Character A: *wide-mouth shock*
Lol
This is why I think Shouheikun has the best army vs army tactics in Kingdom. He knows super-effective tactics for any situation and can pull them off even when they are high-risk high-reward.
Even if his tactics are more conventional and textbook than people like Ousen, Riboku, and Kanki, there are pretty much no generals in Kingdom who have shown more effective tactics than Shouheikun. Some of Riboku and Ousen’s best tactics have been overcome, and Kanki’s tactics are very situation dependent, but Shouheikun? His tactics are so good that he can instruct other characters on how to perform seemingly impossible tactics, and they work anyway. Lol
I won't comment on the extent of his potential, but I think you're overestimating Shou Hei Kun's current ability by quite a considerable margin.
While I don't doubt he's top tier, he hasn't got the feats to justify placing his tactics on the same level as Ri Boku and Ou Sen, who have an abundance of high level feats on panel. Never mind above ranking him above them.
In my estimation, Shou Hei Kun belongs in a tier with the likes of Ka Rin and Go Hou Mei in terms of intelligence, tactics and strategy.
Kan Ki belongs in a tier between them and RBK and Ou Sen.
That's just my view.
While I don't doubt he's top tier, he hasn't got the feats to justify placing his tactics on the same level as Ri Boku and Ou Sen, who have an abundance of high level feats on panel. Never mind above ranking him above them.
In my estimation, Shou Hei Kun belongs in a tier with the likes of Ka Rin and Go Hou Mei in terms of intelligence, tactics and strategy.
Kan Ki belongs in a tier between them and RBK and Ou Sen.
That's just my view.
Shouheikun has shown exactly two battlefield tactics: the Echelon Formation and the Hyourai, both of which were hilariously effective at decimating the armies they were used against.
Riboku’s Ryuudou was overcome by Duke Hyou, and Riboku’s origin tactic was immediately countered by Ousen.
Ousen’s only tactic he’s shown is his Shells & Joints formation, which was immediately figured out by Riboku.
In terms of strategy, I rate Riboku and Ousen above Shouheikun, but in terms of battlefield tactics, Shouheikun clearly has the best feats of the three.
Riboku’s Ryuudou was overcome by Duke Hyou, and Riboku’s origin tactic was immediately countered by Ousen.
Ousen’s only tactic he’s shown is his Shells & Joints formation, which was immediately figured out by Riboku.
In terms of strategy, I rate Riboku and Ousen above Shouheikun, but in terms of battlefield tactics, Shouheikun clearly has the best feats of the three.
It's not just the quality of tactics that matters, it's also matters against who those tactics were pulled off. Shou Hei Kun's opponent was - in relative terms - a complete scrub. It's far from shocking he managed to pull off what he did.
Duke Hyou is a different kind of animal. His instinctual prowess would allow him to replicate that same feat against any general and any tactic. You can hardly hold it against Ri Boku.
Ou Sen and Ri Boku used high level tactics against one another. That their vassals were so well trained, versatile and skilled also reflected well on both of them.
If also reflects highly on both of their tactical ability that they could so quickly react and adapt to each other's moves.
Shou Hei Kun has a lot of hype around him, but his feats don't quite measure up.
Duke Hyou is a different kind of animal. His instinctual prowess would allow him to replicate that same feat against any general and any tactic. You can hardly hold it against Ri Boku.
Ou Sen and Ri Boku used high level tactics against one another. That their vassals were so well trained, versatile and skilled also reflected well on both of them.
If also reflects highly on both of their tactical ability that they could so quickly react and adapt to each other's moves.
Shou Hei Kun has a lot of hype around him, but his feats don't quite measure up.
Shouheikun defeated an army of 10,000 men with 1,000 of his own using the Hyourai. Quite overwhelmingly. No other tactician has pulled off anything close to that, in fact no one has even come close to replicating a feat like this.
And the Echelon was used against Kanmei himself who is one of the strongest Generals in Kingdom history, the only Great General aside from Hakuki to have achieved over 100 victories for his state while never losing once. So that point is moot as well.
Citation needed, if Gokei wouldn’t have let his pride overcome him and would’ve actually used retreat tactics, he would’ve eradicated Duke Hyou and his entire army with complete ease.
Duke Hyou overcame Riboku because Riboku’s battlefield tactics were simply not enough to stop him. Other more tactics-focused Generals like Gokei would’ve defeated Duke Hyou overwhelmingly-and Shouheikun is one such commander. Riboku is more of a strategist than a tactician so this isn’t surprising.
