725 english scan
https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/a0l2Xu2/1/1/
724 english scan
https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/tujIawV/1/1/
https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/a0l2Xu2/1/1/
724 english scan
https://cubari.moe/read/imgur/tujIawV/1/1/
Spoiler General Kingdom Spoiler
- Thread starter Guan Yu
- Start date
- Tags kaneki & mutin kouen > all ousen ousen>cruzeiro riboku>ousen shin > ouhon wingdom
@Adam 🍎 @Monet if you two are talking Total War then the old Total War thread could use some activity. 
https://worstgen.alwaysdata.net/forum/threads/total-war-franchise.22051/page-3
https://worstgen.alwaysdata.net/forum/threads/total-war-franchise.22051/page-3
I have literally used every RTS game available to simulate Kankoku Pass battle, creating the geographical features, spamming soldiers, creating walls and structures. From Total War Three Kingdoms, Age of Empires to Stronghold lol.
Even modded some in-game characters to resemble China's warring states period generals lol.
Easy man lol.
Riboku is pretty great general. However the hype is too much.
when you are in the war, the final result is the answer. Same with football match, you dont care how many shot on goals Liverpool created if the end of the day Real Madrid scored the winning goal.
in this case, you have to admit Ousen won
Riboku is pretty great general. However the hype is too much.
when you are in the war, the final result is the answer. Same with football match, you dont care how many shot on goals Liverpool created if the end of the day Real Madrid scored the winning goal.
in this case, you have to admit Ousen won
Both commanders applying same tactics from the beginning till end but in the beginning Riboku achieved his targets before Ousen while Ousen achieved in right wing later than him that's why mentioned superior there but never mentioned that he's below Riboku as general. He just compared the situation.
In the end with same strategy, it was Ousen who took win not so claimed "superior Riboku".
What did Riboku did after killing Makou on the left to achieve clear win against Ousen. He left Kisui on his own to finish everything there which cost him the whole war. He had the said advantage/superiority as mentioned by Ousen but still achieved a big fat zero.
OwlKi. Brother, totally agrees with you here.
Just like young trio for Ousen, Riboku had Gyou'un, CGR and Kisui. Both of them made there bet on some outsiders there on either of the wings. But sadly it was Ousen's side who succeeded. Lol
In the Shukai plains, it was " great commander and most dangerous man of all china " RIBOKU who lost within few hours at center in face to face confrontation against Ousen. And pretty badly at that.
What bro ? It wasn't only Ousen who got his HQ attacked but at the same time Riboku’s HQ was also attacked. Both had exactly same strategy and timing but at first day Riboku achieved his target but in center's war, it was Ousen who took superiority as first it some normal or elite soldiers reached Riboku’s HQ but at the next moment it was Shin who reached there. Sadly Riboku again got saved by Houken.
If you got few more "ifs" for Banaji reaching there first or Riboku some other greatnesses becoming lame tricks, than Riboku also planter that fat man from former Keisha army to stop Qin's Right wing but that trick also failed.
Once again it was Riboku who lost in the center pretty badly and in few hours against Ousen. Lol
Yup definitely MouBu is the beast here with his martial prowess if you are just comparing the individual strength. Is this the only thing that the Riboku boys got correctly !? Lol
Brother, it's actually Riboku’s fans who are overestimating him way too much.
In the end with same strategy, it was Ousen who took win not so claimed "superior Riboku".
What did Riboku did after killing Makou on the left to achieve clear win against Ousen. He left Kisui on his own to finish everything there which cost him the whole war. He had the said advantage/superiority as mentioned by Ousen but still achieved a big fat zero.
OwlKi. Brother, totally agrees with you here.
Just like young trio for Ousen, Riboku had Gyou'un, CGR and Kisui. Both of them made there bet on some outsiders there on either of the wings. But sadly it was Ousen's side who succeeded. Lol
In the Shukai plains, it was " great commander and most dangerous man of all china " RIBOKU who lost within few hours at center in face to face confrontation against Ousen. And pretty badly at that.
