General & Others Understanding that some things are exclusive to Luffy and Zoro in the Strawhat crew.

[Shepherd]

Kaku had longer limbs and legs and thus as a result had more speed and reach.

False correlation if anything that makes Kaku slower because he has more mass/lankiness to move around. This also means Kaku is far more vulnerable up close due to his lanky physique

Jyubra had claws but they fail in comparison to a person with a longer reach and speed having swords.

Once again not true, Rankyaku is cool and better at a range but let's be real Shigan is what actually kills, not Rankyaku.

Even defensively kaku was better since he had a bigger body than jyubra ontop confusing tekkai.

Jabura's entire fighting style revolves around Tekkai quit the cap, Kaku is larger and has objectively worse Tekkai meaning he's just a bigger and easier target more often than not

Kaku was superior. Again longer limbs longer legs can cover more ground with speed.

Sure he covers more ground but Jabura can close distance far better because his Hybrid form is smaller (less weight) thus faster and much better for using Geppou.

Again kaku who used swords ontop of storm leg technique

He used swords but literally all of his strongest attacks revolve around Ranyaku which utilize his legs. Kaku used his nose more for attacking even more than his sword. His swords are there to parry and defend more often that not.

Also if you want to include his swords then include Jabura's claws

In terms of durability still kaku since he body is naturally more sturdier than jyubra

No he's not naturally more sturdy lol Jyabura can use Tekkai while moving meaning even if you catch him off guard as Sanji often did, he'll be using iron body to defend. The only reason Sanji was even able to win is due to Sanji's DJ that ignores defense

 

[Robin swan]

Let me fix your question for you. "Do the other strawhats need to be as strong as Luffy and Zoro to achieve their dreams?", No.
But do they need to fight and be strong to achieve them?, Yes.

So are you gonna answer or not. Nobody asked you to change anything I'm speaking in fact based. If the sh's never fought again can zoro and luffy accomplish their dreams? Can the other sh's still accomplish their dreams? These aren't hard question if you aren't trying to use mental gymnastics to somehow get around the facts here.

 

[Human D Luffy]

Dude no one implied anything about other sh's not being sh's. It's just the nature of luffy and zoro's dreams REQUIRES that they fight while the others don't. This doesn't make zoro better than any other sh but it's just a observable fact.

I am starting to think that sanji is an idiot because he should have just joined law. That submarine of theirs has a much higher chance of finding all blues than on sunny.

 

[TEACH D TEACH]

Like meat
And sake

 

[Shepherd]

Also I’m pretty sure guns are the most lethal thing in one piece as that’s the only thing that seem to kill people, so by that logic where’s the lethality boost for a clawed finger pistol

Shigan has always been more lethal than Ra kyaku, even in Punk Hazard Vergo uses Shigan to kill not Rankyaku

 

[Taper]

Dude no one implied anything about other sh's not being sh's. It's just the nature of luffy and zoro's dreams REQUIRES that they fight while the others don't. This doesn't make zoro better than any other sh but it's just a observable fact.

I already said before that the sh's look out for each other and sanji would be a top tier. You are getting off base and adding in stuff that was never said like this because you are trying to use mental gymnastics to argue against a fact. The fact is luffy and zoro have to fight to accomplish their dreams and the other don't. This is the point nothing else. This isn't saying that the sh's can't be strong, this isn't saying that they are somehow lesser sh's than zoro, this isn't saying they are weak or anything else you want to try and make it. This is just a fact that luffy and zoro have luffy has stuff with pretty much all the sh's.

Can Sanji find the All blue without fighting? if so tell me how
Can Franky build a ship that will sail through the whole grand line without fighting if so tell me how?
Can Robin discover the secrets of the worlds history without reaching the final island...can she do that without fighting?
Can Ussop be a brave worrier without fighting?
Can Chopper cure all illnesses without fighting? well no because he had to fight against Queen for synthesizing an antidote so Chopper actively fought because of his dream last couple chapters
Can Jinbei end Racism between Fishmen and Humans without fighting the corrupt WG system?
The only member that could possibly achieve their dream without fighting is Brook I guess.

 

[Robin swan]

It. Doesn't. Matter. Because. That. Is. Not. The. Path. They. Chose.

The. Path. They. Chose. Requires. Strength.

If the sh's never fought again can zoro and luffy accomplish their dreams? Can the other sh's still accomplish their dreams?

