[FNZ] Role Madness [Season 2] Round 1 - The Dancing Valentine
- Thread starter Noctis
- Start date
- Tags #yamato4nakama bonbon give me cotton candy for a dance laraptsd scumflowa scumilia scumlighthoe scumrhea scumsopp sussopp
- Status
yoooooo
lets lynch queen
lets lynch queen
Let's replenish order! join us to take out Poison.
Reborn shall follow next.
There's likely just one scum amongst the D1 non voters going by my ultimate computational reads compass. 3 are likely nesting amongst the voters from what I have gathered.
2 gentlemen and 2 ladies is the most feasible scenario.
I think Poison being scum makes sense going from her overall behaviour.
I have never seen a fake write up like that must be crystal clear honest here, I think it's likely that one of those three is a scum and perhaps the ability was casted by Town. Also last game Vergo was indeed a townie and that was SRM, this is RM, eventually there will be no surprises.
I have never seen a fake write up like that must be crystal clear honest here, I think it's likely that one of those three is a scum and perhaps the ability was casted by Town. Also last game Vergo was indeed a townie and that was SRM, this is RM, eventually there will be no surprises.
On a scale of 1-10, how confidentwould you be in this lynch?
Same question.
Firstly, why aren't you reading the role descriptions before asking this question? Secondly, no, we do not.
WIFOM.
How useful. Anti-Town is what it is.
Bastard is a term that seems to vary by community and culture. The one I prefer is "betrays the expectations of a player", as long as it cannot be easily justified (as in, why a common expectation should not be a common expectation in the context it is held in).
And how would anyone but the Cult know the answer to this?
It's almost like there is a very easy way to test this or something...
Appeal to Threat fallacy.
Wow, really? One thing I've noticed here - you've caged your language in very wishy-washy terms. It isn't "wow, this is good" - you've made sure to couch your statement in "if Flower is town" - do you not believe this to be the case? I believe you to be scum.
The passive ability idea doesn't really make a lot of sense. From a balance perspective, it either punishes scum for playing too well (imagine a scenario wherein it triggers during LyLo or something, effectively winning the game for the town), heavily changes the tide of a close game with no way for scum to play around it, or adds little to the town. This kind of ability is usually prompted by the user if not automatic for this very reason - it doesn't work well as a conditional. If you as a host want to weaken a role from revealing itself, then you probably shouldn't let it do so at all.
This would make sense, but if it's a scum ability, then who is to say any of it is true at all? And given that, we essentially end up with WIFOM-reasoning.
Even more reason for people to ignore it. Why, then, have you attempted this day phase to find another partner, when from your perspective this very mechanic has drastically hurt the town, and you yourself?
Again, almost like we can test this...
Writeup. Though I struggle to recall seeing it shortened to WU very often outside of this place too.
Can we please stop misusing OMGUS? I get that people like to label behaviour in one simple term, but if you're unable to identify whichever fallacy or category of behaviour you wish to label, you really should just explain it out, rather than attatching a random, easily-recognised term incorrectly and confusing everyone, particularly newer players, in the process. I'd be more sympathetic if I hadn't gone to lengths to explain exactly what OMGUS is and isn't just last day phase.
Logos. Here you attempt to strengthen your argument against Light by strongly implying you are offering a 1:1 trade, except your behaviour before this does not reflect this mindset, which leads me to believe you are simply using whatever terms you want without regard for the consequences of them, because you know if Light is lynched, chances are you won't follow even if he does flip Town (at least, not because Light flipped town).
Again... there's a very easy way to test this... why has this not been mentioned yet???
Can we stop please? This circular act is not going to avoid a modkill if the host decides it has gone too far. I dislike the non-claiming rules probably more than any other player in this game, and have spent years trying to change the no-claim mindset players and hosts alike on anime communities seem to attatch themselves too, but we can at least ensure we're trying to follow the spirit of the rules while the game is being played, yes?
What questions? Nothing remotely of import was asked that was later ignored from what I read.