And the Echelon was used against Kanmei himself who is one of the strongest Generals in Kingdom history, the only Great General aside from Hakuki to have achieved over 100 victories for his state while never losing once. So that point is moot as well.
Citation needed, if Gokei wouldn’t have let his pride overcome him and would’ve actually used retreat tactics, he would’ve eradicated Duke Hyou and his entire army with complete ease.
Duke Hyou overcame Riboku because Riboku’s battlefield tactics were simply not enough to stop him. Other more tactics-focused Generals like Gokei would’ve defeated Duke Hyou overwhelmingly-and Shouheikun is one such commander. Riboku is more of a strategist than a tactician so this isn’t surprising.
Again, the opponent in question was a scrub.
It doesn't begin to compare to the high level tactics displayed by RBK and Ou Sen. I don't even think it rates higher than what Ka Rin or Tou pulled off.
You do a lot to dress this up, but a) Echelon wasn't some obscure tactic only SHK knows of, and b) Shou Hei Kun gets credit for suggesting the use of Echelon, not for Mou Bu pulling it off.
There is ample evidence in the manga. As well as the fact Hara went out of his way to give Duke Hyou a 100 in Instincts, and the manga makes it very clearly how broken Instinctual Types are.
Hell, you cited the best example yourself with Duke Hyou vs RBK.
RBK is all but outright stated by the author to be the pinnacle of tactics and strategy, and Duke Hyou did what he did against him.
He did the same shit against Go Hou Mei.
I'm not saying the Duke is guaranteed to pull that of against anyone. I'm saying he's capable of it.
Duke Hyou overcame Ri Boku's move because Instinctual Types are broken. There is no clearer example of that than Duke Hyou. Pretty soon it'll probably be Shin.
It doesn't begin to compare to the high level tactics displayed by RBK and Ou Sen. I don't even think it rates higher than what Ka Rin or Tou pulled off.
You do a lot to dress this up, but a) Echelon wasn't some obscure tactic only SHK knows of, and b) Shou Hei Kun gets credit for suggesting the use of Echelon, not for Mou Bu pulling it off.
There is ample evidence in the manga. As well as the fact Hara went out of his way to give Duke Hyou a 100 in Instincts, and the manga makes it very clearly how broken Instinctual Types are.
Hell, you cited the best example yourself with Duke Hyou vs RBK.
RBK is all but outright stated by the author to be the pinnacle of tactics and strategy, and Duke Hyou did what he did against him.
He did the same shit against Go Hou Mei.
I'm not saying the Duke is guaranteed to pull that of against anyone. I'm saying he's capable of it.
Duke Hyou overcame Ri Boku's move because Instinctual Types are broken. There is no clearer example of that than Duke Hyou. Pretty soon it'll probably be Shin.
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The opponent in question was a General who headed the military of an entire state, and Shouheikun dismantled him easily with a 10:1 disadvantage. There are no “scrub” Generals in Kingdom, and certainly not one who headed an entire state’s military lol. This is the guy Ryofui chose to sack Kanyou.
Karin has pulled off nothing close to Shouheikun’s Hyourai. She had like 4x the men that Tou had at Coalition, it would be very easy to do just about anything when you have 4x the numbers of your opponent. Lol
I assume you’re referencing Tou’s bell formation at Coalition, and no lol. This is nothing even close to Shouheikun’s Hyourai. All Tou did was survive against an army with a 4:1 advantage over him. Shouheikun completely mangled an army with a 10:1 advantage over him.
A) huh??? Name me one other commander that pulled off either of Shouheikun’s tactics? “Knowing of” a tactic is nothing, Mouten knew of the Echelon but he even said that the Echelon is so impractical that advanced tacticians can’t pull it off most of the time.
B) you really need to reread the manga bro. Shouheikun did not “suggest” the Echelon, he straight up taught Moubu how to use the technique. Mouten even said that the Echelon was so high level that even advanced tacticians did not use it on the battlefield because it was too risky, but Shouheikun not only pulled it off, but he did so indirectly but instructing another non-tactician on what to do. Lol
This is about the 4th time you’ve made a statement but haven’t cited it. Hara never made such a statement about Riboku. Hara gave him a 100 intellect but that’s not the same as what you’re making up here.
And you outright ignored the point that I made about Gokei basically low diffing him lol, Gokei basically would have eradicated Duke Hyou and his 100,000 man army with less than 10,000 casualties himself.
