General & Others Next Strawhat Crew Members and the Grand Fleet

[Logiko]

I agree with you, in WCI Carrot did standout with Sulong, but that was to showcase the Sulong before it was used in the war with Kaido
Shown in any of the other scenarios that had Minks fighting and still losing would've made the ability seem like a useless powerup

but shown in the instants of Carrot disabling the ships and clashing with Daifuku and ultimately helping the SHs escape shows Sulong as a worth wile powerup

Narratively the setup of Sulong in Zou to the showcase in WCI and use of it by the dukes in Onigashima is a perfect flow of progression when introducing a power-up that every mink has but not all can control

No. The way the chapter was constructed, it was first a showcase of the character of Carrot. The message was as follow: Carrot, despite her look, can be very usefull and very efficient when she uses her Sulong ability. This chapter (and the other 889) work indeed as a payoff of the Duke's word and a setup for the future Mink transformation in Wano.This chapter, was a way to put Carrot on the same level as the other strawhats and put her out of the stowaway box. That's why the chapter ends up on Carrot's smile and not just a simple Sulong action and also and mainly why Carrot's showcase as so much attention put into it on the contrary to the future duke one.

thought you meant this account, guess i misunderstood, sorry

Well, I will most likely delete that present account also anyway

If that's all there was to it then why does Carrot have a unique su long form that's completely different from the wild, feral ones the other minks have? Carrot stands out from the rest of the minks with that form, even Inu and Neko. If anything, it's a poor representation of what su long is supposed to look like, and it begs the question, why is Carrot different?

That's what I mean by "Carrot's showcase as so much attention put into it on the contrary to the future duke one." the way Oda drew Carrot during chapter 888 and the way he organized the chapter is unique and surpass everything you can see with the other Sulong. (in fact when I talk about the N. shining Actions.. this precise action almost surpass every other in term of storytelling and impact. I won't lie, the creation of this chapter was so different that while reading, for one brief moment I thought I was reading something completetly different that One Piece, something more magical, like a wonderful fairy tail. (I think that was mostly due to the fact that I was expecting a berserkal beast and we ended up on a mystical one))

Female vs male. Wanda's Sulong looks the same as hers.

Not at all. Carrot is the only Sulong that appears really human like once she transformed, it's a perfect mix between bestiallity and humanity.

To add to that, there were already 2 minks that were already traveling with the Straw Hats that we knew pretty well at that point (Pekoms and Pedro) so bringing a third just to have them simply be a plot device to show Sulong seems kind of redundant. Sulong didn't have to happen during chapter 888 either, it could've easily happened before Pedro bit the dust or Pekoms got captured. Or honestly, even sometime during Wano.

It doesn't guarantee anything, but her superior control over Sulong could potentially tie into my Wano Rule of 3 theory with a power-up for Carrot. Here are some pages from Chapters 888 and 889.

http://imgur.com/a/EOA9Gzo

A line that stuck out to me when I reread it is when Jinbe said that "when the Minks stare into the full moon on a clear night, they call upon the wild memories that lurk deep within their subconsciousness."

Now would it be possible to call upon these wild, subconscious, memories without the help of the full moon? Could this potential higher form of control get rid of the significant luck-based (or even all) drawbacks of Sulong in general?

:zorothink:


Considering the last time we saw Carrot was only 10 chapters ago with a confirmation from Nekomamushi that she can still turn Sulong,

I think the door could be potentially open for this to happen.

I see that as a possibility too. If one character as to do it, it's the Sulong genius : Carrot.

I dont see much of a difference in the appearances

red eyes
longer hair
fur turned white
aura of electro

Especially when you look at her and Wanda side by side

And i agree the Dukes do have a more feral in appearance but i think that more due to the fact that they are supposed to stand out as the main 2 minks, the rulers and the (assumed) strongest minks, but thats just me

Post automatically merged: Jan 5, 2022

I joke on my stream that this is the only way i see Carrot joining lmao

It's all about the presence. Wanda might look like a bit closer to Carrot (while the other not so much) she still looks like a real beast and quite emotionless on a surface level. Contrary to Carrot who as a possibility for a mush greater range of expression and humanity. Look for example at that Carrot based drawing I made for Carrot a while back.

