Gunei was a 40 year veteran who outright said he knew multiple of Ousen’s tactics lol. I definitely would not call him a “scrub”, he was probably still above General Heki at Shukai lol.
The point is that Ko Chou is stalling out Ousen, Akou, and others right now while Bananji was clearly portrayed as Akou’s equal. To compare Bananji to Kochou tactically is retarded lol.
Gunei was a 40 year veteran who outright said he knew multiple of Ousen’s tactics lol. I definitely would not call him a “scrub”, he was probably still above General Heki at Shukai lol.
He's at best a cheap version of Akou in that regard though. Him claiming something and then getting stomped right after is not putting to much stock to his credibility.
How can we be certain that his application of the tactics are at Akou's level ?
The point is that Ko Chou is stalling out Ousen, Akou, and others right now while Bananji was clearly portrayed as Akou’s equal. To compare Bananji to Kochou tactically is retarded lol.
But Ko Chou is the " Guardian of Kantan". To give Bananji a knock back because he very likely can't pull off the same feat in defending as Ko Chou doesn't make sense. Bananjis offensive dwarfs that of Ko Chou individually.
Also, let's not ignore that Kantan's forces are at worst an entire league above Bananjis soldiers if not more. We have to factor that in.
Ko Chou doesn't serve a great general for what we know. If he was really head and shoulders above the other generals, he should've been one of the three great heavens long ago.
It's still safe to say to see him inferior to Shi Ba Shou.
Gunei’s tactics are not on Akou’s level from what we understand. But they should be pretty comparable, this isn’t One Piece where gargantuan strength gaps exist for no reason, especially when Gunei is a General and a 40 year veteran himself, his application of Ousen’s tactics should be at least comparable to Akou, who stalled out Bananji as Gunei got mauled by Gyou’Un.
But Ko Chou is the " Guardian of Kantan". To give Bananji a knock back because he very likely can't pull off the same feat in defending as Ko Chou doesn't make sense.
Ah so this thinking is the reason why @Bullet made the comment. I'll address it below after the addressing the Bananji part. Well bro this is gonna be a fairly long one, grab em popcorns.
- Bananji was able to see Kanki's weakness just like Riboku was and just the like the other short homie was. Who else was able to find Kanki's weakness? Keisha. This essentially established Bananji & the short dude being on similar level to Keisha in terms of tactics, all three of them being Riboku's top deputies. So with this in mind let's address the two Bananji strategical match ups that you mentioned here.
Akou vs Bananji:
Akou vs Bananji intial warfare:
Akou starts off the attack against Gaku'ei, and overwhelms him. Bananji seeing this, comes up with a strategy and decides to take into action. To which even CHG questioned the timing of his decision.
This strategy that countered the Akou army. Which led CHG to comment on Bananji being good with tactics.
In response to this Ouhon implemented his own strategy. And then Akou tries to counter Bananji using Ouhon.
Bananji counters this by turning back going after Ouhon himself.
Intially it seemed like this was just a wreckless move or something. Which resulted in Akou catching up to him and getting Bananji in a 2vs1. Instead it was a calculated move by Bananji, to execute another strategy. Now this made CHG comment on Bananji's understanding of warfare tactics for the 2nd time.
Bananji here effectively outsmarted Akou on his own. No help from Riboku or any such thing. Now let's get to the unfair discrediting that you're trying to do for Bananji by mentioning Riboku.
Akou vs Bananji with their generals behind them:
Akou implements Ousen's defensive strategy after the HSU & Gyou'un join the battlefield. Now if Riboku had a similar logic as yourself where we discredit somebody because they aren't the ones who came up with the strategy, he would not have made the below statement about Akou being somebody with enough talent to rise into being a supreme commander of a large army, all because he was able to implement such a fearsome strategy from Ousen.
Now let's look at how this strategy was countered. First Riboku personally had called upon Bananji specifically away from the army to counter it. Meaning Bananji was the most capable one out there as far as being able to counter it.
Now what was the actual counter Riboku told Bananji? He simply told him the make up of Ousen's defensive formations.
Bananji used this information and proceeded to counter Ousen's strategy. The fact that Riboku went to Bananji to do it confirms Bananji as being superior when it comes to carrying it out. Now if according to Riboku, Akou can be a supreme commander of a large army simply because he could impliment Ousen's tactics. What does that say about the man who implemented the information given to him to counter that strategy only a few hours before he did it? lol
There's really only one point of comparison that can be made between Bananji & Kouchou, and that is that they both arrived to similar conclusions when it comes to the next strategy of Zhao after Gyou fell and Riboku was arrested without being able to send out any commands.
