Future Events Who do YOU WANT to be One Piece's final villain
- Thread starter Extravlad
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The Worlds Strongest Somali, the true Geeljire Marshall D Teach
@Blackbeard
@Blackbeard
Blackbeard imo, doesnt have the emotional nuance to be the actual final villain. He will be tied to the end, he will be one of the final fights yes, but he doesn't really bring this manga full circle. I think if people think about Shanks in a "logical" way, they might see why he can and fully should be the final antagonist.
- Oda has known the ending to his series since before his series began. This is very unlike most other long running manga because usually the bigger they get, their endings have to fluctuate based on what can be done. We do know (as Oda reminds us always) that his ending hasn't changed. This is important because no matter how much bigger one piece gets, it seems that it will return to its roots primarily for this reason. There are 2 major things that have remained constant since the beginning of the series: Shanks and the Strawhat. They are the biggest things that come out of chapter 1. Blackbeard wasn't hinted at until the 130's and wasnt introduced until the 230's. While there is no evidence to say Oda hadn't conceived Blackbeard from the beginning, we can be sure Shanks was an idea already when Oda drafted his ending.
- Shanks himself is probably the most enigmatic character in the series. We know next to nothing about his motivations or primary feelings about pretty much anything. There are some things that seem to give away to his character though.
- Shanks has constant competitive, almost "evil" looking faces anytime Luffy is mentioned via bounty poster. This has been consistent virtually every time Luffy is mentioned. When he talks to Luffy at Marineford, its yet another weird looking face that sort of doesn't fit the tone of the scene in a way.
- Shanks is an interesting harbinger of peace, but its by which he achieves said "peace" that's odd: His relationship to the WG. Sengoku seems to respect him. This seemed normal until we got chapter 906, his discussion with the Gorosei. This does not make sense in context. The Gorosei murder and commit genocides in droves. This should be the biggest red flag for anyone thinking Shanks is a primarily "good" person.
- Then on that note, his conversation with them ends about a "certain pirate". I hope people know that Oda is all about misdirect when it comes to dialogue. We KNOW Shanks has a disdain for Blackbeard, we KNOW he's warned Whitebeard about him with Ace. So WHY is Oda not actually referencing this "certain pirate" by name prior?
- Whats interesting is that the last thing Shanks did before go to the Gorosei is look at Luffy's 1.5 billion poster and say "its about time we meet Luffy". Not saying it means anything but there was no major Blackbeard or any other pirate news prior to this so...
- Shanks also the same age as the God Valley incident. Oden's flashback also seems to hint that Roger has had Shanks since he was a baby (and maybe even Buggy, who is also the same age). On top of this, Oden's flashback left us with a weird moment where Oden catches Shanks asking Roger an "unknown question", to which Roger responds and Shanks crying. This is a BIG TELL that there is more to Shanks' character than what we know, a hidden emotional connection to Roger or that question.
- God Valley itself is yet another enigmatic island like Laugh Tale. The WG erased the island from maps for a reason, which means Rocks was there for a reason they didn't want another pirate to repeat. If it was just killing the CD's, erasing the island doesn't make much sense when many of them seem to have relocated to Mariejois. On top of this, the term used is "erased from maps", not destroyed.
- A BIG confirmation happened also during Oden's flashback that shows Shanks and Buggy never went to Laugh Tale. This really hurts the whole "gatekeepter" theory because it proves that Shanks wasn't any closer to One Piece than the other Yonko and wouldn't have known where Laugh Tale was.
- We also have zero idea if Shanks is interested or emotionally invested in "One Piece" specifically. His vested interest seems to partially come from Luffy and him meeting again, but why? What does he know or want Luffy to do? He talks about "betting his arm" on the new age, but Shanks never went to Laugh Tale so we have no idea what this actually suggests. There is an idea that "betting his arm" on Luffy suggests malicious intent due to him being a D., and also a reason why he didn't want Ace to die. They are/were candidates for "something". I won't get too deep into theory territory though, its too early.
- Shanks quite literally rips Kids arm off. Pretty violent for a "peaceful" man who sacrifices his own arm. Let it be known that Lucky Roo still shot a man in the head in chapter 1. These people are brutal.
- Luffy has proclaimed twice that he wants to beat Shanks physically, once at Punk Hazard ("as long as Shanks isn't first!"/"I plan on taking down all 4 Yonko") and once at Wano explaining to Hyougoro what the Yonko are.