The point is as you know by not answering it's impossible for zoro and luffy to accomplish their dreams by not fighting yet the other can cuz it doesn't require fighting.

Idk what's so hard about just saying im wrong and moving on. You are factually wrong and try to use mental gymnastics to argue. The other sh's dreams don't require fighting and you know it. None are fighting based dreams just seems like you want to strip something from zoro and luffy. Let me ask are luffy and zoro the only ones currently on the crew with CoC? If you can answer yes what's so hard about answering yes that they are the only ones with fight based dreams? It's a observable fact nothing more.

 

[Celestial D. Dragon]

You just proved my point. Thinking that having 6 CoC in a crew without have dynamics problem is borderline delusional.
You do realize one in a few millions people in OP has CoC right, not one in a few thousands.

Rogers, Rayleigh and Oden are 3 CoC, shanks is a kid. WB, Ace and Oden are also just 3 CoC.
You don't seem to understand. Oden is an exemption. This man NEEDED WB and Roger to get him out of Wano. If he has a ship of his own, he would have set sail by himself long time already. He only joined WB because he needed him to get him out of Wano. As such, the actually number is 2. This will be the same case as Yamato, who is likely to have CoC but has to ask Luffy to join the crew.

Post automatically merged: Jun 18, 2021

Wtf are you talking about. Luffy beat Katakuri in WCI.

The One Piece World is exponentially larger than our own. Our own World has 7.7 BILLION people in it.

Even if we lowballed the One Piece World into oblivion and said it only has one billion people, that's still 1000 potential CoC users. If we equate the population to our own, that's 7,700 potential CoC users.

If we high ball it, considering that World is much larger, it could potentially be 10,000 if not more potential CoC users.

Post automatically merged: Jun 18, 2021

If the sh's never fought again can zoro and luffy accomplish their dreams? Can the other sh's still accomplish their dreams?

The point is as you know by not answering it's impossible for zoro and luffy to accomplish their dreams by not fighting yet the other can cuz it doesn't require fighting.

Idk what's so hard about just saying im wrong and moving on. You are factually wrong and try to use mental gymnastics to argue. The other sh's dreams don't require fighting and you know it. None are fighting based dreams just seems like you want to strip something from zoro and luffy. Let me ask are luffy and zoro the only ones currently on the crew with CoC? If you can answer yes what's so hard about answering yes that they are the only ones with fight based dreams? It's a observable fact nothing more.

Whatever bs you want to spin to help you sleep better at night.

The fact remains, the path the Straw Hats chose requires them to have strength to achieve their dreams. Denying it, doesn't make it less true.

 

[Charlotte Horchata]

You just proved my point. Thinking that having 6 CoC in a crew without have dynamics problem is borderline delusional.

It isn't. You have no standard to logically defend that six is too much but four, as we saw in the Roger Pirates (yes, Shanks included, doesn't matter he's a kid because he'd still have that spirit), is feasible.

You do realize one in a few millions people in OP has CoC right, not one in a few thousands.

...So? It's like saying the top people in their field can't cooperate and be friends only because they're the ones in a few millions —and surprise, it happens all the time! "One in a few millions" is still a significantly higher number than the twelve alive conquerors we know so far no matter how you put it.

You don't seem to understand. Oden is an exemption. This man NEEDED WB and Roger to get him out of Wano. If he has a ship of his own, he would have set sail by himself long time already. He only joined WB because he needed him to get him out of Wano. As such, the actually number is 2. This will be the same case as Yamato, who is likely to have CoC but has to ask Luffy to join the crew.

Your "the actually number is 2" would be somewhat an argument (which it isn't) if Oden was using them instead of being their close friend and like family to Whitebeard; which he didn't. They got along perfectly well and that's the point, plus how you randomly distinguish Oden "using" Whitebeard and Roger from, I don't know, Franky "using" Luffy because he would need a crew to rule his ship in order to travel the world and achieve his dream. Also, still can't argument what's the factual distinction between two conquerors being perfectly capable to work together as the best friends in the world but six can't in spite of being as close as them and willing to die for each other. What actual argument do you have to support that Zoro's case or Rayleigh case can't happen that many times?