KouChou came up with this:
SSJ agreed saying "that's right".
Then we find out the reason why Bananji sent the messenger is to ask KouChou and SSJ to pull back their armies.
So KouChou ~ SSJ ~ Bananji when it comes to strategy, based on the sole comparison we have between the two. Now let's move on to the overhype of KouChou that's based on your misconception of why YTW/Ousen/Kanki are being held at bay.
KoChou - Qin army - 1 year:
I'll bluntly say this, since there's no point in sugarcoating it. But KoChou is not even in the top 3 reasons as to why Qin hasn't been able to do anything for a year, let alone doing it "by himself".
Initial plan & issues:
Only after a month or so of Shin, Mouten, Ouhon becoming generals, SHK & Ousen were confident enough to take out Kantan, despite KoChou being there. They nonetheless had two big concerns that were detrimental to them conquering Kantan.
#1. Strengthened Zhao interior due it's untouched armies. Thanks to the decisions made by Bananji, SSJ, KoChou in pulling back all the armies of Western Zhao back, majority of it's armies remained untouched. Now thanks to the border being smaller, they are also more compacted, which allows them to bolster the defenses of Zhao even more.
#2. The two cities that were before Kantan. Meaning they had to break through the frontline in a manner that they would still be able to handle the two cities that would stand in their way before they get to Kantan.
Now not to disrespect KoChou or anything, since he was the commanding officer of the army he still had relevancy in being a factor in it being hard. As Mouten noted his defenses aren't to be underestimated. But this really just means he's a good defensive general, but this was said so HSU remains sharp and doesn't take the campaign lightly.
Ousen already had a plan to deal with those armies, the two cities, and put down KoChou. But... something happened.
Issues that halted Ousen's invasion:
Just when Ousen was ready to put out the plan. They hear the news about the King and of course see for themselves, the mythical armies of Kantan.
This washed out Ousen's entire invasion plan, so much so that he was forced back to withdraw into the 2nd defensive line and start from square one again. He had taken months to come up with the previous strategy, the situation being much harder now, one can assume this had the potential of taking even more time than before.
Who was the one responsible for mobilizing the armies of Kantan? You guessed it, the man they call Riboku:
Now after Riboku leaves Kantan, Kantan follows in on Riboku's strategy. Building upon Riboku sending out a part of the Armies of Kantan, Kakukai would send multiples armies surrounding Kantan all throughout Zhao's border. Considering Riboku sending a part of the Kantan armies made Ousen have to start from square one and pull back a bit. This would make the situation many times harder.
But that was not all. Kakukai would then follow up on another strategy. Which is strengthening the cities of Hango & Heiyou, the cities that Mouten said were already solid military cities. These two cities would become the strongholds that would strengthen the Zhao frontlines even more. Making the situation many times harder than just reinforcements from the Kantan armies. This of course being a strategy that he got from Riboku as well.
Right now Qin are having issues dealing with the frontline forces. But it's not because they can't deal with them on an individual level or because of some high level tactics. But it's because the moment they deal with an army, another one comes to replace it.
This is an issue that's happening all across the border, with every single army:
Now the other reason was that Zhao had gotten new generals/commanders who were also good at tactics. It's made specifically clear that KoChou isn't the only one that is good in the frontlines when it comes to strategies. That the new officers are no easy mark. If Hara wanted to make KoChou stand out here he would've made em say something along the lines of "While the new officers are no easy marks. KoChou's defenses are insanely strong". Rather he diminishes the presence of KoChou being this big OP general who can keep Kanki/YTW/Ousen at bay, by saying there are other officers who're giving the Qin trouble and not just KoChou. In fact we don't even factually know where KoChou stands against those other Zhao officers
After mentioning the new officers + KoChou. It's made specifically clear that the biggest reason why Qin can't get past them is because they're heavily outnumbered, to a point they don't even have the manpower to tackle it, let alone fully succeed.
The reason for the above is as Ten explained, the Qin simply don't have the soldiers to send to them, as it would leave them open to invasion from Wei and Chu. Which is why the alliance with Wei & taking over Juuko for Wei, is such a crucial strategy.
