General & Others With last chapter, can we say Blackbeard is final villain ?

[Kurozumi Wiwi]

It could be argued they were caught off-guard, and besides that was a year ago before they ate their fruits, and even currently we have Van Agur saying he didn't master his fruit yet, showing Oda is still leaving some room of progression for them

Sure, but they simply aren't portrayed as being anywhere near the level to match the might of the WG as a whole.

Besides, I don't think Blackbeard needs to match the Entire World government power to be the FV.

He doesn't need to, but I believe the final battle will be as massive as Oda is allowed to make it, and I don't see it being the case with BBP as the final villains.

Furthermore, concerning this point, Catarina Devon copying Saturn could play a role in the battle control over the Seraphims

If we add potential ancient weapons he could get via Cariboo's information, that would already considerably boost his world lvl threat

if they do manage to steal the seraphims and have full control over them, I can see him being the FV more easily.

 

[Juanpiz]

Well I think if there is a person on this forum even more unlucky with his agendas it would be you lol

Everything as planned

 

[Garp the Fist]

Okay, that brings up back to Whitebeard's beginning statement.

"You're not him... The man that Roger is waiting for is definitely not you, Teach."

Goes on to talk about inherited will.

Starts talking about someone shouldering the history of centuries, the world government's atrocities and lies, in a great war.

The person the world government is afraid of is Luffy. We know he's the one Roger is waiting for / was too early for. He's their primary enemy, throughout this story. Not Teach. He's been excluded from this grudge match since chapter 576.

What Whitebeard said confirms that Luffy wins in the end, which didn’t really need any confirmation.

Not that Blackbeard somehow can’t be the final villain.

He also doesn‘t say anything about the World Gov’s atrocities and lies. And Teach is far from excluded considering he’s literally considered on a par with Luffy (Nika) and Shirashoshi (Poseidon) as people that Imu despises.

Yeah and toss in Germa, Kaido, Linlin and whoever else and that makes the war even bigger. It doesn't mean the biggest war = the war Oda is foreshadowing. The board will be cleared of all pirate rivals by the time we get to Luffy confronting the World Government.

There’s actually no reason to think this.

WB’s quote is that there will be a great war, not that it will just be Luffy vs World Gov
Doffy’s quote is that there will be a great war to be PK where everyone takes part, Yonko, Warlord, Worst Gen, Marines, RA, Celestial Dragons

There’s no reason to think there’s going to be one great war then another one right after it.

No it hasn't.

It blatantly has.
Oda has told us multiple times that the final arc has started now that Wano is over.
Shanks and Blackbeard (and Buggy and Mihawk) are making their moves
An Ancient Weapon has been used
The Gorosei are descending from Mariejois
The RA are besieging Mariejois
The giants are making their move
The Marines are starting to fight the Yonko

The Egghead arc has shown us the opening blows in a world war.

It's also what every road poneglyph is leading to, the culmination of Robin's dream (learning about the void century) and is the reason Imu-sama puts forward on why they have so many problems, these poneglyphs getting out.

Whatever Roger's reaction was is fine for him. But whatever is on Laughtale is going to be significantly more impactful than a funny joke or what have you

The island is called Laugh Tale, it’s a message left by Joy Boy and it caused great hilarity to the people who read it.

It’s contrary to Imu because Imu is misery incarnate and doesn’t want the story of the life of this hilarious warrior to get out there because it will show that there is a better way to live and that the Celestial Dragons are ordinary people who don’t have any divine right to rule.

 

[MarineHQ]

Everything as planned

Gigabeard for a reason

 

[Sword God Ryuma]

Because Auger said "The World"
The World is just another Term for One Piece
Cuz One Piece according to Roger or what People hope it is represents "Everything this World has to Offer" + "Peak Fame, Power, Wealth"
So nothing New here, BB Pirates's Goal is One Piece, just like Shanks announced it recently & so did Buggy

No the World means king of the world like Xebec. Stop talking nonesense.

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

What Whitebeard said confirms that Luffy wins in the end, which didn’t really need any confirmation.