So again, Zoro, a conqueror, is willing to die for Luffy. Chinjao, a conqueror, went from wanting to kill him to sailing under his flag in like a day. Rayleigh, a conqueror, was crying as his partner said goodbye. Whitebeard, a conqueror who didn't trust other conquerors, ended up seeing Oden as his brother and wanting to make Ace the Pirate King (while Ace, a conqueror, gave his life for his father).

If all the Straw Hats were to be conquerors they would still follow Luffy because they are good people, because they are like a family, and because Luffy's greatest power is to make friends. Simple as that, there's no difference between a conqueror like Zoro subordinating to Luffy and another one, two, three... doing the same, because their friendship and Luffy's own charisma is above that —which is something Rocks and his crew lacked, hence why they failed.

 

[Human D Luffy]

It isn't. You have no standard to logically defend that six is too much but four, as we saw in the Roger Pirates (yes, Shanks included, doesn't matter he's a kid because he'd still have that spirit), is feasible.



...So? It's like saying the top people in their field can't cooperate and be friends only because they're the ones in a few millions —and surprise, it happens all the time! "One in a few millions" is still a significantly higher number than the twelve alive conquerors we know so far no matter how you put it.



Your "the actually number is 2" would be somewhat an argument (which it isn't) if Oden was using them instead of being their close friend and like family to Whitebeard; which he didn't. They got along perfectly well and that's the point, plus how you randomly distinguish Oden "using" Whitebeard and Roger from, I don't know, Franky "using" Luffy because he would need a crew to rule his ship in order to travel the world and achieve his dream. Also, still can't argument what's the factual distinction between two conquerors being perfectly capable to work together as the best friends in the world but six can't in spite of being as close as them and willing to die for each other. What actual argument do you have to support that Zoro's case or Rayleigh case can't happen that many times?

So again, Zoro, a conqueror, is willing to die for Luffy. Chinjao, a conqueror, went from wanting to kill him to sailing under his flag in like a day. Rayleigh, a conqueror, was crying as his partner said goodbye. Whitebeard, a conqueror who didn't trust other conquerors, ended up seeing Oden as his brother and wanting to make Ace the Pirate King (while Ace, a conqueror, gave his life for his father).

If all the Straw Hats were to be conquerors they would still follow Luffy because they are good people, because they are like a family, and because Luffy's greatest power is to make friends. Simple as that, there's no difference between a conqueror like Zoro subordinating to Luffy and another one, two, three... doing the same, because their friendship and Luffy's own charisma is above that —which is something Rocks and his crew lacked, hence why they failed.

I didn't even read your essay, but basically you are telling me that if Oden had a ship he wouldn't set sail with his 9 scabbards instead? Cmon now that's why i hate debating on the low IQ tier.

Post automatically merged: Jun 18, 2021

 

[Charlotte Horchata]

I didn't even read your essay, but basically you are telling me that if Oden had a ship he wouldn't set sail with his 9 scabbards instead? Cmon now that's why i hate debating on the low IQ tier.

Post automatically merged: Jun 18, 2021

I'm not telling you that, but it's not surprising you aren't getting it (and you even believe you are the smart one here when obviously aren't since you aren't even capable of presenting a real, logically valid argument to why two, three, even four conquerors can sail together perfectly fine and be like a family but six would be too much to keep their dynamics sane).

What I'm telling you is that whatever the reason Oden sailed with Whitebeard and Roger is irrelevant because the point here is that conquerors can get along perfectly and work together as best friends and even family, making it completely feasible for many conquerors to sail under the most charismatic leader in this story —hence why Zoro ended up joining instead of going for his dream alone, why Rayleigh didn't even think of setting sail until Roger made him, why Ace was willing to make Whitebeard the king while serving as his commander, why Chinjao is now sailing under Luffy's flag even though he first wanted to kill him...

And let's see if all the admirals end up being conquerors too, because that would make who knows how many conquerors following the Government instead of sailing alone (let's see: Sengoku is confirmed so far, then we'd have Garp, Sakazuki, Kizaru, Fujitora, Ryokugyu... Better for you if those guys aren't all among those few millions in spite of Chinjao explicitly mentioning them when talking about the Pirate King being the conqueror above conquerors).

 

[Human D Luffy]

I'm not telling you that, but it's not surprising you aren't getting it (and you even believe you are the smart one here...).