What bro ? It wasn't only Ousen who got his HQ attacked but at the same time Riboku’s HQ was also attacked. Both had exactly same strategy and timing but at first day Riboku achieved his target but in center's war, it was Ousen who took superiority as first it some normal or elite soldiers reached Riboku’s HQ but at the next moment it was Shin who reached there. Sadly Riboku again got saved by Houken.
If you got few more "ifs" for Banaji reaching there first or Riboku some other greatnesses becoming lame tricks, than Riboku also planter that fat man from former Keisha army to stop Qin's Right wing but that trick also failed.
Once again it was Riboku who lost in the center pretty badly and in few hours against Ousen. Lol
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I’m telling you man, Ousen fans are the most extreme lol. #Moubu>Ousen
Brother, it's actually Riboku’s fans who are overestimating him way too much.
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I’m telling you man, Ousen fans are the most extreme lol. #Moubu>Ousen
Both commanders applying same tactics from the beginning till end but in the beginning Riboku achieved his targets before Ousen while Ousen achieved in right wing later than him that's why mentioned superior there but never mentioned that he's below Riboku as general. He just compared the situation.
In the end with same strategy, it was Ousen who took win not so claimed "superior Riboku".
What did Riboku did after killing Makou on the left to achieve clear win against Ousen. He left Kisui on his own to finish everything there which cost him the whole war. He had the said advantage/superiority as mentioned by Ousen but still achieved a big fat zero.
OwlKi. Brother, totally agrees with you here.
Just like young trio for Ousen, Riboku had Gyou'un, CGR and Kisui. Both of them made there bet on some outsiders there on either of the wings. But sadly it was Ousen's side who succeeded. Lol
In the Shukai plains, it was " great commander and most dangerous man of all china " RIBOKU who lost within few hours at center in face to face confrontation against Ousen. And pretty badly at that.
What bro ? It wasn't only Ousen who got his HQ attacked but at the same time Riboku’s HQ was also attacked. Both had exactly same strategy and timing but at first day Riboku achieved his target but in center's war, it was Ousen who took superiority as first it some normal or elite soldiers reached Riboku’s HQ but at the next moment it was Shin who reached there. Sadly Riboku again got saved by Houken.
If you got few more "ifs" for Banaji reaching there first or Riboku some other greatnesses becoming lame tricks, than Riboku also planter that fat man from former Keisha army to stop Qin's Right wing but that trick also failed.
Once again it was Riboku who lost in the center pretty badly and in few hours against Ousen. Lol
Yup definitely MouBu is the beast here with his martial prowess if you are just comparing the individual strength. Is this the only thing that the Riboku boys got correctly !? Lol
Brother, it's actually Riboku’s fans who are overestimating him way too much.
In the end with same strategy, it was Ousen who took win not so claimed "superior Riboku".
What did Riboku did after killing Makou on the left to achieve clear win against Ousen. He left Kisui on his own to finish everything there which cost him the whole war. He had the said advantage/superiority as mentioned by Ousen but still achieved a big fat zero.
OwlKi. Brother, totally agrees with you here.
Just like young trio for Ousen, Riboku had Gyou'un, CGR and Kisui. Both of them made there bet on some outsiders there on either of the wings. But sadly it was Ousen's side who succeeded. Lol
In the Shukai plains, it was " great commander and most dangerous man of all china " RIBOKU who lost within few hours at center in face to face confrontation against Ousen. And pretty badly at that.
What bro ? It wasn't only Ousen who got his HQ attacked but at the same time Riboku’s HQ was also attacked. Both had exactly same strategy and timing but at first day Riboku achieved his target but in center's war, it was Ousen who took superiority as first it some normal or elite soldiers reached Riboku’s HQ but at the next moment it was Shin who reached there. Sadly Riboku again got saved by Houken.
If you got few more "ifs" for Banaji reaching there first or Riboku some other greatnesses becoming lame tricks, than Riboku also planter that fat man from former Keisha army to stop Qin's Right wing but that trick also failed.