- A big part of why I think Shanks may be the true final antagonist (not villain, there is a difference) is Mihawk. Mihawk lost his Shichibukai status and his only known association with another pirate is Shanks. Im not saying he will "join" the Red-Haired pirates as Shanks' subordinate but an alliance almost seems likely since what comes after Wano is the world being in turmoil. For Mihawk to be aimless until his eventual final fight with Zoro seems weird, and that the thing, he should be Zoro's final fight. IF Mihawk joins Shanks, then I pretty much expect Shanks to be Luffy's final fight then as well.
- Finally, Shanks being the final battle just works extremely well as an emotional ending to this manga. Returning the hat seems to be the "big loop" this series has gone for, as there are even possible indications Luffy becomes PK before the series ends (before the Final War). Luffy returning the hat to Shanks on the grounds that he wasn't this exactly who he though he was is almost beautifully tragic to me (the implication being Shanks has ulterior motives that are morally grey). It works for Zoro vs. Mihawk because that should be Zoro's last fight (assuming Mihawk allies with Shanks for the final war). It works well for Usopp because surpassing his father (assuming they meet before on Elbaf or another location) is probably an extension of his brave warrior dream since everything he is is based on his father leaving him. I just think there is a huge emotional connection to Shanks being the final villain here, not Blackbeard, who's crew members come off more as "epic" villains than serious ones in all their chaos.
Pretty much all I have. One other thing to note is Blackbeard and Shanks certainly dislike each other. When I suggest Shanks being an antagonist, he is also an antagonist to Blackbeard, not just Luffy, and vice versa. Even with their personalities you get very different vibes from them in terms of how they handle things. Red Haired Shanks. Blackbeard. Order and Chaos. Freedom through controlled peace. Freedom through disarray and panic. Luffy stopping both for his own version of freedom, which we all know would be different. Shanks potentially misinterpreting Roger's will. Makes you wonder if its always been that intentional for Oda.
Edit: This would all come after Akainu/Im etc are taken out during the final war. Blackbeard and Shanks to me are the end to this series. Not 2 villains introduced 500 and 900 chapters in respectively.
- Oda has known the ending to his series since before his series began. This is very unlike most other long running manga because usually the bigger they get, their endings have to fluctuate based on what can be done. We do know (as Oda reminds us always) that his ending hasn't changed. This is important because no matter how much bigger one piece gets, it seems that it will return to its roots primarily for this reason. There are 2 major things that have remained constant since the beginning of the series: Shanks and the Strawhat. They are the biggest things that come out of chapter 1. Blackbeard wasn't hinted at until the 130's and wasnt introduced until the 230's. While there is no evidence to say Oda hadn't conceived Blackbeard from the beginning, we can be sure Shanks was an idea already when Oda drafted his ending.
- Shanks himself is probably the most enigmatic character in the series. We know next to nothing about his motivations or primary feelings about pretty much anything. There are some things that seem to give away to his character though.
- Shanks has constant competitive, almost "evil" looking faces anytime Luffy is mentioned via bounty poster. This has been consistent virtually every time Luffy is mentioned. When he talks to Luffy at Marineford, its yet another weird looking face that sort of doesn't fit the tone of the scene in a way.
- Shanks is an interesting harbinger of peace, but its by which he achieves said "peace" that's odd: His relationship to the WG. Sengoku seems to respect him. This seemed normal until we got chapter 906, his discussion with the Gorosei. This does not make sense in context. The Gorosei murder and commit genocides in droves. This should be the biggest red flag for anyone thinking Shanks is a primarily "good" person.
- Then on that note, his conversation with them ends about a "certain pirate". I hope people know that Oda is all about misdirect when it comes to dialogue. We KNOW Shanks has a disdain for Blackbeard, we KNOW he's warned Whitebeard about him with Ace. So WHY is Oda not actually referencing this "certain pirate" by name prior?
- Whats interesting is that the last thing Shanks did before go to the Gorosei is look at Luffy's 1.5 billion poster and say "its about time we meet Luffy". Not saying it means anything but there was no major Blackbeard or any other pirate news prior to this so...
- Shanks also the same age as the God Valley incident. Oden's flashback also seems to hint that Roger has had Shanks since he was a baby (and maybe even Buggy, who is also the same age). On top of this, Oden's flashback left us with a weird moment where Oden catches Shanks asking Roger an "unknown question", to which Roger responds and Shanks crying. This is a BIG TELL that there is more to Shanks' character than what we know, a hidden emotional connection to Roger or that question.
- God Valley itself is yet another enigmatic island like Laugh Tale. The WG erased the island from maps for a reason, which means Rocks was there for a reason they didn't want another pirate to repeat. If it was just killing the CD's, erasing the island doesn't make much sense when many of them seem to have relocated to Mariejois. On top of this, the term used is "erased from maps", not destroyed.