Not that Blackbeard somehow can’t be the final villain.

He also doesn‘t say anything about the World Gov’s atrocities and lies. And Teach is far from excluded considering he’s literally considered on a par with Luffy (Nika) and Shirashoshi (Poseidon) as people that Imu despises.

Whitebeard said Teach isn't the one Roger was waiting for, isn't the one to shoulder history which directly links to the only organization actively hiding, warping or denying history for their own beneit.

Right there, Luffy has to take on the World Government, no one else can. And Whitebeard singles Teach out as someone who won't do that.

As for the atrocities & lies, that's lumped in with history. Why else would you shoulder the history & specificslly challenge the world if it wasn't something monumental?

There’s actually no reason to think this.

WB’s quote is that there will be a great war, not that it will just be Luffy vs World Gov
Doffy’s quote is that there will be a great war to be PK where everyone takes part, Yonko, Warlord, Worst Gen, Marines, RA, Celestial Dragons

There’s no reason to think there’s going to be one great war then another one right after it.

Considering Whitebeard directly called out Sengoku & the World Government when referring to the Great War, it seems very obvious what the war will be. There may be other parties involved, self interested or other groups allying with Luffy lol.

But Whitebeard was telling Sengoku to his face what he fears will happen. No mention of other Yonko, this is directed at the Fleet Admiral.

It blatantly has.

No, it hasn't.

The island is called Laugh Tale, it’s a message left by Joy Boy and it caused great hilarity to the people who read it.

Oda's going balls to the walls with the silliness in the final saga but the One Piece will not be purely humor related. What happened during the void century can be found on Laughtale, unless Oda is getting very tone deaf, the birth of an 800 year old authoritarian regime won't be very humorous.

Another point in favor of Imu-sama being the final villain, we'll literally learn about him and the Void Century on Laughtale.

 

[Peenix]

Well it only makes sense that the villain who's been resting on his laurels for 800 years (Imu) goes down before the ambitious upstart shooting for the skies.

In One Piece, if you don't have any ambition you've already lost before the battle's started.

 

[Sword God Ryuma]

And likely to find out exactly where the man with the burned scar is, since Shiryu ominously hinted that it could be a Government figure.

Teach has put in work specifically for the PK race, whatever side hustle he has with wanting to be apart of the WG is to help him in his race to be PK.

He wants to take over the world like Zebec bro its common sense

Post automatically merged: Feb 17, 2024

So he’s currently in the race for the One Piece though.

That’s his immediate concern given his two recent acquisitions.

Which means he’s going to fight Luffy (the only person as equipped as Teach in said race) for the One Piece.

There’s no coherent argument that Oda had Teach steal the rubbings, get someone who can read them, name drop the burned scar man & the final poneglyph in a Blackbeard flashback just for Teach to not factor into a Laughtale, Lodestar etc arc.

He’s wasted ink setting that up, which more or less locks Teach in as being defeated before Luffy becomes the pirate king

whatever larger ambitions he has doesn’t matter, Kaido and Linlin had their own plans and we see how that went for them.

Then why is He setting up him wanting to be King and Devon touching Saturn

 

[Peenix]

Whitebeard said Teach isn't the one Roger was waiting for, isn't the one to shoulder history which directly links to the only organization actively hiding, warping or denying history for their own beneit.

Right there, Luffy has to take on the World Government, no one else can. And Whitebeard singles Teach out as someone who won't do that.

As for the atrocities & lies, that's lumped in with history. Why else would you shoulder the history & specificslly challenge the world if it wasn't something monumental?

Considering Whitebeard directly called out Sengoku & the World Government when referring to the Great War, it seems very obvious what the war will be. There may be other parties involved, self interested or other groups allying with Luffy lol.

But Whitebeard was telling Sengoku to his face what he fears will happen. No mention of other Yonko, this is directed at the Fleet Admiral.

No, it hasn't.

Oda's going balls to the walls with the silliness in the final saga but the One Piece will not be purely humor related. What happened during the void century can be found on Laughtale, unless Oda is getting very tone deaf, the birth of an 800 year old authoritarian regime won't be very humorous.