Once again it was Riboku who lost in the center pretty badly and in few hours against Ousen. Lol
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Yup definitely MouBu is the beast here with his martial prowess if you are just comparing the individual strength. Is this the only thing that the Riboku boys got correctly !? Lol
Brother, it's actually Riboku’s fans who are overestimating him way too much.
In the Gyou campaign, Riboku and Ousen were portrayed of a similar level. For the broader strategic vision, Ousen got the edge. In the direct battlefield, Riboku's strategies were better, as Ousen himself said.
As for the food supplies, the time that it took the horse Riboku sent to get to Kaine was time that was lost, obviously.
I think that - hadn't Riboku been taken away under the orders of the pedo king - who would have ultimately succeeded there is made unclear. I need to reread this great arc though.
But, overall, Riboku is the #1 in China.
To be fair, Moubu has grown from the Riboku/Ouki battle, years ago. But yeah, he gets clapped against Ousen 
As for the food supplies, the time that it took the horse Riboku sent to get to Kaine was time that was lost, obviously.
I think that - hadn't Riboku been taken away under the orders of the pedo king - who would have ultimately succeeded there is made unclear. I need to reread this great arc though.
But, overall, Riboku is the #1 in China.
This is how it ends
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To be fair, Moubu has grown from the Riboku/Ouki battle, years ago. But yeah, he gets clapped against Ousen
Especially if the battlefield doesn't have a simple layout. In an open field I can't see Ousen winning but Ousen would simply retreat against someone like Moubu until he gets an area he can manipulate.
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The likes of Riboku and Ousen are mad dangerous everywhere. Their manipulation and strategic ability both in the short and in the long term is lethal in any terrain, their battle formations are of the highest level etc.
I don't know why some have this idea that they are somehow less dangerous in open fields lol. I'm picking them any day.
I don't know why some have this idea that they are somehow less dangerous in open fields lol. I'm picking them any day.
I see many things that they could do. A tactical top tier like Gokei created a situation where a martial beast like the Duke and his men charging had gotten trapped by his soldiers in numerical advantage and would have outright killed him right there had he decided not to engage in a duel with him. And there were other factors as well that gave the Duke the battle, don't want to get into that lol.
I can also see them creating a situation where he gets 2vs1. Or gets stabbed in the back while fighting someone. Or even both lol. Don't want to think about all the possibilities now lol. The level of manipulation and strategic vision of the battlefield that they have is tremendous.
He's ultimately a man just like everyone else and can absolutely be put in bad, bad spots. He has grown from Bayou and won't be baited by the likes of Chou Sou anymore but Ousen and Riboku is another thing entirely.
In a strict 1 vs 1 yeah, no one is capable of besting him
I can also see them creating a situation where he gets 2vs1. Or gets stabbed in the back while fighting someone. Or even both lol. Don't want to think about all the possibilities now lol. The level of manipulation and strategic vision of the battlefield that they have is tremendous.
He's ultimately a man just like everyone else and can absolutely be put in bad, bad spots. He has grown from Bayou and won't be baited by the likes of Chou Sou anymore but Ousen and Riboku is another thing entirely.
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In a strict 1 vs 1 yeah, no one is capable of besting him
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@Fleet Admiral Lee Hung @God Buggy
You two don't think Moubu is getting clapped by Ousen in a head on clash of their forces?
You two don't think Moubu is getting clapped by Ousen in a head on clash of their forces?
Absolutely not, and I can’t fathom anyone who does. In a strategic fight involving army maneuvering and such? Sure. In a headon battle? Hell no.
Moubu annihilated Rihaku’s defensive formations in Bayou which were famed throughout China. Rihaku once defended against a Yan Army of 50K Yan mountain lads with only 7K Zhao Plainsfolk. Moubu butchered Rihaku, which Ouki stated was not a feat possible in tactics. This also matches what Shouheikun said about Moubu, tactics will not stop him, through martial might Moubu pulls off the impossible, this has been stressed multiple times in canon.