Vigilante. Though I have my issue with that conclusion too - A Vigilante is a Town-aligned role that can kill a player in the Night Phase (unless various modifiers are attatched). Its Independent/Serial/Cult aligned varient is called "Killer" (hence the common Serial role, "Serial Killer"), and its Mafia-aligned varient is called "Hitman". The problem I have though is that a Vigilante really isn't all that useful a town role - it's designed as a way for the town to remove threats that can't be easily lynched or to clean up players who are by consensus considered scum. Games are rarely designed around a Vigilante blindfiring, meaning that misfires tend to shorten the number of lynches the town has. Moreover, the Town isn't really built to ensure kills go off. Scum killing roles tend to be able to shoot through Iron (also known as Bulletproof, which makes one immune to kills) in a limited (usually (x)-shot) capacity, so them being in possession of a super kill makes sense. But a Vigilante? Unless several scum are immune to normal shots, what value does a Vig shooting through bulletproof and doctor protects have for the Town? And if several scum are immune to normal shots, why even bother having them as such if a dedicated town killing role can bypass it? The design philosophy seems questionable to me on this, and as I never like to assume that the fault lies with game design, I am left to conclude that the kill is likely not from a Vigilante.
Can we please stop trying to flirt with the rules so casually like this? We've all seen how it ends. It's not fun for anyone.
No lynch is bad in most circumstances yes, mathematically so even. Though it should be noted that there are ocassions where a No Lynch is suitable.
Are you trying to get modkills here or something?
Again, this writeup thing really doesn't need to be as absolute as a lot of you seem to be making it out to be. Still no takers for what we should be doing here? Really guys?
You might have, but I find said conclusion to be poorly founded at best. And I'd thank you to not assume a town consensus when the majority have not had their input on this.
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I'll say what we should be doing lynch-wise next post, because no doubt most people have skipped this one.
Br0 you can do better lol. Think please. I was pushing for Rhea the entire phase last time. The day starts, Noctis tags and posts a WU, my first post and instinct is to lynch Flowa. 
I can't tell you everything but you can think aloud and try to get to it.
I can't tell you everything but you can think aloud and try to get to it.
Firstly, why aren't you reading the role descriptions before asking this question? Secondly, no, we do not.
idk how to make u trust me when i cant claim anything lol BUT I WOULDNT KILL MY DANCING PARTNER IM A WIDOW NOW 
How useful. Anti-Town is what it is.
Bastard is a term that seems to vary by community and culture. The one I prefer is "betrays the expectations of a player", as long as it cannot be easily justified (as in, why a common expectation should not be a common expectation in the context it is held in).
And how would anyone but the Cult know the answer to this?
It's almost like there is a very easy way to test this or something...
Appeal to Threat fallacy.
Wow, really? One thing I've noticed here - you've caged your language in very wishy-washy terms. It isn't "wow, this is good" - you've made sure to couch your statement in "if Flower is town" - do you not believe this to be the case? I believe you to be scum.
The passive ability idea doesn't really make a lot of sense. From a balance perspective, it either punishes scum for playing too well (imagine a scenario wherein it triggers during LyLo or something, effectively winning the game for the town), heavily changes the tide of a close game with no way for scum to play around it, or adds little to the town. This kind of ability is usually prompted by the user if not automatic for this very reason - it doesn't work well as a conditional. If you as a host want to weaken a role from revealing itself, then you probably shouldn't let it do so at all.
This would make sense, but if it's a scum ability, then who is to say any of it is true at all? And given that, we essentially end up with WIFOM-reasoning.
Even more reason for people to ignore it. Why, then, have you attempted this day phase to find another partner, when from your perspective this very mechanic has drastically hurt the town, and you yourself?
Again, almost like we can test this...
Writeup. Though I struggle to recall seeing it shortened to WU very often outside of this place too.
Can we please stop misusing OMGUS? I get that people like to label behaviour in one simple term, but if you're unable to identify whichever fallacy or category of behaviour you wish to label, you really should just explain it out, rather than attatching a random, easily-recognised term incorrectly and confusing everyone, particularly newer players, in the process. I'd be more sympathetic if I hadn't gone to lengths to explain exactly what OMGUS is and isn't just last day phase.
Logos. Here you attempt to strengthen your argument against Light by strongly implying you are offering a 1:1 trade, except your behaviour before this does not reflect this mindset, which leads me to believe you are simply using whatever terms you want without regard for the consequences of them, because you know if Light is lynched, chances are you won't follow even if he does flip Town (at least, not because Light flipped town).
Again... there's a very easy way to test this... why has this not been mentioned yet???
Can we stop please? This circular act is not going to avoid a modkill if the host decides it has gone too far. I dislike the non-claiming rules probably more than any other player in this game, and have spent years trying to change the no-claim mindset players and hosts alike on anime communities seem to attatch themselves too, but we can at least ensure we're trying to follow the spirit of the rules while the game is being played, yes?
What questions? Nothing remotely of import was asked that was later ignored from what I read.