What I'm telling you is that whatever the reason Oden sailed with Whitebeard and Roger is irrelevant because the point here is that conquerors can get along perfectly and work together as best friends and even family, making it completely feasible for many conquerors to sail under the most charismatic leader in this story —hence why Zoro ended up joining, why Rayleigh didn't even think of setting sail until Roger made him, why Ace was willing to make Whitebeard the king while serving as his commander, why Chinjao is now sailing under Luffy's flag even though he first wanted to kill him...

And let's see if all the admirals end up being conquerors too, because that would make who knows how many conquerors following the Government instead of sailing alone (let's see: Sengoku is confirmed so far, then we'd have Garp, Sakazuki, Kizaru, Fujitora, Ryokugyu... Better for you if those guys aren't all among those few millions in spite of Chinjao explicitly mentioning them when talking about the Pirate King being the conqueror above conquerors).

Ok, so now you have switched side and finally realized that Oden (CoC user) wouldn't have joined WB if not for his need for a ship to exit Wano...... lol.....

Of course they get along, but Oden wouldn't have joined him if not for the ship.

The issue with your thinking is that CoC user would somehow just join other CoC because they are buddy buddy.

 

[Goat Cracker]

Can Sanji find the All blue without fighting? if so tell me how
Can Franky build a ship that will sail through the whole grand line without fighting if so tell me how?
Can Robin discover the secrets of the worlds history without reaching the final island...can she do that without fighting?
Can Ussop be a brave worrier without fighting?
Can Chopper cure all illnesses without fighting? well no because he had to fight against Queen for synthesizing an antidote so Chopper actively fought because of his dream last couple chapters
Can Jinbei end Racism between Fishmen and Humans without fighting the corrupt WG system?
The only member that could possibly achieve their dream without fighting is Brook I guess.

Yeah mf already said i found all blue by just sailing to FMI

 

[Charlotte Horchata]

Ok, so now you have switched side and finally realized that Oden (CoC user) wouldn't have joined WB if not for his need for a ship to exit Wano...... lol.....

Of course they get along, but Oden wouldn't have joined him if not for the ship.

The issue with your thinking is that CoC user would somehow just join other CoC because they are buddy buddy.

I've never denied that Oden would have sailed alone if he could have, genius of the highest IQ.

Why did Zoro followed Luffy, a person who wasn't even capable of navigating and had a small boat? Why did Chinjao, a completely established pirate and a legend of his own begin to sail under the Straw Hats flag? Why was Rayleigh, who was living a relaxed life and minding his own business, convinced by Roger to turn the world around? Why did Ace, who wanted to take Whitebeard's head, ended up giving his life for him and wanted to make him the king? Why is Sengoku, one of the smartest people in the whole world, following the orders of illegitimate rulers...?

A CoC user wouldn't "somehow just join" other CoC, that's not my thinking (once again, your incredible intelligence arises, what a genius of you comprehending so greatly simple information!). What a conqueror would do, as it has happened tons of times throughout this story, would be joining another conqueror under a strong enough reason (just like sharing bonds with them); which is exactly why all the Straw Hats could be conquerors and they would remain as close as always.

 

[Robin swan]

Can Sanji find the All blue without fighting? if so tell me how
Can Franky build a ship that will sail through the whole grand line without fighting if so tell me how?
Can Robin discover the secrets of the worlds history without reaching the final island...can she do that without fighting?
Can Ussop be a brave worrier without fighting?
Can Chopper cure all illnesses without fighting? well no because he had to fight against Queen for synthesizing an antidote so Chopper actively fought because of his dream last couple chapters
Can Jinbei end Racism between Fishmen and Humans without fighting the corrupt WG system?
The only member that could possibly achieve their dream without fighting is Brook I guess.

Sanji can look for all blue by sailing and asking around even when he's done with the sh's start his own crew solely based on finding all blue. There is no one sanji has to beat that knows where all blue is.

Franky only has to keep making and improving ships to the point 1 sails the entire grand line. He himself doesn't even need to be on the ship he makes. There is no one Franky has to beat to do this. He can literally stay on the smallest island in op and accomplish his dream.

Robin can literally just wait for someone to gather the poneglyphs and offer her services to read them or she can continue to work with dragon to read them. She doesn't need to fight all she needs is someone or some group to gather the poneglyphs so she can read them. There is no one she can beat that would just reveal all the poneglyphs to her so she can read them. She's a historian and unless being a historian is now being a fighter she doesn't need to fight to accomplish her dreams.

