Current Events Zoro Will not be "Defeated" in the Onigashima Raid

Should Zoro be defeated in the Onigashima Raid?

  • Yes

  • No


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#61
He was trained by mihawk for 2 years. Hes already stronger than kyoshiro
What does that matter? Almost every fighter in boxing/MiMA are way stronger than their trainers. Doesn't mean they can't be taught things they don't know, and I guarantee the Samurai from Wano know a thing or two about Swordsmanship, that they can teach.

Rayleigh is lights years stronger than Hyogoro, but that didn't stop him from teaching Luffy.
 
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HA001

World's Strongest Swordsman
#62
What does that matter? Almost every fight in boxing/MiMA are way stronger than their trainers. Doesn't mean they can't be taught things they don't know, and I guarantee the Samurai from Wano know a thing or two about Swordsmanship, that they can teach.
And if they did it would have been tought when they were training. Not in the middle of the war.
 
#67
The Zoro's promise is unfortunately not a good thing for Oda. Because that's not Zoro's fault but Oda's one.
Saying that kind of statement at the beginning of OP was really too much for a character who aims the top. But for his defense, Oda thought he is gonna finish OP after few years.
That's why the few times Zoro didn't look good were after many years against some of them. But if we analyse correctly, there wasn't a single duels besides maybe Kuma because Zoro wanted to save his crew at any cost.

- Zoro vs Eneru, a logia enough to say ... And that was a team fight.
But Oda didn't shit on Zoro because he gave him a new technique, a survival game before that. He defeated many people such as Braham, Ohm (his two main duels) so his role was over.
- Against Kizaru, he was exhausted after TB and come on, no one could defeat an Admiral pre-skip. Zoro didn't even try to fight him.
But we can't deny that Zoro couldn't do anything to them because they were a logia and too overpowered, and Zoro's situation was shit.
- Lucci wasn't even a fight.
- Kuma vs Zoro, the only one which was a dual. Zoro was really gonna lose but Kuma didn't give him the final blow. He gave a task to Zoro. He thought that Zoro would die by the damages so it would be like a final blow. But Zoro was still standing at the end, so is it really a defeat ?

What i could say is that Oda, always found a way to make Zoro good in his "losses".
Zoro didn't lose any 1 vs 1 dual and 0 against swordsmen beside Mihawk. All of those were under lots of circumstances.
One thing I would like to add is the fact that Zoro never put his bandana against any of them which is the trigger for a duel taken seriously by Zoro and Oda..

We could argue for 100 years between us about that but are these fights really considered by Oda as defeats ?
I don't think so, Oda was stuck in a situation where Zoro can't lose but at the same time, he needs hard experiences to rise to the top.
And Oda knews he can't handle a situation where Zoro would continue to win his fights but luffy couldn't. At one moment, Oda would have been in a situation where he needed to make zoro lose.

So that's why Oda gave him Mihawk for his training. So that Zoro could be strong enough as Oda wants him to be. So no worry for Oda about Zoro's promise.

And we can see that Post-skip, Oda is giving everything to don't make Zoro looks bad.
His training, hidding his full power. People are touching him only by sneak attacks or from far away, they don't even dare to come against him.

But the only time when he fought against someone really strong : he did really well !
He pushed an Admiral just by his flying slashes when he was under the pressure of gravity, the DF power of the Admiral.

In Wano, same 0 defeat. Hawkins just touched him only by throwing many nails but he was staying far away. Killer touched him because of Gyukimaru. Apoo touched him because no one could see his attacks. But Zoro was still standing after that. Don't give me dumb panels because you know that's the truth and what happened.
And to avoid some powerscaling issue which are coming such Zoro's first real fight vs King and maybe after that a small participation against Kaido himself, Oda gave Enma to train him more, when Zoro didn't even show his full strenght. Simple Oda didn't limit Zoro's strenght, he opened it even more.

And it will continue with Zoro vs King, next maybe for Shiryuu, Admiral and finally Mihawk.

So yes post-skip Zoro is not gonna lose any fight in Onigashima or even after that.

If yes, the iconic moment of Zoro in baratie written by Oda would make no sense. But as i said in my long post (sorry for that), Oda won't let that happen.
 
#70
Zoro already promised he won't be defeated anymore (in a 1 on 1 vs another swordsman).
Luffy said he wont run away from yonko or admirals anymore yet he ran from BM.
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No I will not love that. Zoro must start winning and prove a lot of people wrong. I quietly hope that all of this memeing Zoro by Oda will pay off in the real fights. I can't stand what Oda does with Zoro sometimes and stuff like fainting should never exist. Zoro losing will make zero sense and only regression for his character.
zoro losing is fine. Losing to a swordmsan would be weird. But him losing is fine, everyone loses. Why cant he?
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That's why I said that if the raid fails they'll have two weeks to recoup and get stronger. But if this raid is the endgame for Wano, then Zoro won't lose.
The raid fails. Adn they get set for execution, marines/bb/ grand fleet will come.
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If the alliance fail in onigashima(which I think will happen), Zoro will surely get beaten.
He will then win against his 1v1 in the return war(King or WW)


Why would Kaido sneak on Zoro?
he meant sneak out of the banquet and go fuck up zoro.
 
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#74
Zoro isn’t gonna lose a clean one on one this arc.

- Firstly Zoro doesn’t need to lose to Make his fights enjoyable, just him struggling and needing a power up is more than enough to make his fight interesting then add in a famous Zoro one liner and you got yourself a bad-ass fight.