That range of expression wouldn't be possible neither that impactfull with Wanda

With Carrot, Oda made the perfect mix between bestiality and humanity. Plus she has the aura of a real heroine in that form when Wanda is more like... meh

Don't take this as me thinking Carrot will join btw. Imo there's way too much going against her, but I think it's important to acknowledge when the opposing argument makes a good point.

Going for her* you really meant

At this day, Carrot is still above Yamato in term of probability. If I have to copy past all my blog.. I'll do it xD

Yeah absolutely, I dont think Carrot will join but i do see her potential as a candidate, granted it has dropped a great deal since Wano started but that doesnt discount her past actions, she's snuck on the ship before and can do it again WITH WANDA'S BLESSING

Yup, I do think too that Wanda would need to give Carrot the "go"

The grand unveiling of the final SH in the story is that she had to sneak onboard to join.

Yup, like Robin.

Your point also makes me need to put again another main question (which I have put before here), which is: why Oda gives every single development to Yamato while Oda could’ve given those to Carrot instead? I mean, the answer should be proved by evidences in the manga; not “I think”

Post automatically merged: Jan 5, 2022

Because the Saga of the Yonko is all about parenting and the relationship between parent and child as well as the "inherited will" principle. Without introducing Yamato. Oda would have lost this major theme during the second part of his arc when it was in fact the most important place to put it in.

Oda therefore created the story of Yamato in order to add depth to that conflict with Kaido and echo the parenting theme we had during whole cake.

Beside the inherited will Carrot doesn't have much to do with that theme. She is just act as an echo of the inherited will theme.

Now... why put so much emphasis on Yamato, well you said it:

for “surprise factor”

Carrot will only be relevant at the end, but right now, what is important is for Yamato to understand her true purpose. It is shown by her constant swinging between her persona of Oden and real identity.. And that journey must pass through making her think with exitment that her purpose is on the sea.. when in fact (twist) it's on the land.. surrounded by people who will respect her.

Post automatically merged: Jan 5, 2022

because she is possibly being setup to join the Straw Hats and Carrot isnt
Thats answer i can give you lol

Carrot is setup to become a strawhat. Yamato is not. Yamato is only pushed thinking taht she will join. The difference is important. Carrot has actual setups (Post/interactions/Driving force etc..)

Post automatically merged: Jan 5, 2022

Actually, if you haven't heard, Oda and Shonen Jump are working together to make Yamato as a decoy so that Carrot can be the surprise. You may be asking why they would feel compelled to trick their young teen target audience but don't worry, I got you.

Here's a post that'll elaborate in better detail:

I think It's a stretch to think that the shonen jump and the marketing department is actually working with Oda..

I think they genuingly believe that Yamato will join. Oda is just choosing to stay silent and playing with the Tide.. Take note that such a huge hype for a red hearing is kind of a miracle for an author. You won't get two chances of having so much liberty.

Post automatically merged: Jan 5, 2022

Everyone who believes carrot will join instead of yamato is delusional lol.

Or...

 

[IIskandar1997]

 

[Finalbeta]

If Hiyori joined Momo would have been left more alone

 

[Sigran101]

If Hiyori joined Momo would have been left more alone

Which would be a good thing since Momo deserves to be alone

 

[Pot Goblin]

Question for the Yamato fans, would you consider Yamato unique in the regard that she is the only member that has actively gunned for a position on the crew since we first met her? Most other members Luffy had to win them over so they agree to join, whereas with Yamato it's the reverse where throughout the arc she's winning over Luffy so that he agrees to let her join.

:zorothink:

I know we have Robin who asked to join at the very end but I would say her uniqueness comes from how she was an ex-villain that joined by surprise as a stowaway and not how she asked to join.

What kinda gave me this idea was the comparison between chapters 985 and 1025.

http://imgur.com/a/0F2ZS6P

When Luffy first meets Yamato, he gets angry right away and has a general casual vibe when speaking with her until they split. But in the very brief interaction in 1025, he seems very happy to see her and praises her for holding back Kaido while he was gone. Bringing back the rule of 3 here, the next time they eventually meet might be the time when Luffy is completely won over and accepts her as a member of the crew.

If this idea is accepted then I can probably apply it to other Straw Hat members where they have a unique element that helps them stand out from other members, both current and potential.

Let me know what you think of this idea...

 

[Logiko]

 

[Sigran101]

Question for the Yamato fans, would you consider Yamato unique in the regard that she is the only member that has actively gunned for a position on the crew since we first met her? Most other members Luffy had to win them over so they agree to join, whereas with Yamato it's the reverse where throughout the arc she's winning over Luffy so that he agrees to let her join.