Another point in favor of Imu-sama being the final villain, we'll literally learn about him and the Void Century on Laughtale.

Eh, I honestly wouldn't be putting too much stock into what Whitebeard was saying.

A lot of people seem to think based on what Whitebeard said that the World Government's defeat will happen after Laugh Tale, but I don't think that lines up with the direction the story is going in. Saturn is (seemingly) about to die, and there is no reason the World Government shouldn't have the Strawhats at the top of their shit list after they've handed the World Government the biggest humiliation in their entire history.

Plus, it really wouldn't make sense for Luffy to read the origins of the World Government and then go "yeah these guys need to go down." Because regardless of how the World Government was founded, but it has become ABUNDANTLY clear at this point that the people in charge of the World Government are irredeemable pieces of shit. The idea that Luffy needs some stone at Laugh Tale to tell him about history for him to realize that the World Government is bad is just silly after what the Celestial Dragons did at God's Valley.

Also Oda himself has said that the story ends with the One Piece being found.

Blackbeard is Luffy's main foil who's been built up since the start of the series, so imo it does make sense for Luffy's final opponent to be him.

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

Eh, I honestly wouldn't be putting too much stock into what Whitebeard was saying.

That's fine for you, I think Oda's going to give the dying words from one of the most influential characters in the manga some actual weight.

A lot of people seem to think based on what Whitebeard said that the World Government's defeat will happen after Laugh Tale, but I don't think that lines up with the direction the story is going in. Saturn is (seemingly) about to die, and there is no reason the World Government shouldn't have the Strawhats at the top of their shit list after they've handed the World Government the biggest humiliation in their entire history.

They assembled 30k marines, 100+ ships, an admiral and a Gorosei and are about to lose. I do not think the World Government will have the manpower or time to put together another force to intentionally hunt down Luffy. Not with most Shichibukai active, regular people turning on the marines, the Revolutionaries being a persistent and growing thorn in their sides.

Plus, it really wouldn't make sense for Luffy to read the origins of the World Government and then go "yeah these guys need to go down." Because regardless of how the World Government was founded, but it has become ABUNDANTLY clear at this point that the people in charge of the World Government are irredeemable pieces of shit. The idea that Luffy needs some history book at Laugh Tale to tell him about history for him to realize that the World Government is bad is just silly after what the Celestial Dragons did at God's Valley.

But what makes more sense?

Luffy defeats Imu-sama, the Gorosei and everyone then learns about what Imu-sama did on Laughtale?

That's like beating up Doflamingo because he's bad without learning about his backstory or his relationship with Law until Zou or WCI. That wouldn't flow.

Blackbeard is Luffy's main foil who's been built up since the start of the series, so imo it does make sense for Luffy's final opponent to be him.

Respectfully disagree. I think Teach is already on a collision course with Luffy before he makes it to Laughtale and I don't believe Teach will have any role in taking down Imu-sama.

 

[nik87]

Oda said the show ends when the treasure is found, not when WG is beaten.
I said, no way we find out all the secrets in Laugh Tale and then proceed to fight WG for hundred chapters with everything already known.
Everything about Blackbeard's crew points to them not being ready yet - BB himself hunting for 3rd DF, Shiryu didnt obtain 2nd DF yet, Devon just obtained 1st step of big plan, Augur hasnt mastered the ability yet and so on...
Marineford war is the blueprint for WG war, the gathering of the best where Blackbeard pirates climb a ladder among the chaos.

Shiryu hinted at WG having the last RPG and WG war could be only the beginning of the last stretch of the Pirate King race.
So, yes, Blackbeard is the final villain but I think he is not the final obstacle for One Piece. I suspect Cross Guild will outlast him, Buggy's luck is something else as he too used Marineford war to climb the ladder. And Oda gets to end the show on silly note with Luffy vs Buggy instead of the serious note of Luffy vs Blackbeard(as serious as the fight with Looney toon can be) since he already complained about it how serious battle shounen get in the end...

