General & Others This is absolutely shameless
- Thread starter Monkey D Theories
- Start date
This is some of the worst writing I've ever seen of a major mangaka. Like someone, anybody, please tell me what's going on in these two pages.
A manga is supposed to tell a story. Luffy is the main character. So it only makes sense that the manga would follow Luffy's story, and not unnecessarily skip over major things that Luffy does for the sake of maintaining viewer interest, right? right?
I could excuse this in the past but now this is just absolutely shameless. This dream which is supposedly a massive mystery has been referenced for over 500 chapters and Oda still won't let us know what it is. Why? is there any reason we shouldn't know what it is? I guess not; Shanks knows, sabo knows, rayleigh knows, yamato knows, momo knows, and the entire fucking straw hat crew knows. Every important character knows, yet the author wants to keep us in the dark for no reason whatsoever.
Whenever a character is about it bring it up, the manga just skips over it for literally no reason. What the fuck? This isn't how a story is supposed to be told. The fact that Oda has done it so many times now just leads me to believe that the story has no real substance. That he needs to keep this going as long as he can because otherwise nobody would care if Luffy just said his dream this chapter.
And I'm worried what this is going to mean for the future. When Luffy goes to raftel, are we just going to see a shot of all the SHs laughing, and then the question of "what is the one piece" won't be answered until 100+ chapters later once the final war is done? I guess so, this is how Oda writes one piece after all.
Luffy's dream was mentioned 4 times now. In the Luffy flashback, in the oden flashback, in Yamato's flashback, and now. And Oda is still pulling this crap. For what? Do any of you truly believe that the reveal of Luffy's dream will be deserving of all Oda has done to conceal it? I really, really doubt it. If anything, it will just feel underwhelming.
its because One Piece has little substance beyond mysteries and action
the mystery is the point, therefore the mystery has to be kept running as long as possible, even when it makes no sense. That's what upsets me, that Luffy's dream is a fake mystery. Its not really a mystery, because almost every single important character already knows about it, but its treated like a mystery for no reason.
the mystery is the point, therefore the mystery has to be kept running as long as possible, even when it makes no sense. That's what upsets me, that Luffy's dream is a fake mystery. Its not really a mystery, because almost every single important character already knows about it, but its treated like a mystery for no reason.
Really? I never got any foreshadowing that Luffy has any dreams other than pirate king, especially, when his dream was established since chapter 1 =>
and when Oda doubled down Luffy's dream in this iconic panel =>
Then he said the same thing immediately after timeskip to Rayleigh =>
"Rayleigh, I am gonna do it. I am gonna be the king of pirates"
Then he said the same to Big Mom and Kaido. He said his pirate king dream so many times that I have never really considered that his real dream could be something else.
and when Oda doubled down Luffy's dream in this iconic panel =>
Then he said the same thing immediately after timeskip to Rayleigh =>
"Rayleigh, I am gonna do it. I am gonna be the king of pirates"
Then he said the same to Big Mom and Kaido. He said his pirate king dream so many times that I have never really considered that his real dream could be something else.
Last edited:
So Luffy's dream went from "Become King of the Pirates" to "Become King of the Pirates in order to be the freest man in the world but I ain't actually explaining what my perception of freedom is to begin with" to "Become King of the Pirates in order to do a thing I think I would only have shot at after already becoming King of the Pirates but I ain't going to say what this thing is".
One Piece has to be the only story I have ever read where I don't actually know what the protagonist's main motivation is.
One Piece has to be the only story I have ever read where I don't actually know what the protagonist's main motivation is.
Oda angels still defending Oda from answering basic questions even after 25 years,
"It is part of the One Piece so he can't show it now even after 25 years and 1000+ chapters because we the readers are still not allowed to know anything about the One Piece because it is the One Piece and the story will be ruined and fall apart if anything about the One Piece gets hinted before the One Piece gets found by those people."
What kind of story has 1000+ chapters and the readers still don't know the main character dream? Lmao.