- A BIG confirmation happened also during Oden's flashback that shows Shanks and Buggy never went to Laugh Tale. This really hurts the whole "gatekeepter" theory because it proves that Shanks wasn't any closer to One Piece than the other Yonko and wouldn't have known where Laugh Tale was.
- We also have zero idea if Shanks is interested or emotionally invested in "One Piece" specifically. His vested interest seems to partially come from Luffy and him meeting again, but why? What does he know or want Luffy to do? He talks about "betting his arm" on the new age, but Shanks never went to Laugh Tale so we have no idea what this actually suggests. There is an idea that "betting his arm" on Luffy suggests malicious intent due to him being a D., and also a reason why he didn't want Ace to die. They are/were candidates for "something". I won't get too deep into theory territory though, its too early.
- Shanks quite literally rips Kids arm off. Pretty violent for a "peaceful" man who sacrifices his own arm. Let it be known that Lucky Roo still shot a man in the head in chapter 1. These people are brutal.
- Luffy has proclaimed twice that he wants to beat Shanks physically, once at Punk Hazard ("as long as Shanks isn't first!"/"I plan on taking down all 4 Yonko") and once at Wano explaining to Hyougoro what the Yonko are.
- A big part of why I think Shanks may be the true final antagonist (not villain, there is a difference) is Mihawk. Mihawk lost his Shichibukai status and his only known association with another pirate is Shanks. Im not saying he will "join" the Red-Haired pirates as Shanks' subordinate but an alliance almost seems likely since what comes after Wano is the world being in turmoil. For Mihawk to be aimless until his eventual final fight with Zoro seems weird, and that the thing, he should be Zoro's final fight. IF Mihawk joins Shanks, then I pretty much expect Shanks to be Luffy's final fight then as well.
- Finally, Shanks being the final battle just works extremely well as an emotional ending to this manga. Returning the hat seems to be the "big loop" this series has gone for, as there are even possible indications Luffy becomes PK before the series ends (before the Final War). Luffy returning the hat to Shanks on the grounds that he wasn't this exactly who he though he was is almost beautifully tragic to me (the implication being Shanks has ulterior motives that are morally grey). It works for Zoro vs. Mihawk because that should be Zoro's last fight (assuming Mihawk allies with Shanks for the final war). It works well for Usopp because surpassing his father (assuming they meet before on Elbaf or another location) is probably an extension of his brave warrior dream since everything he is is based on his father leaving him. I just think there is a huge emotional connection to Shanks being the final villain here, not Blackbeard, who's crew members come off more as "epic" villains than serious ones in all their chaos.
Pretty much all I have. One other thing to note is Blackbeard and Shanks certainly dislike each other. When I suggest Shanks being an antagonist, he is also an antagonist to Blackbeard, not just Luffy, and vice versa. Even with their personalities you get very different vibes from them in terms of how they handle things. Red Haired Shanks. Blackbeard. Order and Chaos. Freedom through controlled peace. Freedom through disarray and panic. Luffy stopping both for his own version of freedom, which we all know would be different. Shanks potentially misinterpreting Roger's will. Makes you wonder if its always been that intentional for Oda.
Edit: This would all come after Akainu/Im etc are taken out during the final war. Blackbeard and Shanks to me are the end to this series. Not 2 villains introduced 500 and 900 chapters in respectively.
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Blackbeard, it would be underwhelming to waste BB as your average villain and have in his stead a clown as the final villain. IM is something which come out of the blue hundreds of chapters in the story while BB was planned and present since very early in OP, Akainu is an underling of the underlings of him plus BB already played the navy along with the strongest pirate crew of the world once and he wasn't even yet a yonko. The other names make even less sense than IM and Akainu.
To me, that's what makes Teach unique amongst most of the One Piece villains. He's not an unstoppable obstacle Luffy has to overcome, rather he's the perfect counterpart who's rise to power contrasts and occurs in tandem with Luffy.
The fact he achieves victory through any means necessary, while also having fate by his side similar to Luffy, means he'll present a unique challenge in the future.
In what way, though? He managed to kill Thatch, steal the Yami Yami no Mi, capture Ace, freed the worst criminals from Impel Down, stole the Gura Gura no Mi, stole Newgate's territories, and crushed the Whitebeard remnants. And his accomplishments are likely not to stop any time soon.
The fact he achieves victory through any means necessary, while also having fate by his side similar to Luffy, means he'll present a unique challenge in the future.
In what way, though? He managed to kill Thatch, steal the Yami Yami no Mi, capture Ace, freed the worst criminals from Impel Down, stole the Gura Gura no Mi, stole Newgate's territories, and crushed the Whitebeard remnants. And his accomplishments are likely not to stop any time soon.
