Character Discussion Yamato ain’t trans...
- Thread starter Lion of Olympus
- Start date
How is that different from referring to Kiku and Izo as brothers (when Kiku had already identified as a woman)?
Yamato discusses identity with Luffy on the same page and from that point on he says Yama-guy, even though he does NOT agree with Yamato being Oden.
Basically, finding the one exception to identifying Yamato as male and running with that as the dominant understanding is confirmation bias.
Yamato discusses identity with Luffy on the same page and from that point on he says Yama-guy, even though he does NOT agree with Yamato being Oden.
Basically, finding the one exception to identifying Yamato as male and running with that as the dominant understanding is confirmation bias.
Well, most languages use the masculine pronouns to refer to any group of individuals; it could have been one guy and nine girls, and you’d still call them “brothers” for shorthand in a lot of dialects. Kiku being lumped in as a man despite identifying as a woman isn’t the same as Yamato - there’s no confusion with the former, Kiku is Kiku and Kiku is a woman in her mind. At the moment, Yamato is Oden and Oden is a man, so Yamato is a specific man when she’s Oden; when she isn’t that specific man, the indication is that Yamato is Yamato and Yamato is a woman. As far as the confirmation bias, that knife can cut both ways…her continuously referring to herself as a man while in the Oden mindset is every bit as disingenuous as saying that the words “Kaido’s daughter” are the true misdirect.
Funny this about these threads is how so many make it a big deal when One Piece itself says it's not.
Bon Kurei said gender is just a word but he prefers women. No one draws attention to his gender.
Iva and the Okama's philosophy is that gender doesn't matter and just be happy. Absolutely no one drew attention to their lifestyle. Only person who showed disgust was Sanji. Aside from that, no one cares.
Okiku, despite viewing thouself as a women, still refers to himself with male pronouns and calls himself Izo's brother. Kiku and Luffy literally had one small panel about Kiku's sexuality and dropped it. Why? Because it doesn't matter.
Yamato is the dumbest case since she literally going around saying the scabbards are her retainers and Momo is her son. Momo and Shinobu even looked at Yamato like she a psycho and ran. It's literally just extreme Oden cosplay.
Some of y'all care waaay too much about this when the characters themselves don't care.
Bon Kurei said gender is just a word but he prefers women. No one draws attention to his gender.
Iva and the Okama's philosophy is that gender doesn't matter and just be happy. Absolutely no one drew attention to their lifestyle. Only person who showed disgust was Sanji. Aside from that, no one cares.
Okiku, despite viewing thouself as a women, still refers to himself with male pronouns and calls himself Izo's brother. Kiku and Luffy literally had one small panel about Kiku's sexuality and dropped it. Why? Because it doesn't matter.
Yamato is the dumbest case since she literally going around saying the scabbards are her retainers and Momo is her son. Momo and Shinobu even looked at Yamato like she a psycho and ran. It's literally just extreme Oden cosplay.
Some of y'all care waaay too much about this when the characters themselves don't care.
We're not talking about "most languages." You used the official translation for English and so did I. In English, we do NOT say brothers if we're referring to siblings of different genders. I'm pretty sure you're North American like me and Stephen so you should understand that is not up for debate in our use of English.
The exact phrase is "Kozuki Oden was a man, right? So I became a man too." That's literal Japanese. Yamato is not a man "because" Oden was a man, but became a man because because Oden was a man. If you don't get the difference, you don't get it. If it means something to you that the manga must be lying in every example you find, that's cool.
The exact phrase is "Kozuki Oden was a man, right? So I became a man too." That's literal Japanese. Yamato is not a man "because" Oden was a man, but became a man because because Oden was a man. If you don't get the difference, you don't get it. If it means something to you that the manga must be lying in every example you find, that's cool.
So if the pronouns aren’t negotiable in English, “Kaido’s daughter” is the start and (current) end of the case for Yamato as a woman. May not be much, but it’s more important than you wanna believe since it’s the official translation. You don’t need to explain this to me like I’m an asshole, especially since it sounds like you’re also saying that Yamato isn’t a trans man in the traditional sense, that she “became” a man to be more like Oden rather than Kiku identifying herself as a woman.
"Like an asshole." ROFL, I try to make what I'm saying clear if I can. I dunno what to tell you, it now sounds like you agree that the text box is the start and end of considering Yamato a female. So addressing Yamato as male started before that and hasn't ended. What does that mean? You're right that this is not a typical trans identity situation, and when speaking about Yamato I refrain from even bothering with pronouns unless pronouns are the actual topic. But so far I think the manga leads us to the one conclusion. Maybe everything gets dropped later, but that hasn't been the case up to now.
The manga usually wants us to come to a conclusion so it can subvert those expectations, so I’m not saying it’s guaranteed, but I think the hints are there that Yamato herself won’t identify as a man when (I hesitate to say “if”) she drops the Oden cosplay. The safest thing would be to not refer to her with any specific pronouns, sure, but I don’t think either masculine or feminine are wrong until we get actual on-panel confirmation of who YAMATO is, not Yamat-Oden.
You really think Kaido being an LGBT supporter suits his personality? 
What's much more possible is him saying this because of always wanting a son but not getting one so he raised Yamato as a son. That doesn't change Yamato's gender.
What's much more possible is him saying this because of always wanting a son but not getting one so he raised Yamato as a son. That doesn't change Yamato's gender.