- Secondly Zoro losing doesnt make sense story wise. Luffy needs all the help he can get against Kaido. Zoro still has to be able to fight after his one on one fight in order to help Luffy beat Kaido.

- Thirdly like stated above Zoro learns nothing from losing, he’s already faved defeat bu the strongest swordsman in the world, him losing to King or Who's Who isn’t gonna teach him anything.

- Lastly Zoro’s goal is to be the WSS thats Top Top Tier level in One Piece, him losing to a F6 member or a calamity isn't gonna get him any closer to that goal.
 
#75
Who should defeat Zoro exactly anyway?

No one is good enough except for a full power Kaido taking on him alone
I don’t think kaido needs to be at full power to do him in mate. There is also big mom.
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- Lastly Zoro’s goal is to be the WSS thats Top Top Tier level in One Piece, him losing to a F6 member or a calamity isn't gonna get him any closer to that goal.
Luffys goal is to become the pirate king, that’s top top tier level in one piece. Yet he lost a lot, and is now getting ever closer to his goal. I don’t get this point at all.
 
F

Fallen Prince

#77
Honestly biggest disappointment to one piece fan is lack of sword fighting . Zoro gets the "escape" tag because he never fought against a caliber swordsmen who can outsmart him .(Please dont tag me Vista and Mihawk they are allies now)

Kyoshiro was def perfect enemy for him to surpass but now they are allies . I dont think king is natural swordsmen its more like he is using his df power to overpower this sword . I don't think we'll ever get to see zoro fighting against a proper swordsmen !
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Zoro suffering a major defeat in the upcoming future is inevitable, but the question remains as when it will happen. Now the reason why I say this is inevitable, is because this is the route Oda has always chose to use as the driving force to make Zoro want to become stronger. We first saw this with Mihawk, and then later saw this with Kuma, and then finally saw it with Kizaru. It's always been a common theme to showcase Zoro have a relatively easy time throughout the adventure, before Oda decides to drop the proverbial brick wall into Zoro's path, which causes him to want to become stronger.

Zoro has yet to even come close to that brick wall throughout the New World, and has by far had it the easiest he's ever had throughout the entire series. To me this is showcasing that Oda is gearing him up for a serious rude awakening. He's letting Zoro overconfident and cocky nature which was heavily prevalent in the beginning of the series, rear its ugly face more so now than ever.

With that being said, Oda has only dropped that brick wall in Zoro's face one time in Baratie with Mihawk, and every other time it came at the end of the arc. Zoro has never suffered a defeat at the hands of an opponent, picked himself back up in the same arc, and then rematched the opponent and defeated them.

So the question remains, is what would make Wano different than previous arcs in order for Oda to drop that Brick wall in Zoro's face, mid arc. The answer is simple. Because this is Wano, the Country of Swordsmen. The absolute perfect place for Zoro to train and become stronger, but he'll never do that unless he is given a reason to.

But now there is another issue with this, and that is the fact that Wano seems to be entering into the final stages of the arc, and will be soon approaching it's climax.... Or are we? You have to realize that we are still in the middle of Act 3 of the Wano arc. The act, where in most traditional Kabuki plays, is almost always destined to end in tragedy. The way Oda has set this arc up, has all signs pointing to the raid on Onigashima, ending in utter failure. Even back in the beginning of the arc, we were explicitly given a one month timeline via Hawkins prediction, and yet here we are, only two weeks into Wano. That means we should still have at least two weeks of Wano left.

So what will the Straw Hats and the alliance be doing for those two weeks? The obvious answer would be re-evaluating everything that went wrong, and working on getting themselves stronger in order to prepare for the inevitable rematch with the Beast Mom pirate alliance. And like I said before, Zoro will not push himself to get stronger, unless he suffers a crushing defeat. It's the only way his character progression of wanting to get stronger has been built up over the course of the series.

Now with all that being said, I will say this. If this Onigashima raid is truly meant to be the end game for the Wano arc then ZORO WILL NOT LOSE. BUT, if a major tragedy is meant to happen during act three, and the Straw Hat alliance is meant to suffer an utterly crushing defeat, then Zoro will be ranked among those defeated, and it will drive him to want to become stronger, and it will most likely come at the hands of a strong Samurai (Perhaps Kyoshiro) who teaches him the ways of the Swordsmen of Wano.
Yes i endorse this thread , Zoro def had easy time in new world . I hardly remember any opponent that could match him zoro one on one . Lets not add killer since he was under infulence of artificial devil fruit and orochi .

Zoro 's brickwall might well be kaido himself . He needs to prove that he is surpassing oden with enma !

Zoro likes to take on guys bigger than him so King /Queen wouldnt interest him . Oden has history with kaido and Zoro feels its moral duty to kill/ mortally wound kaido with the very sword. Zoro will see kaido as invisible opponent just like he felt when he was fighting mihawk back in baratie .
 
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#78
Base on what exactly?
Their headcanon, thats alll they got really atm.
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I'd understand the argument for Zoro to lose on Wano more if it wasn't for the fact that we've literally seen him berate himself for getting wounded by Killer.
He berated himself not because of the prospect of losing but the prospect of getting wounded before the final battle. Now we are in the final battle, so he can struggle/lose and get himself back up/learn from the experience. Just like any other normall shonen protagonist. But i guess people dont want him to struggle at all up until mihawk. Really devalues the title of WSS that no one but him gives a fuck about already if thats all it takes.
 
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