Now an overview of the Top 5 reasons why Qin hasn't been able to take Kantan:
1. Riboku himself. The two crucial strategies he laid out are the entire backbone of Zhao right now.
2. Armies of Kantan. These are the strongest armies in the entire Zhao kingdom, these were the armies that Riboku himself intially wanted when dealing with Ousen, YTW, Kanki. Believing he could easily deal with them if he could use just 100k of them, simply a part of the army. Something Ousen would also go on to confirm that had Kantan rolled out it's armies they would've been wiped out from the start. Now majority of the armies of Kantan have been mobilized across the border.
3. The Two cities that were strengthened thanks to Riboku's strategy are now the backbone of the Zhao frontline. They serve as the stronghold, similar to Gyou serving as the Qin stronghold.
4. The non-Kantan armies that had remained untouched in the western front are now on the border in a much more compact way. Making it harder for the Qin to find any holes like they did with the Invasion of Gyou.
5. Qin don't have enough numbers to even tackle the Zhao frontline, let alone get past them and then deal with the two cities behind the frontline. This is thanks to the threat of a Wei invasion, which is what the current arc is for.
6. KoChou and the new Zhao officers.
I was wrong in my initial statement. KoChou doesn't even make top 5 in terms of being the reason why Qin can't get to Kantan, let alone being the very reason they're being held up.
So yea, KoChou is an exceptional general. In ability he's in the SSJ- Bananji - Keisha realm. But as a general due to experience, he's superior imo. But no way is he on the same level as YTW, Ousen, Kanki.. let alone Riboku's equal.
Ah so this thinking is the reason why @Bullet made the comment. I'll address it below after the addressing the Bananji part. Well bro this is gonna be a fairly long one, grab em popcorns.
- Bananji was able to see Kanki's weakness just like Riboku was and just the like the other short homie was. Who else was able to find Kanki's weakness? Keisha. This essentially established Bananji & the short dude being on similar level to Keisha in terms of tactics, all three of them being Riboku's top deputies. So with this in mind let's address the two Bananji strategical match ups that you mentioned here.
Akou vs Bananji:
Akou vs Bananji intial warfare:
Akou starts off the attack against Gaku'ei, and overwhelms him. Bananji seeing this, comes up with a strategy and decides to take into action. To which even CHG questioned the timing of his decision.
This strategy that countered the Akou army. Which led CHG to comment on Bananji being good with tactics.
In response to this Ouhon implemented his own strategy. And then Akou tries to counter Bananji using Ouhon.
Bananji counters this by turning back going after Ouhon himself.
Intially it seemed like this was just a wreckless move or something. Which resulted in Akou catching up to him and getting Bananji in a 2vs1. Instead it was a calculated move by Bananji, to execute another strategy. Now this made CHG comment on Bananji's understanding of warfare tactics for the 2nd time.
Bananji here effectively outsmarted Akou on his own. No help from Riboku or any such thing. Now let's get to the unfair discrediting that you're trying to do for Bananji by mentioning Riboku.
Akou vs Bananji with their generals behind them:
Akou implements Ousen's defensive strategy after the HSU & Gyou'un join the battlefield. Now if Riboku had a similar logic as yourself where we discredit somebody because they aren't the ones who came up with the strategy, he would not have made the below statement about Akou being somebody with enough talent to rise into being a supreme commander of a large army, all because he was able to implement such a fearsome strategy from Ousen.
Now let's look at how this strategy was countered. First Riboku personally had called upon Bananji specifically away from the army to counter it. Meaning Bananji was the most capable one out there as far as being able to counter it.
Now what was the actual counter Riboku told Bananji? He simply told him the make up of Ousen's defensive formations.
Bananji used this information and proceeded to counter Ousen's strategy. The fact that Riboku went to Bananji to do it confirms Bananji as being superior when it comes to carrying it out. Now if according to Riboku, Akou can be a supreme commander of a large army simply because he could impliment Ousen's tactics. What does that say about the man who implemented the information given to him to counter that strategy only a few hours before he did it? lol
There's really only one point of comparison that can be made between Bananji & Kouchou, and that is that they both arrived to similar conclusions when it comes to the next strategy of Zhao after Gyou fell and Riboku was arrested without being able to send out any commands.
KouChou came up with this:
SSJ agreed saying "that's right".
Then we find out the reason why Bananji sent the messenger is to ask KouChou and SSJ to pull back their armies.
So KouChou ~ SSJ ~ Bananji when it comes to strategy, based on the sole comparison we have between the two. Now let's move on to the overhype of KouChou that's based on your misconception of why YTW/Ousen/Kanki are being held at bay.
