Powers & Abilities "Advanced CoC" is not a thing. This is "Advanced Ryou" + CoC.

#22
I had this exact same thought since the chapter dropped and it's still confusing.

Why would Oda focus the entirety of Act 2 to make Luffy gain the Advanced levels of CoA when he throws it overboard immediately.

- What creates the barrier ?
- Do the attacks only hit harder or do they effect the inside ?

Kaido coughed up blood after Luffy hit him to the stomach and since no scales were destroyed I can only imagine that internal destruction was used.

Why would Oda show Hyo's Advanced armament training when Luffy just uses a Advanced CoC only ability.

Either way, it is far too confusing and we need context.
Cause I don't think either one on it's own will be enough to defeat Kadio, so he will combine the two at some point.

Luffy said he couldn't penetrate deep enough with regular Ryuo, so it stands to reason that internal destruction probably wasn't as effective as it could be. AdCoC seems to be able to penetrate deep into Kaido's body. Now all Luffy has to do is figure out how to use the two in conjunction with eachother to cause massive internal damage to Kaido.
 
#23
Cause I don't think either one on it's own will be enough to defeat Kadio, so he will combine the two at some point.

Luffy said he couldn't penetrate deep enough with regular Ryuo, so it stands to reason that internal destruction probably wasn't as effective as it could be. AdCoC seems to be able to penetrate deep into Kaido's body. Now all Luffy has to do is figure out how to use the two in conjunction with eachother to cause massive internal damage to Kaido.
He is already doing that... Look at his fists.

 
#24
Cause I don't think either one on it's own will be enough to defeat Kadio, so he will combine the two at some point.

Luffy said he couldn't penetrate deep enough with regular Ryuo, so it stands to reason that internal destruction probably wasn't as effective as it could be. AdCoC seems to be able to penetrate deep into Kaido's body. Now all Luffy has to do is figure out how to use the two in conjunction with eachother to cause massive internal damage to Kaido.
It's pure speculation that Adv CoC penetrates deeply into the body, that's the thing. We don't know which Haki type does what in those attacks.
 
#25
It doesn't matter. This is just overcomplicating a simple concept. Luffy comes to the realization that you can coat yourself with Conqueror's Haki, just like Hyou was teaching him to do with CoA. Kaido then confirms that, that is the case, but only a handful of people in the World can do it. Adding CoA hardening to it will definitely make the attack stronger, but it is not needed.
You don't get this. The "hardening" effect is there for Ryou.
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I had this exact same thought since the chapter dropped and it's still confusing.

Why would Oda focus the entirety of Act 2 to make Luffy gain the Advanced levels of CoA when he throws it overboard immediately.

- What creates the barrier ?
- Do the attacks only hit harder or do they effect the inside ?

Kaido coughed up blood after Luffy hit him to the stomach and since no scales were destroyed I can only imagine that internal destruction was used.

Why would Oda show Hyo's Advanced armament training when Luffy just uses a Advanced CoC only ability.

Either way, it is far too confusing and we need context.
Yeah... He's just adding CoC to his advanced Ryou, otherwise there is no reason for the Hyo training flashback. We literally see his hand as black.
 
#29
We've been over this. Oda doesn't colour all the time. See Red Hawk last chapter.



Yes, it's CoC... That's literally the title of the thread. The point is Luffy did not invent a new type of CoC, but rather is channeling it through the Ryou coating he was already using.
He used it, if you pay attention to the tip of the fist, it is coated, he may well have coated it later, when the blow was closer to Kaido, we don't see his fist in front of KAIDO's face without COA, but we can see a shading on his fist.
 
#31
Except Luffy doesn't use CoA at all when he first uses AdCoC to block Kaido's club.

This actually is CoA. Rayleigh with the elephant. Sentoumaru against Luffy. The Admirals against Whitebeard.

People forget that there are 3 levels explained. This was retconned as stage 2 CoA basically. Stage 3 is essentially applying that and it becoming internal destruction (Luffy vs the Tree in Ch 955).

I agree with @sanjikun , this is Stage 1, 2 and/or 3 CoA with CoC applied. When Luffy blocks the Kanabo, its stage 2 with CoC. When Luffy attacks Kaido, likely stage 3 with CoC


I agree that this shit is confusing though, but this is how I understand it atm
 
#32

To tell you the truth, it wasn't with Hyogoro that Luffy learned something new, it was with KAIDO, Hyogoro taught his limit, Hyogoro doesn't have COC, so he taught penetration from outside to inside, disregarding COC, in this chapter , Luffy realizes that KAIDO hits him without even touching him, causing a lot of damage, and what Luffy does is attack KAIDO without touching him and defend himself without touching the enemy, something he never did, as well as kaido and his divine diagram did, by default, luffy doesn't necessarily need to use his arms to defend himself or stop a blow now, he can just use the COC to stop the attack, even without touching it, and apply Ryou + Coc, to do more damage , next chapter, luckily we will have an explanation of kaido.​

Ryou has always shown to be a skill that needed to be within a few centimeters (it does not necessarily need to touch the user), to inflict internal damage, but RYOU was never seen being used defensively and stopping attacks without touching, this applies only offensively and within limit, COC generates a wave, as if Luffy is holding something etc ...​
 
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#33
So is this the first time Luffy used internal destruction? Or has he been using it the whole time?
Unexplained.

Luffy has had 2 new attacks on the roof, Gomu Gomu Red and Red Roc.

Red is the base form version of Red Hawk, a G2 attack. Red Roc is the G3 version , which is also a reference to a giant mythogical bird.