 

[Dragon777]

Both what WB and Roger/Oden said clearly there is something to be done after the OP, and not before.

So, we already know.

 

[Celestial D. Dragon]

@ the bolded; Yeah, this only bolsters the Imu-sama final villain camp, as it's fully expected Luffy will "shoulder the centuries of history" and confront the World Government.

@ the rest;

Whitebeard outright says Blackbeard's "not him", then goes on to describe an individual who will inherit Ace's will and shoulder centuries of history which directly leads to the great war... Then mentions the world being turned upside down with the discovery of the One Piece.

Spoiler

I'm not sure how a world where the governing body is dismantled (via Teach) can be turned upside down even more. And that's ignoring the fact that the One Piece has obvious historic ties to the Void Century and will be integral in the instigation of the Great War.

Teach has no place in this. He cannot take down the World Government because Whitebeard outright says he's not the one to do so and Blackbeard cannot be the world government because he doesn't represent the world government, he'd be an usurper at best.

Cool, the race for the One Piece can be even more dramatic. That does not give him any role beyond it, though.

I'm not sure I agree with your assessment here.

Blackbeard could have plans to take on the World Government and cause horrible, unimaginable pain to the world, after becoming pirate king. Luffy fighting him there would keep those stakes high because if he loses, Blackbeard can go on a rampage.

There's nothing that requires Blackbeard to be the final villain and per Oda's own build up, Teach cannot be the one to take down the world government.

Nor does he currently pose a fraction of the threat that they do.

Yes, Blackbeard is not the guy who is going to shoulder centuries of history, and free the suppressed World. But there will be a great war, and nothing indicates that Blackbeard will not be participating in that war, with his own agenda.

We just found out that Blackbeard comes from a special lineage, and the one thing we know about those with special lineages, is they all have direct ties to the Void Century, and were basically wiped out by the World Government.

If you apply that to Blackbeard, he has the greatest reason to want to see the World Government torn down. He doesn't have to do it on his own, but knowing Blackbeard, who is a man of opportunity, he would be the first to capitalize on the Great War, and use it to see his objective come to fruition.

If he knows the One Piece will spark a Great War, he's going to go for it. But if the great war is his objective to begin with, then he doesn't have to be the one to actually set it off. As long as someone finds the One Piece, the war is inevitable. Going after the One Piece is just a means to an end, if the end game is the war that comes with finding the treasure.

No matter how you look at it, "Pirate King" is not Blackbeard's end goal. We were literally told that this past chapter.

If Oda wants to build up Blackbeard for having a greater goal, only to have Luffy beat him on the road to Laughtale, and take him out of the equation before the great war, then so be it. I think that would be a terrible way to end the biggest built up villain in the entire series, but there is one thing that is undeniable. Blackbeards true goal does not stop at Pirate King. All signs point to a higher agenda.

 

[Paperchampion23]

Oda said the show ends when the treasure is found, not when WG is beaten.
I said, no way we find out all the secrets in Laugh Tale and then proceed to fight WG for hundred chapters with everything already known.
Everything about Blackbeard's crew points to them not being ready yet - BB himself hunting for 3rd DF, Shiryu didnt obtain 2nd DF yet, Devon just obtained 1st step of big plan, Augur hasnt mastered the ability yet and so on...
Marineford war is the blueprint for WG war, the gathering of the best where Blackbeard pirates climb a ladder among the chaos.

Shiryu hinted at WG having the last RPG and WG war could be only the beginning of the last stretch of the Pirate King race.
So, yes, Blackbeard is the final villain but I think he is not the final obstacle for One Piece. I suspect Cross Guild will outlast him, Buggy's luck is something else as he too used Marineford war to climb the ladder. And Oda gets to end the show on silly note with Luffy vs Buggy instead of the serious note of Luffy vs Blackbeard(as serious as the fight with Looney toon can be) since he already complained about it how serious battle shounen get in the end...

You can just shift everything back and assume Mariejoa never gets visited. Maybe Blackbeard doesnt lose AT Laugh Tale, but the island before it. Maybe Imu doesnt lose at Mariejoa, but at Laugh Tale proper around the time Luffy finds One Piece.