Vigilante. Though I have my issue with that conclusion too - A Vigilante is a Town-aligned role that can kill a player in the Night Phase (unless various modifiers are attatched). Its Independent/Serial/Cult aligned varient is called "Killer" (hence the common Serial role, "Serial Killer"), and its Mafia-aligned varient is called "Hitman". The problem I have though is that a Vigilante really isn't all that useful a town role - it's designed as a way for the town to remove threats that can't be easily lynched or to clean up players who are by consensus considered scum. Games are rarely designed around a Vigilante blindfiring, meaning that misfires tend to shorten the number of lynches the town has. Moreover, the Town isn't really built to ensure kills go off. Scum killing roles tend to be able to shoot through Iron (also known as Bulletproof, which makes one immune to kills) in a limited (usually (x)-shot) capacity, so them being in possession of a super kill makes sense. But a Vigilante? Unless several scum are immune to normal shots, what value does a Vig shooting through bulletproof and doctor protects have for the Town? And if several scum are immune to normal shots, why even bother having them as such if a dedicated town killing role can bypass it? The design philosophy seems questionable to me on this, and as I never like to assume that the fault lies with game design, I am left to conclude that the kill is likely not from a Vigilante.
Can we please stop trying to flirt with the rules so casually like this? We've all seen how it ends. It's not fun for anyone.
No lynch is bad in most circumstances yes, mathematically so even. Though it should be noted that there are ocassions where a No Lynch is suitable.
Are you trying to get modkills here or something?
Again, this writeup thing really doesn't need to be as absolute as a lot of you seem to be making it out to be. Still no takers for what we should be doing here? Really guys?
You might have, but I find said conclusion to be poorly founded at best. And I'd thank you to not assume a town consensus when the majority have not had their input on this.
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I'll say what we should be doing lynch-wise next post, because no doubt most people have skipped this one.
Why aren't you even considering Emilia here? What's with this soft defence of Emilia, even?
Is it safe to say you assume one of them is Town, too?
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Here's how we should approach the lynch. We place a majority of votes onto Flower. If the writeup is correct, Flower is not a valid lynch candidate, and so is not targetable for a lynch. Thus, the second-largest wagon should be one of the three listed. If flower gets lynched, then we know that the writeup was a lie, and we also remove the player that stood to gain the most from the fact it was a lie in Flower too. If Flower isn't lynched, we follow the process correctly, we confirm Flower as Town directly (or as good as in any case) and we also prove that we should never be using this pairing mechanic, or even making partners with one another, ever again, because it's purely anti-town. Anyone who then pushes us to do otherwise can be safely considered Anti-town.
Of the three, I do not believe in an Emilia lynch right now, because I have no idea why Scum!Emilia would try to fake some kind of information on Flower at the start of the day, presumably knowing the side effects of losing her R/P/S game, making her push redundant. If the lynch really is between those three, this is almost certainly a scum-aligned ability or mechanic, because only scum benefit from being able to reduce the lynch pool in a way that doesn't even guarantee that scum are lynchable. Aside from my gut currently telling me she's town, her behaviour does not make sense as scum. She could of course be scum and not be mafia, which is still a fair possibility, but I believe she still has more reason to not be the lynch over the other two here.
my two strongest candidates are queen and flower,
I am isolating their posts rn,
One of them is mafia.
I am isolating their posts rn,
One of them is mafia.
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Here's how we should approach the lynch. We place a majority of votes onto Flower. If the writeup is correct, Flower is not a valid lynch candidate, and so is not targetable for a lynch. Thus, the second-largest wagon should be one of the three listed. If flower gets lynched, then we know that the writeup was a lie, and we also remove the player that stood to gain the most from the fact it was a lie in Flower too. If Flower isn't lynched, we follow the process correctly, we confirm Flower as Town directly (or as good as in any case) and we also prove that we should never be using this pairing mechanic, or even making partners with one another, ever again, because it's purely anti-town. Anyone who then pushes us to do otherwise can be safely considered Anti-town.
Of the three, I do not believe in an Emilia lynch right now, because I have no idea why Scum!Emilia would try to fake some kind of information on Flower at the start of the day, presumably knowing the side effects of losing her R/P/S game, making her push redundant. If the lynch really is between those three, this is almost certainly a scum-aligned ability or mechanic, because only scum benefit from being able to reduce the lynch pool in a way that doesn't even guarantee that scum are lynchable. Aside from my gut currently telling me she's town, her behaviour does not make sense as scum. She could of course be scum and not be mafia, which is still a fair possibility, but I believe she still has more reason to not be the lynch over the other two here.
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