KoChou - Qin army - 1 year:
I'll bluntly say this, since there's no point in sugarcoating it. But KoChou is not even in the top 3 reasons as to why Qin hasn't been able to do anything for a year, let alone doing it "by himself".
Initial plan & issues:
Only after a month or so of Shin, Mouten, Ouhon becoming generals, SHK & Ousen were confident enough to take out Kantan, despite KoChou being there. They nonetheless had two big concerns that were detrimental to them conquering Kantan.
#1. Strengthened Zhao interior due it's untouched armies. Thanks to the decisions made by Bananji, SSJ, KoChou in pulling back all the armies of Western Zhao back, majority of it's armies remained untouched. Now thanks to the border being smaller, they are also more compacted, which allows them to bolster the defenses of Zhao even more.
#2. The two cities that were before Kantan. Meaning they had to break through the frontline in a manner that they would still be able to handle the two cities that would stand in their way before they get to Kantan.
Now not to disrespect KoChou or anything, since he was the commanding officer of the army he still had relevancy in being a factor in it being hard. As Mouten noted his defenses aren't to be underestimated. But this really just means he's a good defensive general, but this was said so HSU remains sharp and doesn't take the campaign lightly.
Ousen already had a plan to deal with those armies, the two cities, and put down KoChou. But... something happened.
Issues that halted Ousen's invasion:
Just when Ousen was ready to put out the plan. They hear the news about the King and of course see for themselves, the mythical armies of Kantan.
This washed out Ousen's entire invasion plan, so much so that he was forced back to withdraw into the 2nd defensive line and start from square one again. He had taken months to come up with the previous strategy, the situation being much harder now, one can assume this had the potential of taking even more time than before.
Who was the one responsible for mobilizing the armies of Kantan? You guessed it, the man they call Riboku:
Now after Riboku leaves Kantan, Kantan follows in on Riboku's strategy. Building upon Riboku sending out a part of the Armies of Kantan, Kakukai would send multiples armies surrounding Kantan all throughout Zhao's border. Considering Riboku sending a part of the Kantan armies made Ousen have to start from square one and pull back a bit. This would make the situation many times harder.
But that was not all. Kakukai would then follow up on another strategy. Which is strengthening the cities of Hango & Heiyou, the cities that Mouten said were already solid military cities. These two cities would become the strongholds that would strengthen the Zhao frontlines even more. Making the situation many times harder than just reinforcements from the Kantan armies. This of course being a strategy that he got from Riboku as well.
Right now Qin are having issues dealing with the frontline forces. But it's not because they can't deal with them on an individual level or because of some high level tactics. But it's because the moment they deal with an army, another one comes to replace it.
This is an issue that's happening all across the border, with every single army:
Now the other reason was that Zhao had gotten new generals/commanders who were also good at tactics. It's made specifically clear that KoChou isn't the only one that is good in the frontlines when it comes to strategies. That the new officers are no easy mark. If Hara wanted to make KoChou stand out here he would've made em say something along the lines of "While the new officers are no easy marks. KoChou's defenses are insanely strong". Rather he diminishes the presence of KoChou being this big OP general who can keep Kanki/YTW/Ousen at bay, by saying there are other officers who're giving the Qin trouble and not just KoChou. In fact we don't even factually know where KoChou stands against those other Zhao officers
After mentioning the new officers + KoChou. It's made specifically clear that the biggest reason why Qin can't get past them is because they're heavily outnumbered, to a point they don't even have the manpower to tackle it, let alone fully succeed.
The reason for the above is as Ten explained, the Qin simply don't have the soldiers to send to them, as it would leave them open to invasion from Wei and Chu. Which is why the alliance with Wei & taking over Juuko for Wei, is such a crucial strategy.
Now an overview of the Top 5 reasons why Qin hasn't been able to take Kantan:
1. Riboku himself. The two crucial strategies he laid out are the entire backbone of Zhao right now.
2. Armies of Kantan. These are the strongest armies in the entire Zhao kingdom, these were the armies that Riboku himself intially wanted when dealing with Ousen, YTW, Kanki. Believing he could easily deal with them if he could use just 100k of them, simply a part of the army. Something Ousen would also go on to confirm that had Kantan rolled out it's armies they would've been wiped out from the start. Now majority of the armies of Kantan have been mobilized across the border.
3. The Two cities that were strengthened thanks to Riboku's strategy are now the backbone of the Zhao frontline. They serve as the stronghold, similar to Gyou serving as the Qin stronghold.