"It is part of the One Piece so he can't show it now even after 25 years and 1000+ chapters because we the readers are still not allowed to know anything about the One Piece because it is the One Piece and the story will be ruined and fall apart if anything about the One Piece gets hinted before the One Piece gets found by those people."
What kind of story has 1000+ chapters and the readers still don't know the main character dream? Lmao.
It never needed to be anything complex either. If Luffy's entire motivation was "I want to go on adventure and the path to become Pirate King would be the biggest, most awesomenest adventure ever!!!" then that would be perfectly fine.
The problem with coming up with increasingly complex motivations is that the author needs to come up with increasingly complex reasons as to why said character has the aforementioned complex motivation.
"I want the biggest adventure" is self explanatory.
"I want to be the freest man in the world" is a whole other ballgame since now we are in the realm of perceived abstract concepts.
"I want to do a vague thing that needs me to do the most nearly impossible thing first in order to attempt it" is just.... Lol.
I have a post in the Critic's Thread on my thoughts on Luffy's given motivations.
In short, we are 20+ years and over 1000+ chapters into a series where no reader knows what the protagonist's actual main motivation is.
Oda should have stuck to adventure.
The problem with coming up with increasingly complex motivations is that the author needs to come up with increasingly complex reasons as to why said character has the aforementioned complex motivation.
"I want the biggest adventure" is self explanatory.
"I want to be the freest man in the world" is a whole other ballgame since now we are in the realm of perceived abstract concepts.
"I want to do a vague thing that needs me to do the most nearly impossible thing first in order to attempt it" is just.... Lol.
I have a post in the Critic's Thread on my thoughts on Luffy's given motivations.
Just putting the contents of a post of mine here since the thread it was on got locked and I can no longer quote it. Besides, this thread looks like it is need of some activity.
I find one of the biggest problems with Luffy’s character in general, is that his motivation is not truly fleshed out and at times seems rather hollow.
His goal is to be Pirate King because of two supposed reasons;
I) The promise between him and Shanks.
II) Luffy perceives the Pirate King as the individual with the most freedom.
Before this, Luffy only stated that he had intentions of becoming a pirate in general, a pirate under Shanks at that.
This means that Luffy basically declared his intention to be Pirate King because Shanks refused to allow him on his crew and triggered him.
As for Shanks, he only states that Luffy should return the hat to him when he is “a great pirate”.
In short, Luffy’s motivation regarding his desire to be Pirate King is actually quite shallow. The promise between him and Shanks also fails to establish why Luffy desired to be a pirate in the first place.
Ultimately, the first thing that would need to be fixed before anything else is a proper, established character motivation and an explanation as to why Luffy desired to be a pirate from a young age and why he desires to be the Pirate King specifically.
Edit: The spoiler tags are flipping out on me and I have no idea why. Lol.
I find one of the biggest problems with Luffy’s character in general, is that his motivation is not truly fleshed out and at times seems rather hollow.
His goal is to be Pirate King because of two supposed reasons;
I) The promise between him and Shanks.
II) Luffy perceives the Pirate King as the individual with the most freedom.
The problem with reason number one is that Luffy made the declaration of becoming the Pirate King before he made the promise to Shanks.
As for Shanks, he only states that Luffy should return the hat to him when he is “a great pirate”.
The greatest problem with this supposed reason is very simple.
At no point has Luffy ever established his opinion on what exactly he perceives “freedom” to be.
If one were to generalize the concept of “freedom” then you would find two basic types.
I) Freedom from. This is the desire to leave behind that which one deems obstructive to one’s happiness/quality of life in some way.
II) Freedom to. This is the desire to do what one seeks to achieve in life which in turn will contribute to one’s happiness/quality of life.
These may seem similar but they are different.
For example, through being a pirate, Luffy is no longer bound by any law of any nation thus he has freedom to do anything he pleases.