However, based on dialogue, it seems Luffy is now applying Level 3 CoA to them since he says Kaido is dodging and it seems Red Roc hurt Kaido the first time. Unknown why his hand goes on fire though.
 
#34
He is... That's literally what the flashback was. Hyo was talking about going internally...

I'm talking about actually showing internal damage being done. Not leaving it ambiguous to the readers to try and figure out whether internal destruction is being used or not.

And it wouldn't even make sense for Roger and Whitebeard to be using an "Internal destruction" technique for a Sword clash. Like what's even the point of that?
 
#35
Unexplained.

Luffy has had 2 new attacks on the roof, Gomu Gomu Red and Red Roc.
That Gomu Gomu Red was just Luffy being Luffy, he was playing mind games with Kaido, it wasn't an actual attack, he was pretending to use red rock to see if Kaido would actually dodge and he did confirm Luffy's thinking that he is actually damaging him


As for the adv CoC thing, for me it seems that while attack you also use CoC to try and overpower your enemies will causing them to fail to block your attacks, you are literally adding your willpower to an attacking to overpower the other person
 
#36
I'm talking about actually showing internal damage being done. Not leaving it ambiguous to the readers to try and figure out whether internal destruction is being used or not.

And it wouldn't even make sense for Roger and Whitebeard to be using an "Internal destruction" technique for a Sword clash. Like what's even the point of that?
I just think the exact technical aspect of Haki really was just never supposed to be explained on this level.

Like what has confused me the most was how the original aspect of haki (producing a wave of repelling energy) was retconned to be an even stronger version that Luffy couldn't use. Then we have the internal destruction one.

My assumption is that since Luffy is making Kaido bleed from his fists with Haki, he's using it. Like the other WG pirates up there either use swords w/ Haki or in Kids case, a slamming technique to make Kaido bleed. Kid even asks how Luffy did it.
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That Gomu Gomu Red was just Luffy being Luffy, he was playing mind games with Kaido, it wasn't an actual attack, he was pretending to use red rock to see if Kaido would actually dodge and he did confirm Luffy's thinking that he is actually damaging him


As for the adv CoC thing, for me it seems that while attack you also use CoC to try and overpower your enemies will causing them to fail to block your attacks, you are literally adding your willpower to an attacking to overpower the other person
No he completes the attack name. Check the 1009 raws. He doesn't say Red until basically when Kaido dodges. Its the base form version of Red Hawk and Red Roc. Those 2 names are in reference to birds. This move specifically leaves the bird reference out. All 3 moves are fire punches.

You can even see its not a G2 or G3 punch, which explains why the name is different
 
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#38
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No he completes the attack name. Check the 1009 raws. He doesn't say Red until basically when Kaido dodges. Its the base form version of Red Hawk and Red Roc. Those 2 names are in reference to birds. This move specifically leaves the bird reference out. All 3 moves are fire punches.
Go reread the chapter, he was faking it, he stopped short before finishing shouting out the attack because he wanted Kaido to think he was going to use red rock again, that why he laughed and commented on Kaido being afraid.
 
#39
I just think the exact technical aspect of Haki really was just never supposed to be explained on this level.

Like what has confused me the most was how the original aspect of haki (producing a wave of repelling energy) was retconned to be an even stronger version that Luffy couldn't use. Then we have the internal destruction one.

My assumption is that since Luffy is making Kaido bleed from his fists with Haki, he's using it. Like the other WG pirates up there either use swords w/ Haki or in Kids case, a slamming technique to make Kaido bleed. Kid even asks how Luffy did it.
The way I look at it, is that everything Luffy has learned from WCI until up to this point has been preparing him for this inevitable 1 v 1 against. Now that he has the Advanced form of all three forms of Haki, he needs to put them all into practice with each other to stand a chance in winning this. AdCoA and AdCoC both can hurt Kaido, but on their own, neither one is enough. I think by utilizing Future Sight and combining AdCoC and ACoA, that is the trick to beating Kaido. If Oda doesn't go that route, then I'll entertain the notion that it's possible that's what is happening now. But I just have a feeling we are going to get one last "Aha!" moment from Luffy, before he enters into G4 for the last time to end this fight. In the meantime, Luffy will be fighting against Kaido, while Oda finishes up all the downstairs fights.
 
#40
Go reread the chapter, he was facing it, he stopped short before finishing shouting out the attack because he wanted Kaido to think he was going to use red rock again, that why he laughed and commented on Kaido being afraid.
Like I said lol, look at the raws. The attack is in full quotations. There is no "...." indicating he didn't finish the name.

Its not a G2 or G3 punch. Red Roc is specifically a G3 attack. It's why the name is different. He commented on why Kaido is dodging because he's using Adv CoA.
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The way I look at it, is that everything Luffy has learned from WCI until up to this point has been preparing him for this inevitable 1 v 1 against. Now that he has the Advanced form of all three forms of Haki, he needs to put them all into practice with each other to stand a chance in winning this. AdCoA and AdCoC both can hurt Kaido, but on their own, neither one is enough. I think by utilizing Future Sight and combining AdCoC and ACoA, that is the trick to beating Kaido. If Oda doesn't go that route, then I'll entertain the notion that it's possible that's what is happening now. But I just have a feeling we are going to get one last "Aha!" moment from Luffy, before he enters into G4 for the last time to end this fight. In the meantime, Luffy will be fighting against Kaido, while Oda finishes up all the downstairs fights.
I hope Oda gives Luffy a lot of new attack names. There's massive potential to finally differentiate everything
 
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