What tactics does Ousen have that can defeat Moubu? Shells and Joints? Please, that tactic can’t even defeat Bananji, it could only stop him and certainly did not stop Gyou’Un, Moubu would crush this tactic with extreme prejudice. Hell, Chou Sou pulling every strategy with prep time out of his ass and with Riboku being the true master-planner, couldn’t defeat Moubu, merely corner him. Moubu had arrows sticking out of his arms and torso and was still plowing through Chou Sou’s encirclement without issue. And this was with Chou Sou using strategic warfare, not headon warfare tactics like we are discussing with Ousen atm.
What warriors does Ousen have who can stop Moubu? I won’t even mention them by name because they’ll all be reduce to clouds of powdered blood against Moubu. Even Gyou’Un and Gaku Haku Kou (blessed be their names) are getting pounded by Moubu.
In terms purely of head-on warfare, Ousen gets steamrolled by Moubu. Let Ousen defeat Ordo in headon warfare and then we can talk about Moubu, but Ousen’s strengths are as a strategist, not as a head-on commander. Head-on Ousen loses to Moubu, Kanmei, Renpa, Yotanwa, the Juukou gang, maybe Gaimou, maybe Duke Hyou, even Riboku who is also primarily a strategic commander would defeat Ousen head-on.
Moubu annihilated Rihaku’s defensive formations in Bayou which were famed throughout China. Rihaku once defended against a Yan Army of 50K Yan mountain lads with only 7K Zhao Plainsfolk. Moubu butchered Rihaku, which Ouki stated was not a feat possible in tactics. This also matches what Shouheikun said about Moubu, tactics will not stop him, through martial might Moubu pulls off the impossible, this has been stressed multiple times in canon.
What tactics does Ousen have that can defeat Moubu? Shells and Joints? Please, that tactic can’t even defeat Bananji, it could only stop him and certainly did not stop Gyou’Un, Moubu would crush this tactic with extreme prejudice. Hell, Chou Sou pulling every strategy with prep time out of his ass and with Riboku being the true master-planner, couldn’t defeat Moubu, merely corner him. Moubu had arrows sticking out of his arms and torso and was still plowing through Chou Sou’s encirclement without issue. And this was with Chou Sou using strategic warfare, not headon warfare tactics like we are discussing with Ousen atm.
What warriors does Ousen have who can stop Moubu? I won’t even mention them by name because they’ll all be reduce to clouds of powdered blood against Moubu. Even Gyou’Un and Gaku Haku Kou (blessed be their names) are getting pounded by Moubu.
In terms purely of head-on warfare, Ousen gets steamrolled by Moubu. Let Ousen defeat Ordo in headon warfare and then we can talk about Moubu, but Ousen’s strengths are as a strategist, not as a head-on commander. Head-on Ousen loses to Moubu, Kanmei, Renpa, Yotanwa, the Juukou gang, maybe Gaimou, maybe Duke Hyou, even Riboku who is also primarily a strategic commander would defeat Ousen head-on.
Ousen beating Moubu in a head on clash of forces is the most foolish thing I've read these days since the invisible handcuffs on King and Queen.
Like wth, Moubu pierced through even Kanmei's forces his way through - tactics wont work against him. On a plain land in a army v army war, Moubu is undoubtedly the strongest General.
Like wth, Moubu pierced through even Kanmei's forces his way through - tactics wont work against him. On a plain land in a army v army war, Moubu is undoubtedly the strongest General.
The final result is the answer? So strip away any and all context as to how the victory was achieved regardless of whether it was through battlefield tactics or campaign strategy, ignore who contributed to the victory and only look at the final result? The final result alone will tell us who the better tactician is?
Well I guess that means Sanyou Mougou is a superior General to Sanyou Renpa since the final result was that Mougou won and Renpa lost.
Well I guess that means Sanyou Mougou is a superior General to Sanyou Renpa since the final result was that Mougou won and Renpa lost.