:zorothink:

I know we have Robin who asked to join at the very end but I would say her uniqueness comes from how she was an ex-villain that joined by surprise as a stowaway and not how she asked to join.

What kinda gave me this idea was the comparison between chapters 985 and 1025.

http://imgur.com/a/0F2ZS6P

When Luffy first meets Yamato, he gets angry right away and has a general casual vibe when speaking with her until they split. But in the very brief interaction in 1025, he seems very happy to see her and praises her for holding back Kaido while he was gone. Bringing back the rule of 3 here, the next time they eventually meet might be the time when Luffy is completely won over and accepts her as a member of the crew.

If this idea is accepted then I can probably apply it to other Straw Hat members where they have a unique element that helps them stand out from other members, both current and potential.

Let me know what you think of this idea...

Wouldn't Carrot be the same thing though? She's not an ex villain, Luffy never asked her, and the narrative is that she will sneak on board to join the crew.

 

[Pot Goblin]

Wouldn't Carrot be the same thing though? She's not an ex villain, Luffy never asked her, and the narrative is that she will sneak on board to join the crew.

I personally don't subscribe to the whole stowaway idea with Carrot. I'm more thinking she could be a character that starts from total naivety and is thrust into a situation that she couldn't even comprehend before (WCI). And over the course of the story, she would grow up and understand the bigger picture of the world. She's grown past having to sneak on the ship and instead asks Luffy straight to his face, which is where he says yes. Though this is only an idea that I would have to take a deeper dive to see for sure.

One might bring up Chopper, but I see his story on Drum Island and after is about him overcoming his insecurities from being alone and thinking he's nothing more than a monster. It's probably part of the reason why he's mostly been the doctor team mascot as of right now since his insecurities died at FMI where he accepted being a monster fully for Luffy, sacrificing the only thing that made him look human.

 

[IIskandar1997]

Question for the Yamato fans, would you consider Yamato unique in the regard that she is the only member that has actively gunned for a position on the crew since we first met her? Most other members Luffy had to win them over so they agree to join, whereas with Yamato it's the reverse where throughout the arc she's winning over Luffy so that he agrees to let her join.

:zorothink:

I know we have Robin who asked to join at the very end but I would say her uniqueness comes from how she was an ex-villain that joined by surprise as a stowaway and not how she asked to join.

What kinda gave me this idea was the comparison between chapters 985 and 1025.

http://imgur.com/a/0F2ZS6P

When Luffy first meets Yamato, he gets angry right away and has a general casual vibe when speaking with her until they split. But in the very brief interaction in 1025, he seems very happy to see her and praises her for holding back Kaido while he was gone. Bringing back the rule of 3 here, the next time they eventually meet might be the time when Luffy is completely won over and accepts her as a member of the crew.

If this idea is accepted then I can probably apply it to other Straw Hat members where they have a unique element that helps them stand out from other members, both current and potential.

Let me know what you think of this idea...

What about Brook?

 

[Pot Goblin]

What about Brook?

I would put him in the same camp as Robin, he does ask in the end but it's how he instantly becomes a crewmember in the first place that makes him unique. What would make Yamato stand out is that she consistently and actively wants (and has wanted for a long time) to join Luffy very early since they meet. As well as how Luffy has not fully accepted her as a member just yet. Or at least has not said out loud that he considers her a member.

 

[Logiko]

I personally don't subscribe to the whole stowaway idea with Carrot. I'm more thinking she could be a character that starts from total naivety and is thrust into a situation that she couldn't even comprehend before (WCI). And over the course of the story, she would grow up and understand the bigger picture of the world. She's grown past having to sneak on the ship and instead asks Luffy straight to his face, which is where he says yes. Though this is only an idea that I would have to take a deeper dive to see for sure.

One might bring up Chopper, but I see his story on Drum Island and after is about him overcoming his insecurities from being alone and thinking he's nothing more than a monster. It's probably part of the reason why he's mostly been the doctor team mascot as of right now since his insecurities died at FMI where he accepted being a monster fully for Luffy, sacrificing the only thing that made him look human.

Oda tends to stay straight aroung the core of his characters. Even if it is possible that Carrot might grow enough to comprehend the world and it's grandor, this wouldn't get rid of her core personnality being a reckless 15 year old girl who does whatever she wants boyond consequences.