Duke Hyou is broken in his own way, but against more tactics focused Generals like Gokei, he will get absolutely mangled as he did at Dakan Plains. Riboku’s greatest strengths are not in tactics, they are in his manipulation of information and overall strategic ability. As a tactician, he is up there with the best but there are battlefield tacticians who are noticeably better than him, such as Gokei and Shouheikun. Hell even Gekishin would’ve arguably defeated Riboku if not for Houken.
I’m not downplaying Riboku, but it’s important to recognize why he is the strongest General of all time, and that is because of his strategic ability snd information manipulation, not because of his army vs army tactics where there are certainly better generals than him.
Karin has pulled off nothing close to Shouheikun’s Hyourai. She had like 4x the men that Tou had at Coalition, it would be very easy to do just about anything when you have 4x the numbers of your opponent. Lol
I assume you’re referencing Tou’s bell formation at Coalition, and no lol. This is nothing even close to Shouheikun’s Hyourai. All Tou did was survive against an army with a 4:1 advantage over him. Shouheikun completely mangled an army with a 10:1 advantage over him.
A) huh??? Name me one other commander that pulled off either of Shouheikun’s tactics? “Knowing of” a tactic is nothing, Mouten knew of the Echelon but he even said that the Echelon is so impractical that advanced tacticians can’t pull it off most of the time.
B) you really need to reread the manga bro. Shouheikun did not “suggest” the Echelon, he straight up taught Moubu how to use the technique. Mouten even said that the Echelon was so high level that even advanced tacticians did not use it on the battlefield because it was too risky, but Shouheikun not only pulled it off, but he did so indirectly but instructing another non-tactician on what to do. Lol
This is about the 4th time you’ve made a statement but haven’t cited it. Hara never made such a statement about Riboku. Hara gave him a 100 intellect but that’s not the same as what you’re making up here.
And you outright ignored the point that I made about Gokei basically low diffing him lol, Gokei basically would have eradicated Duke Hyou and his 100,000 man army with less than 10,000 casualties himself.
Duke Hyou is broken in his own way, but against more tactics focused Generals like Gokei, he will get absolutely mangled as he did at Dakan Plains. Riboku’s greatest strengths are not in tactics, they are in his manipulation of information and overall strategic ability. As a tactician, he is up there with the best but there are battlefield tacticians who are noticeably better than him, such as Gokei and Shouheikun. Hell even Gekishin would’ve arguably defeated Riboku if not for Houken.
I’m not downplaying Riboku, but it’s important to recognize why he is the strongest General of all time, and that is because of his strategic ability snd information manipulation, not because of his army vs army tactics where there are certainly better generals than him.
Hey @everyone this is not a new chapter notifications but an acknowledgement of a great effort within the kingdom community.
The coloredconcil team have uploaded the first 6 volumes of the Manga in high quality (1920x2800) using the translation of turnip farmers with the Japanese names. Give their website a visit to show them support.
https://coloredmanga.com/manga/kingdom/
@TheKnightOfTheSea @Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @Owl Ki @RayanOO @Jailer @centurion @Da evil Who @Patryipe @Nidai_Kitetsu @Haoku @Desolate Smaug @Luffy is the mc @Topi Jerami @Blackbeard @Arara @MarineHQ62 @Bepo @God Buggy @kom5 @Monet @Phoenix @Nel-Zel fiasco @Dark Admiral @Greenbeard @Peroroncino @Yo Tan Wa @Thururu @Great General Kanki @Bullet @Red Admiral @Koro @Ninjashadow0209 @M944 @Nibel @Xlaw @Blue @Ponelglyph @Zo0oL SaN @Reign @RecoomeBoom @Puki @NirOU @Little Wing @JEA @Mr. Bushido @Den_Den_Mushi
The coloredconcil team have uploaded the first 6 volumes of the Manga in high quality (1920x2800) using the translation of turnip farmers with the Japanese names. Give their website a visit to show them support.
https://coloredmanga.com/manga/kingdom/
@TheKnightOfTheSea @Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @Owl Ki @RayanOO @Jailer @centurion @Da evil Who @Patryipe @Nidai_Kitetsu @Haoku @Desolate Smaug @Luffy is the mc @Topi Jerami @Blackbeard @Arara @MarineHQ62 @Bepo @God Buggy @kom5 @Monet @Phoenix @Nel-Zel fiasco @Dark Admiral @Greenbeard @Peroroncino @Yo Tan Wa @Thururu @Great General Kanki @Bullet @Red Admiral @Koro @Ninjashadow0209 @M944 @Nibel @Xlaw @Blue @Ponelglyph @Zo0oL SaN @Reign @RecoomeBoom @Puki @NirOU @Little Wing @JEA @Mr. Bushido @Den_Den_Mushi