4. The non-Kantan armies that had remained untouched in the western front are now on the border in a much more compact way. Making it harder for the Qin to find any holes like they did with the Invasion of Gyou.
5. Qin don't have enough numbers to even tackle the Zhao frontline, let alone get past them and then deal with the two cities behind the frontline. This is thanks to the threat of a Wei invasion, which is what the current arc is for.
6. KoChou and the new Zhao officers.
I was wrong in my initial statement. KoChou doesn't even make top 5 in terms of being the reason why Qin can't get to Kantan, let alone being the very reason they're being held up.
So yea, KoChou is an exceptional general. In ability he's in the SSJ- Bananji - Keisha realm. But as a general due to experience, he's superior imo. But no way is he on the same level as YTW, Ousen, Kanki.. let alone Riboku's equal.
Dear God, the length of this comment lmfao. I’m on mobile so I can’t possibly respond to this right now.
Needless to say though, Ko Chou is 3GH level, there’s no other way to sugarcoat that. In the same way that Yo Tan Wa’s Mountain Tribes factor in to the strength of her as a General, so do Ko Chou’s elites troops.
There’s no point in dismissing Ko Chou consistently defeating the strategies and tactics of 3 Qin 6GG level Commanders for a year straight, just because Ko Chou is following Riboku’s grand strategy lol.
That’s like me dismissing Bananji’s tactics on the right wing because Riboku was in charge of the battle lol.
Bananji is definitely not Qin6 level, and Ko Chou definitely is. There’s a reason this guy was called “the Guardian Deity” Lol.
Oh come on, that's a bit too much wouldn't you say?
Gunei is a scrub in comparison to Akou and his application of Ousen's tactics. Besides, some folks have already outdone themselves with great posts showcasing why Bananji may have been the strongest General of Zhaos left wing during the War.
Even Garyuu has not only hyped his strength, but also his eye for tactics, well, not that we expected anything different from Riboku's right hand.
I also have Ko Chou in very high regard, just saying.
It wasn't just Garyuu who hyped up his tactics. Ten did it next day after Garyuu died. That they might have slain Garyuu but Bananji isn't a slouch either ("either" making it a comparison between Garyuu and Bananji, that just like Garyuu, Bananji isn't a slouch on tactics).
I mean Bananji pretty much would've won Zhao the Shukai plains battle right there and then, with that strategy, had Gyou'un not done fucked up and continued attacking like the Qin had wanted to.
And just to back up your argument regarding Gunei-Gyou'un-Bananji situation. Gyou'un might've been plowing right through Gunei's tactics that he picked up from Ousen. Bananji was plowing through the defensive tactics of Ousen himself. Now it might just be me, but plowing through the defenses of Ousen's HQ, where Ousen is the one directly responsible for the tactics, seems much more impressive than plowing the defenses of a guy who's the underling of Ousen's underling.
Dear God, the length of this comment lmfao. I’m on mobile so I can’t possibly respond to this right now.
Needless to say though, Ko Chou is 3GH level, there’s no other way to sugarcoat that. In the same way that Yo Tan Wa’s Mountain Tribes factor in to the strength of her as a General, so do Ko Chou’s elites troops.
There’s no point in dismissing Ko Chou consistently defeating the strategies and tactics of 3 Qin 6GG level Commanders for a year straight, just because Ko Chou is following Riboku’s grand strategy lol.
That’s like me dismissing Bananji’s tactics on the right wing because Riboku was in charge of the battle lol.
Bananji is definitely not Qin6 level, and Ko Chou definitely is. There’s a reason this guy was called “the Guardian Deity” Lol.
Well bruh I wanted to be as elaborative as possible.
Yotanwa's mountain tribes actually don't factor into her strength as a general. Just like Ouki having an underling who was on par with him in abilities had no factor on Ouki's strength as a general. Not sure where you're getting this from. I hope this isn't an attempt to say that she's not on the same level as Qin 6 on her own. If you meant to say the strength of their armies, then yea underlings matter, because they make up the army.
Ko Chou's elite troops? Not sure what you're referring to, we haven't even been introduced to Ko Chou's elite troops. If you mean the armies of Kantan, they aren't KoChou's elite troops. The armies of Kantan are directly under the King himself, even Riboku had no command over them, let alone KoChou.
"That’s like me dismissing Bananji’s tactics on the right wing because Riboku was in charge of the battle lol." Not sure what this is referring to.