Ussop just needs to be brave. He can find any number of things he's scared of and face them to be more brave. There is no one person he can beat to be brave. He's already beaten and fought people stronger than himself yet still isn't brave.

Chopper wants to cure any illiness, all he needs is a lab to do it. Queen had only 1 antidote for a virus and chopper didn't have time to make his own. He was forced to fight queen he doesn't need to fight anyone to accomplish his dream. Had you gave chopper a lab and time chopper still would come up with a antibody for queens virus he didn't need to fight queen to figure out the antibody for his virus. You can't sub situation for dream other you'd have to believe chopper could never make a vaccine for queens virus without fighting him. That isn't the case but just the situation chopper was placed into.

Jinbe needs to make relationships better between humans and fishmen for his dream. Him fighting would actually hurt since the WG has it's hand in the news and can make jinbe out to be a terrible monster. Jinbe's dream is diplomatic in nature not physical in nature. How does beating a bunch of humans help him accomplish his dreams? It doesn't unless other humans have his back and jinbe can effectively articulate the goals he has. There isn't someone jinbe can beat that would just make fishmen and humans treat each other like brothers or at least neighbors. His dream is something that requires politics to accomplish.

So no again none of them need to fight to accomplish their dreams. There isn't someone who they can beat who makes their dreams come true. Luffy beating the yonko gives him the poneglyphs and makes him more free. Zoro bearing mihawk makes him was. Zoro and luffy need people they have to face to accomplish their dreams the others don't.

 

[Human D Luffy]

I've never denied that Oden would have sailed alone if he could have, genius of the highest IQ.

Why did Zoro followed Luffy, a person who wasn't even capable of navigating and had a small boat? Why did Chinjao, a completely established pirate and a legend of his own begin to sail under the Straw Hats flag? Why was Rayleigh, who was living a relaxed life and minding his own business, convinced by Roger to turn the world around? Why did Ace, who wanted to take Whitebeard's head, ended up giving his life for him and wanted to make him the king? Why is Sengoku, one of the smartest people in the whole world, following the orders of illegitimate rulers...?

A CoC user wouldn't "somehow just join" other CoC, that's not my thinking (once again, your incredible intelligence arises, what a genius of you comprehending so greatly simple information!). What a conqueror would do, as it has happened tons of times throughout this story, would be joining another conqueror under a strong enough reason (just like sharing bonds with them); which is exactly why all the Straw Hats could be conquerors and they would remain as close as always.

you asked too many questions i wouldn't spent 10 min reading and answering all.
1) zoro joined luffy because luffy blackmailed him into joining him........ he wouldn't have joined luffy if luffy didn't blackmail him LOL

 

[Robin swan]

The One Piece World is exponentially larger than our own. Our own World has 7.7 BILLION people in it.

Even if we lowballed the One Piece World into oblivion and said it only has one billion people, that's still 1000 potential CoC users. If we equate the population to our own, that's 7,700 potential CoC users.

If we high ball it, considering that World is much larger, it could potentially be 10,000 if not more potential CoC users.

Post automatically merged: Jun 18, 2021

Whatever bs you want to spin to help you sleep better at night.

The fact remains, the path the Straw Hats chose requires them to have strength to achieve their dreams. Denying it, doesn't make it less true.

Can't handle being wrong huh. Stop spreading your bs if you can't even answer simple questions.

 

[Charlotte Horchata]

you asked too many questions i wouldn't spent 10 min reading and answering all.
1) zoro joined luffy because luffy blackmailed him into joining him........ he wouldn't have joined luffy if luffy didn't blackmail him LOL

What an amazing conqueror, subordinating to another one and ending up willing to give his life for him because of a blackmail. Was Chinjao blackmailed too? Ace? Rayleigh? I mean, we have so many conquerors following another one without their dynamics failing...

 

[Human D Luffy]

Was Chinjao blackmailed too? Ace? Rayleigh?

Ace was blackmailed too. Are you reading two pieces?
He basically had to join WB or die.
Chinjao is the head of his own crew, so i dunno wtf are you talking about.

 

[Sir Yasheen]

Ace was blackmailed too. Are you reading two pieces?
He basically had to join WB or die.
Chinjao is the head of his own crew, so i dunno wtf are you talking about.

No he wasnt. He was given the option “get off this ship and try to kill pops again later or start and take the mark off Whitebeard on your back.”

Ace had full freedom