However, in becoming a pirate, Luffy is now unwelcome in most civilized territories and is consistently hounded by the Navy and bounty hunters. As captain he is also responsible for the burden of protecting his crew and giving the final order on what course of action to take. Benn Beckman pointed this out to Luffy (albeit somewhat jokingly since Luffy was a child at the time).
In short, Luffy has denied himself freedom from both increased responsibility and the entire judicial/law enforcement system.
The problem with all this is that all Luffy sought to do is have nakama and adventure which he could have done without being a pirate.
So why did Luffy desire to become a pirate?
When he lived with the mountain bandits he was completely free from any and all typical societal responsibilities. The World Government did not even know of his existence. So what was there for him to seek freedom from?
All Luffy has ever stated to desire (beside the tenuous goal of becoming the Pirate King) is a loyal crew and adventure. The thing is, there is no law or societal responsibility preventing Luffy from doing this legally.
For example, Montblanc Noland was a famous adventurer, funded by governments to find new land with the assistance of a loyal crew. In fact, even becoming a Marine would have allowed for both adventure and a loyal crew. So what freedom to was Luffy seeking?
Again, why did he desire to become a pirate?
Also, why does he perceive the Pirate King to be the “man with the most freedom” when seeking such a title means upholding a duty to crush any challengers to the title (of which there are many) as well as being the most wanted man in the world thus being hunted down with extreme prejudice by all law enforcement organisations?
If one were to generalize the concept of “freedom” then you would find two basic types.
I) Freedom from. This is the desire to leave behind that which one deems obstructive to one’s happiness/quality of life in some way.
II) Freedom to. This is the desire to do what one seeks to achieve in life which in turn will contribute to one’s happiness/quality of life.
These may seem similar but they are different.
For example, through being a pirate, Luffy is no longer bound by any law of any nation thus he has freedom to do anything he pleases.
However, in becoming a pirate, Luffy is now unwelcome in most civilized territories and is consistently hounded by the Navy and bounty hunters. As captain he is also responsible for the burden of protecting his crew and giving the final order on what course of action to take. Benn Beckman pointed this out to Luffy (albeit somewhat jokingly since Luffy was a child at the time).
The problem with all this is that all Luffy sought to do is have nakama and adventure which he could have done without being a pirate.
So why did Luffy desire to become a pirate?
When he lived with the mountain bandits he was completely free from any and all typical societal responsibilities. The World Government did not even know of his existence. So what was there for him to seek freedom from?
All Luffy has ever stated to desire (beside the tenuous goal of becoming the Pirate King) is a loyal crew and adventure. The thing is, there is no law or societal responsibility preventing Luffy from doing this legally.
For example, Montblanc Noland was a famous adventurer, funded by governments to find new land with the assistance of a loyal crew. In fact, even becoming a Marine would have allowed for both adventure and a loyal crew. So what freedom to was Luffy seeking?
Again, why did he desire to become a pirate?
Also, why does he perceive the Pirate King to be the “man with the most freedom” when seeking such a title means upholding a duty to crush any challengers to the title (of which there are many) as well as being the most wanted man in the world thus being hunted down with extreme prejudice by all law enforcement organisations?
Edit: The spoiler tags are flipping out on me and I have no idea why. Lol.
Oda should have stuck to adventure.
Really? I never got any foreshadowing that Luffy has any dreams other than pirate king, especially, when his dream was established since chapter 1 =>
and when Oda doubled down Luffy's dream in this iconic panel =>
Then he said the same thing immediately after timeskip to Rayleigh =>
"Rayleigh, I am gonna do it. I am gonna be the king of pirates"
Then he said the same to Big Mom and Kaido. He said his pirate king dream so many times that I have never really considered that his real dream could be something else.
and when Oda doubled down Luffy's dream in this iconic panel =>
Then he said the same thing immediately after timeskip to Rayleigh =>
"Rayleigh, I am gonna do it. I am gonna be the king of pirates"
Then he said the same to Big Mom and Kaido. He said his pirate king dream so many times that I have never really considered that his real dream could be something else.