Just asking to join Luffy would feel out of character for Carrot, she is not that nice, like I said before here. When Carrot's want something, she doesn't really ask, she takes.

There is also the possibility that she just walk through Luffy once they get on the Ship, but it would delete: the surprise factor and the Running gag.

Once thing I agree with, is that Oda might use the whole cake crew to legitimise her once they discover her on the ship.

 

[jordin]

Question for the Yamato fans, would you consider Yamato unique in the regard that she is the only member that has actively gunned for a position on the crew since we first met her? Most other members Luffy had to win them over so they agree to join, whereas with Yamato it's the reverse where throughout the arc she's winning over Luffy so that he agrees to let her join.

:zorothink:

I know we have Robin who asked to join at the very end but I would say her uniqueness comes from how she was an ex-villain that joined by surprise as a stowaway and not how she asked to join.

What kinda gave me this idea was the comparison between chapters 985 and 1025.

http://imgur.com/a/0F2ZS6P

When Luffy first meets Yamato, he gets angry right away and has a general casual vibe when speaking with her until they split. But in the very brief interaction in 1025, he seems very happy to see her and praises her for holding back Kaido while he was gone. Bringing back the rule of 3 here, the next time they eventually meet might be the time when Luffy is completely won over and accepts her as a member of the crew.

If this idea is accepted then I can probably apply it to other Straw Hat members where they have a unique element that helps them stand out from other members, both current and potential.

Let me know what you think of this idea...

She's unique in that she's doing the reverse of how the first member was recruited, which imo is fitting for the last. You explained it well yourself about how Yamato is moreso winning Luffy over than the usual opposite, but there's more to that when comparing her to Zoro.

1. Luffy heard the stories around Zoro and decided he was going to join his crew as long as he's good. Yamato heard all about Luffy and decided she was going to leave with him before they met as well.
2. Luffy blackmailed Zoro into joining. Yamato tried to blackmail Luffy to go on his ship.
3. Zoro initially told Luffy he wanted nothing to do with him until he was convinced to trust him. Luffy reacted the same way with Yamato until she convinced him to trust her.

I think it's reasonable to assume Oda would draw connections like that between the first and last member of the main cast and Yamato matches up fine.

 

[Logiko]

She's unique in that she's doing the reverse of how the first member was recruited, which imo is fitting for the last. You explained it well yourself about how Yamato is moreso winning Luffy over than the usual opposite, but there's more to that when comparing her to Zoro.

1. Luffy heard the stories around Zoro and decided he was going to join his crew as long as he's good. Yamato heard all about Luffy and decided she was going to leave with him before they met as well.
2. Luffy blackmailed Zoro into joining. Yamato tried to blackmail Luffy to go on his ship.
3. Zoro initially told Luffy he wanted nothing to do with him until he was convinced to trust him. Luffy reacted the same way with Yamato until she convinced him to trust her.

I think it's reasonable to assume Oda would draw connections like that between the first and last member of the main cast and Yamato matches up fine.

Not really.

1. There is a difference between a captain hearing about a potential recruit, and a character hearing about a group and stating they will be part of them...

2. There is no blackmail on the side of Yamato. Yamato only pushed a logic. It's like if I would ask you, well you are a sibling of one of my friend, you should be okay giving me your coatch for the year... There is no blackmail here, just bad logic. Try it. Imagine, any other character (beside Vivi) having this kind of argumentation toward Luffy.. would you feel the same way?

3. Luffy already trusted Yamato before she spoke. That's his "power"

I really don't understand how you people can't see how the logic of Yamato is completely flawd.. That's why I'm (mostly) talking about hype blindness. I feel like your are all so hype about Yamato or her "Aura" that you don't see the obvious..

A character stating that they will join the crew outside of any context will never be fitting in term of narration. A character needs to earn it's place in the eyes of LUffy, not only that but the character need to be fighting FOR Luffy and his action, not just because they have heard quite a few cool thing about them.

 

[Formerly Seth]

 

[Logiko]

 

[Formerly Seth]

That's Neko. Perorin.

 

[Logiko]

That's Neko. Perorin.

Same result

 

[Formerly Seth]

 

[Pot Goblin]

She'll do something eventually... right?

 

[Staticshadic]

She'll do something eventually... right?

I think it’s little to late for that

Same result

Not really