The issue is even post Egghead, theres still a hundred little pieces moving at once. Ironically an Admiral and Gorosei losing barely puts a scratch on the other 3 Admirals and 4 Gorosei (plus Imu), let alone the 2 Yonko, Mihawk, etc.

Honestly this shit just might be way more chaotic than we think anyway

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

No matter how you look at it, "Pirate King" is not Blackbeard's end goal. We were literally told that this past chapter.

No, but this is Teach's next objective in his scheme. He stole Law's rubbings, is the second character to bring up the burned scar man and stole Pudding.

He is going to Laughtale, or whatever arc precedes it. And that means he's going to be fighting Luffy.

 

[Dragon777]

No, but this is Teach's next objective in his scheme. He stole Law's rubbings, is the second character to bring up the burned scar man and stole Pudding.

He is going to Laughtale, or whatever arc proceeds it. And that means he's going to be fighting Luffy.

And again, BB is literally the only credible contender.

Who will antagonize Luffy for the race to PK? Law? Kidd ?

That aside form everything else, aside from WB, Roger an Teach's own words.

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

And again, BB is literally the only credible contender.

Who will antagonize Luffy for the race to PK? Law? Kidd ?

That aside form everything else, aside from WB, Roger an Teach's own words.

Every part of the adventure was tough except the last leg, apparently. The most they had to contend with was Kidd's waterlogged corpse.

 

[nik87]

You can just shift everything back and assume Mariejoa never gets visited. Maybe Blackbeard doesnt lose AT Laugh Tale, but the island before it. Maybe Imu doesnt lose at Mariejoa, but at Laugh Tale proper around the time Luffy finds One Piece.

The issue is even post Egghead, theres still a hundred little pieces moving at once. Ironically an Admiral and Gorosei losing barely puts a scratch on the other 3 Admirals and 4 Gorosei (plus Imu), let alone the 2 Yonko, Mihawk, etc.

Honestly this shit just might be way more chaotic than we think anyway

I'm having a hard time predicting the timeline.
The Giants of Elbaf just make it all worse.
They are too powerful looking at what they are doing to a fleet a lot bigger than the fearsome Buster Call.
It would be logical to gather them as allies before moving onto WG but they would wreck 90% of their forces effortlessly.

On the other hand, they could end up neutralized by CoC's crowd control just like Fishmen were in FMI arc...
I agree that nothing seems fixed, visiting Mariejois isnt really a must, PK final fight might not be at Laugh Tale and so on.

I expect two Battle Royale scenarios, one in the fight vs WG, all factions gathering, just like in Marineford.
The other would be to determine who claims the ultimate treasure and I cant really pinpoint where that should play out.
Akainu could fit into Elbaf, paralleling Surtur but no way he gets there alone but pulls a bigger force than Egghead because we saw what happens against Giants even with a force such as the one surrounding Egghead... I am talking at least all of the Admirals coming with him.

On the other hand, Elbaf by itself is huge even if we leave all outside forced out. It is the island with 2nd most build-up in the story, second only to Laugh Tale. The never-ending war, the Vikings that inspired the whole story, possible huge Joyboy lore considering the large straw hat in MJ... Considering their lifespan, their memory of the Void Century is the freshest.
It is certainly a bigger mess than we expect...

 

[Dragon777]

Every part of the adventure was tough except the last leg, apparently. The most they had to contend with was Kidd's waterlogged corpse.

Yeah, it seems the least part will be a joke. We had 1000 chapters of people that wanted to he PK and reach Raftel with all their might, ending with Kaido and BM, but apparently now no one cares anymore.

Now his mighty adversaries will be best friend Law, Kidd the drowned corpse and if we are lucky maybe Buggy, but not the CG, because Mihawk and Croco do not care: Buggy in person .

 

[Jackteo]

Zoro is the only certainty we have. He will fight Shiliew and Venus and Venus > Shiliew
The BB pirates will be defeated before the WG