There is no statement or showcasing of Kochou countering the tactics and strategies of the other three. That isn't even brought up as an issue, lol. In fact it's made clear that Zhao's strategies on the battlefield in the frontline is not the big issue they're facing. The issue they have is they don't even have the manpower to tackle the numbers of soldiers that are there in the Zhao frontline, let alone give them a good fight.
Nobody claimed Bananji is Qin 6 level. I specifically stated KoChou > Bananji as a general due to his experience over Bananji. However, KoChou himself is not on Qin 6 level, because there's no statement or portrayal showcasing it.
I realistically think Kochou could prove to be as high as #2 of all time in Zhao. I don’t know if he’ll ever prove himself that strong but so far he and his army have been scarily strong in my humble opinion.
Shibashou is ruling over a city so I think he must have some brain ou guts. And he seems to do things his own way so it made me think about some indépendant spirit but a spirit nonetheless. And he is currently helping Ri Boku
Shibashou is ruling over a city so I think he must have some brain ou guts. And he seems to do things his own way so it made me think about some indépendant spirit but a spirit nonetheless. And he is currently helping Ri Boku
I don't think so either. He seems very calm and calculated, doesn't do any wasted sacrifices. His potential is so crazy, hopefully he'll get involved in this war at some point.
I don't think so either. He seems very calm and calculated, doesn't do any wasted sacrifices. His potential is so crazy, hopefully he'll get involved in this war at some point.
I'm so looking forward to Shibashou. Riboku recommended him for the Three Great Heavens spot and the dude looks like a freaking beast.
With that being said yeah, I don't see him cracking the top 3. We have Riboku who is the strongest of the Great Heavens, then freaking Renpa (there's nothing to say here) and Rinshoujo, who was Renpa's equal outright. I don't see it.
Maybe Shibashou is around Chousa? Do you guys think he'll end up stronger than one of the Great Heavens? Though again we have nothing about Chousa lol.
I'm so looking forward to Shibashou. Riboku recommended him for the Three Great Heavens spot and the dude looks like a freaking beast.
With that being said yeah, I don't see him cracking the top 3. We have Riboku who is the strongest of the Great Heavens, then freaking Renpa (there's nothing to say here) and Rinshoujo, who was Renpa's equal outright. I simply don't see it.
Maybe Shibashou is around Chousa? Do you guys think he'll end up stronger than one of the Great Heavens? Though again we have nothing about Chousa lol.
So far Shibashou’s subordinates do not have the same level of hype as the Ten Heroes/the Four Heavenly Kings. It’s still early and we know very little about them but we need to know more about them before we put them on Heavenly King level, and if his subordinates fall short of that level then ultimately Shibashou himself will fall short of Renpa’s generation of Great Heavens.
Which notably is exactly where I first listed Shibashou when this thread was first made lol.
So far Shibashou’s subordinates do not have the same level of hype as the Ten Heroes/the Four Heavenly Kings. It’s still early and we know very little about them but we need to know more about them before we put them on Heavenly King level, and if his subordinates fall short of that level then ultimately Shibashou himself will fall short of Renpa’s generation of Great Heavens.
Which notably is exactly where I first listed Shibashou when this thread was first made lol.
I'm also very intrigued what kind of a General he is. Zhao doesn't really need another mastermind but what they need is a powerhouse so I'm thinking he's a beast of a fighter.
I'm also very intrigued what kind of a General he is. Zhao doesn't really need another mastermind but what they need is a powerhouse so I'm thinking he's a beast of a fighter.
His Generals haven’t really impressed me tbh but I was already expecting them to be nuts and they do seem to be very strong. They all seem like Bananji-tier warriors at least lol.
But they are also competing with some of the most hyped Generals in all of Kingdom with the Heavenly Kings in terms of portrayal, so they’ve got some high expectations to live up to.
So far Shibashou’s subordinates do not have the same level of hype as the Ten Heroes/the Four Heavenly Kings. It’s still early and we know very little about them but we need to know more about them before we put them on Heavenly King level, and if his subordinates fall short of that level then ultimately Shibashou himself will fall short of Renpa’s generation of Great Heavens.
Which notably is exactly where I first listed Shibashou when this thread was first made lol.
For now I think the Heavenly kings are a bit higher but SBS squad looks beastly too : a good leader who seems good overall, a monster, a good strategist and an other good experienced fighter. And I can bet the Ten Bow Seikaun.
I'm also very intrigued what kind of a General he is. Zhao doesn't really need another mastermind but what they need is a powerhouse so I'm thinking he's a beast of a fighter.
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